Should "Green Energy" consumers pay a "mining fee"?

[lightbulb27]

Shouldn't you be paying more so that the people who work in dangerous conditions to provide Cobalt, Lithium and other materials, have a decent life? Why are so many "Green" people being greedy bullies?

Bonus question: Should Tim Cook be required to work in a mine for one day for their equal pay?

Nothing like saving the planet... by burying other human beings in misery...

A little of the spare change in your Tesla would go a long ways...

Where are the Democrats, the liberals, the progressive to take on this issue of fairness? Why aren't you pushing your govt?

[NamerOfStars]

Why single them out? Okay, because they're so obnoxious about it, but really- why? It's not like ONLY electric car batteries use cobalt and lithium. The phone you're using to read this needs them, too- and even the computer I'm typing this on contains components made in Indochina under lousy working conditions- and some in China, under absolutely terrible ones. I do what I can to source the stuff I use ethically- but there's no a whole lot I can do; I'm just a lower-class American schlub.

Look, a lot of the modern environmentalist movement is founded on distortions, inaccuracies, and outright lies- but that doesn't mean we shouldn't work to minimize our impact on the biosphere, or that we shouldn't develop alternative energy sources. Penalizing people for trying to do that isn't going to help, and even if burning oil has NO effect on global climate conditions, the supply is still limited; it ain't gonna last forever. Once it starts getting so low that governments nationalize production and seize it all, how are you going to get around? How would you get food into the grocery stores? As it stands, electric vehicles are currently our best bet.

Want to improve working conditions in the third world countries that produce our minerals? Great! Want to improve tech recycling? Fantastic! I'm behind those things, too- but the best way to do that is to incentivize them economically. Unless you have a better idea? I'm more than willing to hear it.

[lightbulb27]

you make some fair points.

hows this...
Step #1 is awareness, every product comes with a label "product made with slave labor, but were working on it. and a photo of the impoverished person. something like that.
Step #2:
United Nations requirements around mining such materials. We do this with many products... organic, and such. There should be minimal standards rather than "bottom" dollar cost.

There's a real problem with our disposable and consumption based society that should be examined. Things are designed to fail and be replaced rather than repaired and enhanced. That... should be in the public debates.

I'm sure I Can come up with better ideas if I put more thought into it. I wonder... whom is responsible or enabled for promoting improvements such as these?

[NamerOfStars]

It'd be a start. Step 1 wouldn't work without a very specific definition of "slave labor", and most companies would make *just enough* changes to not qualify- but that'd still be a step up.
Step 2- the UN doesn't really have much power, and given the horribly bigoted nature of many of its dictates and policies, shouldn't. I think you could improve both, however, by making laws setting classification levels for extraterritorial working places- you obviously can't force Malaysian factories to operate under US laws, but you CAN inform people of what those conditions are.

That, however, would penalize makers of more complex things. A company that makes cell phones needs a lot more materials, and a LOT more processing, than one making, say, axes. And most simply aren't going to look deeper than "Ooh, it got a red rating from the ratings board"; you also need to improve the target consumer market, or nothing's going to change in a positive way.

[exitseven]

Yes, goods such as major appliances should be manufactured so that components can be easily replaced. A refrigerator or stove should be able to last 100 years.

[lightbulb27]

@exitseven that I'd prefer, and I think eventually, we get back that way with enough global stagflation. robots working for many whom can't earn enough, paid by the govt.

[ObscuredBeyond]

Isn't it neat how 95% of the environmental destruction is caused by 5% of the population, which then seeks to dictate to the remaining 95% of the population that it needs to eat parasite-infested critters and freeze half to death in winter, and sacrifice its children to Moloch, to "save the planet"?

It's almost like we've reverted back to being dupes and derps for every pagan superstition ever. Now, if only we could bring back nithing poles, and put these elitists' heads on them...

[lightbulb27]

yes, the difference between hundreds of years ago and today is we have more cameras to see it happening life and back then they did drawings. It's either sick or dumbfounding, not sure which yet.

[Aerissa_Jade]

Liberals love slave labor, as long as they can stick their heads in the sand and pretend they don't know about it.

Many illegals that they welcome with open arms, work for less than minimum wage that they value so much. If minimum wage is so good, why do they want workers to work less than it?

They are 100% okay with identity theft too, if an illegal uses it to get a job better than minimum wage.

There should be a Green Energy mining fee on batteries that cost above say a few hundred dollars. Be it for a electric car, or a electric lawn mower or snow blower.

Considering these devices will need new batteries every 5 years or so, where as a gas powered one, can last decades if taken care of properly.

For things that aren't considered green energy, like batteries in laptops and phones, no fee's needed, as green energy tax wouldn't apply. No one is advertising those as green.

Electric devices too, such as cars and small engines should not be allowed to charge up using any grids that energy is produced by fossil fuels.

Everyone can get solar panels (pay green energy fee on those too) and then charge their electric cars off the solar panels.

So what if it takes a month to charge that car for one trip... haha.

[lightbulb27]

time to run for office!

My original 30 yr old gas mower still runs great! high polluting, but low cost in waste/recycling/production.

[Aerissa_Jade]

Yeah my dad still has a 20 year old Craftsman from Sears and they've been gone for most my life.

[lightbulb27]

thats what I had... gave it away.
parents gone? I'm sorry to hear that:(

[Aerissa_Jade]

Nooo, Sears has been gone most my life, parents still around. I barely remember Sears as it closed down a long time ago.

[lightbulb27]

oh yea. that's sad as well, an icon of the nation.

[jshm2]

That's mostly bullshit.

Sure the labour exploitation is bad, but it's bullshit to claim it's "all for Green". When in fact something like 5% of it is for "Green". Those mines and resources are used in fossil fuel heavy industries, commercial and consumer tech, more than for electric cars, let alone for energy production.

It's a classic example of "Facebook research, pips facts" Flat Earth idiots usually go for.

[lightbulb27]

you have a point, it is used in many ways and has been for centuries.
But here we go using it in batteries and we need a bunch of them if so many cars are going electric. Isn't this an opportunity to improve conditions of other humans?

Of course, I could have posted a photo of oil workers and such and maybe that is bad as well, but there's big money behind them and maybe some safety/security in many companies. It seems apparent some humans are being exploited for gain.

[Soteris]

Sure, but move the oil subsidies from taxes to "dirty energy" consumers.

[msmissydc]

Dont forget all the costs that are needed for catastrophes caused by global warming.
We also probably shouldn't tell them that there is much more drilling and mining is needed for their 'dirty energy'.

[Soteris]

@msmissydc Lets also not forget the cleanup from oil spills or the costs associated with other countries controlling the price of fossil fuels and causing massive economic problems around the world like currently.

[lightbulb27]

@msmissydc there's no free lunch, that's for sure...

[exitseven]

yes, subsidies for electric cars should be abolished. Let the free market determine what people will drive. It should not be up to the taxpayers to fund electric vehicles.

[lightbulb27]

yes, I can't imagine Honda/Toyota could use slave labor/sweatshop conditions in producing their cars. But we have that, albeit, it's in many products.

[exitseven]

All the electronic in cars, even American cars are made in some third world hell hile.

[joeldalton]

100%. And they should not be able to get their energy to power their electric cars from any fossil fuels.

[Anonymous]

Forced labor has been and likely will always be a popular point for the left wing political establishment

[lightbulb27]

you'd think they'd be addressing such issues since they are in power.

[Opinion Owner]

They need it to explain many of their policies such as the all-electric drive and how they are pro-overpopulation but anti-jobs, forced labour producing electricity would explain both issues in a package

[BJP21]

We kind of already do if its incorporated into the cost of an automobile.

[Avicenna]

Excellent points

[In_Trance]

Yeah