Are you excited that the January 6th tapes are released?

[Juxtapose]

Finally, we can actually see what happened with our own eyes instead of relying on liars.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/politics/sen-mike-lee-calls-investigation-j6-committee-tapes-released-deliberately-hid-us.amp

Yes

No

[Avicenna]

Excited? No, but we knew that these liars were hiding all sorts of stuff and therefore badly misrepresenting things.

The public has a right to know, especially the full extent to which federal agents and/or informants encouraged trespassing and rioting.

[Juxtapose]

People really act like the FBI would do something like that when they tried to sabotage civil rights movements all the time.

Not to mention the CIA has literally experimented with mind control using lsd. What do people think would happen if the CIA succeeded? The government is evil and lies to us.

[Avicenna]

Very evil and lies a lot indeed.

[Tamera952]

Come on, I’m embarrassed for you now,

[Avicenna]

@Tamera952: You should be embarrassed for yourself.

[BCRanger10]

I'm all for more evidence of the Democrats lying about January 6th being released.

[goaded]

For there to be "more" evidence, there would already have to be some.

[Tamera952]

They don’t need to lie. It’s no mystery who was there — & why they were there. Overwhelming video evidence supports that. You’re looking for a smoking gun that doesn’t exist.

[WhiteSteve]

I mean, I’m all for full disclosure, but I’m getting a little weary of people trying to pretend January 6th wasn’t a big deal. It’s probably the biggest black-eye on the right wing in this country in modern history, and there’s just such an obvious effort to dismiss it as less than it was, because they must know that literally anything they ever say again can just be countered with “Remember that time you guys tried to ignore democracy and change the results of a legal election? No one forgets.”

Showing up in the first place and trying to do anything besides stand outside with signs was where the irreparable and inexcusable fuck-up occurred, whatever happened or didn’t happen inside is largely irrelevant. If I walk into a liquor store with a gun, and I pull it on the cashier…. nothing that happens after that, even a change of heart and walking out the door, undoes that I have attempted a robbery.

So there’s nothing going on INSIDE the Capitol that gives any measure of a pass to anything that happened OUTSIDE of the Capitol. Even if they were all just casually milling around in there, the desired crime of stopping/stalling the electoral process had already occurred, they don’t need to be violent inside the building to be liable for their unauthorized presence there. The Republican Party and the American right wing own this terrible look forever, they will be the ones written as those on the wrong side of history, so I’m not sure what anyone hopes to convince anyone of with additional footage, unless you have clear and obvious video of Nancy Pelosi holding a back door open for a bunch of ANTIFA members and giving them outfits that look like they do most of their clothes shopping at Bass Pro Shops, lmfao.

[Juxtapose]

There have been numerous leftist groups that have stormed the capital already and Trump had to hide in a bunker.

This is just very blatantly biased media reporting about a glorified trespass violation.. staged by the FBI and Antifa.

[Juxtapose]

So no, the right doesn't own a single iota of this made up farce.

[Juxtapose]

And I am saying this as a classical liberal who is sick to death of woke progressives.

[WhiteSteve]

I’d be interested to hear of these left wing assaults on the Capitol, if they’re from tried-and-true reliable news sources like Reuters, Associated Press, etc, and not from fly-by-night sources claiming themselves to be the purveyors of “the real truth.” I’ve seen no evidence to trust in the information coming from the latter.

[Juxtapose]

No, I don't engage in debates with people who don't believe in citizen journalism. The people are the press, not corporations. Period.

[WhiteSteve]

My issue with a lot of “citizen journalism”, as I understand it, is just that it seems to not jibe with the reality I encounter when I leave the house everyday, whereas mainstream journalism typically DOES, so that’s what I base my opinion off of. I’m not totally opposed to independent media. I trust the veracity of David Pakman or The Young Turks over someone on MSNBC, for example, despite not always agreeing with their takes. These are opinion people and not reporters, but their sourcing seems to be more legitimate and not driven by what corporate sponsors approve of or don’t, which also influences what they cover and how they cover it. I’m perfectly capable of hearing things and sifting the apparent facts from opinions or sensationalism. That’s all Critical Thinking 101 stuff. I’m not looking to debate you, I just said I’d be interested to hear about these alleged left wing assaults that caused Trump to hide in a bunker. I feel like Trump, of all people, though I don’t really consider him much of a source for factual information, would be crowing about that incessantly if it had happened, so I’m just surprised I’ve never even heard of it from him.

[Juxtapose]

The Young Turks are abominable and I can prove it.

https://youtu.be/Jssc6kECBiU?si=7Adhb02eorm1VUfw

They are not the type of people to go for any accurate information whatsoever.

apnews.com/.../donald-trump-ap-top-news-george-floyd-politics-a2326518da6b25b4509bef1ec85f5d7f

There, it's even from a source you like. But I do not condone giving corporations exclusive press power. It is anathema to the spirit of the first amendment and the spirit of a free press.

The mainstream media is controlled by the deep state. CNN, Fox News.. all untrustworthy.

[WhiteSteve]

Ok, but…. the link you provided with the article in your original question is from Fox News?

[Juxtapose]

And to preempt you asking why that video is an abomination..





TYT doesn't understand scientific research.

[Juxtapose]

Yeah, so what? I will also cite CNN as a source selectively because even liars don't lie all the time. Generally though you want to stay as far away from corporations as possible when it comes to your news.

[WhiteSteve]

I’m not sure what about that Young Turks clip offends you, to be honest, so I can’t really comment. I’d agree for the most part with their takes on the results of that study.

I remember the protests outside the White House. I was unaware Trump went into a bunker over it. I’m VERY on board with anti-police brutality sentiments, so I support the cause for protest wholeheartedly. The report doesn’t seem to assert that the property was breached though, and January 6th is different from any other protest or riot we’ve seen, because it was specifically done to interrupt a political function of our democracy. Civil unrest to vocalize displeasure at an event or situation is very normal, trying to stop votes from being counted because you don’t want the guy who won to be president, or because you believed in lies told to you of the election being stolen is not normal.

[WhiteSteve]

But…. who the hell is @aghollingsworth? Some guy in the comments says it’s not true and that’s all we should need to believe him? Maybe the study is legit or not, and I’ve seen TYT outright apologize for getting things wrong, so I don’t think they mean to be deceptive. But regardless, rape and sexual assault are a HUGE problem, so why wouldn’t we want to talk about it and be horrified? Even if these stats are off, it’s not like it doesn’t happen routinely, so outrage over it is completely valid.

Generally agree with you about corporate news media, but some are better than others. You just have to take it with a grain of salt. But I’ll just always have questions about reporting from randos who haven’t been through any sort of vetting process and are often heavily agenda’d.

[Tamera952]

Come on buddy, staged by the FBI & Antifa? …you’re dreaming dude, Those there were TRUMP TARDS for sure.

[Juxtapose]

He literally described how their methodology was completely flawed lol.. but yeah sure, 1 in 3 men would TOTALLY rape.. lol you're a bigot. I am done here.

[Juxtapose]

@Tamera952 https://youtu.be/Am7j3zRtaUI?si=idskJhNstti4Pt0k

https://youtu.be/u4z087Kv09o?si=6GIUo_cDHlY1Wnjg

[rigmarole]

These commies are retarded.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@Tamera952 so what do you have to say about the videos of people trying to egg the crowd on to get violent and then everyone started chanting "he's a fed" or the video of the guided tour they kept saying never happened or the cuncussion grenades that were thrown into a crowd of people just standing there.

Not even trying to be argumentative. It's just that I think of myself as a person who can see through the lens of others pretty easily, but when I read something like this, it's just like... Did you see any of the videos?

[goaded]

That first one is the guy that BLM denounced as being an agent provocateur in the summer of 2020. The second one is obviously another attempt to imply video of people not committing crimes (although I expect any insurrection supporting police welcoming the crowd were among those disciplined for dereliction of duty) somehow means the crimes that were on video didn't happen. It's ridiculous.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@goaded but why is it, the Trump people can pull up all these videos of everything being fine, and the violent videos are almost nowhere to be seen.

Like what's a video that shows something you take issue with?

[goaded]

@Telekinetic-Potato Sorry, I was referring to the Tim Pool videos @Juxtapose posted.

That said, I don't understand your question. Do you mean the Trump people are avoiding putting up the videos of violence?

Everybody's seen the Ray Epps video from Jan 5th, is that what you're talking about when people were shouting "fed"? Which guided tour? I'd be interested in the video of concussion grenades being used, it might add something to the conversation that footage of people milling around never will.

[TallGuy8383]

@goaded why is it that when trump has rallies and what not they consider that violent but they said that the riots of 2020 were peaceful?

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 Most of both were peaceful, Jan 6 definitely was not. It was a planned attempt to steal the presidency from the rightful winner, and there are many Republicans willing to say so.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@goaded x.com/JackPosobiec/status/1726343345654394976?s=20

[Telekinetic-Potato]

x.com/.../1726578190725071141?s=46

https://youtu.be/zsbIiX58PRE?si=D4SDKINEMuExlEE4

[Telekinetic-Potato]

I know it's a hard pill to swallow, but these people absolutely were not there to overthrow the president. Where there a lot of people there who thought the election was rigged? Almost certainly. But Jan 6 needs to be a wakeup call for this country that the corruption in our government has gotten so flagrant that normal, everyday people who show up at the Capitol to protest were treated like this, sentenced to felonies.

If you take emotions out of it, I know we all feel very strongly about what we believe but there should be no shame in updating our view points because most of the informatiin the majority of the country has access to is propaganda.

But it becomes clearer and clearer every day that Jan 6 was the closest thing to a Bloody Sunday they could make happen.

[goaded]

@Telekinetic-Potato Saying not all of them knew they were part of a plan to keep Trump in office after he lost the election means exactly as much as saying video of people not beating cops means cops weren't beaten. It's ridiculous.

There have been about a dozen convictions for seditious conspiracy related to the attempt to keep Trump in power illegally. In any reasonable country, all the Republican lawmakers who were willing to go along with the plot and vote to reject valid states' results would be in prison already. They all knew the results had been certified by the states and they all knew that no court cases found any significant wrong-doing.

This isn't emotional, these are solid facts. Democracies don't work if one side is willing to reject results that go against them based on lies.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@goaded but they aren't solid facts, and your entire premise is flawed because I never made the claim that there's one population of protesters who knew about a plot and another who did. That's just some bs the media keeps telling people like you so that you don't question the people being sent to prison. Or the fact that there's no evidence to support the claim that this was an insurrection to overthrow the election.

How the fuck is showing up to the Capitol of arguably the most militant country in the world as unarmed citizens supposed to overturn anything? We're all American, we've all seen the show cops or watched the news before, it's not like it's not common knowledge the police there are very well equipt for something like this.

If it was such a dangerous situation, where was SWAT or secret service or any of the other rapid response units in that area which train day and night to respond as quickly as possible?

Why is it that the coverage of the whole thing has been very surface level. And you're talking about his people being arrested, what about Biden laptop or all the shit with Hillary?

They're getting away with real crimes meanwhile Trump is in court, gag ordered pre-sentenced before even getting to have a trial. A trial which started by someone who basically was specifically elected because she campaigned on finding a way to pin something on him.

In any reasonable country, none of this would be happening. We are in the middle of a Civil cold war and the majority of the weapons are news and social media.

[goaded]

@Telekinetic-Potato You know saying I've been misinformed by the media is just ad hominem, right? https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ad_hominem

There's a judicial system that's set up to get to the facts as far as humanly possible.

That judicial system has established that the claims of election fraud were baseless (and has since established that, for example, Rudy Giuliani, was simply lying and defaming innocent election workers who have been hiding for their lives ever since - he literally admitted it).

It has found in multiple court cases that there was an insurrection, that there was a conspiracy to lead the attack on the Capitol, and that Trump engaged in that insurrection.

That's all a damn sight more solid that claims to the contrary coming from some random person on the internet or proven frauds and liars like Giuliani, Trump and Bannon.

"How the fuck..." That's en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_incredulity

Read an indictment or two.

[Tamera952]

@goaded well said. 100% true

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@goaded @goaded first of all, anyone who needs to quote vocabulary they learned off CNN is a tool bag. That's just my personal opinion that got me back in this conversation. It's incredibly silly and pedantic to use phrases that you feel the need to leave the definition for after you've used it. Especially when you're trying to sound smart. Go look up Spiros from the show billions and that's what you look like.

You know what, here it is: https://youtu.be/Q1UmKJVU_Lw?si=EjXiqjVgyeVhIaSI

This guy is what you sound like.

"how the fuck"

Whats funny about you calling it an argument from incredulity is that your statement in itself is more of one than the statement it came from.

Let's go over some basic English grammar so that you can understand why I stopped talking to you a few months ago and maybe you'll be more careful to listen to what other people are saying so you don't keep just blindly thinking you're right all the time.

When I said how the fuck does a group of unarmed civilians walking into the Capitol of the most heavily armed militant country in the world cause an insurrection, it's not an incredulant argument because the point it was in response to was that, they were trying to overthrow the government... Oh I'm sorry, let me update you're answer for you to the most up to date bs, they were trying to stop the ballot counting or whatever.

So to ask how these people who I just showed you were welcomed into the building and were obviously unarmed, is simply a necessary part of communicating why you thought there was something about this that would count as overthrowing the government. You can't take someone poking a hole in your idea and just start attacking the argumentative style as a way not to answer it.

Sorry guy, I aced my logic classes.

[goaded]

@Telekinetic-Potato OK, Ace, how is causing the loser of an election to stay in power despite the express will of the people not an attempt to overthrow the government?

Some of the people were unarmed therefore nobody was armed? Is that your attempt at logic?

[Telekinetic-Potato]

@goaded if I said anyone was armed other than people with the government, it must have been a typo that I'm sure would have been easy for anyone trying to have a straightforward conversation to pick up on. It goes pretty much without saying, there was not a meaningful presence of firearms in the possession of protesters in relation to the claim that they were there to overthrow the government lmao

What you're doing when you ask "how is causing the loser of an election to stay in power despite the express will of the people not an attempt to overthrow the government?" comes across to people who actually cared enough to look into it as you're just the type who sees 2 parties and yours is the good one.

It's hard for anyone to take that seriously when most of the statement has almost no grounding in reality. Which since we're being smartasses, you're committing the fallacy of Alleged Certainty
www.logicallyfallacious.com/.../Alleged-Certainty 😘

"How is causing the loser of an election to stay in power... "

Nobody was there to do that. Ignoring the pleth of video evidence like the crowd chanting "he's a fed" at anyone suggesting insurrectionist activities. How about the fact that it makes no sense and I don't think there's too many people who would disagree with me that even if they went in there and slaughtered every single person in the building (which how would they have done that without a shit load of guns?) it still wouldn't have done anything whatsoever for the election. And these weren't exactly brain dead people. Many of the people arrested had totally normal, corperate jobs. Some of them happened to be there while on business trips. It's so silly for anyone to seriously think this large crowd of people were trying to overturn a U. S election, got inside the building and the only shots that were fired that day were into the crowd of protesters who weren't even inside the building.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

(we can skip over this, just wanted to respond to your other point) If you want to talk about the will of the people, that's a whole other can of worms, but I'll just drop the anecdote that it's not a particularly strong argument when the reason they were there was to protest what they believed was election fraud. And you can't really blame them for thinking so. Look at how many illegals came to this country right before the election, always granted amnesty by dems right before an election. They also thought they found evidence of an fbi informant talking about it with a politician on video they never felt was looked into enough.

It's hard for me personally not to think about this day every time I see how well he's doing in the polls right now. Did you know that a US president has never done as well in the polls as he was doing a couple weeks ago and not gotten elected? The numbers CNN is putting up now look eerily similar to what some polls was saying last election to me going off memory.

I just don't understand how someone trying to have an honest conversation about this stuff would even need these things pointed out. None of what I'm saying is a conspiracy theory. Or at least, I guess some of it used to be. All this information was freely available the whole time and the video evidence became incredibly widespread around the time we started this conversation.

[goaded]

@Telekinetic-Potato How can I have an honest conversation with someone who claims no attacker was armed on Jan 6? Even if you only count firearms, that's not true, and anyone can see the things that were used as weapons on the day.

I can see you haven't been following the court cases or even the Jan 6 committee, otherwise you would be certain Jan 6 wasn't an accident or something that got out of control; it was Republicans sabotaging the purely ceremonial count of electoral votes so that Republicans in the House could vote to keep Trump in office (one vote per state). Trump's been lying about election integrity in the US for over a decade.

Then you go on to lie about immigrants being granted amnesty (which still wouldn't entitle them to vote).

[GoodGuyBreakingBad]

Yes, I am happy

[goaded]

But there's all this video of me not beating anyone; that proves I didn't do anything wrong, you should totally ignore the video of me beating someone!

Trump brought a mob of supporters to the Capitol and told them a pack of lies to get them to fight for him. Oh, and courts have ruled that it was an insurrection, including one that explicitly states that Trump engaged in it.

"Denver District Judge Sarah B. Wallace wrote that Trump “acted with the specific intent to disrupt the Electoral College certification of President Biden’s electoral victory through unlawful means; specifically, by using unlawful force and violence.” And, she concluded, “that Trump incited an insurrection on January 6, 2021 and therefore ‘engaged’ in insurrection.”"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/11/17/colorado-2024-ballot-trump-insurrection/

[Juxtapose]

Is it that woke Soros hired district attorney? Trump did not bring a mob of supporters to the capitol with the intention of them taking over anything. It was a protest that was sabotaged by the FBI and actually Antifa.

[goaded]

Like I said elsewhere, there's no need for LSD brainwashing, the old-fashioned propaganda you've been exposed to and continue to spread works just fine.

Nothing that you disagree with is true, nobody can possibly be disagreeing with you based on evidence, and assertions from people you agree with don't require evidence.

[Tamera952]

Do you even think, or just repeat what you heard on news max?

[TallGuy8383]

@Tamera952 well I could say the same for you. Do you think or just believe everything bullshit lie that cnn or msnbc tells you. Media is nothing but fake bullshit lies. They tell you what the people want to hear and brainwash you in the process

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 Who told you that "Media is nothing but fake bullshit lies."?

[Sabretooth]

with none of that having any proof behind it.

[goaded]

@Sabretooth Of course there's proof. Quite apart from everybody having witnessed it in real time, here's the court order: www.courts.state.co.us/.../...%20Final%20Order.pdf

Just like @Juxtapose, nothing that you disagree with is true, nobody can possibly be disagreeing with you based on evidence, and assertions from people you agree with don't require evidence.

[Sabretooth]

that was regarding what Juxtapose said.

[goaded]

@Sabretooth I had a feeling it was out of character. Please accept my apologies (I'm really bad at names, even these fake ones). It's a really annoying feature of the site that you can't see a difference between a response to the asker or the opinion owner. (I've started manually tagging them if they're both in the conversation.)

[Sabretooth]

accepted. I'll tell ya this: if this is an illusion... well, Quentin Beck
would be the be the youngest person in history to check themself in a retirement home.

[Sabretooth]

pardon the typo... rest hasn't come for a very long time...

[TallGuy8383]

Your profile pic says it all. You stand with Ukraine. Why don’t you stand with America and fix American problems. Don’t let the media divide America any further than it already has. The media is nothing but lying propaganda and you eat that shit right up. Turn it off, you’re being brainwashed

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 and the right stands with Putin. this isn't about polices... we're way past that. this is about morality. I'm a not a Democrats but, it's clear that it's the Republicans that are responsible for the divide. how do you unite with insane, racist people that want to wipe you out? this whole ''vermin'' talk? this is nothing new. this is a video from 2019: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRlX-DxXF7I

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth why would you assume that I vote right? All I will say is this both parties are trash

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 I didn't. perhaps in general. but, the Democratic Party does actually have decent people in it. people like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who nearly $5 million in Texas relief efforts. and there's also a good deal of pundits who are honest and fair, like, Lawrence: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPl_zb6P6NQ

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth AOC is garbage, along with her buddy up in Minnesota. You’re playing clips from msnbc. Another garbage news media outlet. The media outlets are pure trash in America, they all lie. It’s all owned by liberal left billionaires. You keep falling for the bullshit they sell you

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth one thing trump was right about is, fake news. It’s all fake, they sell you fear, just like the whole Covid outbreak

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 and you keep on outing yourself as a Republican. You call a woman who went out of her way to help a state run by Republicans at you trash a clip of a left wing news outlet that was calling out Democrats. And haven't over a million people died from COVID!

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 and

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 I also remember a very interesting story. Trump once threatened to sue Lawrence for saying that he wasn't as rich as he claimed that he was... That never happened.

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth millions of people die from the flu world wide. No one talks about that. The left had control of the house, senate and the White House, they could’ve put a huge road block on guns, but didn’t. They had total control and did nothing. I’m an independent, I don’t choose sides

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth also if you died in a car accident they chalked it up as Covid. Why? Because the hospitals were getting money for it. So I don’t necessarily believe the Covid numbers. Anyway, I got work to do, I’m out. Have a good Thanksgiving

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 36 000, on average. Most people get the flu shot as that was not tide to the right downplaying it as Trump is on tape saying that he did. Democrats have tried: www.google.com/.../story%3fid=84995465

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 untrue: apnews.com/.../fact-check-covid-pandemic-hospitals-medicare-157398144949

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 and same.

[TallGuy8383]

@Sabretooth 400,000 die from the flu world wide

[TallGuy8383]

@Tamera952 is argue with you but you just repeat what you’ve been told, you don’t think for yourself. You’re one of the indoctrinated ones

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 7,000,000 people have died worldwide from covid, that's over 17 years' worth of flu deaths.

[Juxtapose]

Those are fake numbers. Even if someone had covid and died in a car accident it was ruled as a covid death. You could have covid, be completely asymptomatic and be shot in the head. That would have been ruled as a covid death.

Massive hoax and psyop.

[Sabretooth]

Trump said that publicly, too. privately? not so much: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJkVOs0s3mw&t=1s

[goaded]

@Juxtapose Even if every car crash victim and every gunshot victim were counted as a covid death (they weren't), that would still leave a million US deaths.

[Juxtapose]

I don't trust their numbers whatsoever because they were counted in malicious, bad faith to begin with. The whole thing is utterly fabricated.

[goaded]

It's really not. It happened all over the world. People really died. You're believing liars.

[Sabretooth]

I remember a story where a man lost his... Wife to cancer, if I remember correctly. There were no beds left.

[TallGuy8383]

And you believe those numbers from Covid. K

[Sabretooth]

That other guy blocked me. Heh.

[TallGuy8383]

It’s funny how after Biden got elected, they instantly took the Covid death ticker off the news stations. Why aren’t we counting their deaths anymore? Oh probably because it was all a ploy to get trump outta office and you people believe this shit, hook line and sinker

[TallGuy8383]

I would think at your age 58 years old you would be wise enough to know that these people don’t give two shits about you as a person. They just want your vote so they can be power-hungry assholes and control your life. When they had total control of the house the center and the White House did they do anything about gun control? No absolutely nothing because we still have mass shootings galore.

[TallGuy8383]

But hey you do you boo

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 You blocked @Sabretooth? Snowflake.

There hasn't been a minute in decades where Democrats had a veto-proof majority in the Senate and both the presidency and the House. Even then, the best they could force through would be whatever the most conservative Democrat would let them.

[TallGuy8383]

He blocked me

[TallGuy8383]

I ain’t no fuckin pussy snowflake. He blocked me first

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 Why don't you both unblock each other and have a reasonable conversation?

[Sabretooth]

I haven't blocked him. I could snap a picture of my block list if so required.

[TallGuy8383]

Funny you call me a snowflake online but you probably wouldn’t say it to my face. Typical keyboard clown!

[goaded]

@TallGuy8383 He says he didn't block you. I believe him.

[Sabretooth]

he's still talking shit about me? coward! YO! GENIOUS! if I had blocked you, then, I wouldn't be able to get notified about your replies, now, would I?

[Tamera952]

Trump himself tweeted ahead of time, it was gonna be wild. When they were breaking the windows in, & climbing in - it sure looked like they were trying to ‘take over’ something.

[NaultD]

It dosen't change anything. They broke through windows and someone got gundown by security. Its still an attack on the capital building.

Sure cops are moving the crowd inside slowly just because they don't want to get beaten to death. Thats no different then talking to an armed intruder in your home and you talk them down to leave before someone gets hurt. The crime is still on the intruders even if you deescalate the situation.

Are there inside fed agents? 100% there is and they get head counts. Banking statements. Profiles on head members. Endlessly feeding enough rope to hang themselves with but never the plan guy themselves. With enough evidence they try to stop attacks before they happen. Like that white group stuffed in uhauls. Some times its too little not late.

Same thing happened with 9/11/2001 attacks. The whole dispute between who won the 2000 bush or gore locked up intelligence agency's for months that did discover attack plans and ways to counter but the highest ups was playing politics to care. After the duat settled it was too little to late.

[rigmarole]

You should stop smoking crack. It's ruined your brain.

[Telekinetic-Potato]

January 6th is like that movie don't look up where the scientists are trying to tell everyone that the world is ending and if people would just look up to the sky, they'd be able to see it, but everyone just kinda goes "no way, what a load of crap"

I challenge everyone reading this, the next time you hear a big story on the news or read about it in a blog post, ask yourself this: did they offer hard, indisputable, smoking gun evidence?

You might ask what does that mean? When CNN says Elon musk said something from his texts that were released from the Twitter lawsuit, and they don't leave a link to the rest of the conversation, that's not evidence. That's technically not even journalism.

When Fox says that Biden is ruining our ability to profit off of our oil because he won't let anyone drill, but they won't say how many permits were given out compared to other years, that's not evidence either. Which, before the end of his first year being in office, he signed more drilling permits than almost any other president in the history of the nation.

And don't just take their word for it if they cite the source. I read an article once with the headline something along the lines of "black babies more likely to die than white babies due to racism study finds"

After reading it, I just questioned how on earth you could scientifically prove that. So I found the study they referenced, paid the $12 or whatever it was and before you even get into the actual study, in the synopsis it literally said "the results of this study do not mean babies are disproportionately dieing from racism" and even went on to discuss counter claims to such a conclusion that no reasonable person would come to after even glazing over the text.

And yes, huge news agencies do stuff like that and worse all the time. Just look at what media matters did to x the other day.

[rigmarole]

It was obvious what was happening. For several weeks before it happened we watched as ANTIFA/BLM had repeated video chats about dressing up as trump supporters and attacking the capital building. There were tons of agents mix in with them provoking action. Trump supporting message boards were repeatedly spammed with the same sort of content by glowies. Moderators tries to squash the calls to violence by government agents and ANTIFA/BLM members on those forums. People that were regulars on those boards talked about how a false flag was being set up. Then the minute it happened we watched it on streaming video live on the internet. It took a little while for the media to catch up with the propaganda that was going on and start covering it. They showed only clips that made it look bad for Trump and many videos that exposed government agents and BLM/ANTIFA got censored from the internet within a couple hours by Google/YouTube, Twitch, etc.. We picked apart the footage and told the world about known ANTIFA/BLM members pointed out government ops and crowd instigation. We pointed out the ANTIFA/BLM/Government agents bussed in and allowed through the barriers. The the typical shills threw around "conspiracy theory" to try to discredit the facts.

[rigmarole]

Now years latter people are catching up to the story just like every other story...

media.128ducks.com/.../...632216752c14c7b566be.mp4

[blueonblack22]

I’m sick of J6. Yes it was embarrassing, wrong and horrible. It needed to be called out as such.

Yes I know the tapes will show that most of the protestors weren’t doing anything wrong beyond just entering the Capitol building (media tried its hardest to fixate on the worst parts). It is a crime to trespass and they shouldn’t of done that But still most of those people didn’t actually do anything

But I used to able to mock liberals for all their asinine behavior especially during the BLM riots. But when J6 happened my face was bright red from a giant face palm. I was just like “oh f**k……” because I knew this gave the leftist media the perfect excuse to get the negative attention off all the mass BLM rioting the left continuously propagated and encouraged in the summer of 2020.

Over 30 were killed and there was over 2 billion dollars in property came out of the BLM riots. National monuments were vandalized and may if then weren’t confederate statues. Liberals were even targeting the Lincoln memorial which was batshit insane.

However again it’s just amazing how quickly and conveniently all that carnage was muted out and forgotten about when J6 happened. That’s no coincidence.

[rigmarole]

You should stop smoke crack, it's ruined your brain.

[blueonblack22]

@rigmarole excellent rebuttal bro. Totally shut me down. I’m so impressed with your insight.

[goaded]

You make some good points, but you should consider that the BLM protests included something like 25 million Americans over months, and that many of those 30 killed were killed by police or counter-protesters, not to mention criminals taking advantage of the chaos.

Jan 6 was the first time in American history that there wasn't a peaceful transition of power to the winner of a presidential election. That's a BFD.

[Tamera952]

Huh? Excited? …. umm, no. I think we already got a good eye full in real time. Let me know if there’s anything exciting that shifts the understanding from what is already the summary collective knowledge — which is a bunch of angry, white, racist, ignorant, very gullible, gun freaks, conspiracy minded, MAGATARDS who were manipulated by big daddy TRUMPTARD, who believed that dipshits lies and went on a rampage, raised hell, & broke into the capital, period, full stop. — what all do you think is missing?
NO MYSTERY there.

[Tamera952]

Not everything is a conspiracy. Sometimes a ‘cigar is just a cigar’. I think we all saw who was responsible and why.

[TallGuy8383]

You do realize the liberal left is the racist group, correct. They do nothing for the black community other than feed them lies and keep them below poverty. It’s all part of their plan to maintain their votes and then once they secure their votes, they fuck em over and lie to them again

[TallGuy8383]

After all it was the Democratic Party that started the KKK but you keep focusing on the bullshit the media tells ya!! It’s people like you who fall for the lies they tell you, hook, line and sinker

[Sabretooth]

well, unless it's a Dominican or a Honduran. Those are specifically grown for homosexuals.

[Sabretooth]

@TallGuy8383 also, not true. it was established by Nathan Bedford Forrest. does that name sound familiar?

[Tamera952]

@TallGuy8383 The “liberal left” is comprised of many different groups & ideas, & one cannot accurately state that this loosely defined bloc is “racist” as a whole — that’s absurd. What they do, or do not do for the black community is certainly up for debate.
I doubt it’s a collective effort to “fuck ‘em over” — but could they do more? Yes. More than likely. I am aware that generally they take the black vote for granted, this is true.

[monorprise]

No, I really don't care. Most of those people had a natural right to be in what was until then "The People's own house" to petition for redress of grievance. Thou I agree congress could not refuse an order from the States and thus also with what was done.

What congress's poorly trained goons did to those unarmed people was unbecoming of a goverment that claims to represent the people and respect free speech.

Congress needs to start behaving like a democracy and release their political prisoner.

[goaded]

"unarmed people"
https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence
https://youtu.be/C3EIgmdRPXk
https://youtu.be/OWW38O4QnmM
https://youtu.be/pXCDseiJN5U

[monorprise]

@goaded Don't see any arms in the capital, in those videos, or really any arms at all that don't belong to the federal 'law enforcement'.

[goaded]

All those things they're using to beat the cops? They're weapons.

[monorprise]

@goaded If your definition of a weapon includes a walking crutch and a stick against people who have guns and armor then not much can be excluded from the term "weapon".

No they don't qualify as real weapons, and none of them were inside the capital in the 2 videos i can actually see.

[goaded]

The law defines them as weapons, as well as the bear spray that attackers brought with them. I just posted a couple of videos, you know damn well that there were people with weapons outside and inside the capitol. There's even video of one attacker boasting about the spike on the end of his flagpole.

[monorprise]

@goaded The "law" in question is written by people in that building who have zero respect for the written Constitutional law which explicitly forbids them from making any such law on arms at all.

So I'm afraid the insane musings of what those same politicians will allows on this issue does not deserve to be called "law" by any patriot. Merely what the thugs they hire with stolen money will, or in this case will not competently enforce.

[goaded]

Bullshit. The law in question is hundreds if not thousands of years old. It's never been lawul to take up arms against your legal government, and rarely been moral. Breaking the previously unbroken rule of peaceful transfers of power in the United States is not one of those times.

[monorprise]

@goaded 1st there is a very big difference between bearing arms and taking up arms.
2nd That goverment only exist because the states that created DID take up arms against their goverment.
3rd That goverment unlike the states that created was NOT given the power to disarm its people.

[goaded]

Exactly. They were doing both. That's illegal, and, as long as there are free and fair elections, immoral.

They took up arms in the 18th century against a government (monarchy) that did not allow them democracy. Then they created a constitution that would remove the need to ever do that again.

The government hasn't disarmed the people, it's convicted people who used those arms illegally.

[monorprise]

@goaded Except there were no fair elections in 2020, wide spread fraud, so by your own standards their protest was not only moral but required. Thou we might agree it was in the wrong place congress has no legitimate power over elections.

As even the founders recognized a democracy is often even more repressive to the right of the people than a monarchy and the British empire was indeed a democracy then just as it is now. For it was not King George who imposed said taxes and threaten the rights of the people but the British parliament.

Even had the colonies been given representation the population electing said parliament was nearly twice as many as all 13 colonies combined. A people living in a very different world politically.

[goaded]

Yes there were "fair elections in 2020", most of the states Trump was complaining about were run by Republicans who knew their election results were valid. If "congress has no legitimate power over elections", why were Republicans in congress trying to ignore the results?

[monorprise]

@goaded As a German you may not understand this fact but as it was I'm sure told to you before. However in most American state elections are run locally more than by the State goverment, this is good for limiting election problems to areas but bad for state wide popular vote contest as any given county could corrupt the election for the whole state in such contest.

Nonetheless in nearly all states the State retains ultimate sovereignty and ownership of local governments and thus also legitimate oversight. The request was for congress to legitimately go back to the States and ask them to verify their conclusion thus providing more time to investigate the very unusual election practices introduced in 2020 with very unusual results.

Congress unfortunately forced the State's hands with their relatively short deadline prohibiting acquitted investigation. This fact should have been protested along with the novel and Un-secureable changes to election practices.

[goaded]

Every state was satisfied with the result it sent to Congress. Every single one. All Congress and the VP had to do was count the votes. All they had the authority to do was to count the votes or, with massive bipartisan support, reject the results from a particular state.

It's been years, now, and not a single state has found any reason why the results they first sent to Congress weren't valid.

So, why were Republicans in congress trying to ignore the results?

I'll tell you why. It's because if they broke the system sufficiently, they could bring the decision about the presidency down to a state by state vote, and there are more Republican states than Democratic ones. They wanted to steal the presidency, and Republican lawmakers were willing to go along with the conspiracy.

[monorprise]

@goaded Simply not true, States have to cast their electors on the 15th of December or forfeit them.
After that there hasn't been much of a serous investigation nor in many of theses states any means by which to carry out said investigation given the completely black-box nature of how most of their votes were cast.

Put quite simply they implemented a system that is unverifiable and deployed it on a scale where it decides the margin of victory at where even a small rate of abuse would lead to fraudulent outcome.

So no, we have no idea what the majority of voters actually supported in theses states and never can given what little the Goverment thereof did to collect and preserve evidence.

[goaded]

Not one state had outstanding court challenges to the results of the elections on Dec 15. There have been many investigations since then in many states, although I will agree with you that they weren't serious, they were based on lies (remember "bamboo fibres"? That "audit" found a few hundred MORE votes for Biden).

What you call the "black-box nature of how most of their votes were cast", most people call a "secret ballot". There are many checks and controls on whether votes are valid or not, otherwise those Republicans voting for dead relatives wouldn't have been caught, would they?

So, why were Republicans in congress trying to ignore the states' results, if not to break the system sufficiently that they could bring the decision about the presidency down to a state by state vote and steal the presidency?

[monorprise]

@goaded If you leave your cash out in the open and unobserved, there is pretty much no case or investigation you can have to prove who stole it.

Such is the case with modern election laws in most states via voting by mail, the means by which you can verify the vote was cast by a voter are weak at best. The fact that this was allowed by the state court and in many cases even the leglsator means there is no case to even challenge the illegitimate system they created.

Unfortunately elected politicians either benefit from election fraud or are not threatened by it as such they have little to no reason to do anything other than deny it and sweep it under the rug. Ultimately you will be forced to live with the political oligarch's picks or leave.

For a lot of democrat states today like New York and California that is increasingly leaving. Put simply their elections don't matter.

[goaded]

If there's no way to prove it, then all the Florida elections Republicans won using mail-in voting were just as "insecure", but they never complained then, did they?

If you had tens of thousands of illegal mail-in votes in a state (enough to affect the results), there would be reports of hundreds or thousands of people apparently trying to vote twice. That didn't happen. All you've got are Republicans lying about the vote they lost and trying to take away the choice of president from the people.

[monorprise]

@goaded Its true we don't know that Florida's elections were legitimate, and as Republican are forced to play the same game, they too will become ever more disconnected from the people and corrupt.

As mentioned elected politicians have little reason to support any kind of honest election they if they are effected by said fraud at all they benefit from it.

As such they are happy to make broadly unenforceable rules.

[goaded]

Yeah, we do know that the elections were legitimate, all of them. It's just Trump Republicans like you want to sow distrust in elections so that that can ignore them in the future. Same as every other authoritarian, like Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini, Putin. Come to power despite the system, then get rid of elections altogether (or ensure they're pointless, like in Wisconsin where a majority of the votes gets you about a third of the seats - if you're Democrats - statewide elections elect Democrats, state elections elect Republican majorities).

[monorprise]

@goaded A legitimate election is held by verifiable means, the 2020 elections and thereafter were not verifiable and as such rigable.

Its not that republican won't win under these rules i that under these rules both parties will be geared towards harvesting and printing ballots rather than getting results and the favor of the people.

So major problems will be ignored when they don't suite the interest of the political elite who control the political machine which prints and harvests these ballots to the point where large numbers of people will be disenfranchised and if they have the option be forced to leave the domain of that machine's authority.

This is already happening in New York and California. If this situation persist in maintain disastrous policies in theses states and imposing the same on all others. We will be forced to look for a resolution in something other than elections and if we can't flee peacefully we really don't have many other good non-revolutionary.

[goaded]

Either the 2020 election was legitimate, or the US has never had a legitimate election. Mail in ballots have been used since the 19th century. Each person entitled to vote gets one chance to vote. People printing their own ballots will be caught, like the Republican candidate's wife in Iowa who got caught stuffing just 23 ballots. Changing the 2020 results would have taken tens of thousands, it would not have gone unnoticed.

Oh, and look at that, you're threatening to use violence in pursuit of your political ambitions. There's a name for that: terrorism.

[monorprise]

@goaded The U. S. Carry out more than 50 elections every 2 years. Some States do so even more frequently, Some of thou elections are conducted in such a way as to accurately reflect the will of the people of said states, others are not. In 2020 for the first time an effective majorty in key states were not soo conducted.

Just because some states have a great deal of experience with mail in balling and even have procedures and practices to do so more credibility does not mean all states and certantly not the states in question do.
Nor does it mean that their elections are particularly honest. I for one do not beleive in the honesty of califorina, or for that matter many other state elections going back decades.

I think the fact that many of theses States which are otherwise naturally blessed have consistently maintained policies soo bad as to drive people out. Is clear evidence that their elections may not in fact represent the will of their people but rather a disconnected minority in charge.

I am inclined to leave the issue to the state as elections are in fact state issue. What however was condemable in 2020 was the radical and sudden large scale shift to such unreliable systems of voting among such large shares of the population.

This made it impossible to to validate said elections, or even reach the absurdly high standard of evidence to really challenge it in court. Evidence standards that in many states really does come down to proving enough individual ballots now numbering in the millions were fraudulent and doing so within a matter of weeks.

That may have been possable prior to 2020 in close elections where the questionable ballots numbered in the thousands but not millions.

[goaded]

And why should I believe your version of events over the courts'?

Why do you think no evidence of significant election malpractice has been found in the years since the election? It couldn't possibly be because there wasn't anything remotely likely to change the results, could it.

What has come out in the last three years is that the people making the wild claims were lying. Do you think the election workers in Georgia were illicitly passing memory sticks to each other?

[monorprise]

@goaded I have seen plenty of evidence That 'court' hand picked by the people who benefited from such fraud failed to recognize it under the laws written by the same dirty politicians is nothing new. This is a long standing problem with elections in this country. A problem we have been complaining about for many decades sine they made such dirty election laws in the name of "increasing voter turn out".

2020 just took things to a dramatic new level and created entirely new standards of ill-responsibility. Courts and legislators turned a blind eye to ever larger problems all to secure their own hold on power. Even when they modify the law supposedly to 'fix' it they don't bother fixing the problem instead their very public focus is on telling everyone how much more people can now even more easily vote.
Which of course translates to less verifiably. The truth is the politician will not fix a problem which is responsible for their own hold on power.

[goaded]

Please do share all this "plenty of evidence". What I see is you deciding that everything that disagrees with you is made up and all the lies you've been told are true. Why, if all the politicians changed voting laws to stay in power, did multiple Republican states lose representation?

Most people think high voter turn out is a good thing, because you get a more representative government. I can understand the party of hatred not wanting normal people to vote.

[monorprise]

@goaded You mean like this video:
rumble.com/...2020-election-fraud-documentary.html

You seem to be ignoring the point, the current election laws or simply practices Disregarding said laws in many states are not verifiable systems of voting.

They are overly complex, with significant black boxes under the control of people who have every reason in the world to cheat if under any real control at all. We discussed Mail in voting in other threads and drop box voting among countless other unverifiable systems.

What the politicians who benefit from this choose to call 'proof' is by design very unlikely to be found absence gross neglect or confession.

There is a reason few countries on earth allow theses unverifiable practices

[goaded]

They're not unverifiable, though. There are many checks that are made, the elections are often run by the losing side (what incentive do they have to cheat?), and if someone did manage to fake 10,000 ballots or more, there would be hundreds or thousands of cases of people appearing to vote twice. There are people on both sides monitoring things to ensure everything's fair, the difference in 2020 was that there were a whole bunch of morons who didn't know what they were looking at.

Oh, and lies about real election workers that caused them to suffer for years afterwards.

[Bloodfeast]

Did anyone here watch the interviews with the bull horns shaman guy in blue?

I think he's telling the truth personally. It wasn't this "insurrection" where ideologues with a mission planned ro overthrow the government.

It was basically a group of dummies.

I never bought into the insurrection thing and I'm very anti Trump anti Republicans anti conservatives.

But I think the insurrection is liberal BS. Liberals are masters of lies.

Conservatives are just stupid. Liberals are evil.

[goaded]

There were a lot of useful idiots there, like him, but there were also people there with definite plans to disrupt the count, Something like 13 people have been convicted of seditious conspiracy in relation to the attack; they had firearms just over the state lines ready and waiting. Everybody there was there because Trump called them.

[normalice]

I already saw what happened on live television. The far right fake news is trying to suggest that maybe christian nationalism isn't so bad because some of the J6 rioters spent some percentage of the time >not< rioting, but that's just not the way it works.

[rigmarole]

You should stop smoking crack, it's ruined your brain.

[normalice]

Sorry about that rage addiction of yours but at any moment you could just choose to stop dedicating your whole life to being a simp for fascism, so not that sorry.

[lightbulb27]

seen good bit of it, glad to hear as it helps to see what isn't shared in the media. What ever happened to "reporting"? Oh yea... that doesn't sell clicks.

could they stop destroying their records as well, figure out what the Epps guy was doing there... how many FBI and were they monitoring or fanning the flames.

Never assault the building where there's a bunch of lawyers...

[exitseven]

I have already seen quite a bit of them. Pretty intense stuff, all those armed terrorists burning the Capitol to the ground. Oh wait, that was Chicago in 2020, my bad.

[Surely]

After seeing the video of a couple of guys joining the “protests “ after coming from behind the police lines. The guy at the shooting of the veteran. Then walking through the police line while carrying a backpack and changing shirts.
The FBI not admitting how many plants they had in the crowd. Ray Ebbs not being arrested.
Polosi refusing Trumps offer of extra law enforcement. Something is rotten!

[gorydetails]

Yup, we've seen feds and cops welcoming protestors inside the capitol. It is a total sham.

[OldBlue]

Not really, because nothing will become of it. The Republicans have been in power for almost a year now, so why haven't they held hearings on Jan 6th? Why hasn't Nancy been put on the stand?

[DJB72]

It doesn't matter. Reality and what the tapes show could be the same or radically different after this long.

[Juxtapose]

What?

[DJB72]

Enough time has passed that the tapes could easily have been edited to fit the preferred narrative. The thing that kept haunting the Kennedy investigation was the presence of physical film of the shooting. It's impossible to edit the originals without the tampering being instantly seen by anyone - not just an expert.

Not so much these days.

[Juxtapose]

Ahhhh I see. Very good point. At this point we will need artificial intelligence to detect the editing of other artificial intelligence.

[goaded]

Aren't these videos supposed in some way to be exculpatory? On the other hand, millions of people watched a lot of the violence in real time.

[SotiCoto]

The what now? I don't know who these people are, nor what they supposedly did or didn't do... but I'm a little puzzled that the question was phrased as though you expected anyone to have any idea what you're talking about.

[A_Bell]

I am tired of both Trump and the deranged anti-Trump people.

God, give normal people a break.

[Exterminatore]

Yes, but I have to ask how much of that they even edited. I trust nothing our government tells us and trust no evidence they had the opportunity to get their hands on.