Why don't the US and NATO send F-16s to Ukraine right now?

[MaxUsefull]

[BCA6010]

The obvious reason out of the gate is that they are worthless without trained pilots, and depending on how much they already know, that process can take at least a year. Information on the subject is wildly inconsistent, but as best as I can tell, Ukraine has very few pilots who have even started let alone finished training on the F16. If anyone sends those planes over now, they're just asking to get bombed (though given Russia's inexplicable and inexcusable failure to knock out Ukraine's airfields in the opening days of the war, maybe not...). So far, Ukraine has done an amazing job at completely wasting much of what we send their way, because they did not and will not ever have to pay for it, and frankly life is cheap in the eyes of tyrants and oligarchs.

Don't believe much of anything you hear about that war that doesn't come straight from an on the ground source that you personally know. This has been one of the most heavily propagandized events in world history with both sides and all parties involved grossly embellishing, if not outright fabricating facts to suit their means.

[Drewtate]

What good would they do. The Russians are dug in covered by anti air missile batteries, sighted anti tank weapons and massed artillery with fortified bunkers and tanks in reserve.

If Ukrainian F16 went into combat tomorrow there wouldn't be a single F16 left. These lessons were learned the hard way in Vietnam by the US military and Israeli airforce in Yom kippor war. For instance in the Yom Kippor war when the Israeli airforce tried to attack Egyptian positions on the other side of Suez canal the suffered heavy loses, in fact they lost about 1/4 of their entire airforce. It was a similar problem for the us military over north Vietnam which the Soviets had turned into the largest most advanced concentration of air defences at the time. Specific tactics& strategies of taking down air defence systems had to be developed and we saw the fruition of this during the Gulf War and Bosnian war. Stealth aircraft was also developed for this purpose along with electronic warfare aircraft and the Ukrainians are not capable of conducting this complete kind of aerial warfare and will never be. A non-stealth aircraft can not survive over the Russian occupied dombass or keiv areas.

So basically unless the Ukrainians are handed F35s, F22s, F117s, F23 or some new cheap aircraft with Stealth features new fighters won't matter anymore than new tanks.

[AutumnSerenity]

Well, the good news is that no one is going to use nuclear weapons (not even the communists) because everyone knows the outcome of that - no one wins. However, we’re treading lightly with Ukraine because Putin knows that he can easily initiate a global conflict (WW3) by sending guided missiles to a NATO ally. We’re simply trying to avoid a global conflict.

[AutumnSerenity]

(WWIII)*

[Drewtate]

If Putin nuked Ukraine NATO wouldn't do Jack shit. The reason Russia can't nuke Ukraine is because Ukraine is a neighbouring country. Its one thing nuking a country on the other side of the planet but when it's on your boarder you would be iradiating your own territory, your own people, your own food supply, your own water supply etc. Even just a little nuke. Children born with deformities, lowered fertility rates, erectile dysfunction, cancers, tumours and so on.

[AutumnSerenity]

Ukraine isn’t a NATO ally so, no, we wouldn’t do anything.

[AutumnSerenity]

@Drewtate, however, the use of a nuclear weapon would be enough for us to get involved.

[Drewtate]

... and do what?

[AutumnSerenity]

What do you think, kiddo?

[Drewtate]

... condemn it in the international community, marches in solidarity with Ukraine and change our Facebook profile to the Ukraine flag.

[AutumnSerenity]

I wish. Unfortunately, anyone using a nuke in this day and age will initiate WWIII (although it looks like we’re already in the initial stages of it).

[Drewtate]

You actually think that if Russia used a nuke in Ukraine we would actually engage in nuclear war with a country that has 6000 icbms that could completely flatten every city in the US. You dreaming, we will do much less than when Russia invaded Ukraine

[AutumnSerenity]

Well, the US isn’t going to sit idly by while a dictator nukes other countries. We have among (if not the most) powerful military in the world. Do your research. If you hate the US, move to Russia - I’m sure they need soldiers since Ukraine has already obliterated most of their military.

[pascal_climbs]

Doing that puts them directly into the conflict and then things may escalate (nukes). Nobody wants that. There will no winners in that case, only losers.

[jshm2]

Because who the fuck is going to fly it and arm that flying coffin?

Most warplanes are useless against Russian sunburn missiles - and a deathtrap against the newer stuff. Not even the USA can fuck with Russian missiles. Even NASA buys it's rockets from Russia!

It's why you always hear the Ukrainians wanting more tanks and artillery - but never more planes. They know the West can give nothing better in the air, but only on the ground.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

The USA tehnology is the moust advance in the world, all the war equipment from USA are better x100 time then russian one.
What Russia say about it own army is propaganda, as the "second" moust powerful nation, it can't take down the 15 rank army in the world.
USA can take an entire country at any time they declare, comparing whit Russia who whas expecte to take Ukraine in 3 days and end up in a 2 yare bloody war.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

I olso don't understand, in my country they prepare the ukrainian soldgers to fly them but i feel like it take so long and there had been made so many exxcuse for thous moneys and equipments to be send in the very last moment.
I think that Poland demand unconditionaly suport for Ukraine is the best action tht Europ and N. America can do.
I will olso like to demand more suport for Ukraine in this conflict

[DryGermanGuy]

Training the pilots, establishing a distribution channel for parts and maintenance, planning how to get them into Ukraine covertly… it will happen in the first quarter of 2024.

[rigmarole]

What do you want us to drop bombs on Ukraine?

[IslaTheWitch]

Because it's not the goal. The goal is to starve Russia, and for this, time it is needed.

[purplepoppy]

Because they might piss Putin off and trigger him to nuke the USA

[RedInnocent68]

Because WWIIi would suck even more than Russia v Ukraine.

[KrakenAttackin]

Why? I have no interest in sending more expensive hardware to the Ukraine just to protect democrat bag money.