Would the federal court hear this if Kilmar Garcia really had no rights as MAGA on here keeps saying?

[Anonymous]

"

On Tuesday, a federal judge in Maryland, Paula Xinis, took up Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia’s motion for “additional relief.” The motion asked the Judge to:

Order the Government to take specific steps by Monday, April 14, 2025, including requesting Abrego Garcia’s release under the contract the U. S. has with El Salvador and returning him safely to the United States.

Order expedited discovery of the Government’s actions (or failure to act) to facilitate Abrego Garcia’s return to the United States.

Begin contempt proceedings against the government for “failure to comply with the Court’s prior orders.”

Updates

1 y

In her order, Judge Xinis wrote, “Defendants therefore remain obligated, at a minimum, to take the steps available to them toward aiding, assisting, or making easier Abrego Garcia’s release from custody in El Salvador and resuming his status quo ante. But the record reflects that Defendants have done nothing at all.” Any party other than the government would already be in contempt proceedings, if not the U. S. Marshal’s lockup.

[jshm2]

LOL, the courts have no power to force anything. So it's meaningless whatever the judge says.

[David318578]

The Supreme Court already ruled on it and the liberal Judge is out of luck

[Asker]

Apparently you cannot read, or if you can, you don't understand what youread. The Supreme Court remanded the case to the District Court, and the Court ruled that Trump had to facilitate the return of the immigrant to the US for due process and a trial, which Trump did not do - thus the current filings that I have enumerated in the question and addendum.

Do you need further explanation of this? Stating things that are untrue does not make them true.

[David318578]

I can read just fine, and least thing I read was the supreme Court already ruled. Now in my reading of your post I noticed a complete lack of any links.. care to provide a link?

[Asker]

Sure. https://joycevance.substack.com/ - if you run into a paywall here and cannot read it, DM me and I will copy and send it to you. Joyce is a former federal prosecutor and an accurate legal historian and of course an attorney.

[David318578]

And her order was reversed by the Supreme Court. All she is demanding now is to know what steps they did to retrieve him back.

www.dhs.gov/.../icymi-dhs-sets-record-straight-about-kilmar-abrego-garcia

“The Supreme Court said the district court order was unlawful and its main components were unlawful and reversed 9-0 unanimously, stating clearly that neither the Secretary of State or President could be compelled by anybody to forcibly retrieve a citizen of El Salvador from El Salvador who, again, is a member of MS-13, which—as I’m sure you understand—rapes little girls, murders women, murders children, is engaged in barbaric activities in the world. And I can promise you if he was your neighbor, you would move right away.”

[Asker]

That is just simply untrue. Trump said that. He lies.

[Asker]

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62gnzzeg34o

[David318578]

That is from the department of homeland Security. And think about it logically. The US has absolutely no athority over what another country does with its own citizens. She has no legal standing and that's why it got reversed.

[Asker]

That is absolutely NOT what the court said:

The U. S. Supreme Court issued a brief, unsigned order on April 10, 2025, concerning the wrongful deportation of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia, a Maryland resident. In this order, the Court acknowledged that Abrego Garcia's deportation to El Salvador was illegal and directed the Trump administration to "facilitate" his release from custody in El Salvador. The Court emphasized that his case should be handled as it would have been had he not been improperly deported. However, the Court remanded the case to the lower court for clarification on the additional instruction that the administration "effectuate" his return, indicating that further proceedings are necessary to determine the extent of the government's obligations in this matter.​
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While the full text of the Supreme Court's order is not publicly available, the docket for the case, Noem v. Abrego Garcia, 24A949, can be accessed on the Supreme Court's official website
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Wikipedia

For a detailed summary and analysis of the Supreme Court's decision, you may refer to this article from SCOTUSblog:
SCOTUSblog
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SCOTUSblog

[Asker]

In SCOTUS blog, in this case:

"EMERGENCY DOCKET
Justices direct government to facilitate return of Maryland man mistakenly deported to El Salvador
By Amy Howe
on Apr 10, 2025 at 7:25 pm
The Supreme Court
Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia was taken into ICE custody on March 12, before being removed to El Salvador’s notorious Terrorism Confinement Center. (Katie Barlow)
The Supreme Court on Thursday evening largely left in place an order by a federal judge in Maryland directing the government to return to the United States a Maryland man who is currently being held in a maximum-security prison in El Salvador as a result of what the Trump administration concedes was an “administrative error.” In an unsigned opinion without any recorded dissents, the court turned down the Trump administration’s request to block the ruling by U. S. District Judge Paula Xinis, which Chief Judge John Roberts had temporarily paused on Monday afternoon to give the justices time to consider the government’s request.

The justices agreed that Xinis could require the Trump administration to “‘facilitate’ Abrego Garcia’s release from custody in El Salvador and to ensure that his case is handled as it would have been had he not been improperly sent to” that country. But the justices sent the case back to the lower court for Xinis to “clarify” her additional instruction that the Trump administration “effectuate” his return.

[Asker]

That is hardly a reversal. What you wrote is a recitation of a lie Trump and Miller originated and promulgated, which was repeated by Hoomeland Security because they are fearful of contradicting Trump and Miller.

[Asker]

A federal judge in Washington threatened on Wednesday to open a high-stakes contempt investigation into whether the Trump administration violated an order he issued last month directing officials to stop planes of Venezuelan migrants from being sent to El Salvador.

In a 46-page ruling, the judge, James E. Boasberg, said that he would begin contempt proceedings against the administration unless the White House did what it has failed to do for more than a month: give scores of Venezuelan men deported to El Salvador under the expansive authority of a wartime law called the Alien Enemies Act a chance to challenge their removal.

“The court does not reach such conclusions lightly or hastily,” wrote Judge Boasberg, who sits as the chief judge in Federal District Court in Washington. “Indeed, it has given defendants ample opportunity to explain their actions. None of their responses has been satisfactory.”

[David318578]

Yes and you ignored the most important part of what the supreme Court ruled.. that the DOJ and the President can not be compelled to bring him back.
Facilitate his return is different then demanding his return. President Trump already had a meeting with the president of El Salvador and he said he is not returning him.. it's over, there is absolutely nothing the lower courts can do.

[Asker]

It is certainly NOT over, as you will see in the coming days. I get that you want it to be over, but that is not what is happening Even now, the district Court is parsing the meaning of the term "facilitate" in this context, and reaching some rather damning conclusions.

www.politico.com/.../supreme-court-trump-administration-return-el-salvador-deportee-00285813

[David318578]

yes it needs to correct the phrasing because thats what the supreme court told them to do. But here is the problem for you and the district judge, this is from the Supreme Court link from your politico link..

"The rest of the District Court’s order remains in effect but requires clarification on remand. The order properly requires the Government to “facilitate” Abrego Garcia’s release from custody in El Salvador and to ensure that his case is handled as it would have been had he not been improperly sent to El Salvador. The intended scope of the term “effectuate” in the District Court’s order is, however, unclear, and may exceed the District Court’s authority. The District Court should clarify its directive, with due regard for the deference owed to the Executive Branch in the conduct of foreign affairs."

No court has authority over foreign affairs. I'm sorry but this is dead, there is nothing that district court can do to force a president of another country to give up one of his citizens, nor can that court demand that Trump try and get him back by force or economic pressure. When it clarifies the actions that Trump must take to get him back, it will be struck down because it would "exceed the district courts authority"

[Asker]

The collusion between Trump and the dictator of El Salvador is readily apparent to everyone. You are relying on statements made by the dictator under duress. When Trump or the Justice Department is forced to request the man's remand back here, he will do that. I am certain he does not want this sort of trouble.

[David318578]

Trump and the DOJ can't be forced to request the man back.. thats the point you are struggling with. No court has any authority on foreign affairs, The only thing they can demand is they "facilitate" his return and they listed out how they would do that.. They would provide a plane.
Its over, anything else the district court tries to do will get struck down because again THEY HAVE NO ATHORITY.

Here is the video listing out everything..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scdgJIG_6-U&t=153s

[Asker]

I am not struggling with any of this. They can be ordered by the Supreme Court or the District Court to do exactly that. Whether or not they comply with the order (s) is really the issue.

[David318578]

Yes the supreme Court could order them, but the supreme Court already has said that's outside of courts authority, so they won't.

The Supreme Court has also told the district court it needs to specify what actions it's demanding to happen, whatever actions that get demanded that could actually force the president to bring him home, will get struck down by the supreme Court as being outside the courts authority.

So basically the court can give orders that have nothing to do with foreign policy (which wouldn't get him home) or can make demands that force them to bring him home, which should be outside the courts authority and get overturned.

It's over the authority the courts have can not force him home

[Asker]

I think you are not understanding this at all in that you think that Trump has the authority to violate the Constitution and deprive a person of notice and due process. He does not, although you keep persisting in trying to find ways that he does.

Wait and see what happens.

[David318578]

If he was actually a US citizen then you would have a point, he is not. He is a citizen of El Salvador, what do you think a US district court can do to force an El Salvador citizen into the US?

Tell me what you think they can do, and I will tell you why it's outside of the athority of that court.

[Asker]

For what crime (s) is El Salvador holding him?

[David318578]

That's completely irrelevant to what the US district court has athority over.

But to answer your question he is in jail for being a MS-13 gang member

[Asker]

He is in jail in El Salvador because Trump paid to put and keep him there. The gang stuff is a lie.

[David318578]

2 separate immigration courts had him listed as a MS-13 gang member.

But that's still irrelevant, he could be the nicest guy in the world that has no ties to MS-13 and human trafficking. And still the Distinct court would have no athority to force his return.

[Asker]

Do you always believe MAGA lies like "2 separate immigration courts had him listed as a MS-13 gang member." ?

[David318578]

www.dhs.gov/.../kilmar-abrego-garcia-ms-13-gang-member-history-violence

And the full police report from 2019 is here..

Department of Justice (. gov)
https://www.justice.govPDF
Kilmer Abrego Garcia Documents

Now why are you believing the lies that the media push?

[Asker]

Any federal Judge can order him to make a good-faith attempt to return the man to the US, as he was illegally deported. Whether or not he obeys the order is another matter entirely. Whether or not the man is a gang member is irrelevant. There has been no due process, and no adjudication of any of the various lies Trump and MAGA have told about him.

[David318578]

Forcing the president to attempt to make foreign policy deals is outside the athority of the court.

Also he already had due process back in 2019 when 2 courts ruled he was an illegal alien and a MS-13 member.

But let's pretend that he deserves another day in court, to what end? We are going to waste tax payers $$ to drag him back just to deport him again?

He is a MS-13 gang member that is an illegal alien, he is exactly where he belongs.

[Asker]

You seem to believe that because you say something that makes it true. You have offered proof for nothing. Are you seriously this stupid?

[David318578]

You have it backwards I don't say something and that makes it true, I know the truth and then say something.

I understand the constitutional rolls of the Judicial legislative and executive branches.
Under the Constitution, the President of the United States determines U. S. foreign policy. The Secretary of State, appointed by the President with the advice and consent of the Senate, is the President's chief foreign affairs adviser.

There is a reason the supreme Court demanded the district court be specific is because the judicial branch has no foreign affairs authority.

"Facilitate" is ambiguous and generic, it just means make it easier. So IF (big IF) El Salvador released him, Trump needs to "make it easier" to return. Trump already said they would provide a plane to facilitate that. That's completely different then trying to force the President to make foreign deals to force his return.

There is nothing that the judicial branch can do to impact foreign affairs, I'm sorry that you don't understand that, but that's not my fault.

[Asker]

El Salvador's dictator will do anything that Trump tells him to do regarding this man, just as he imprisoned this man because Trump told him to. Trump may continue to tell him not to do it as he apparently already has, although Trump and many government lawyers are in hot legal and public relations water over this, or Trump may tell the dictator to release him. I think Trump is concerned that causing him to be released will mean admitting he (Trump) made a mistake, which he most likely views as constituting admitting "weakness" and/or Trump is concerned that if the man is released he may cause legal trouble for Trump and others for violating his civil rights, and kidnapping and falsely imprisoning him.

Nobody, including the Courts and the majority of people, believes that Trump did not and does not have any influence in the imprisonment of this man or his possible release. If you believe to the contrary, you are either very naive or very obtuse.

[Asker]

@David318578 You are also misusing language. It is "roles", not "rolls" and it is "remand", not "demand" in your prior post.

All of these words have different meanings, and these were not just spelling errors.

[David318578]

Of course he has influenced, that's his job. I'm positive that if Trump called the President of El Salvador and asked for his release he would be released. The point is that the Judicial Branch has no athority to make that happen.

The Trump team already admitted to making a mistake with him, his deportation was supposed to be handled differently because of the judges order.

Trump ran a campaign on kicking out illegal aliens, that's what he is doing, this man was always going to be deported. He is an illegal alien and a ms-13 gang member and has ties to human trafficking, there is no scenario where Trump would not kick him out.

[Asker]

The Judicial branch, including the Supreme Court, has every right to order Trump (or others) to request his release, and if he refuses, to sanction him. He is not yet a dictator. Kidnapping a person and denying their civil rights is not part of his Presidential duties and thus he arguably has no immunity as you might otherwise suppose.

There is no evidence that he is a gang member, and no evidence that he was involved in human trafficking. If you have evidence of reasonable provenance to the contrary, please do link it here.

[Asker]

Even if you have such evidence, it DOESN'T MATTER. Every person in the US is entitled to notice and due process per the Fifth Amendment, and is not guilty of a crime and cannot legally be punished until they are tried and convicted, not merely the subject of accusations.

Are you an American, or were you educated in the US?

[Asker]

@David318578 My comment here are NOT personal and I admit I can be a bit sarcastic at times - however - my cats Allister and Angus send greetings to your very cute cat!

[David318578]

First off no court can order the President to do anything related to foreign issues, any order would be unconstitutional and outside the athority the construction allows for the judicial branch.

Second there is evidence that he was a ms-13 gang member I have already posted it and 2 courts found him guilty of being a ms-13 gang member and also of being guilty of being in this country illegally.

But you are correct his MS-13 status is completely irrelevant, he is a citizen of El Salvador not the United States, he entered this country illegally and can be deported without being a MS-13 gang member.
Anyone who enters the country legally and gets a green card, or a student visa or work visa can have that revoked and kicked out as well. In fact there was a story pretty recently of a student here on a student visa that got kicked out.

Lastly I'm a Gen X... my generation grew up on sarcastic interactions so no worries and no offense was taken on my part. And my cat Wybie sends his greeting back lol

[Asker]

Of COURSE the Court can make such orders and in fact already has. Where do you get such notions? Please cite the portion of the Constitution stating it is illegal.

He DID enter the country illegally, apparently, although I've yet to see proof of that, but nobody has contradicted it either. I think he previously had an asylum claim that may still be valid, not sure.

I have never seen any evidence that he is or was any sort of gang member, but apparently, in El Salvador, gangs were trying to extort money from his family's food business, which sort of casts doubt on the gang membership accusation. If you have evidence with good provenance supporting gang membership, I would like to see it. I note that gang membership is NOT a crime in the US and not a reason to deport someone.

Which brings me to what I believe is the nexus of our argument: I think it is incontrovertible that this man had an absolute right per the Fifth Amendment to notice and a hearing with due process before being deported, and he did not get that. This was a terrible criminal act on the part of the government, and a gross violation of his Civil Rights as well. Everyone who is deported gets such a hearing, except this guy didn't. He should have.

What should the Government do to mitigate and remedy this crime?

As an aside, should he return to the US, I predict he will sue everyone responsible for this, and that may be why the government is so resistant to retrieving him. Kidnapping, false imprisonment, and multiple violations of civil rights come to mind. I am NOT a lawyer!!!

**Important!!** Allister wants to know if Wybie would like to play laser tag with him - please ask as Allister is bugging me about it..!

[David318578]

The construction spells out the powers of all the branches of the government. It would be like making the argument that the Judicial Branch can make new laws, it can't, it interprets laws and can declare a law unconditional, but has no athority to create a new law because that is outside of the powers of the Judiicial branch.

Article Two of the United States Constitution grants power of foreign policy to the President of the United States,[7] including powers to command the military, negotiate treaties, and appoint ambassadors. The Department of State carries out the president's foreign policy. The State Department is usually pulled between the wishes of Congress, and the wishes of the residing president.[8] The Department of Defense carries out the president's military policy. The Central Intelligence Agency is an independent agency responsible for gathering intelligence on foreign activity. Some checks and balances are applied to the president's powers of foreign policy. Treaties negotiated by the president require ratification by the Senate to take force as United States law. The president's ambassadorial nominations also require Senate approval before taking office. Military actions must first be approved by both chambers of Congress.

The Constitution grants Congress the power to approve the president's picks for ambassadors and the power to declare war. The president is commander-in-chief of the United States Armed Forces. He appoints a Secretary of State and ambassadors with the advice and consent of the Senate. The Secretary acts similarly to a foreign minister, because they are the primary conductor of foreign affairs.[9] While foreign policy has varied slightly from president to president, there have generally been consistently similar goals throughout different administrations.

[Asker]

The link to the police report is broken...

[Asker]

Also, none of this involves commanding the military, negotiating treaties, or appointing ambassadors. Trump sent him there, and he can also ask for him back - and should. He victimized this man and his family, and in mitigation, he should at minimum undo his crime as best he can. If the Constitution controls Trump's activities, then it controlled them via this situation to begin with. You cannot have it both ways. Trump DID violate multiple civil rights in concocting this deportation sans due process.

[Asker]

@david318578 This may help to resolve some of our mutual confusion and differences:

www.stevevladeck.com/.../144-the-supreme-courts-late-night

[Anonymous]

Hold Trump in contempt personally and throw that clown in jail where he belongs finally

[exitseven]

I doubt it. The case was pretty much open and shut. The governemnt had a legitimate deportation order and he was a citizen of El Salvador so he was being returned there.

[Asker]

There are no open and shut cases. Every person who is going to be punished in any way must have notice and due process according to the Fifth Amendment.

[DrPepper12]

Legal residents have rights. Full stop.

[Anonymous]

maybe Corey Booker will bring him back to America.