At what point do you think a fetus/baby in the womb becomes a separate individual from the mother?

[Anonymous]

[Apple1996]

At birth. With one of my babies his body went into shock after birth having to run on his own blood type since before that his body was running soley on my blood type. Pretty interesting how they literally don't even use their own blood until they are born. Completely dependent on the moms body/blood/everything to stay alive

[SuperZonicGUY1992]

Bro I got the correct answer for you. Now the village no longer exist.

Weird thing boomers are insisting and pushing us to have babies when they want to be absent grandparents. The boomers do not even bother showing up at their grandkids the birthday parties or soccer games.

No wonder why so many woman want to be childless because there is no village with these boomers. They want to be called the grandparents when they can't even be bother to send out a happy birthday card for their grandchildren.

[AviatorTom]

Some people view my opinion as controversial.

I believe the fetus is totally dependent on the mother until it can physically survive on its own, viable outside the womb, without extraordinary assistance. That usually happens after 30 weeks gestation.

Up until that point, the woman is in charge. After that point is when the debate really begins.

[goaded]

I don't know about an exact week, and I think late term abortions are almost entirely end-of-life decisions by the indisputable next of kin, but I know people who would insist I uprooted a dozen oak trees with my bare hands today, if they'd been human embryos or fetuses.

Reasonable discussions can be had. Roe was the reasonable compromise, broken by unreasonable people who have doubled the chances of dying while pregnant in states where abortion is illegal.

[14gurlz2gagonit]

@goaded Only the religious right had a problem with Roe for a pretty long time.

You know what made me, a pro-abortion fanatic change my mind about Roe? Progressives started pushing for me to pay for those slut's abortions.

I already know the pro-choice arguments; in fact, I make them myself. But those cases where it's a fucked pregnancy, incest, and so on are few and far between. The bulk of them are just sluts that are too stupid to use protection and too slutty to abstain from sex... and I have no problem with that, until they expect me to pay for their preferred choice of voluntary childlessness or childfreeness.

Basically, it's a case of the left shitting all over one of it's greatest victories which was Roe. Oh, and they also started pushing for shit like after birth abortions as well, so I don't think they were winning over any fence sitters on the subject of "Is abortion killing a child?" Our progressives basically lit a fire under the asses of the pro-life groups.

So, yes I agree that Roe was reasonable... but where they were pushing it to go is what turned it into something the federal government didn't want on it's plate, so they kicked that argument down to the states to deal with at the state level.

[goaded]

@14gurlz2gagonit Funny, because you don't sound reasonable, what with all the slut shaming and lies about "after birth abortions" and so on.

[14gurlz2gagonit]

@goaded Hey I know you're German trying to understand our politics, so I figured I'd break it down from my non-partisan viewpoint about why Roe got fucked. It's just info... I don't care if you like it or not and I'm not trying to sway you in any direction. Personally I don't care if the left legalizes killing kids after birth, or if the right... well, actually if the right got their way I think it would do damage. Statistically speaking crime went down with abortion legalized which is logical if you think about it. It's usually unwanted kids that get treated like shit through childhood and tend to sway that direction.

The after-birth abortions is not a lie... I figured you'd at least look it up and find out I'm not lying if you think it's bullshit. You didn't even bother did you? That's probably what you don't understand about some elements of our far-left wing... they really are so bad that even people that are blue no matter who, decide to opt out. The shit is so bad that I think our left wing is about to split into two parties. Democrats and the progressives. Democrats still hold the power but it's slipping right now to the progressives.

If you were American, which would you be... a regular moderate Democrat or a Progressive Democrat?

[goaded]

@14gurlz2gagonit There's no point in looking up something that can't exist by definition. There's no such thing as an "after-birth abortion" because there's a baby, not a fetus. It's a right-wing lie.

[14gurlz2gagonit]

@goaded lolz alright... they started pushing for it though... it caused a reaction. That's all I'm saying.

Remember I fully support abortion... but even I was face palming as those planned parenthood people and particular senators were suggesting it. Right after they just pushed pretty hard to make tax payers pay for abortions. As a supporter of it, I was like, will they just STFU already. About a month later SCOTUS finally reacted in return... mainly about using federal tax dollars and all that. By pushing it to the state level the federal level just doesn't have to deal with the idea. Thus Roe was overturned, and I'm pretty damn sure it was cause they were trying to make it a money issue for the federal level.

The after birth stuff... was like right along after the strong push to provide abortions. Planned parenthood loved the idea because now they'd get paid on that side of things, it would up the numbers because that pay wall would make it more available... and bla, it is what it is.

It's on the state level now and there are 50 of them. The ultra liberal states still have their abortions as usual and the conservative states finally got to taper it down.

I'm just trying to explain why it got dropped to the state level and you got to turn everything into a stupid fucking argument. WTF dude?

[14gurlz2gagonit]

https://youtu.be/qEv1afKaLhA?si=a9IB6rHBmxe_WaZU

[14gurlz2gagonit]

@goaded You ignored this question btw---> If you were American, which would you be... a regular moderate Democrat or a Progressive Democrat?

[goaded]

@14gurlz2gagonit No. "After birth abortion" was a right-wing lie beginning to end, and you've bought into it.

All this has done is increase maternal and infant deaths in states that banned abortions. Look it up.

White women in Texas are nearly twice as likely to die during pregnancy as before Dobbs.

In true right-wing style, Texas simply stopped looking at those deaths for the years immediately following their abortion bans.

[Реrverted_Сreeр]

It never was one and the same with her. Smash. Next question.

[OlderAndWiser]

Is your real question: at what point should the life of an unborn child be protected? I think that life should be protected from conception.

[David318578]

It's separate DNA from conception. But if you are asking at what point it should not be aborted? Probably some point when there is enough brain activity that it can feel pain would be my guess. When that is I don't know.

[fuddly]

It's a grey area and always will be

There is no right answer

I don't think it anything to do with pain

It's a moral issue

When we can recognize a human we think it's wrong

But from any age 1 week 1 month 2 months
3 months it's a human being

Other hand there's the rights of the mother to live her life. Her right to choose... Can't deny that either.

So best to be respectful of both sides

[strateguy632]

I believe in science a fetus is separate from when it has different d. n. a., as they usually say, "anybody who says different than science is like fascists." Ironic?

[SofaKingsMart]

Literally, when it is physically separated from the mother.

[strateguy632]

But different d. n. a. than mom,
don't you believe in science?

[SofaKingsMart]

@strateguy632
Absolutely.
If it’s in me, it’s a part of me.
If it’s outside of me, it is separate.

Do you follow a science that says otherwise?

[Реrverted_Сreeр]

@strateguy632 to your argument, they reply "because it has different dna, it is considered a parasite".

[SofaKingsMart]

@Реrverted_Сreeр
Oh crap!
Was that the response I was supposed to give?

Guess I missed the memo.

[Lliam]

It becomes separate from the mother as soon as it is born and starts breathing and eating on its own.

[Реrverted_Сreeр]

Smart... you just toss it outside and it hunts and builds its own shelter too.

Even chopping it off from the root a month early would still make it breathe and eat on its own so you're really killing it. Just damaging severely.

[Реrverted_Сreeр]

Come on, it is a murder. But the greater question should be, if murder is necessary at times. If the baby is violent and scares you? Then stabbing it is self defending. But you get the idea. It has a soul and astral body but so do Palestinians. I mean, so does Vladimir Putin and so many people would justify killing him.

[Lliam]

@Реrverted_Сreeр. Separate means separated.

[Miristheiss]

A child has its own unique, separate DNA the moment of conception.

[Anonymous]

What you're really asking is, at what point in a pregnancy does it become murder when a mother chooses to abort the baby. There is no easy answer. To me, it's when the baby has a discernable heartbeat.

[michol123]

It's separate when it comes out and the umbilical cord is cut duh 🙄

[strateguy632]

So mom has two brains? Of course not duh!

[Anonymous]

Think of it this way. A woman can lose a baby at any time for a multitude of reasons, naturally.

[seeyounexttuesday]

It's always a separate individual. It has different DNA.

[SotiCoto]

When they move out to go to university at 18... though even that is no guarantee any more.

[shortster]

When the DNA from the sperm fuses with the DNA from the egg.

[strateguy632]

Precise same as animal biology "life cycle".

[Twalli]

At the point which, if it was removed, it wouldn't immediately die. If it has developed enough to survive outside the womb, it's a human.

[AngryCarl2]

Obviously when the doctor cuts the umbilical cord.

[strateguy632]

Not obvious, in fact educated people know it is separate before.

[goaded]

Shit! My adult kids are still part of their mother?

(They let me do the cutting; it's tough stuff!)

[captain_voidwalker]

When the heart starts beating which is about 6 weeks in.

[I_am_a_human]

When the baby leaves the womb and umbilical cord is cut

[dragoblack]

When it can survive outside of the mother, otherwise it is a literal parasite.

[strateguy632]

Until they corrupt the online dictionary parasite means "plant or animal" i took A screenshit for when liberals will corrupt online stuff. I can't put screenshot in reply.
dictionary.cambridge.org/.../parasite

[strateguy632]

The point is "a different species ".

[dragoblack]

Oxford description states "a parasite is an animal or plant that lives on or inside another animal or plant and gets its food from it" humans are animals by the way.
Oxford description also states "Biological Definition:
A parasite is an organism that lives in or on another living organism (the host) and obtains its nourishment from the host, often to the detriment of the host."
So you can spout your liberal derangement syndrome, all you want, but it takes only moments to educate yourself. And cherry picking info doesn't make you correct, when you don't even fully understand the context of the description.

[Panthero80]

He/she is always a separate being, as the fetus has a deferent genome.

[QuietRunner]

When the baby is tattooed with the barcode ID after birth

[PeachyPie93]

When it is born and not a still birth.

[beenherebefore]

When the baby is born I guess.

[4ngelic]

around 3-4 months

[DawnB]

When the baby is born

[chocolatetwopointo]

when she gives birth?💀 is this not common sense?

[strateguy632]

Maybe, if people didn't listen in biology class it is public opinion.

[chocolatetwopointo]

do u agree or disagree?

[_piotr]

On conception. Egg + sperm.

[Sal_Monella]

At conception, it has its own unique DNA.

[Godihateyou]

Conception. Different DNA.

[Kelly6]

After birth, when he gets his own ID

[Anonymous]

When it develops body parts

[Opinion Owner]

And the heart starts beating

[wkhan_87]

After four months in womb

[strateguy632]

French law, despite modern country banned abortion in third month or later, separate life.

[12karen]

After birth... 😑

[Anonymous]

when (s) he was born

[Dongie]

Upon conception.

[Dongie]

I see me and a few normal people got the answer right.

Just because the new human being is dependent on the mother's gifted body doesn't give her ownership.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

When it's born