Can women beat men in combat sports?

[Anonymous]

If UFC, MMA, Judo etc. had no gender divisions and only weight, how well do you think women would fair vs men? Do you think it would be fair?

[HartleyB]

There have been fights with men vs women of the same weight and the women knocked the guys out so it could happen for sure but there is a societal issue with men and women fighting eachother which is fair enough..

But hypothetically yeh if the weight classes were still in place there are women out there that could beat up a lot of guys there own weight 🤔 and remember we aren't allowed to wear groin protection and guys have to at a professional level and imagine if that rule was removed and groin attacks were legal that would turn the tides very very quickly I feel 😅

[Asker]

So you think in a fight where groin attacks are legal, it would be a fair fight and women would win 50/50? Not sure I agree. Sure getting hit in the balls sucks lol, but men are still faster and stronger and more durable at the same size. Testosterone and all that. So I still don't think it would be that easy. Hitting the balls is no guarantee.

And what martial art do you think women would have the most chance vs men in? And why do you think there is a split if you're so confident women would win just as much as men at a professional level? How come we don't see mixed judo, boxing etc. events happen? There has to be a reason you know.

[HartleyB]

No? I didn't say 50/50 I said it would have the possibility to change fights rapidly.. not just standing up and kicking and punching but imagine if you were wrestling and had your junk grabbed and squeezed? You don't think you would tap out quickly? There actually is a very good video that another girl posted on another post similar to this with a male and female fighting in military uniform at same weight and height and she won and did really really well and I believe she kneed him in the groin and he went down and she choked him to win so it is definitely possible..

Why ask the question if you so desperately want the answer you already think to be true and just refuse anything other than that? Did I say confidently that all women would just beat up all men? No? But like I said imagine in wrestling like sports if you could grab the groin.. like yeh you could do it to a woman to but we can defend against it by closing our legs or moving hips and it isn't as painful as a guy getting his junk squeezed and pulled I personally don't think so

And the segregation from women and men in sports is just the way our societies have developed? We don't like seeing other genders hitting eachother just like we don't like seeing a 160kg guy beating up a 70kg guy? And yeh on average men at the same height as women are usually stronger in upper body so it is an advantage so sure that is a reason as well

[Asker]

Which video are you referring to? Do you mind linking it? I have trouble believing she was even allowed to knee him in the groin like that unless it was a street fight. But yeah a choke might work sure. I never said women couldn't win, just that would be less likely than the men winning. Do you agree with that?

I don't know who's groin is more painful to hit but that's fighting dirty anyway! Would you like winning that way? And if fighting dirty is allowed it's not like women don't have other sensitive parts. None of that should be allowed because it's just dirty and lame and doesn't show who's the better fighter.

It's not just upper body strength men have. We have more durable bodies for punishment than women. And also more lower body strength as well. Otherwise you'd see women dominating in all lower body competitions but it's still men that usually come out on top.

As for wrestling, well if we wrestled, I could just take you down before you had a chance to fight dirty unless you're super skilled at avoiding takedowns. You wouldn't have a chance to go for the groin if you're pinned down quickly. I don't see women constantly beating men in wrestling competitions either but I do agree maybe due to skill and flexibility you have a bigger chance there.

Sure there are societal norms but if people really believed including fit and athletic women that they could beat most guys, they could just challenge males constantly until the narrative got shifted. We don't see that happening because your average woman cannot beat the average man in my opinion.

[HartleyB]

Go find the video on the other post similar to yours.. at least the other guy was thinking about the topic and discussing it without just having an existing conclusion and just repeating it..

Ok all hail the man 🙏 men are superior in every which way and us pitiful women cannot stand a chance against the superior man 🙇‍♀️ bow down to the superior men!

Wtf dude you clearly are just insecure and you want to constantly reassure yourself that your little masculine ego doesn't get shaken at all.. what lower leg sports are you talking about anyway? Women are smaller on average so that makes every other average lower regarding body composition as well as less testosterone but when you consider male and female of the same height and especially weight in reality there really isn't much difference in strength or ability depending on training.. and as for groin strikes specifically the testicles of course you would complain that is dirty why wouldn't you? They are an easy effective target that only men have and are very vulnerable and accessible and you can kick punch knee squeeze and pull them and they are extremely sensitive and debilitating so of course you would rule that out.. if a man can use his strength in a fight to win then why can't his bodies weaknesses be used against him to? Oh because that makes men not be invincible and we don't want that to get out there do we?

Of course the average women is less likely to beat an average man because of the way averages are calculated and the average differences.. that is why I said same height and weight which would not be the average for male and female

[Asker]

Lol I don't know which video you are talking about, you made the claim so you should link it. I'm not insecure but you seem to be when you can't seem to except that the average man is just much stronger. That's not a knock on women, that's just basic biology. Women have other advantages over men but strength is not one of them.

And when I say men are strong in both upper and lower body I'm talking about the SAME size, not smaller women vs larger men lol. Do you understand? Pound for pound men are stronger than women and better at most physical tasks due to testosterone. Women have to work harder to get the half results of men during training. It has nothing to do with average sizes. The average small guy is stronger than the average big woman. Why do you think all combat sports and other sports in general including those with weight divisions are separated by gender?

And you keep ignoring the fact that men can fight dirty too if they wanted to. Groin shots probably hurt a lot for women as well, not to mention... other areas. Trust me, you would NOT like that. You don't WANT those kinds of rules to be allowed.

Look if you're so confident, just challenge a guy to wrestle you or something who's around your size. And make sure to tell him not to hold back (because we men will against women since we don't want to hurt you). You will quickly realize the massive difference!

[Asker]

Also you brought up a good example with wrestling. Wrestling IS separated by weight classes. And according to you, given the same weight and training, women can be just as strong as men. That seems to be your main argument.

If that's the case, how come adult men and women don't wrestle each other frequently? Why are there STILL gender divisions when there are already weight divisions when according to you that's all that really matters? How come there aren't female wrestlers clamoring to compete with the men in their weight division? Doesn't this example alone prove you wrong?

[HartleyB]

Omg what ever dude I dont even care anymore you are probably a fat lazy slob that couldn't even beat a child at wrestling or fighting without running out of breath because it is always that kind of guy that is so insecure that a woman could beat a man at some things that you constantly try to reassure yourself by trying to argue with people about it lmao

Yep ok men are just superior and there is no way that us inferior women can fight the invulnerability of a male and all of his testosterone

How convenient that if a guy loses it is because he is 'going easy' and you clearly don't give a fuck about answers to your questions you just want to keep reassuring yourself that men are just superior in every way so I am wasting my time replying to you

The other post with the video has been deleted by the look of it so just look it up because I'm not going to bother because you are not interesting enough to talk to because you are just interested in stroking your ego

There are gender divisions because there are differences and I acknowledged that but you aren't even taking any notice of what I said so I don't care any more so bye

[Asker]

Why are you getting so overly emotional and angry? I'm just having a calm debate here and you keep flying off the handle for no reason and resorting to personal attacks. And no I'm not fat nor did I say women can never win. You keep putting words into my mouth. So who's insecure again?

Now you are trying to change what you said because here's what you actually said:

"but when you consider male and female of the same height and especially weight in reality there really isn't much difference in strength or ability depending on training"

This is blatantly untrue. Men are much stronger on average even given the same level of training. I'd actually prefer if it wasn't the case but unfortunately it is. Sure a skilled woman could beat a dude in wrestling, I never denied this. I said it was very unlikely given the same skill and size due to the biological differences. I repeat have you ever actually wrestled a guy and won who was a similar size to you and not holding back? Go try it, then come back and tell me there is no difference. And maybe argue with facts and evidence instead of personal attacks and emotion this time.

[HartleyB]

You love jerking yourself off don't you? I am not even upset I am just not interested anymore in your topic because you aren't even interested in it you already have the conclusion you want so you are just wasting my time lol you can stop replying now it is boring reading your replies it is just you saying the same thing over and over and the personal insults are just keeping me same through reading your monotonous boring replies that every insecure guy writes about this topic lmao

[Asker]

The only one that has resorted to personal insults here because she has not real argument is you. You've claimed there's a video that supports your viewpoint but have provided no evidence. You also said this:

"but when you consider male and female of the same height and especially weight in reality there really isn't much difference in strength or ability depending on training"

I've explained why this is blatantly false. It's called... basic biology. Given the same level of training men will almost always come out on top. I repeat, you are wrong here.

If you argue with guys about this and get responses like these, we aren't insecure. We're just trying to explain to you why you are blatantly uneducated on the subject. I've already stated women CAN win in wrestling, just that it's unlikely. Notice how you are dodging my quest, have you tried it and won vs a similar sized dude who wanted to win as much as you?

Because yes, I've horsed around with girls before and found they were extremely weak compared to me and I'm not athlete. I would love for women to be stronger. I repeat, I like athletic strong women. So NO, I'm NOT biased. You're the biased one who's making stuff about me and men in general because you are so insecure.

[HartleyB]

Is there a circle jerk emoji? I have been trying to find one out there for guys like you who like to jerk yourself off and all the guys that agree with you? 🤔

I already admitted that you are the superior sex? End of conversation men are just 1000x stronger smarter faster and cooler than women ok I get it I don't care please stop replying I am sick of your boring shitty responses of you jerking yourself off I don't care 🤣

[Asker]

Why do you insist on hating all men or calling us arrogant and just jerking off? Lol. I'm just trying to tell you what the evidence supports. I don't hate you or anything. Honestly, what you are saying is extremely rude and mean (is that how you talk to all men and women you don't agree with?). I never said women were inferior to men. You just keep putting words in my mouth.

[Beatrice1865]

A woman could win if that woman is Ronda Rousey. Or maybe if the man in question is disabled. But if we’re talking matched for weight class, height, training, etc and everything is controlled for... well... that’s kind of like asking if Michael Cera could beat Bruce Lee in a fight. I guess it’s possible, just highly unlikely.

[Asker]

Thanks for the reasonable and honest take! Women CAN win but it's unlikely. How do you think YOU would do vs a guy around your skill level and size? Just curious.

[Beatrice1865]

I think I have pretty much every advantage short of being male. I’m 5’10, I have mostly fast twitch muscle fibers (I was able to sprint 13 seconds untrained for the 100m, which is rather fast for an untrained female sprinter) which tends to help with punching power. I have pretty respectable lifts, for the most part, and I can lift more than the average guy. However, if you took a guy and gave him the same training or you assessed me next to my brother, there would be no comparison. I wouldn't stand a chance against a man of similar size and body composition to me.

[Asker]

You sound like one strong girl then. Maybe you could beat up most average guys. 13 seconds is very fast for any untrained person, male or female. Out of curiosity how much can you bicep curl? And do you lift often? Just wondering what you consider average.

[Beatrice1865]

My weight for dumbbell bicep curls (3-4 sets with 8 reps) is 35 lbs. I’ve never tested my 1RM but I doubt it’s much higher than that. I’ve been lifting for a couple of years now. Bicep strength is definitely where I tend to see larger differences between sexes on average, as it seems like the average guy can curl more than me whereas I’m leagues ahead of the average woman.

[Asker]

Yup males have generally a lot more upper body strength, lower body tends to be closer. Is that 35lbs combined with both arms? Or just a one arm curl? Because you might be selling yourself short there if it's 35lbs in each arm. That's well above the average women AND average dude. Most untrained dues will not get anywhere near that.

[Asker]

In fact you can see how you fair by looking at this chart:
strengthlevel.com/.../lb#standardsFemale

Obviously weight class matters but unless you are 200+ pounds, your bicep curls are VERY good. Most men would take a bunch of training too before they can get to 35lbs for a single arm bicep curl.

[Beatrice1865]

I meant 35 lbs per arm. I’m roughly 145 lbs so it’s not that out of the ordinary, it’s somewhere between intermediate and advanced and I’ve been training for years. I guess I overestimated the male average because my brother was easily curling 40 lbs untrained, but I think genetics need to be considered. I mentioned my 100m time, and my brothers was better than mine and he has a good enough standing vertical to dunk fairly comfortably at 5’11. On the other hand, my mile time is utter horseshit for someone as physically fit as me and it gets worse and worse relative to other people longer I run, which leads me to believe that I’m genetically predisposed to be better at strength/power sports than endurance sports.