Is this black woman right? BLM doesn’t care about black lives?

[Jersey2]

Yes

No

Results

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

She's not right. She's just another Black person acting on behalf of White conservatives, idiotically defacing a mural of a movement that would have protested on her behalf had police ever killed her unjustly. Black Lives Matter simply addresses the fact that Black people get killed at higher rates by the police than people of other races unjustly, such as when they are unarmed and not posing an immediate threat to the officers. They also address that police officers are unlikely to be disciplined for unjustly killing Black people and that the media, police departments, and general public are likely to demonize the victim rather than the officer that killed them. That basically gives the impression that maintaining the status quo matters more than the lives of Black people unjustly killed by police. Black Lives Matter is simply a movement that addresses this and hopes to raise awareness to this issue with protests. Thankfully, their protests have made a lot of positive changes moving forward, which is a win. Simply because people can riot and commit other crimes under a Black Lives Matter banner doesn't represent the message of the overall movement. Sure, Black-on-Black crime is also a problem, but the main reason Black Lives Matter doesn't protest it isn't because they don't care about Black lives.

Most killings that happen in the Black community are gang related and gangs won't stop killing each other simply because people are protesting their actions. Instead, Black people show that they care about Black victims of Black-on-Black crime by seeking justice for the victim and sharing their condolences with their loved ones. People tend to protest something that requires a solution. When a Black person kills another Black person, more often than not, a solution happens, where that person is often put in prison. However, with police officers breaking conduct, they're very rarely punished. Anybody that actually does believe that Black lives matter would agree that such cops should be punished. In addition, many church programs, community organizations, anti-gang violence groups, and "Stop the Violence" campaigns exist nationwide in Black communities, which also symbolizes care. Those groups can address Black-on-Black crime while Black Lives Matter should be able to address police when they do wrong. As for defunding the police, it's simply a call for action to hold police officers accountable for their actions. It also doesn't mean that the police force would be abolished completely. It simply means that much less taxes, among other other things should be paid to support them and, instead, go to programs that can actually make positive change. Too many of them abuse their power and many of them are getting fired left and right for expressing their hateful views towards Black people. It's 100% fair to defund the police until they learn how to be held accountable for their actions and treat the people that they're supposed to "protect and serve" with respect.

[Jersey2]

Defunding police means a rapid and steep climb in murder rates and violent crime, it’s true and is playing out in places like NYC right now! People, black people, are dying because of this and she knows it.

Gand deaths may be inevitable but the numbers of them can be lowered with more police. Defunding won’t hurt middle class white kids who are protecting for this, they will be safe and comfortable.

Blacks are responsible for more than half of murders with only 13% of the population. Murders and criminals don’t want to be arrested so they fight, most of the time, with police. The police are aware of it and react swiftly as they know how it will go down if they don’t.

She has a right to not have bullets fly through her apartment killing people while they sleep. She has a right to walk in the dark and not be robbed. She has a right to have drug dealers taken off her streets so children can walk to school. These are real issues.

[Jersey2]

Gang deaths may be inevitable...

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Jersey2:

"Defunding police means a rapid and steep climb in murder rates and violent crime, it’s true and is playing out in places like NYC right now! People, black people, are dying because of this and she knows it."

Defunding the police simply means to reallocate most funds and tax dollars away from local police departments to other government programs that can aid the community better. It doesn't abolish the police or prevent them from working. Also, the police still exist in New York. Murder's always going to exist regardless of whether the police are funded. If her main concern is Black people dying, protesting a group that isn't killing Black people isn't the solution. Her community organizing and forming and/or joining anti-gang violence campaigns rather than destroying the mural of a movement that would have protested on her behalf if cops unjustly killed her is the best solution. However, she won't do that because she just wants positive attention from White conservatives. To conservatives, she looks like a hero, but to those with at least half a brain, she looks like a complete fool.

"Gand deaths may be inevitable but the numbers of them can be lowered with more police. Defunding won’t hurt middle class white kids who are protecting for this, they will be safe and comfortable."

More police presence won't lower gang activity, as much of history shows. Police only have the power to enforce the law by arresting criminals. They don't do anything to prevent people from committing crime. Hardened criminals don't care about police presence and smart criminals infiltrate the police. Defunding the police is not done to "hurt" people. It's simply meant to put our funds and tax dollars to better use, as opposed to people putting them in the hands of people that very rarely get punished for breaking conduct.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Jersey2:

"Blacks are responsible for more than half of murders with only 13% of the population. Murders and criminals don’t want to be arrested so they fight, most of the time, with police. The police are aware of it and react swiftly as they know how it will go down if they don’t."

According to the most recent numbers, the 2018 murder data table, Black people were responsible for 38% of the murder, not "over half." I agree 38% of the murders with being only 13% of the population still indicates a much higher murder rate compared to Whites, but only 16,335 murders were committed in 2018 and Black people only committed 6,318 of those murders. The Black population is around 43,000,000, meaning that 0.01% of Black people committed murder. In other words, murder is not that common of a crime compared to others and the vast majority of Black people are not killers. Regardless, even if Black people have higher murder rates, that doesn't mean that we should allow the police to kill us unjustly, get off scot-free, and demonize the victim rather than the killer.

"She has a right to not have bullets fly through her apartment killing people while they sleep. She has a right to walk in the dark and not be robbed. She has a right to have drug dealers taken off her streets so children can walk to school. These are real issues."

And we have the right not to be killed unjustly by the same people that we pay our taxes to so that they can "protect and serve" us. That is just as much of a "real issue" as the issues that you named.

[Jersey2]

Reduce Funding = Reduced Police which = More Black Deaths.

It is a simple yet reliable formula. Murder rates are already up in those cities as the police are being held back. I am fine amend comfortable where I sit, so not threat to me, I’ll just stay out of those cities. But for those that live there it will be hell.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Jersey2: Murder rates rise and fall regardless of police presence. I don't understand how you don't understand that simple fact.

[Jersey2]

Wow. Okay. That’s pig headed. The rates have already gone up in NYC far and above what would be expected otherwise. The carnage in the near future will even catch your attention. And like I said, I’ll be fine. Dead black people don’t bother me that much I guess. Have a good day.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Jersey2: It's not "pig headed." It's the straight up truth. Crime rates rise and fall regardless of police presence. Crime rates tend to spike in the summer regardless in nearly all major cities. Combine the summer with the pandemic, high unemployment rates, and the protests, and you have an increase in gun crime nationwide. New York is not the only major city experiencing it and it has been going on in New York before their police department was defunded. You just don't want to accept the facts. As for you not caring too much for dead Black people, well, I'm not surprised in the slightest. Have a terrible day.

[Jersey2]

I will keep an eye out to what you point out. We will all see in the long run.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Jersey2: And with that, also make sure that you take everything I said in all my replies to you with consideration.

[Electric_Dreams]

- BLM absolutely would protest on her behalf if she was killed by non-black police... so you're half right there. It's clear that if she was killed by black police however they would not protest on her behalf. More to the point, statistically the chance of her being killed by a black civilian is astronomically higher than the chance of her being killed by a white police officer or of any police officer for that matter. If this much more likely scenario were to happen to her, then BLM would absolutely not protest on her behalf.

- Black Lives Matter spreads the lie/fallacy/misinformation/falsehood that black people get killed (unjustly) at higher rates by police than people of other races. All I know is the statistics for unarmed civilians killed by police in America, and in this context black civilians absolutely are not killed at higher rates than people of other races. I can't speak for armed civilians.. although I would not be surprised if black civilians actually are killed at higher rates when armed, because there's a link between civilians being armed and civilians committing murder, and I do know that the leading cause of death for black Americans is murder by black Americans.. so for this reason I would not be surprised if huge numbers of armed black civilians are killed by police (one of which was Michael Brown for a fact).

- I'm not sure about disciplinary procedures, however I do believe that those very very few police who unjustly kill black Americans do appear to get off pretty light, and that bothers me. To suggest that the general public and the media especially, are likely to demonise black people killed unjustly by police is ridiculous at this point. Considering that the many mainstream media outlets take an awfully biased approach on the side of BLM, and that many indoctrinated civilians such as yourself lap it up.

[Electric_Dreams]

- What positive changes have their protests made? Please compare the positive changes BLM have achieved to the positive changes instrumental black civil rights advocate Martin Luther King jr. made. BLM activities have actually resulted in the deaths of black civilians this year, where BLM supporters were likely responsible for the deaths. In at least one case it is a definite that BLM supporters were directly responsible (little girl shot in her mum's car). A frightening number of people died in Seattle's CHAS-CHOP though, including a 16 year old black boy executed by ANTIFA. Yes ANTIFA not BLM, however BLM were instrumental in the formation and management.. or lack thereof, of the CHAS-CHOP. BLM are partially responsible for everyone that died as a result of Seattle's CHAS-CHOP. This also includes a 19 year old Black American.

- "Sure, Black-on-Black crime is also a problem". You can take pride in the fact that you got one thing right. ... "but the main reason Black Lives Matter doesn't protest it isn't because they don't care about Black lives" ... oh. Please tell me why BLM do not protest the epidemic numbers of black Americans killed violently by black Americans. Please tell me why the comparatively minuscule number of black Americans killed by police is of more importance to them.

[Electric_Dreams]

- Gang activity actually has a lot of innocent victims. Whether that's someone completely uninvolved in gangs that is killed violently due to gang activity (murder, mistaken identity, whatever it may be), or whether it's someone that is involved in gangs, but primarily due to fear, whereby being involved in a gang is the preferable option (preferable to being murdered, their family being hurt). Everyone is innocent of gang activity until they become involved in a gang, and some of those who become involved are not initially enthusiastic about it. Furthermore much gang activity revolves around illegal drug trade (a problem which would be astronomically reduced with the abolition of prohibition.. but that's a whole other issue), which again has many innocent victims.

- Actually many people in black communities do not seek justice for the victim. In many cases it is very difficult to get witnesses to speak up, to get members of the community to help assist the police, because of fear of the (black) gangs, or because of a hostile attitude toward the police.

[Electric_Dreams]

I’m sorry, at this point your argument consists of desperately clutching at straws, ridiculous mental gymnastics, excuses, to try to justify why BLM do not talk about the epidemic of black Americans, many of them NOT involved with gangs, killed violently by black Americans, many of them involved with gangs. It's futile to justify the unjustifiable. If more often than not a solution happens where the person is put in prison, then why are black Americans still being killed violently by black Americans at epidemic proportions? This tells us that these so-called "solutions" are not actually solving the problem. They are not solutions. Sure some of the murderers go to prison, however the overarching problem of black Americans being killed violently by black Americans on an epidemic scale is not being solved. It might be solved if every single black American gang member in the US were to spontaneously combust. Might be. However, in a few years at the most, the problem would return. Many black American children grow up (fatherless), become involved in gangs, and kill people violently.. usually people of the same race.

- "Anybody that actually does believe that Black lives matter would agree that such cops should be punished." .. I think the vast majority of people do believe that black lives matter. Because it's obvious, it's stating the obvious. Very few people are actually saying anything to the opposite (although actions speak louder than words and more black people are killing black people than non-black people are killing black people). Furthermore I think very few people are saying that such cops should not be punished. Again, stating the obvious. It seems like you're insinuating that there are many people who don't think these cops should be punished, who don't think black lives matter. There are not. Not many.

[Electric_Dreams]

- "In addition, many church programs, community organizations, anti-gang violence groups, and "Stop the Violence" campaigns exist nationwide in Black communities, which also symbolizes care." Great. They should exist. Why is the group that focusses on the single digit number of unarmed black Americans killed by police in the last year much more popular, widely known, prevalent in the media, much more active, empowered and supported than these groups which focus on the epidemic numbers of black Americans killed violently by black Americans? The group that talks about the 9 people is one of the most talked about organisations in the country, but the groups that talk about the 900+ (probably way more) are barely talked about, especially outside of their own communities. Why? Justify that.

- "... go to programs that can actually make positive change" Like what?

- "many of them are getting fired left and right for expressing their hateful views towards Black people." For criticising BLM. Criticism is not bad.. people seem to think that it's bad, but it's not. Everything should be criticised, because criticism is drawing attention to problems, contradictions, hypocrisies and double standards that if positively addressed will benefit the subject of the criticism. Criticism is not hateful. Furthermore I do believe more police are leaving the police force or suffering from "blue flu" than are being fired for criticising BLM, or as you put it "expressing their hateful views".

- "It's 100% fair to defund the police until they learn how to be held accountable for their actions and treat the people that they're supposed to "protect and serve" with respect." Then I would argue that it is also 100% fair to defund BLM until they learn how to be held accountable for their actions and treat the people that they're supposed to "protect and serve" with respect; specifically black people.

Your vision is not clouded by bias. This is plainly obvious.

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kfgz-o4asU8

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb5GTdExw_w

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDJ4jBoHwK0

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbkFB1EtReM

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7niLmM6JgQ

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgpoBpUCQ6E

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFkJDwASf4s

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZkctbbPhw0

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z87t0f1-hiI

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUZtdDQhDH8

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuD0cR_7VQ8

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kjU-scnwec&t=1s

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NVqzq710mc

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kx6AqKu9QJs

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HwvbEJDsvg

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMtZ8V3_LVc

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtFKIPugsok

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fma3f91WOUU

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6mBZSQdGCE

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el0A_oO6E7M

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLuJa9X21PE

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVIhRvkT8kg

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlM1jBEWfNo

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTcViL8Udo0

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMGs9d0R-Ls

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBC-pdmeMbY

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXCDNh7LfM4

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUJ4J19taeM

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWZqh93lewA

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Sk4-p_0pcU

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM-w7fDuFJw

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sV5qU6e-YY

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cUQqPxw3hc

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AL-vuY27grY

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuC2TiCks5o

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0w9H7jJp7I

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c44gMpMEfM

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xr5DVYbQKgY

[Jersey2]

@Electric_Dreams

What? No Diamond and Silk!

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZN4A8w20OE

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqJnzBHURvs

[Electric_Dreams]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17JMEPQjlnk

[Electric_Dreams]

I could go on

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

Wow, you really posted a lot of comments to me. Well, I can do that too and, still, I will respond. In your first comment, you mention that Black Lives Matter wouldn't protest if a Black cop killed this woman. That's just not true. Black Lives Matter has protested the actions of corrupt cops of all races. You also mentioned that the chances of this woman being killed by another Black civilian than another police officer is higher. That might be true, but doesn't matter. Simply because a Black person has a higher chance of being killed by another Black person doesn't mean that we should allow cops to break conduct and kill us. By your logic, if another Islamic terrorist attack occurred in the United States, we shouldn't care about it because Americans kill each other more than terrorists kill Americans. BLM has every right to protest police misconduct, something that you seem to have a serious problem with. You mentioned that Black people are not killed at higher rates by police compared to other races and that BLM is just spreading fallacies and falsehoods. Your claim is a falsehood. Statistics show that Black people are far more likely to be killed by police compared to other races and studies even show that Black people are more likely to be killed by police when unarmed and not posing a threat to officers. Links to the statistics and studies would be shown below.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

In a study called "Officer characteristics and racial disparities in fatal officer-involved shootings" conducted by David J. Johnson, Trevor Tress, Nicole Burkel, Carley Taylor, and Joseph Cesario, a portion of their study mentions an alarming truth, which states the following in the paragraph "Racial Disparities by Type of Shooting," it states:

"Examination of National Violent Death Reporting System data shows racial differences across types of fatal shootings. Black civilians fatally shot by police (relative to White civilians) are more likely to be unarmed and less likely to pose an immediate threat to officers (26). In contrast, White civilians (relative to Black civilians) are nearly three times more likely to be fatally shot by police when the incident is related to mental-health concerns and are seven times more likely to commit “suicide by cop” (26). These are incidents where a civilian threatens a police officer for the purpose of ending their life (27) and reflect higher rates of suicide overall among Whites relative to Black and Hispanic civilians (28)."

More information on that study could be found in the link below.

https://www.pnas.org/content/116/32/15877#ref-13

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

As for armed civilians, the same study shows that Whites are more likely to be armed compared to Black people and are more likely to attempt suicide by cop. However, most armed police killings are justified and justified killings are 100% irrelevant to my claims. I am glad you admit that you're bothered by unarmed Black people not posing a threat to police officers being unjustly killed by police, as any normal human should be. However, you seem to emphasize "very few." That honestly disturbs me. Even if the numbers are low compared to civilian-on-civilian murder, it's still a problem. Even if the numbers aren't high compared to other murder rates, their lives still matter. Terrorist attacks on United States are low compared to American-on-American murder, but they're still a major problem when they happen. Police officers should definitely be held accountable for their actions. You say that it's ridiculous that the media and general public demonize Black victims of unjust killings. When George Floyd was killed unjustly, the media and public made him out to be the villain by putting out his criminal record and saying he wasn't a hero as if he was the killer, but hardly anything was said about his killer, Derek Chauvin. There is no "indoctrination" on my part. I simply follow the facts that my links to raw studies and statistics can verify.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

You asked about what positive changes have occurred due to the protests? Many companies have changed their policies, the government has been considering new police reform bills, some cities and states have approved of reparations for Black people, the police has been defunded in some cities, and so on. The Civil Rights Movement in Martin Luther King's era is very similar to this era. Both have made positive changes. However, no one said that the Civil Right Movement ended with Martin Luther King. It's been continuing on ever since then and still making changes today. As for BLM being responsible for the deaths of some Black people, no evidence proves that they were actually BLM supporters. BLM is not an official organization, but rather a political statement. Anybody can commit foul acts under a BLM banner, but that doesn't represent the overall message or the statement itself. Reports of existed of White supremacists groups pretending to be BLM supporters during riots to destroy Black owned businesses and kill Black people. For instance, If I and a group of friends wore a shirt or carried a sign saying that I supported Trump or the Republican Party in general and committed heinous acts during riots or whatnot, that doesn't represent Trump supporters or Republicans, but rather us. By your logic though, it does. That's a poor argument. As for the CHOP shooting, I looked into the story of the 16-year-old boy being killed. What evidence do you have that Antifa killed him? If you do have evidence, please ensure that your sources are not biased. You said that I can "take pride" in the "one thing" I got right. I take pride in everything I say and, yes, Black-on-Black crime is a problem. Crime is a problem. As for why BLM doesn't protest Black-on-Black crime, I can tell you that, but you have to be willing to listen without bias.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

That's because people generally protest something that doesn't have a solution and they want the government to be aware of it so they could make changes. Most Black-on-Black crime often has a solution, which is the offender going to prison. When a police officer unjustly kills an unarmed Black people, he typically doesn't get punished. That's something that needs to be protested so that the government can make changes and punish them. Also, most murders that occur in the Black community are gang and drug related. Drug dealers and gang bangers could seriously care less if people protested against them. They're not going to stop making all that fast money off drug sales and stop the gang wars just because groups protest against their actions. The government is more likely to listen to protesters than criminals. BLM not protesting it doesn't mean that they don't care about Black-on-Black crime because protesting is not the only way to show care. We express care when our people get killed by gang and drug violence by sending out condolences to their family members, supporting them in any way we can through donations, seeking justice for the victims, supporting the many anti-gang violence campaigns in Black neighborhoods, support the churches that help the community, support community outreach that helps keep Black youth off the streets, and seek political solutions that could reduce the level of crime in our communities. The problem is that many people aren't convinced that this actually happens because the news doesn't always show it. Many people that do this are also BLM supporters too. In other words, we have people in our community regularly doing all they can to end the violence in Black communities, and people that address the violence against us committed by other groups such as corrupt cops. Again, simply because Black-on-Black crime is more common does not mean we should allow police officers to commit crimes against us.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

You mentioned that gang activity claims a lot of innocent lives. Sure, gang members do sometimes kill innocent people, whether on purpose or accident. Still, the majority of people targeted by gang members are other gang members or drug dealers. The reason I mentioned that most Black-on-Black violence is gang violence is because the vast majority of Black people are not killers and, as I said to Jersey, the latest statistics I could find, Black people committed just over 6,318 murders in 2018. Sure, compared to Whites, that's a high murder rate, but compared to the Black population, which is 43,000,000, that's 0.01% of the Black population. You mentioned that many people in Black communities don't seek justice for victims. That's not true. Many criminals in the Black community don't seek justice for the victims. Criminals have a lot to lose if they snitch. However, contrary to common belief, many Black people are law abiding citizens that have no problem seeking justice for victims and raising awareness. You claim that I am making excuses trying to "justify" BLM not protesting Black-on-Black crime. I already explained to you how not every problem requires a protest as a solution. If you seriously can't understand how gang members and drug dealers won't stop what they're doing because of simple protests, then I don't know what to tell you. Simply put, they don't care. Protests are for raising awareness. We are already well-aware of Black-on-Black crime. Black-on-Black crime has other solutions rather than protests, as I mentioned before.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

You mentioned that the "solutions" are not solving the problem. As mentioned, only 0.01% of Black people commit murder and crime rates have been dropping slowly for years. The solutions obviously aren't perfect because the reasons for violent crime is complex and has several underlying issues that would likely take generations to fully address. To put it simply, murder is something that is difficult, if not impossible to stop. Some people are just straight up psychopaths with no empathy for others. However, that's not the point when I mentioned "solution." By "solution," I meant that even if Black-on-Black crime is a problem, Black offenders are still held accountable for their actions. Cops that break conduct against Black people, however, are very rarely punished. That's the issue. We can't expect a simple BLM protest against Black-on-Black crime to garner a perfect solution. If anything, it would only serve as a distraction from holding cops accountable for their wrongdoings as well. Sure, many Black people might not have a father in their home, but still many Black people still undergo discrimination in the workplace and housing, and thus are more likely to be regulated to the most dangerous neighborhoods, and have to turn to crime to support themselves as well. As I said, the problems are extremely complex and are not as simple as putting the reasons for crime on one simple cause. Either way, regardless, my sole point is no matter what reason Black people commit crime, Black people are held accountable for their wrongdoings while corrupt cops very rarely are.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

How do you know that the majority of people truly believe that Black lives matter? What evidence do you have to support that claim? I'm skeptical because too many people oppose the BLM movement and claim that it's "racist," and too many people demonize Black victims of unjust police killings, just like they did with George Floyd. Personally, I think that most Americans care more about the status quo than Black people being unjustly killed by police. They're not likely to say that because they don't want to be seen as racist. Thus, they find more clever ways to express themselves by saying things such as "all lives matter" while refusing to say that "Black lives matter." Yes, you're right, more Black people are killing Black people than non-Black people are killing Black people. Again, that doesn't give cops the right to break their conduct to kill us either. I'm seriously having trouble understanding why you're objecting to that simple fact. If police officers are killing us unjustly and getting off scot-free we have EVERY RIGHT to protest that so that they could be held accountable and thus prevent this in the future. I don't want to have to wait for the numbers to drastically increase before we "officially" say it's a problem. A person killing someone and getting away with it is ALWAYS a problem. I want to address it and stop it before it actually does increase in numbers. As long as police officers are not held accountable, the job of police officer becomes more attractive to racists, which could potentially increase its numbers. We don't want that to happen.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

As for your videos, most of them come from biased conservative sources or just celebrity opinions on Black Lives Matter, whom mostly all happen to be Black. Conservatism is all about maintaining the status quo. Thus, they're highly likely to oppose anything that aims to bring change, which includes Black Lives Matter. If that's not bias, then I don't know what is. I don't care about that. I only care about the truth. The truth is that Black people are killed at higher rates than other races by police when they are unarmed and not posing a threat to the officer. When this happens, the officers are very rarely punished, implying that the status quo matters more than the Black victims. The Black Lives Matter is a direct response to that fact. Because I believe that justice should be served for these Black victims, I support Black Lives Matter. I don't care what any celebrity, conservative, or YouTuber has to say about it. They can try to demonize the movement all that want, but at the end of the day, as long as Black Lives Matter continues to oppose the FACT that Black people are unjustly killed at higher rates without being punished, I have no reason to oppose Black Lives Matter.

[Electric_Dreams]

You are delusional, blinded by your own bias. You deny facts, you deny logic. You are very clearly indoctrinated. Attempting to debate with you is futile because you talk absolute nonsense, you deny facts and logic, you refuse to believe or comprehend the possibility that you could be wrong, mistaken or misguided on anything. You offer ridiculous whataboutisms which are irrelevant to the primary issue. You conduct desperate mental gymnastics to make the most ridiculous, nonsensical attempts at an explanation for your thoroughly hypocritical, rampantly contradictory, double-standard riddled, logically unjustifiable arguments. I destroyed your argument, and you responded by talking nonsense, and refusing to accept truth and logic. I've done it with yourself at least once before on here, on the same matter.. and again, there is no point attempting a debate with someone such as yourself once I've made the initial response. I think sadly you are a lost cause, at the age of 29 n' all. If you are 19 one could have hope that your mind would mature along with your body.. but you should have done all that by now. That said.. quite a lot of indoctrinated social justice warriors such as yourself do take a turn in their 30s or perhaps as late as their 40s.. so there may be hope yet.

I could destroy the majority of your awful attempts at counter-argument there, maybe even every one of them.. but like I said it's pointless. You talk nonsense, you are literally delusional. .. although I think your primary delusion is bias. Extreme bias is a mental illness.

[Electric_Dreams]

If you think you are more intelligent than all of the people in those videos I commented then you are extremely delusional indeed. If you think you are more intelligent than half of them, even if you think you are more delusional than a quarter of them, then you are absolutely, extremely delusional and indeed you are a lost cause.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

Wow, after all that, you respond to me with nothing but disrespect, calling me "delusional" and a lost cause. I was very respectful to you in my responses. Not once did I ever insult you. I was expecting a long, but friendly debate because you seemed respectful at first despite disagreeing with me. By the way, you didn't "destroy" any of my arguments, sweety. I responded to all of your claims with facts. You just simply don't want to accept the facts. You don't care about whether or not what you believe is true. Instead, you care more about what is politically conservative rather than what the raw data says. That, my friend, makes you biased. Yet, you call me a "lost cause." You literally linked me to a bunch of conservative YouTubers and you quote debunked data from conservative sources.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

Facts I mentioned in response to your false claims:

• BLM has protested Black officers breaking conduct
• Even if Black crime rates are high, Black people still have the right to protest crimes committed against them by police.
• Black people do get killed at higher rates than Whites, especially when unarmed and not posing a threat to the officers. Even sent a link to the raw study confirming this. https://www.pnas.org/content/116/32/15877#ref-13
• That police officers do rarely get punished for misconduct. This link in Chicago shows that only 7% get disciplined. https://beta.cpdp.co/
• Listed changes made like Black people being approved for reparations, companies changing policies, police discipline bills being passed in many states, and so on when you asked me.
• Mentioned you provided no evidence the teen killed in the CHOP shooting was a victim of Antifa and asked you to prove it.
• Explained to you BLM don't protest Black-on-Black crime because Black criminals are already held accountable while police officers are not due to 7% of them being disciplined.
• Explained how people can still care about other issues without protesting them.
• Explained the numerous anti-gang violence and youth programs that Black people support to fight Black-on-Black crime.
• Did the math explaining only 0.01% of Black people committed murder in 2018. 6,318 out of 43,000,000 Black people equals 0.01% of Black murderers.
• Explained no matter the number of the Black people killed, Black people still have the right to protest injustice. For example, if a terrorist only kills two people, we have a right to oppose terrorism even if Americans kill more Americans than terrorists.
• Your videos are people expressing their opinions on BLM, which is irrelevant. I won't stop supporting BLM just because a few YouTubers, celebrities, and conservatives don't like it.

[Tiffany_Taylor_Made]

@Electric_Dreams:

Sweetheart, everything I posted in these bullets are facts. You can't claim I'm "biased" because I accept the truth. If your goal is to change my views on BLM, please address every bullet and prove those statements wrong using logic with non-biased evidence. If they're wrong, I dare you to show me how. If you can't, have a great day.

[Mystic_Nova]

Bet this won't be on the news for long. But she is right.

[Jersey2]

That’s true. I saw it as Diamond and Silk posted it. They are two black women who support Trump. I then found the video after much searching in YouTube, it seems like they are burying it.

[Jersey2]

There is also a video of a Lesbian woman who is a Trump supporter who did something similar last week. I also know lesbian Trump supporters but you won’t see that on the news.

[Mystic_Nova]

If they ate white, theyll be on the news. All the other peeps who vandalized it, theyvnake sure to put white so and so vandalized blm mural

[Jersey2]

The white people who did it were charged with a hate crime. I don’t understand that and I guess they won’t charge her with a hate crime. It’s a convoluted mess.

[Mystic_Nova]

Exactly. At this point I'm just waiting for the aliens or even jesus to come down and be like "the faq guy" 🤣

2021 will be interesting to say the least

[Jersey2]

We still have the “October Surprise” to look forward to... which is going to be huge I would imagine given the craziness of the political theater thus far.

[Not_Average]

They care about less than 1% of black lives in the US. The statistics show that less than 1% of black homicide is inflicted by white police officers. The rest are inflicted by other black people according to statistics.

I think they started out with a good premise- but it's just turned into something else entirely. I mean, they defunded NYPD 1 billion dollars, thus collapsing police presence. Now homicide is up 400%. I think if you look at the facts, and genuinely care about the betterment of the black community- you'd realize that they need more police on the streets. All studies showcase that less police presence equates to more crime. Taking away public safety shouldn't be politicized. It's just an obligation from the government.

It's really terrible as to how they're manipulating the masses of Americans. Most Americans are good people that possess morals. When an American is told that Police Officers are mindlessly murdering masses of black people on the street for no other reason than they're black- of course they're going to be against that. If you dig into the facts, you'd realize that this whole movement just doesn't factually add up to what they say they're fighting for. It's causing a lot more harm than good.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

She's right. Black Lives Matter organization doesn't care about black people nor their lives.

The BLM don't protest nor show up when Derrick does a drive by and kills other Black people.

Nor the does the Black Lives Matter movement show up to protest and try to protect the termination of Black fetuses getting aborted daily by the thousands.

Its all a sham.

[Jersey2]

I agrre

[Flower7]

She does seem to have a point with her statements.

I don't understand why those police are treating her like she's committing a crime and trying to restrain her throughout the whole video. She's advocating for THEM to keep their funding and she's on their side. Yet, they're treating her like an enemy. If I was her, the behavior of those police officers might make me change my mind about supporting them so strongly.

It was sad when the one officer got thrown to the ground, but I really don't understand why he was touching her in the first place. They're acting like she's doing something wrong by painting over the BLM mural. But was it even legal to paint that on the street in the first place? I don't see that she did anything wrong here, except for that officer who got hurt. But again, why was he holding on to her in the first place?

I'm also unclear on exactly what she's being arrested for. I wonder if she still would have been arrested if that policeman hadn't fallen over. In my eyes, that's the only possible crime that was committed here.

[Jersey2]

The Police I thought were very gentle and patient with her. So much so that a black man was yelling they aren’t even arresting her. That mural was painted by the NYC mayor after he cut the police force by an astounding 1 billion dollars. The city paid for it so she is vandalizing public property so the police had to arrest her... even though they didn’t arrest people for doing the same to statues.

White people who did what she did last week were charged with a hate crime as well. A Lesbian Trump supporter did the same thing in the past week as well. This was the third incident of this type.

[Electric_Dreams]

Technically she's right, as there are an abundance of lives that BLM do not give me any reason to believe they care about.

However, there are some black lives that BLM care about, which are those ended by white people.

So technically BLM do care about black lives too.. just not that many of them. .. but really when you think about it, they're only presenting themselves as concerned in the matter of black lives ended by white people, which makes me inclined to think that what they really care about is taking revenge upon white people who kill black people. .. so it's not the black lives they care about.. it's the white killers of black people that they are concerned with punishing. Their actions lead me to believe that that is what they really, passionately care about.

[JaneDoe377]

Yes very true. I think some of the people involved, protesting and whatnot, are not understanding what's at the heart of it. It's just a political movement, the top level people in it and financiers only care about ripping apart this country's freedoms and rights. They do not care about black lives.

[Daniela1982]

It's all these dumb young people who just like to protest about anything and are just there to cause trouble and loot and burn. They could care less about BLM, they just want to score a new big screen from a store they are looting. Also, if black women cared about black lives mattering why do they abort their babies? Or do the little black lives not matter too?

[Miristheiss]

So we can judge all police based on the actions of a few?

By that logic, blacks commit WAAAY more crime in inner cities all over the country, way more than any other group. Gangs, drop outs, drugs, drive by shootings, robberies, murders... etc. Inner cities are hell in most big cities. By your logic, we can just assume most blacks are criminals and we shouldn't trust any of them.

Based on your logic. Cops are just out to get black people.

I'm guessing you only want to pick and choose when you can group blame people.

[Anonymous]

BLM is a movement running on emotions , not on logic and long term planning. It will not be successful even though it's purpose is pure and honest because there is lack of leadership and direction. They are just emotional and doing whatever they feel is right.'

This is no way to bring about a permanent change. For permanent change , you need careful planning and deliberation and an eye that can see in the future.

[Jersey2]

But are the people running it really interested in black people or simply using them as a tool to get rid of the police? Many say BLM is run by Marxist and Antifa.

I saw many times on the news black people at demonstrations telling white people to stop rioting and destroying things, now I think it is because they had a separate agenda.

[Opinion Owner]

that's what I am saying , they are demanding stupid stuff like defunding the police and whatnot. They don't have clear goals and directions , just doing what makes them feel good emotionally but does nothing for any of us in the long run.

And the woman above is right , this movement is not inclusive at all , they are not taking black women's demand in consideration and it is being hijacked to gain votes in the upcoming elections as you said it

[zollo]

But they did have a reason and a goal for defunding the police, they were going to take that money and distribute it back into education and something else. I'm not saying I completely agree with all the stuff going on and some of the demands are just crazy and very unorganized. But hopefully if school are getting paid more then there can be better education standards and more opportunities which in turn would hopefully lead to a better community.

[ZackBan]

Of course she is. BLM is becoming a moment with its own personal agendas of chaos and destruction. Nothing they ever did helped promote equality or give the public a better view on black people, not to mention their demands would plunge the country in chaos.
I mean really vandalism and hate promotion are the way forward now? Also defunding cops is a just asking for gangs who care little about rights or lefts to be given uncontrollable power over the streets.

[Anonymous]

Man, I love how much people are shitting on this mural. Is this like the 4th time? Or is it more? Every few days it seems like there's another example. This is much more acceptable than tearing down statues, so defacing their symbols in this way is the perfect choice. Though I expect the complicit state government to clap back with some overtly draconian punishments to those doing the defacing -- a clear demonstration of their toxicity.

[Jersey2]

The white couple who did it earlier were hit with a hate crime. I don’t know about the lesbian or black woman if they will get hate crimes. It seems distorted and wrong that someone gets an extra charge because of the color of their skin.

[Opinion Owner]

Yeah, it's obviously fucked and that's why people are challenging BLM and all manner of SJW nonsense in the first place. I hope there's more people that aren't going to back down though, it's precisely when the pressure is on that people need to keep pressing while maintaining the moral high ground to show how wrong this all is.

[Anonymous]

Of course they don't care they're just using race as a cover to push a violent revolutionary marxist agenda. All the people who follow black lives matter and think they're doing a good job are just useful idiots. Probably be the 1st ones to be executed when they take over as well

[zollo]

What? Your saying the people supporting BLM would be the first ones executed if who takes over? Black people?

[Opinion Owner]

Anyone following them. 101 for being a dictator soon as you get power kill everyone who has rebelled before. Why would you leave people who like to rebel alive soon as they realize you are lying to them just to get power that going to rebel against you so you kill them off before that happens.

[zollo]

But that's assuming that whoever "gets to power" is actually not for the movement and also that they would be like a dictator and kill people which isn't exactly a clear shot.

[Opinion Owner]

It's clear you don't understand black live matter is a revolutionary marxist movements Race is just cover to get useful idiots to do what they want

[zollo]

Many didn't start out believing it that way though, many people who fight and support the BLM movement truly just want equality for Black people.

[Opinion Owner]

Maybe some who joined it but One of the founders even Says so that their marxist. Black people have black privilidge things to stuff like affirmative action what they want more of. It's a false narrative you believe. Just been used as cover to have a violent marxist revolution

"BLM co-founder describes herself as 'trained Marxist'" nypost.com/.../

[Anonymous]

Yes. 95% of black lives are taken by other block people, yet they only screech when they're taken by a white person or a police officer. Not to mention, BLM protests have killed more black people in a span of a few months than police have in two years, and this includes a dozen to a half a dozen black children.

But how many times did the BLM movement when little black girls were shot and killed by their own stray bullets?

[Opinion Owner]

But how many times did the blm movement protest when*

[Jersey2]

This is all true.

[Anonymous]

Wow, that cop looks like he dislocated his arm when he fell.

I'm curious why this woman will be prosecuted for vandalism when she is trying to exercise her 1st amendment rights but those who tore down statues, spray painted buildings, committed arson, vandalism, intimidation, trespassing, assault... were all let go

[Jersey2]

Double standards. And the white couple who did the same thing to this “mural” were charged with hate crimes. I doubt she will be. It’s a convoluted mess.

[Anonymous]

Why do people say "fuck the police" when they will totally eat their words when it does come time to actually call the police in a dire situation/shit hits the fan?

[Jersey2]

Because they are Sheeple.

[Shampan]

I do agree with her sentiment in this video. You need a good police force to have a civil society no matter what. Taking money away from police will do more harm than good

[cth96190]

The woman is correct.
Black Lives Matter is a Communist organisation that does not give a damn about anything other than Communist revolution.
The USA needs a Pinochet.

[DCooper]

She's right. Who do you think ends up being disproportionately victimized when the police start ignoring crime in black neighborhoods for fear of getting called racist?

[lrichl]

Blm does not care about anything , but rich white liberal polititions.

[Anonymous]

Wow I wonder why the news never covers she's a black woman. All they ever talk about is logo getting destroyed. Weird almost like they are extremely biased and lying about everything

[cloud9vortex1234]

It seems like the cops are agreeing with her because they're not doing much to stop her.

[Jersey2]

I think a lot of people agree with her. She said the next day that the police were very appreciative of her efforts.

[AllThatSweetJazz]

The prospect of getting forceful with a black woman... on top of a BLM sign... as a cop... while you're being filmed? I think they know they are in a situation where everything can go wrong for them in a heartbeat.

[Anonymous]

BLM cares nothing about lives. It's a racist domestic terrorist group that only wants to disrupt society.

[Jersey2]

I wonder if most of this is because it’s an election year.

[Opinion Owner]

I think it's part of it.

[BeMuse]

It's pretty obvious the BLM doesn't care about black people.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/gPcj6KdDe3E