I remember the first boyfriend i had which was back in middle school and I was the one that asked him out and I remember one of the popular girls at school at the time made fun of me for making the first move and said she’d never ask a boy out because boys should be the one to ask a girl out and I felt really bad at the time and ashamed like I did something wrong?
I feel like over the years I’ve also grown more introverted and a bit more insecure/self conscious so I’m not sure if I’d be brave enough to make the first move in a relationship again.
Why is it so stigmatized for women to make the first move in a relationship?
I think it comes down to relationships versus sex.
Evolutionary bioethics is pretty clear that men are better off nailing and impregnating females and having no more irksome involvement with children. Human babies are born premature because the heads got too big for females to birth without them being borne earlier. Chimp babies are running around climbing trees whilst human babies are still helpless.
Again bioethics has the consequence that females need the male who knocked them up to stick around providing food etc.
So human females need to be more relationship oriented than chimp females.
Lets take group of 5 females and 5 males If all females expect a courtship process and neatly wrapped bison stakes at the front door then all females mostly get courtship bison. And they get to assess who is best at bacon.
On the other hand one of those 5 females is capable of keeping all of the 5 males reasonably happy in life. The other females are not going to be happy because suddenly they don't get neatly wrapped bison steaks any more. They'll call that 'keep the boys happy' girl a slut. Freeze her out and definitely won't help her through child birth. "Serves you right slut" they'll say to the girl who destroyed their market value.
In approaching that boy, the hot girl saw you broke the sisterhood and thought you damaged her and all the other 'proper' girls market value. What would happen if all girls approached boys they had a wet for? Obviously the market would plunge.
What happens if girls don't approach boys - ever? Well first the most keen boys are obvious. The girls get more courtship pressies and they can suss out the boys who are best with bison. Good to know that for paleo child support. Plus the boys who want to fuck you the most can be parlayed into relationships easiest.
2 million years are not only long enough to make a habit and an ethos but also burn it into your primary sex circuits.
So I don't think it is surprising that the hot girl said what she did. You were undercutting her value and other girls value. I am being somewhat tongue in cheek but it is what the fundamentals are. It is a bit old school now but that is still playing out.
The short version is there are evolutionary bioethics that were advantageous to human evolution in the past. One of which was forming relationships as opposed to casual hook ups in the jungle.
A girl approaching a boy looks more to be a hookup. A girl waiting to be approached is more relationship oriented. For eons girls have set a relationship as the price for sex. By approaching a boy you were a market disruption.
I don't know if it is "stigmatizing," but if it is it's because it is unnatural. And any unnatural behavior in either men or women is viewed as repulsive by others (from mildly to severely repulsive). There is a reason for that. Unnatural behaviors go against natures plan after millions of years of diligent evolution. So nature built in a protection mechanism to try to eliminate them from the gene pool by making those who engage in such behaviors outcasts who are less likely to reproduce and perpetuate the undesirable (from nature's point of view) behavior.
In this case men are designed to be the natural pursuers in male/female relationships. Women are designed to attract men, and men are designed to pursue women for the purpose of reproduction of the species. No different than many other animal species that have the exact same pairing and mating regime. So when women pursue men, others are designed to be repulsed by that unnatural behavior that deviates from male female natural roles.
I used to think this way. But now I stopped making the first move. It has always ended in disrespect and abuse for me. Even if I got the guy, he treated me worse because it started off with me going for him. Thei le ego is too over inflated and they see themselves as superior when it starts this way. Or, you are in a more masculine role.
Women! Use your femininity to make him come to you and entice him to make those moves. He will treat you way better.
Is it actually stigmatized? I’ve asked out two of my boyfriends and they were my longest relationships. I just don’t think women do so as often but nobody ever treated me as any sort of way for being the initiator and I know a few older women that asked out their husbands initially (which was admirable to me if anything) as well as a friend who proposed to her husband.
I feel like my wife of nearly 20 years made the first move by handing me her number. It may be different in the area you live or due to your younger age. It definitely depends on the gentleman's personality as well. If he's just a player, he'll see you as an easy opportunity. If he's a genuine person and finds you interesting and thinks you might make a good partner, he would value your forwardness.
Its not stigmatized against you just let her words hit deep into your heart. You knew what you wanted and you went for it and thats a very commendable quality. I takes guts to face rejection head on something that girl was too scared to do. Dont let the words of someone change your perspective on life so much. Just live life how you see fit and take peoples opinions with a grain of salt.
Not sure why there is a stigma, but I like it when a guy makes the first move. It shows that he is really interested if he is willing to risk being rejected.
If he slow to make the first move I like flrting with him to encourage him to make the first move.
@dynamicyandere exactly. if i didn't ask this guy out i would have regretted it my whole life. now i just know he is a complete dick who didn't appreciate me and i can move on.
Men cherish what they have to work for. If you say here I am they loke it but it isn't as special. So they usually put less effort into keeping you and aren't really all that pressed about losing you.
Girls who make the first move or at least show interest first are the best. The girl I’m pursuing told me she asked her daughter how she felt her dating me and said she did a tarot reading about her and I. I don’t mess with tarot cards, but I had no idea this girl was even interested in dating until she told me these things. I’m not pursuing her, but it’s reciprocal. I pursue her a little, she reciprocates and pursues me a little. Etc. Its refreshing when a girl shows interest first.
Boys asking girls out men asking women out it’s so old fashion if somebody makes fun of you that’s OK if you’re looking to have somebody in your life why not make the first move sometimes you have to do that three or four times with different people. I think it’s great that you feel comfortable enough in your own skin to make the first move and ask somebody out good for you. It should not matter in the end. What matters is how you spend your time together
I really am not sure that it is stignatised , I think the one example you give , that particular girl , well she's just a stupid bitch frankly , and I think particularly at your age , its probably how most dates / outings originated .
Because in this life, everything is expected from men. A man will show his love, a man will show his attention, a man will do the romantic thing, if he is going to buy a gift, the man will be the first to buy it and the man will pay the bill. Since everything is expected from the man first and such a taboo is formed in people, I think it is due to that.
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Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
In a word--it's NOT stigmatized. Most girls don't DO it, but there's certainly no stigma attached. I'm not surprised that you cited another girl giving you grief. You asking guys out is direct competition to her. So it's not in her interest for you or any other girl to do that. But there's definitely no general stigma against it and you typically end up with better dating outcomes if you do the asking.
we men have got to a point where it can be damaging to our freedom! if we make the first move. so most good men only ask once and if we get a brush off or no, we move on, as asking a second or third is now a crime.
I definitely encourage more women doing this more often. especially if they keep complaining about there not being any good men. well there's a lot of guys who are shy and too nervous to approach. why not go for them?
cuz women dont mind being rejected its having to put up with the bitchiness of other women thats the worst. last time i approached a man who rejected me. the bitchiness of the other women was terrible. i am still traumatised about the horrors they said three years later. to be fair they were mormon girls so maybe things are different if their church. but i dont think its just that. naturally all women can be horrid to others. you dont get it cuz you are a guy.
@catarecute noni dont get that. What i do get is that mem are told to just ‘man up’ if we get rejected whereas women you can just not approach anymore and there's no stigma attached to you doing so.
I wish it was simply ‘whoever is attracted to who should do the approaching’ and let it all even out among the sexes.
well what i do most of the time is i do exactly what i want to caring a world aboyt what others think. only god can judge me as he created me. other humain being seriously practicaly never listen to them. if everyone was listening to other (which most are tbh) the world would be a serious mess (which it is tbh). if someone tells me what to do i either ignore it or do the opposite. people are more than 95% of the time wrong.
It shouldn't be. I am not shy and have no issue approaching, but more than once I have been OBLIVIOUS that a girl was interested.
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
I don't oppose women doing it but I just find it to be a bit of a turn off. I'm generally not interested in women who take the lead like that. That's not to say it's wrong or bad, it's just not what I prefer.
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Anonymous
(18-24)
+1 y
I'm not really interested, I reject all women who approach me anyway, I'm not interested in spending my time on women.
I don't think it's stigmatized. It's more like we don't have the balls (pun unintended) to do it. I would much rather give a man the green light than actually drive the car myself.
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