Do you think God gives people like Dahmer a pass just because they are “born again”?

[WhyohWhy69]

Yes

No

I don’t believe in any God

[Kaneki05]

If your going by the bible that's what it say's so yeah?
The bible clearly states many times people can be forgiven longs if they choose to put faith in god and learn from their wrong doings. And even further it states that when judgement day comes you also get another chance.
So when that day comes, if you ask for forgiveness and choose god rather than reject him you will be granted eternal life otherwise well you just simply cease to exist.

Also by bible logic you have to be actually aware of said actions which as messed up as Dahmer was, he was aware that he brought much pain by his actions hence why he tried to ask for death then when he wasn't put to death he turned to god for forgiveness.

I don't believe in any god but I know what the bible say's. And by what it say's Dahmer would be forgiven unlike someone as Gacy who would reject god in heart beat as he never once showed a bit of a remorse or empathy. Theoretically he could turn to god upon judgement but I think it's pretty clear he wouldn't.

[YesterdaysChild]

@Kaneki05 You apparently don't know what the Bible says. Hebrews 9:27 - “It is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment” After you die you don't get another chance. Your soul either goes to Heaven, or to purgatory until judgement day. Read what it says about the Rich Man and Lazarus - Luke 16:19-31
New International Version
The Rich Man and Lazarus
19 “There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

27 “He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’

29 “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’

30 “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead." Satan would love you to believe otherwise. You sound like a Jehovah's Witness.

[Kaneki05]

@YesterdaysChild Using quotes from the bible won't help when there is million of them and people can skew them to whatever they want.
John 8:12. 12 When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”
Do you think this quote only applies to some random people? No it applies to all whether you were guilt before or not.
Oh what's that other famous one ya know about let the one without sin cast the first stone or another by Jesus which say's his Church won't fall to Hades, hades back then meant death and when he said Church he meant followers.
And considering you can choose to follow him anytime looks like those people will be fine.

And the whole point of Jesus dying was to forgive people of their sin but I am sure you forgot that as you randomly call me Witness yet my views aren't at all alike because if you knew one simple and obvious fact about them is they don't believe everyone gets saved they think a certain number does. Which ya know is dumb because Jesus died for everyone not an certain number.

[Kaneki05]

Also not even religious nor my views just saying what the bible say's. It also say's other things like women shouldn't be heard or it's okay to kill but only if you are king but hey I would rather focus on the more positive Jesus dude.

[Kaneki05]

@YesterdaysChild Also wasn't Abraham like 2 seconds away from been a killer himself? Like ya know longs if god say's to do it's morally okay as he was going to do it. Lucky god been such a nice guy stopped him but hey it's the thought of happily doing it that counts right?

[YesterdaysChild]

Abraham was following God's directions. It was a test to see if Abraham would follow God or go his own way. He passed the test. Also, some of the things you quoted were from the Old Testament that went out on the Day of Pentecost. I do see you seem to know a lot about the Bible. It is strange that you are not a believer. Being saved also requires repentance. Not many want to change their ways and still live a sinful life. God is not mocked and He knows the heart. Whatever a man sows he shall reap.

[loveslongnails]

@YesterdaysChild " “It is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment” After you die you don't get another chance. Your soul either goes to Heaven, or to purgatory until judgement day". Hmmm, so YOU think. Then again, that doesn't explain a THING about what Christ said regarding the soul that was in John the Baptist, hmmm, does it?

But for people like yourself, there's no contradiction in the Bible and there's a quote to explain everything, or so you believe. However, YOU sound like someone who believes you come to Earth one time, get one chance to learn EVERYTHING you need to know to get into your Heaven. That amounts to accepting Christ as your Lord and Savior, but THAT means a whole different set of things. Ever stop to think about your own "beliefs", or does the book, written by men and wholly edited by the Church, have all of that covered for you without thinking?

Now THAT sounds like a Mormon or an Evangelical !!

[Kaneki05]

@YesterdaysChild The fact Abraham would do it based on god's demand is exactly why I am not religious. I would never go against my own morals for some deity whether it created me or not it's my life and my views, same way I wouldn't do something or follow whatever my parents believe if it does not align with my views.
Indeed, god would know if they truly wanted to repent so it wouldn't matter if one just lied to please god it wouldn't work. I don't think Dahmer was lying, and if he wasn't god would see that he is sorry and would allow him to be forgiven.

I ain't a fan of the bible or any faith but Jesus he only preached good things hence to my thoughts he didn't exist anyway, also the whole idea is a bit messy with god sent Jesus to forgive everyone but in fact Jesus was the one who prayed to god to be more forgiving therefore while they align Jesus seems to be his own person with much better views and doing his own plan, otherwise why pray to tell god what he already's already tasked you do and why ask him to be more forgiving if that's what he is doing anyway?
And while Jesus preached about bringing his sword in which he meant his word and was trying to bring people together in a bitter irony he actually caused a massive divide and might as well brought a real sword because many wars happen due to the separate views on his role in the bible.

[Kaneki05]

How things can drastically go so wrong from the plan when you have a god that's all powerful, and has a so called grand master design don't add up. A lot of god's plans fail. He flooded the world didn't do much, he created a perfect garden with two of the purest humans didn't work, he created angels that are meant to be pure didn't work. Safe to say this god don't have a good track record.

I will mention times his plan did work like Abraham, Freeing the Hebrew slaves, Job. But even these 3 things are majorly flawed, one's twisted because he asked the guy to kill his own son, the other he set plagues upon people including innocent children who had of course no stake in the decisions of what there pharaoh, job he literally did evil things to him just because satan taunted him to do so as a test to see who was right...

I would never want to live under a deity who proves their point by doing horrible things and it's shown in the bible time and time again. god is very willing to doing bad things to get what he wants. I don't care whether Satan wanted to test the people's faith or god wanted to free some slaves that resulting in innocents deaths of children is just wrong.

Such points are why I would never follow the bible, and will happily reject god if he does turn out to be real.

[Kaneki05]

Well tbh it would be more accurate to say Jesus would forgive Dahmer than god, but Jesus with his dying wish was for god to be more forgiving hence why he now will be in judgement day but before that he's just a mess of anger and who's to say he still ain't Granted we haven't seen any divine punishment recently so maybe it worked.

[loveslongnails]

@YesterdaysChild If EVER there was a fabricated story in the Bible, it was this one. It's precisely the kind of story a human would write. It reduces God, the Creator of all things everywhere, to a game player. I can't IMAGINE a loving God playing Almighty Thunderer and posing a "Sophie's Choice" to someone - choose me or your son.

By the way, anyone can quote the Bible, but how much have you thought about it before you parrot it?

[Kaneki05]

@loveslongnails There is no need for you to be replying to her. I think my comments are long enough lmao. And well yeah in my thoughts they were all just written stories but Abraham story does line up with god's need to prove himself as he also shows with Job and when he brings wrath to those who oppose him, and other worship of false ideals it's actually very much in character.

[Kaneki05]

Idols*

[loveslongnails]

Sorry, but neither that story nor Job lines up with anything that I imagine a loving God would do, and I don't even want to get into "god's need to prove himself"! Not going there. I reply to her because I want to point out that I don't believe she's ever thought about what she quotes. It's so easy to find a Biblical or spiritual quote for every situation from ANY religion, but so what? How does that deepen your understanding of anything simply by quoting it? All that means is you're good at memorization or looking something up.

[Kaneki05]

@loveslongnails Bruh your preaching to the choir here. I know my points are long so I get ya didn't read them but that's literally what I am saying I don't need you also defending my point here lol.

[abc3643]

How did Dahmer "get a pass"?
He was beaten to death in prison after being there only about 2.5 years.

Besides, he's in Hell now as evidenced by this Christmas song...

There goes Jeffrey Dahmer
With a Christmas ham.
After he has sex with it,
He'll eat up all he can.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/Zad5rhVOirg

[OlderAndWiser]

The Bible says that God forgives us of our sins if we repent and accept Jesus as our savior. It doesn't distinguish between degrees of sins and it doesn't say that some sins cannot be forgiven. However, it also does not say that God is an idiot and believes every person who professes to have been born again.

[strateguy632]

exactly god knows the intentions and if sincere

[ProbablyClueless]

Dahmer is an interesting case. As fucked up as he was, he was also extremely aware of his behavior and literally wasn't able to stop. The guy was absolutely deranged. In a lot of ways I genuinely feel bad for him because he just never had a chance. You could make a compelling argument that his soul was trapped in a sick body. I'm not sure how god handles a situation like that, but I don't think it's fair to treat Dahmer the way god would treat a BTK or John Wayne Gacy.

[strateguy632]

this question was asked in a reason mel gibson movie.

on one hand we must stop sinning, so not rely on grace to sin, but as gibson character explained "god door is always open.

[strateguy632]

*recent mel gibson

[AngryCarl2]

Yes, it's clearly stated in the Bible:

1 John 1:9 - "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

[RealMarek]

The way I see it, God is fully capable of perfect justice and mercy even when they are in tension with each other from our perspective.

[ChicoFromThe305]

Yes but that doesn't mean there won't be consequences during judgment day, when he gets judged by God.

[ChicoFromThe305]

Not only That, God knows a person's heart so if he really meant the repentance prayer or if it was just a bunch of meaningless words, God knows.

[Daniela1982]

If you were saved you won't be judged on Judgement Day, only the unsaved are judged. But born-again believers are given crowns for their good deeds which is sort of a judgement.

[ChicoFromThe305]

I'm pretty sure everyone gets judged

[Daniela1982]

Nope, because the saved had their sins forgiven and when God forgives your sins He remembers them no more, having thrown them as far away as the west is from the east.
Hebrews 10:17; Hebrews 8:12; Jeremiah 31:34

17 then he adds,

“I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”

12 For I will be merciful toward their iniquities,

and I will remember their sins no more.”

34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
If God judges the believer then He doesn't tell the truth about remembering our sins. But we know God is incapable of lying so it is truth. Jesus took away all our inequities on the cross.

[ChicoFromThe305]

Yea after he judges you tho he will forget them but I think everyone has to go through judgement, really think of it, I doubt all our sins are forgotten until we enter the kingdom of heaven.

[Daniela1982]

Nope, they are forgotten the moment we accept Christ as our savior.
1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

[ChicoFromThe305]

Hm 🤔

[loveslongnails]

I think karma takes care of everything in the end, we just don't get to know how or see it all the time.

[Twalli]

I don't think that belief should matter regarding your afterlife. If you do good, you should not be punished more that those who didn't for a portion of their lives.

[exitseven]

No, Jeffrey Dahmer will roast on the end of a pitchfork for all eternity.

[Anonymous]

God is Just. I don't worry about it. I figure when I can create a universe like he did then I'll judge the manner in how he runs his.

[Avicenna]

Not a mass murderer like Dahmer, no

[Danny_dan92]

Who?

[NikolaiIvanovB41]

Jeffrey Dahmer.

[Danny_dan92]

No clue who that is

[Danny_dan92]

Oh wait, the cannibal homo

[Danny_dan92]

Well he’s dead so… lmao