Ok so I saw two posts earlier you guys probably saw it too, it got me a little triggered ngl but... Do people really think that abortion is ok? This is TOTALLY wrong and I get a bit worried by the fact that countries actually allow this. When people say pro-choice I just think pro-murder, really. Someone has to talk about this. Honestly guys, birth control is a thing, condoms are a thing so why take a child's life if all of these things are here for the specific reason to not make you pregnant? You're not allowed to kill your baby outside of the womb so how the hell are you able to kill them inside the womb? Just think about it: that child could've grew up to be an amazing doctor, soldier, engineer or maybe even the president but no, his/her life is cut short because of... what again? I still don't understand. I'm sorry to say it but if you think that this abortion thing is right... I don't want anything to do with you. I'm so young but I can't believe that I have more common sense than some adults who think that this should be allowed (This was more of a rant than a question but thanks for reading anyway)
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If y'all wanna talk about "childbirth and bearing a child is hard" then don't. Do you know how many preventions there is for pregnancy these days? Condoms are 99.98% guaranteed, come on guys. But since most of the people these days are obsessed with sex, I'm not surprised.
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Im not even reading comments anymore. I gotta say, the amount of people who think this is ok is really concerning. Most of y'all are bringing Christianity into this but i didn't mention a thing about religion. Cause you dont need to be religious to know that abortion is disgusting. All i gotta say is: god bless all of you. The world is going south and its only getting worse. This is all the devil's work.
It's a debate because it's not a black and white issue. I used to be 100% pro-life. Morally, I'm still very much against abortion. Realistically though and from my experience working in the real world with impoverished families and women who have considered abortion, I now understand why it happens and I'm much less judgmental of women who feel like they have to make that choice now.
1) For someone living in poverty who can barely afford to keep a roof over their head or food on the table for themselves, how can they afford diapers and other basic childcare necessities? It's very easy to say "just use birth control" but the fact is, birth control isn't 100% effective, it does fail sometimes. Then you have people who can't easily access birth control. You also have uneducated people who simply don't know! In the United States, we don't have consistent, proper sex education in all of our schools and not all parents talk to their kids about how sex works or how to have safe sex. This can be a cultural issue in some communities and a lot of it boils down to lack of education or sociocultural stigmas surrounding talking about sex and birth control.
2) People who are pro-life often say to give up a child for adoption rather than get an abortion. I completely understand why this is said but I think it's coming from a place of ignorance from people who don't truly understand what the foster care system looks like or what children within this system experience. I work with foster children ALL the time and I can tell you, it breaks my heart to see how many unloved children there are in our foster care system. I even see failed adoptions ALL the time. I see people adopting or fostering for the wrong reasons and causing further hurt and trauma for kids who have already experienced enough trauma for a lifetime. It's sad and if every woman who didn't want a child gave birth and gave up their child to foster care/adoption, it would completely overwhelm the system more than it already is. There already aren't enough *good* families willing to foster or adopt.
3) Awful things like rape happen. Even being against abortion for myself, if I were raped I would absolutely consider it and I think forcing a woman who was raped to give birth to their rapists baby is completely disgusting.
4) Outlawing abortions doesn't mean it won't happen. Back alley abortions will still occur, it will just be a lot more unsafe for women.
I could go on but ultimately, no, I don't agree with abortion on a personal level but through learning more about society, experiencing the real world, and talking to people who are in different circumstances than myself, I understand why it happens and it's certainly a LOT more complicated than many people think. I would love for our government to find ways to fix our systems so that the rates of abortion naturally decrease. I want abortion to be rare and for more women to get pregnant on their own terms and want to keep their babies. Our society simply isn't there yet.
and its that kinda thing that makes me think its lesss about pro-'life' and more about controlling women. cause if they truly cared they would try everything to make it so women don't feel the need to get an abortion in the first place.
@Still-alive Yes, I agree with you! And to add to my original opinion above, I'd also like to point out that I work with extremely poor and historically underserved populations so that gives me a different perspective. I literally had a parent of one of my clients tell me today- "if I knew how babies were made my kid wouldn't be here." She was referencing her second child... meaning, she didn't put two and two together after having her first child that sex is how you get pregnant. I can't make this stuff up. That's the state of sex education and poverty in our country. This parent has severe mental health needs. Her kids also have severe developmental, behavioral, and mental/emotional needs. I know this is just one example but unfortunately, it helps demonstrate that it's not quite as simple as "just use a condom" for someone who doesn't even know that sex is how conception occurs...
Yes id “kill” the fetus if i got pregnant. No babies for me! Im on birth control:) it can fail:) just saying. Doesn’t mean imma sacrifice my life and career for that fetus.
Exactly it wouldn’t be my fault if my birth control failed and it resulted in an unwanted pregnancy hence i would immediately get an abortion in that case. Done deal. A small pricey procedure that will save me TONS of money down the road plus my career, and mental health and freedom 😀
It doesn’t have a soul😂 it isn’t alive. It cannot live independently without sucking the life out of me. It cannot talk, walk, laugh, cry, etc. Go care about the millions of ALIVE kids in foster care
@Brittanyroseee my religious belief says s/he is alive i am muslim also my ancestors used to be christian and according to them this is murder because the bible forbids it
Now go and smite Amalek and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.’”
@Brittanyroseee I am half Armenian and I know the bible. Also, according to the bible, the end of murderers is hell just like those who commit adultery.
@Brittanyroseee you're not a christian 100% you're the one who needs to read the bible before saying something you dont understand. So i agree with @UpdateGloomyNights
@RandomPerson114 CHILD. Kiddo. You don’t understand anything 😂 there is no way in hell im giving birth to an unwanted fetus let alone from rape. So just stop lol. There are tons of reasons why people get abortions. Stop caring about fetuses and go help the kids in foster care
I think it's wrong for me and the women I'm with. At the same time, if other people want to go to California, New York, or Colorado and have parties for turning back time on a creampie, that's none of my business. I wouldn't sleep with that girl sober in the first place.
I tell people on the left who are panicking and considering crime with Roe v Wade being overturned to let states work it out, same as back in the day I told other people to not bust up those road flares and put them into pipes. America is huge, seriously, pull out a map and compare the land area of the US to pretty much every other country excluding Russia. Region to region, and state to state we're going to have different values.
Like aside from $300k+ there is no way I'd live on the west coast, and I'm sure a lot of them feel the same about living in the south... aside from Texas... Anyway, if you feel it's wrong, live in an area with similar people who vote and feel the same way, and/or just go to church. If you feel it's right at any point in time, go to the east or west coast.
I appreciate your courage. You took a beating for this post. Don't change. Keep educating yourself on this issue and every issue that is important to you. Stick to your conscience. There are a lot of really cruel and wicked and ignorant people out here. Don't waver in your beliefs. @RandomPerson114
No you aren't just curious @MentorMan you're making a dumb point while being passive aggressive on top of it. I don't have to financially support them just cause I don't want them to be killed. What is the matter with you?
@Deserter 1) I was validating the gauge of your “sense of morality” to see if matters one way or other, though to be fair… you were quite opaque in demonstrating what side of the y axis your morality curve wends from your very first reply on this thread, so I probably didn’t need to affirm that. Habitual critical thinking and information validation sometimes feels like a curse. 2) Google. com > “dictionary:passive-aggressive” . 3) Oh objectively, I’ve tons of flaws. Mistaking your passionate but fundamentally flawed opinion that freedom is bad as something with any weight relative to the fundamental human rights of any individual pregnant person, much less all of them in the United States, is fortunately not one of them.
I’m so amused people think this has to mean something. It’s so easy to have a self induced abortion at home and no one would be the wiser. That’s what will happen if these uptight Karen’s and David’s keep pushing it.
Yes those dasterdaly Karens that won't let you murder baies. Lmao yeah, just kill the baby you've been oregnant for for 9 months, nobody will suspect a thing
If you actually cared, you’d put more effort into supporting women in progress towards solutions to prevent unwanted pregnancy in the first place. None of these pro lifers are doing this though.
@Deserter I honestly don't care what you think. I and all the people who upvoted MzAsh's answer agree with her. In fact, most of the people who upvoted her answer are male users. So there actually are men who support a woman's right to have an abortion.
@Deserter How do you know they want their women to abort if they get them pregnant? You're making assumptions about people you don't know. And abortion is NOT murder!
At least they're decent men who support women's rights. I'm literally offended and disgusted that there are men who try to dictate what women should do with their bodies. You're not a woman and you don't have a uterus so it's not a decision you can make for any woman.
Just because you see it as wrong doesn't really make it actually wrong. What's holding you back is you view it as a human being there for you give it a human right. But in the end, that's just your point of view and you're pushing it to the law book. Also it's so easy to just say "because Science said so" to favor your argument when anyone can also do the same thing when it comes to a counter argument for your belief. Making laws for abortion just interfere's with people's view. I don't view fetus as humans so does sperm and egg cells so I wouldn't say it's killing but rather shedding or discarding. But saying those are humans, well those are your views. I don't like sex being taken for granted not because I'm concerned for the fetus but for the mother's health but I still give them choice to abort with their own consequences. People can make mistakes and abortion is a solution to fix that mistakes just like accidents can happen to everyone not just when it comes to getting pregnant. So what do you do if you break a bone by accident? Most people would go to the hospital and have a surgery to fix it. Same goes with an accidental pregnancy. That "keep your legs closed" BS is also another way to blame someone doing what humans naturally do. Of course you can say abortion is not natural but what is indeed natural is killing a new born or abandoning an infant if they're not committed to raise it like what animals sometimes do. You want that instead? Also that's just like saying, if you don't wanna get a broken bone, don't go out and be a basement dweller. If you Pro lifes want every baby to be born, but they don't care if that baby is going to be an orphan all their childhood, or if the baby is going to suffer malnutrition, or if the baby has no medical insurance and end sick and dies or if the baby is going to grow up feeling unwanted, develop depression and suicide. They want all babies but they are not going to take care of them. If they really cared that much they would offer themselves to take care of every unwanted kid of people who are going to abort. The funny thing is that many pro life aren't that pro life when it comes to death penalty. So what you called "murderer" is wrong except when it's justified. "But where's the justice in that? The baby didn't do anything" Yeah the baby didn't do anything that she have to keep it either. I can also say, the baby didn't do anything except for the fact that it's inside the mother causing her pain and can cause her a lot later on in life so I'm a pro choice because I'm concerned about the mother, the child (Who's gonna suffer as a human being later on), the husband, the family and the government. Kids not taken care of properly can go violent and be suicidal which is a very big issue to society and last I check, Earth has over 7.5 billion people polluting the world.
If you think of pro choice as a pro murder then why do you think we don't mind an accidentally pregnant girl if she keeps her fetus as a choice? On the other hand, you do make it a big deal if she choose to discard it by choice. Which just makes you an anti choice instead of a pro life. You don't care about the mother's life so where's the "pro life" in that? Or should i say that's just pro manipulation? How about if I say forcing a girl to keep her unwanted "child" is wrong and should be jailed for it just to be fair? Oh you don't like that? Then mind your own business.
How do you create a society with the least abortions possible? It's with sex education and avaliable birth control including access to abortions. This has been proven time and time again. So this pro life agenda has nothing to do with abortions. It's to create as much human suffering onto people outside of your fold.
These anti abortion people are the same people that force there 13 year old daughter to marry their rapist so god dosen't deem them a whore. Be it 20 to 70 year old men. That ultimately leaves the mother the only option to commit suicide. Also what's the most common way pregnant women die? If you said homicide by there partner you are correct. Then if you want to avoid all that is a home abortion that might kill yourself accidentally anyway.
Even by your own standards of when life begins, more people die by every metric by being anti abortion. I can't see any argument other then wanting to salivate over people's suffering. Like a commodity you create situations to make it grow and grow and feast upon the suffering of others.
So saving a baby is encouraging people's suffering? I don't know what you're on right now but please sit down and get some rest, this much drugs is not good for your health.
The leadership of anti abortion also want to get rid of any form of birth control. The hard core Christian zealots. That's why i mentioned the child marriage because it's integrated into the topic.
Give an inch and they will take a mile. These are the people feasting on suffering. There is a group of GOP that are ultimately dooms day cults counting the days to rapture. Creating as much human suffering as possible to look holy on the promise day to go to heaven in the end of days.
Yea you said "cult" they are not christian. Christians wouldn't look upon the suffering of others because we are told to love everyone as equal. Besides, you don't need to be religious to know that abortion is disturbing. you're making it like people need to have sex, it isn't that deep.
Notice how that man didn't give a bible verse. I wonder why... Anyway Psalm 127:3 Children are a gift from the Lord; they are a reward from him. I could give you another one.
People in power are in the cult. So it's very relevant. This is why evangelical Christians supported trump and got him to move American embassy to Jerusalem. All apart of the dooms day cults influence.
Secondly what People need is to know how sex works. I started this conversation with sex education and avaliable birth control including access to abortions.
The dooms day cult People want to take away both creating human suffering to look holy on rapture. You can hate abortions and be pro choice because it creates a society with the least abortions possible.
I don't know what you're on about, I losing braincells just reading your words. Listen, abortions are disgusting and you need to sleep off that whiskey.
It's when a fertilized egg gets stuck in a woman's fallopian tube, rather than the uterus (where the baby is supposed to develop). There is no way for a woman to control for this - it just has a chance of happening with every pregnancy.
There is no way to move the egg and preserve it. It must be removed, or it stays there.
If it stays, the fetus doesn't have enough room to develop and this will kill the fetus eventually because it has no room to develop. If it stays, the mother WILL die because the fallopian tube is not meant to develop a baby and its stunted development will be enough to damage the mother's body to the point of death.
Abortion is the only way to save the mother.
She can then try again and there's still a chance an ectopic pregnancy will happen again.
Perhaps the baby develops without organs necessary for life - again, nothing a mother can do to prevent this. Even the healthiest of mothers sometimes have to deal with this.
Sometimes a mother has an accident or something else happens and she must terminate the pregnancy to survive.
There's many reasons for an abortion to happen. It's not just a black and white moral question - rarely is there anything like that in life.
I urge you to research pregnancy while you're young and before you birth children, if you so choose to have them. It is more complicated and risky than you know, with dramatically more serious long term effects on your health than you currently know about.
I just think you don't have the ability to reason for yourself. You were fed this nonsense and you swallowed it without questioning. It is so simplistic. . . it doesn't even seem rational.
Let's say if you wanted to have a baby. But something went wrong with your pregnancy and it is so bad it could endanger your life. You do realize in some states, you may not be able to get permission for the abortion. Because the decision would not be made by a doctor. It would be made by a politician. The same ones who gave you vaccine advice. And even in the case where a doctor could, not many doctors are going to risk a murder charge to save your life. You could die in a country where abortion is illegal. Or die trying to get to a state or nation that allowed you the procedure. . . that ultimately could save your life.
That is only one example.
Mind you some of these same states are also enacting legislation restricting access to birth control. So a 16 year old girl, who might be raped, or just sexually active, couldn't even take the medication preventing her from facing such a decision.
And I only learned this because, my ex nearly died over an irregular period. In your version of Gilead, she would be dead as a doornail. Because the only way doctors could stabilize her was to put her on birth control. And the only reason why we were okay is because of my healthcare coverage. If we had none, in your Gilead, she is dead.
Since you've already adopted the language and mindset of abortion=murder, and anything BUT carrying the baby to term is murder, is there really any point in having a discussion with you? Do you realize that on the political scene, the majority of the "pro-life" people who claim they are protecting the "rights of the unborn" rarely give a shit about what happens to an unwanted baby once it's born? Well, that's an aside, so back to the point.
First, let's check your "facts": "Condoms are 99.98% guaranteed". Guaranteed what - to prevent pregnancy? Not on your life. Little known facts about condoms Theoretically, the are 98% effective when used perfectly and properly, but in the REAL world, that doesn't happen and their effective rate drops to 87%. Not only that, but if condoms are the ONLY method of birth control, you can expect a failure rate of anywhere from 46% - 52%. This is just one source, but you can find corroborating information in many others.
There's a larger question that encompasses everything from the right to govern one's own body to whether you think abortion is morally wrong or not, and your personal relationship with your Creator, if you even believe in that.
You would be wise to learn that other viewpoints dissimilar to your own do not take on the simplistic, righteous sense of condemnation that yours does.
The NPCs have been programmed for decades. That hardcore China-serving brainwash doesn't disappear overnight. It took Russia 20 years to erase the Soviet Union from the public psyche. And after over 30 years, many in the west still don't know that the Cold War ended.
Toxic as Roe is, badly as it needs to be extinct, simply handing that power back to the states isn't going far enough. And we still need to reverse Lawrence, which has been even more destructive in even smaller a time window.
We also need to flood the ballot box with third party candidates. No R or D! Red and Blue Kool Aid are the same poison! Piglosi, who pretended to be afraid of January 6th, had zero problem laundering money in Ukraine, after stink like her stoked the flames with Russia to turn Ukraine into a war zone. Yet, Cocaine Mitch and even Turncoat Crenshaw are just as bad!
Throw all the monkeys out! Reboot the entire zoo!
Without this, even if we reverse Lawrence next, the gangsta gubmint will always ensure that the opposite of the actual law is what gets enforced!
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Anonymous
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You know you have a a lot of valid arguements but the one things you're missing is the perspective of the women have gone through this procedure or are contemplating this procedure. I commend you for having such strong morals and convictions and I hope that if that's your belief that you continue to live by them. However, you are young and is still much you have to learn about life and the world in general. Whether a woman chooses to be pregant or chooses to end a pregnancy really doesn't have any bearing on your life but it does on hers. If it bothers you then pray about it, pray for the change of social values, pray for better access to birthcontrol, pray for a better justice system to keep sexual predators off the streets, pray for the medial profession so they can find ways to save the women who's lives are in danger when carrying a pregnancy to full term and definitely pray for the aborted fetus if that helps you as well. If you live in the U. S. maybe someday you'll get to vote on this issues. God bless!
@randomperson114 I don't know what the voting rules are in each country, I only know that if Roe vs Wade gets overturned that it will be up to each U. S. state so it's vary possible you can vote in the country where you live. I know that most people who are pro-life mean well, and most people who are prochoice mean well too, I would even argue that I am morally and religiously prolife, but legally prochoice. I know that sounds confusing but there are a few articles that might help explain my position, rather than me typing up these same thoughts, this one is about a devoutly catholic woman who feels very dedicated to the unborn while recognizing the difficulty of the choice that some women are faced with. www.americamagazine.org/.../abortion-bodily-integrity-women-241656 It explains why some people who are of strong faith such as myself, can look at this issue from multiple perspectives and not see it as a black and white issue. There is another article that is well written too but let me be clear, I'm not expecting this to change your mind, I think you should stick to your morals. I only urge you to look at why some women might choose to do this because it's not always for reasons of selfishness, sometimes it's an act of desperation and as a chritian I try to have compassion for these women, not only the reasons for how they might have gotten to their position but also why they are feeling so desperate. www.courier-journal.com/.../
I just got an abortion the other day. It was a very hard decision, noone finds out their pregnant and says "fuck I want an abortion" no it sucks and it kills you afterwards, but I couldn't afford another child we're barely getting by as it is. I can't afford to be healthy and go to the doctors all the time. My first pregnancy was terrible I was high risk and sent to bed rest for the last whole month... Don't even get me started on labor. If I would have kept that fetus inside of me and allowed it to grow in into a baby it would have probably had a hard shitty life because again I'm barley getting by as it is. This abortion debate isn't about what's right and wrong, it isn't about religion or any of that bullshit the media is spilling. It's about MONEY the number of new babies is decreasing by a lot and the government doesn't like that. Who's going to work and pay taxes? That's what it's all about. They need more workers for future generations they don't care how shitty they are brought up if they are barely surviving just as long as you don't get an abortion. Like seriously none of you people who are against abortion gives a fuck about what's going to happen to those children after they are born to someone who straight up doesn't want it and can't take care of it properly.
You are very smart and am proud to see someone so young to understand abortion is unnecessary with all the contraceptives and plan B. I feel like because abortion is legal, people choose to make irresponsible decisions they wouldn't make if they couldn't have an abortion to fix their mistakes.
So many have been desensitized to thinking these human lives are just clumpsvof cells. Honestly we are all clumps of cells. Doesn't mean we aren't living beings. These babies have heart beats, brain activity, the ability to feel pain, can suck their thumbs. They even breath as early as 10 weeks.
Spot on! I don't understand it either. I mean, I CAN understand the necessity for it at times (ex. if the mother's life is in danger), but as I understand it, those instances are relatively rare in this day and age with our modern medicine being able to perform virtual miracles. I could be wrong, of course (I don't work in the medical profession), but if I am I'd appreciate not being called names. Abortion "on demand" is completely wrong, and I say this as someone who used to believe the exact opposite, as someone who used to hate "all those crazy religious folk who are trying to control our lives". I changed my mind, I woke up to the reality of what was really going on.
the doctor comes in after your scans and bloods etc,
they tell you that your developing baby if it is born will only live at most a year and due to defects will be in constant pain which they cannot do anything for.
will leave that moral decision for you.
to have a human baby lying there in complete pain, knowing you could have prevented it or not.
now imagine it is twins, for one to live, the other must be terminated,
you can have both die by doing nothing or one live by doing something,
Ngl... good point, I'll give you that one. But I mean in terms of women who have a fully healthy baby in the womb and just abort it because of their "reasons".
Either way, imagine a girl age 14-16 is raped by her father, brother, uncle, (one of those), she is pregnant with twins. The family have a genetic defect, there is a 90 % change both will be born with it.
What happens?
Let the kids be born with genetic defect and put into care system
The child faces a future where she is a pariah and keeps them?
A state in the USA is pushing a bill to make all abortions for any reason, even to save the womans life, as murder. Even some birth control gets that charge
Also you need to be very aware of the care system, it’s under funding, it’s abuse, then of course the medical expenses both are now saddled with for their genetic illness, disease, which comes out of the care system or the mother. Then the mental health issues…
Life is not black and white.
You have families that cannot afford sanitary products or will not buy them for their daughters.
They now have extra mouths to feed, even though they cannot afford to feed their current child.
@Agape93 Ireland did that, contraception was banned, abortions banned, kids went to religious care homes, where there was no care only abuse, then the bodies were buried in mass graves.
“The morning-after pill refers to several emergency contraceptives sold in stores to anyone of any age.
“It can be an effective way to help prevent unintended pregnancy if you've had unprotected sex, experienced contraceptive failure (like a condom accidentally slipping off or breaking), or if you've made a mistake with your birth control pills.”
“The morning after pill can cost as little as $11 or as much as $50 or more depending on the brand available at your pharmacy.”
I'm saying that one rand (my currency) is equal to fifteen American dollars. So if my currency is so underdeveloped than a country like America's currency then condoms must be more cheap in in other countries as well. A condom in my country is 99 cents. How much is it in your country? (Also, why is a 14 year old thinking about buying a condom?)
Because life orientation has only become a subject recently. We are getting used to the subject, because now we need to pass that subject in order to pass the whole year. That subject teaches us about sex and how to use a condom properly but keep in mind, many children all around south africa do not have education and cannot learn these subjects. But just look at how many of them actually aborted the baby, I bet it's less than half. Because in third world countries the majority of us have morals. You're just losing your grip on what's right or wrong.
If condoms are so cheap, why is it the global epicentre for HIV.
Also morning after contraception, would prevent a good number of those 23,000 births.
Those extra births are most likely families already living in extreme poverty, now given more mouths to feed and even less food for the family pushing further into poverty.
It’s almost like an entire country digging itself a huge hole.
I'm tired of this conversation, I'm not talking sense into you but what did I expect from someone with 69 in their name? Anyway, all I can say is that abortion is wrong, end of story. God bless.
The problem with abortion is, people feel SO strongly that what they believe is right, and the other view is wrong that there is no room for discussion. Look at you for example. I'm not saying you are right or wrong, but you have a set belief, and anyone opposing it simply cannot be right. Until you accept there could be extenuating circumstances to abort a child, such as being raped by a sociopath that you know will spawn a monster into society, what is the point of there ever being a discussion?
First of all, the personality of the child has nothing to do with the ones who bore them. Secondly, killing a baby who cannot even defend itself is wrong
Because bodily autonomy, a person cannot be forced to have their body parts used against their will. Hell, even body parts from a corpse cannot be used with out prior consent. Forced pregnancy is torture, no one should be forced to put their life in risk against their will just because some guy decides to ejaculate inside a girls vagina...
You're 16, do you really think that if you got pregnant the government should have the right to force you to carry that pregnancy to term and give birth to that baby? What about a 13 year old girl? Or an 11 year old?
I agree but I still think with the millions of women that have been assaulted etc… it will always b legal. It’s wrong yes. It’s morally wrong. It’s jus more about the funding of the ridiculous “planned parenthood “. I’m sure it was good in theory…. But has bcom a serious cash cow for liberals. Look up the donations that it gives. Taxpayers dollars go to it then liberals receive the money or the pay lobbyist etc. it’s sickening. Something needs to change… not allowing 20-25 week abortions either.
18.6K opinions shared on Society & Politics topic.
Just so you have an understanding of my opposing view:
1) bodily autonomy should be a funded mental right. Nothing goes in or comes out of it without our say. Anti vaxxers used the same arguments pro-abortionists use. And ultimately it’s right. I walked a fine edge of saying a society should be able to e not vaxxed. Not force them to get vaxxed.
2) a fetus is not a baby. It’s human, but so is sperm. Should sperm be regulated?
3) ultimately, anti abortion laws are like the government forcing all of us to donate blood.
Sperm is just sperm. With a fetus, the egg is already fertilised by the sperm and growing in a womb so, the fact that you admitted that a fetus is a human and you still thinks this I right is concerning
Even the Catholic Church has had a policy of accepting abortions until the embryo is "ensouled", which they believed to be when it "quickens". This is similar to the heartbeat laws.
I don’t think it’s ok because you still killing and I think it messed up because well actually my experience my friend almost got one 13 years ago but I stopped her reminded her her real mother could of done that to her but gave her up for adoption instead Wicth is always a option and my mom was single and 20 it could of been me always other options are going to be There never is it OK to kill anything alive or not even born yet
Do you know how difficult it is to be pregnant and have a baby? It can literally be deadly. Why force a women to be have a baby when it is life threatening? Like sure women that want babies would be more then willing to risk their life and go through trauma to have a baby but those that don't it's torture to them so it's best to let everyone choose instead of forcing them to be pregnant.
You couldn't afford a 99cent condom? Then why would sex even cross your mind? I bet you never heard of actually studying in school because you would've known the consequences.
People who have a lot of sex can't afford 99c each time they fuck. And I did lots of studying in school lol I graduated a year earlier then my class and luckily I did that cause I had a child to raise by then.
Ok yea, you're making it like you NEED to have sex in order to continue with your life. If you had common sense, you would've evaluated the risks and would've known that having sex without a condom (especially when you dont have ay least 99cents) is stupid. But they don't teach common sense in school so I'm not surprised that you graduatsd.
It was worth the risk. I'm happy that I have my kids and husband. But obviously that's just me, there's lots of women that don't want that life and they shouldn't be forced to have it If they have other goals besides having a family
@RandomPerson114 If a bone is broken, most people would go to the hospital and have a surgery to fix it. Same goes with an accidental pregnancy. That "keep your legs closed" BS is also another way to blame someone doing what humans naturally do. Of course you can say abortion is not natural but what is indeed natural is killing a new born or abandoning an infant if they're not committed to raise it like what animals sometimes do. You want that instead? Also that's just like saying, if you don't wanna get a broken bone, don't go out and be a basement dweller.
It’s a debate because not everyone has the same moral code. You can’t expect others to feel exactly as you do. I don’t like abortion either. It’s not something I would ever consider. However, I understand the argument for it. Some people see a fetus as not a fully formed human being with rights yet. It’s part of the mothers body until he/she can survive outside the womb. This issue argues morality vs individual rights…….. two things people are very passionate about. So I try to understand both sides and not be too preachy.
Because a lot of woman ultimately view children as a form of slavery and in their view they are actually fighting for their "freedom" rather than being "shackled" by raising a child or even giving up to adoption.
Because recovering from childbirth is still something they have to deal with, and they want to be free from that
"Abortion is wrong" that is your own opinion, other people have other opinion and as long as we pretend to have freedom, those people are allowed to make their own choices and just because you don't like them it doesn;t make their choice invalid. Agreed though, this shouldn't be a debate as people should stay out of other people's lives
That's the thing. Your opinion is that abortion is killing a baby My opinion is that abortion is getting rid of some unwanted complications that ruin lives and it's just a "parasite" until birth. Whose opinion is right? Who will decide on it? You?
@RandomPerson114 That's because you just see it as a baby when it is just a fetus. Sex kills billions of sperms cells which could've been a baby. But you would like to argue that a sperm is different from a fetus. If that's so then why isn't a fetus different from a born baby? I see, you only wanna view things like how you wanna view it when it favors your feelings.
In case of rape or medical conditions women are entitled to make their damn decisions, As long as the pregnancy does not exceed 3 months. So abortion to me should stand. Instead of abolishing it over there, I think they better act and reason with them brains. I heard that some states do believe in abortion, if one state abolishes abortion people will drive long distances to a state which accepts it and it will be done.
And those who cannot drive all that distance will be forced to do it themselves, at their houses which can really end up un a havoc. watch out.
Late term abortions should be an exception as well if the mother or her child are in a life-threatening situation. An abortion also makes sense if the baby could die once it’s born. It reduces suffering.
@TheAfrikan I also believe in women having abortions for whatever reason up to around 24 weeks when the fetus is viable outside the mother's womb. Late term abortions are exceptions for the reasons I listed. So I believe abortion should be legal in almost all or most cases. Every woman's situation is different and anti-abortion people don't have the right to tell her what's best for her situation. The decision is between her, her doctor, and the father.
@TheAfrikan Hopefully they do. It seems to be that a lot of people don't care about certain issues unless it directly or indirectly affects them in some way. So a lot of pro-life people don't understand the need for some women to get abortions. They change their minds once they get pregnant with babies they don't want or can't support or the men who get their women pregnant are in that situation.
These people only start to have empathy once this happens to them. This doesn't happen with every pro-lifer but it still occurs. I read some BuzzFeed stories about people who were anti-abortion and changed to pro-choice based on their experiences or the experiences of other people in their lives.
@Cherry234 True for sure, since a person who is fuckin experienced in pouring Iodine, on other people's wounds, will never know how much that shit hurts not until when it is poured on to his or her. We happen to have a lot of sayings in my home language, which can relate to ya reply dear bt you won't understand the hmm. People actually tend to have no feeling about some situations until that fateful day when he situations knock on their doors.
That's your opinion. I firmly believe in women having the right to choose what to do with their pregnancies. Just don't force your beliefs on people. Just because you consider something bad doesn't mean it's going to be banned everywhere. But seriously, banning abortion is downright cruel and inhumane. It's a violation of not just women's rights but human rights in general. Some women need abortions because of life threatening situations.
And a woman should ABSOLUTELY have the right to an abortion in a rape/incest case. No woman should be forced to carry a rapist's child. Also, I believe it's wrong for a woman to give birth to a child that resulted from incest because of all the possible defects that can result.
I think there are a few circumstances where an abortion is permissible, like if the mother may die if the baby is carried to term. But mostly it just seems to be for convenience for when someone gets pregnant, as their means of birth control.
I'm not pro-life or pro-choice. I'm anti-people being stupid about sex. We all know that it takes a man and a woman to create a child. Due to this both have a responsibility to prevent a unwanted pregnancy. A responsibility should be taken seriously. Not taking such a responsibility seriously is stupid. If people where taking this responsibility seriously the abortion rate would drop as a rock. Yet people want to drag everything thing into the debate and completely forget about such basic facts.
You say it as if it's too wasy to just not have a baby, but you're not considering the health problem neither raped women. If you're mother was in the verge of dying while being pregnant, would you try to save your mom or the baby? And it's funny cause your kind of people only care that the baby is born but after that you disappear like nothing happened and that the baby you want to be born is off on its own. It's very hypocritical and your question is very irresponsible on your behalf.
If you tell them they're hypocritical and don't really care about those babies once they'e born they get all mad and defensive. They don't want to admit that they don't really care. These people aren't actually pro-life but they're anti-choice. They're only pro-birth. They just want to control women and shame them for having sex.
Rape is wrong. Forcing a woman or a child to bear a child conceived by rape is wrong. Abortion is not wrong. It’s a fetus. A parasite in fact. You pro birthers irritate me. You don’t care about the welfare of the child… how many of you adopt children? There’s plenty in foster care already. My body my choice. Your body your choice. We need to be able to make these decisions for ourself.
In those days, the women shall become pregnant, but they the sinners shall come out and abort their infants and cast them out from their midst; they shall also abandon their other children, casting their infants out while they are still suckling. They shall neither return to them their babes nor have compassion upon their beloved ones.”
BOOK OF ENOCH
CHAPTER 69
And the fifth was angel named Kasdeja: this is he who showed the children of men all the wicked smitings of spirits and demons, and the smitings of the EMBRYO in the womb, that it may pass away
good point "You're not allowed to kill your baby outside of the womb so how are you able to kill them inside the womb?" it is the same harm to a human life. "Just think about it: that child could've grew up to be an amazing doctor, soldier, engineer". well said.
This is the SECOND time I've had to write a complete MyTake on why I hate this idiotic "pro-life" argument and why it holds no water. This one question alone inspired this.
@RandomPerson114 Have you thought of any helpful advice to offer someone in this type of situation? Or about the laws that either make their tragic situations either somewhat bearable vs. being a living hell?
12.1K opinions shared on Society & Politics topic.
It isn't a debate. Both sides just like to feed each other polemics.
Just as racism, sexism and many other "isms" aren't a debate. But people like to throw them around to one up each other. They have no interest in facts or the people involved. Just that they had a "last word" on it.
In your list I see an ''... amazing soldier...'' Soldiers are trained to murder other soldiers (and civilians as well if they're in the way). In your list I see an ''... amazing president...'' who won't hesitate to send soldiers to their deaths.
What is wrong for YOU isn't wrong for others. That's how debates are born. I respect your views, but please don't imprint them on me :) Many decisions in life just can't be brought down to a simple (or categorical) 'yes' or 'no'. Personally, I believe that a potential human deserves a chance to live - unless there are exceptional, very specific and very severe reasons that speak against it.
Ok sure. Soldiers are trained to protect their country, protect it the people in it and they sure as hell don't get enough respect or pay for that. Also many presidents around the world aren't corrupt and actually avoid wars/ take care of their people. by the way, I'm not imprinting anything because you didn't have to read my post. And also, there's no reason to deprive a potential human of their lives. Becasue the last time I checked, murder was illegal.
Hi, active duty Soldier here. We are NOT trained to murder civilians “if they’re in the way”. That’s HIGHLY illegal and we would be tried for crimes against humanity for killing unarmed civilians. I don’t know who you got that from but it’s 100% fucking wrong.
@ShakTreblat I was more thinking of ''indirect'' -but tolerated- killing such as Hiroshima, or bombing out other cities more recently. I would not mind if they (you) killed each other only.
@andreasderjuengere You think it’s tolerated killing civilians? Do you know the sheer amount of PTSD we get from going to war? Do you know how much red tape goes into the rules of engagement and Geneva Convention? We don’t just go out to war for the sheer fuck of it, and when we come back we get mentally fucked up for the rest of our lives and set aside on the curb and forgotten about. Please don’t speak on things you do not understand.
@andreasderjuengere You think it’s my choice to kill? I don’t do it because I choose to, I do it because I have a family to take care of and I want to see them grow and prosper. Very hilarious that you mention Hiroshima but not the action that started it: the bombing of Pearl Harbor. You make it sound like we did it just for fun. We did it because we were at fuckin war. But go ahead and smile it off. You’re a fuckin coward that would rather disrespect the thousands of people defending your freedom as they die. But carry on you Jody know-nothing fuck
@ShakTreblat I have no interest to be ''defended'' by guys like you. In fact, without guys like you, there wouldn't even be a need for ''defense'' :D As for Pearl Habour - wasn't that an attack on a military installation? And you guys killed Grandma's in return. Who's ''brave''?
@andreasderjuengere So based off what you just said, if it’s military it’s ok if people with families die. You know fuck all about me. And you clearly know fuck all about the armed forces if you think we’re trained to murder civilians. But I have no time to argue with a 58 year old Jody know-nothing retard who’s on his way out the door.
@andreasdeejuengere you obviously don’t know your history either. The US wasn’t even involved in WWII until the attack on Pearl Harbor. The US also helped liberate the Jewish people locked away in internment camps being tortured, starved and murdered. But please continue on your high horse of self righteousness. At least know your history before you start poppin off about killing civilians like a fuckin idiot.
@ShakTreblat You appear emotional now. MY history isn't YOURS, mate. ''My'' own people were the ones who murdered Jews; don't think that I like that any more than you do. ''Your'' own people saved the Jews after Hitler and Mussolini declared war on you. Otherwise, you'd just have watched; the Jews are an excuse that came in handy later on.
My age: when I go, it'll not be because some soldier 'on the other side' shot at me :D
@andreasdeejuengere I’ve watched people I care about get killed and you make it to be something funny. You laugh at people who had husbands and wives and children just because they’re military. You sit there and act like it’s funny that people are killed brutally and gruesomely as if they deserved it because they wore a uniform. You have to be one sick individual to laugh at children growing up knowing their parents sacrificed their lives for people like you who laugh at them. Yeah I’m pretty fuckin emotional about that.
@ShakTreblat Don't see my 'emoji' as laughing at YOU. I'm laughing out of satisfaction that my own death is unrelated to some government's brainwash or manipulation. ... How can it be that people are ''killed brutally and gruesomely'' with all the nice rules you mentioned earlier? How will you protect your family when you're DEAD? How will you ''defend'' your home while (U. S. style) you are absent because of devastating the homes of others - overse's?
I'd rather say: you live in your own military world - your argumentation is about justifying to do what you do for the sake of being right. That's what I initially had in mind with: ''don't imprint on me, please''
@andreasderjuengere You really have no clue do you? The rules of engagement and the Geneva Convention are followed by the United States and our NATO Allie’s. Do you think the terrorists that behead civilians and bomb tourist attractions care about these rules? Don’t be such a condescending piece of shit. You’re narrow minded scope of the reality of war is so ignorant for you to think that troops deploy just to “devastate the homes of others”. This all stemmed from you being so ignorant that you really think troops are trained to kill civilians just for the fuck of it, and then you had the nerve to laugh at people dying because they serve their country like a disrespectful Jody fuck who’s only good for fertilizer when you’re dead. But you go ahead and sit on your high horse because you’re so much better than everyone who wears a uniform.
@andreasderjuengere But please talk to me about being wanted. Clearly nobody has time for you, a 58 year old man with some superiority complex picking fights on an app with strangers. You’re just a pathetic little boy who’s wasting the very few years you have left being a dick.
@andreasderjuengere I replied to your initial comment because you were absolutely wrong for saying I’m trained to kill civilians. you're the one that started popping off about being ok with Soldier’s dying like an ignorant prick about things you have no knowledge of in the slightest. You want forgiveness? Go to a fuckin priest. All you’ll get from me is the finger 🖕🏾 I’ve got zero tolerance or respect for human garbage like you that laughs at people dying like it’s a joke.
I will never understand why people get all work up over something that does not affect your life or goals. Just mind your own business and focus on your life
Oh yea, have you lived in South Africa? Thats where i am right now and it's not fun. Why dont you stop judging others lives before getting to know them first? Also I didn't mention a single thing about religion, you jusf brought it up.
And why didn't they use a condom? Not using some sort of condom/contraceptive and aborting the "unwanted" child just because you wanted a few extra seconds of pleasure is selfish.
@RandomPerson114 have you not heard of rape? Or is it because you're 16 you simply don't know what that means yet? Either way, your argument is laughable
You know, putting your opinion on a public forum? People respond to other people's comments all the time. Don't get mad just because I don't like the way you think
Just like going out or doing anything else, there's a 0.000001%-ish chance you'd break a bone. Because you're such a "pro life" and you just wanna let people live with their mistakes, I'd say whenever you're in an accident, don't call an ambulance, don't fix your mistakes and live with your mistakes forever.
@Aiko_E_Lara if i got raped and that resulted in pregnancy she probably would say “it is a gift from god” and would probably expect me to keep the child. HELL NO IT IS GOING DOWN THE TOILET
The main point is the decision on when something is a human. If someone is due tomorrow, I agree, abortion is murder. Taking plan B, not quite murder, wouldn't you agree? At some point we call a bundle of sperm and egg a human and at that point we no longer allow abortion. I am personally of the opinion that this is at just about 22 to 24 weeks of pregnancy. We all agree that murdering a child is a bad thing. We don't all agree when something is a child.
@TallAnon I agree with you. However, an exception for a late term abortion is for a life-threatening situation to the mother or the baby. I also think an abortion makes sense in this situation if the baby is going to die once it's born. That's not infanticide. Getting an abortion would reduce suffering.
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Yes, most people consider abortion to be ok to varying degrees, from my end of the spectrum where it should be free and without limitations, to those who think it should only be done to save the mothers life.
That's not the point, the point is that the fetus is already developing into a baby by the time abortion is taking place. Meaning that they have the potential to become a human but other humans decide to kill them. Also about the women dying in childbirth, what are you on about there?
But do you know what? Male ejaculation is just the sperm. The egg hasn't been fertilised by the sperm yet. But in pregnancy, the egg has already been fertilised, meaning that the baby is already developing. Therefore, a child is growing and developing inside a mother's womb. Which is why abortion shouldn't. Be. Allowed. I'm not interested in continuing this further, clearly you are not being reasonable. God bless you and I hope one day you'll find out what I meant.
@RandomPerson114 You just revealed that you're a psychopath. Yeah you're not actually pro-life. You're a sadist. I honestly find it sickening that you think a woman shouldn't be allowed an abortion if her life is in danger. The utter lack of humanity you have is disgusting...
I remember years ago, before Ireland gained common sense, a woman came in and it was shown that she had a brain dead fetus. Like it was dead dead. No saving it. But they wouldn't abort it until it started rotting inside her. By the time they finally got it out, she had gone into septic shock and died. Made international news.
Exactly. UN charter states bodily autonomy is a basic human right, and part of that is one being the sole arbiter of what happens to your body medically, sexually and so on. So banning that is a violation of human rights.
I’m not exactly pro abortion but the whole it’s killing babies argument is kinda insane and I really think shows a lack of critical thinking skills. Is killing bacteria murder? How about killing a mouse? Is not using a condom murder? Is choosing to not have children murder?
Yeah. I use the analogy of people trying to call fried eggs the same thing as chicken wings, when they're clearly not. An embryo is not the same thing as a fully formed newborn baby and if pro-life people really gave a damn about this, NONE of them would ever have sex outside of the goal of reproduction, in the first place. Considering condoms are a form of abortion. But no; that's too inconvenient for them.
Its not a debate wether or not abortion is wrong. Its about where and how women can safely abort a fetus, or if they need to risk their own life in a back alley where the abortion is done with a coathanger.
Personally don't like abortion. But medically necessary is fine by me or if the fetus has problems. The problem were seeing with roe v wade is it will in some states make birth control no longer available like all forms. Which is bullshit. As far as I'm concerned let it stand. Roe v wade did make abortion trendy it made them safe. I have been refused a vasectomy multiple times already. I can't wait to see what bullshit happens next.
I wouldn't abort my baby, but I don't have a right to decide if another woman does that. Like I won't be taking care of the baby, and it's not my baby, then why does it matter what i think about it. That's it.
It's a lesser evil. Forcing someone to raise a unwanted kid under unwanted conditions are evil. Your evil to the kid and the parents, abortion is killing something that isn't aware yet. The best is to use birth control so it never happens.
Cause people are selfish. Women don't want the responsbility, men want to fuck as much as they want without consequence, simps think it'll get them laid.
Funny things about opinions. Everyone has one and they tend to be different. I see it as no more wrong than it would be to remove a parasite. Unwanted things that drain from the host.
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Anonymous
(25-29)
+1 y
I don't see what's wrong with abortion. Like, why is it compared with killing? It's still an embryo or a foetus. It's not a baby yet. So, technically, it's ok to do it. Like, why are people against it, anyway? Why can't people decide what they do with their own bodies ( babies aren't separate bodies until they are fully and actually born)?
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Opinion Owner
+1 y
Just saw an update. True, religious influence in the ban is less (but not non-existent). But, still don't see why abortion should be outlawed. Like I said, yo7re not a person unless you're born and start crying (at least). Before that, we are just foetuses or embryos. It can't be counted as a life form. Let me give y'all an example. Miscarriages are very common in primates. It's so common that, most of the time, the mother would never have noticed the unborn embryo leaving through her vagina, before even knowing she was pregnant in the first place. So, abortion is the natural way of life. If you're b9t meant to be born, you won't. You can't force others to have a child they don't want. But, let me take your side in this. If you think abortion should be outlawed and are disgusted by the people who think otherwise, find them and offer to be a surrogate/foster parent. I can guarantee you that at least 50% of people will be ok with it. If you can't do it, let those women choose what they do with their bodies and to-be-maybe-babies... 😡😡😡
@NorthwestRider@Confidentandchill I agree with you guys. It's really not other people's business. I'm glad there are some men on here who care about women's rights.
What if the woman was raped? What if the woman is 14 and uneducated? What if the woman is a drug abuser? and last what if a person got pregnant ON birth control? because there is still that 2% risk.
Then I would expect one of them would get a vasectomy/tubal ligation for 100% protection, but if they don't want to have those procedures and get pregnant, of course they should have an abortion. No woman should be forced to put her body through that.
in my opinion it depends on the context. if you're aborting for selfish reasons then that's just wrong but if u got pregnant while you're still in school then i think abortion seems like the best option
Before caring about fetuses, go care about those MILLIONS of ALIVE children in foster care that are DYING to have a family. You are so selfish! All you prolifers are hypocritical and selfish and this is coming from a Republican trump supporter😂im not liberal but im PRO CHOICE and adopted.
@RandomPerson114 😂you absolutely do not have more sense than me.. you are 16 years old. A CHILD. Abortion is not wrong 😂😂😂i will abort every fetus i get pregnant with. I don’t want kids ever
@RandomPerson114 what I said is facts😂y’all prolifers are such hypocritical people. Obsessed with unborn fetuses while there are already alive children in foster care.
@RandomPerson114 ok so abortion is wrong period so even if i got raped, which i have before, i should carry the fetus for 9 months and give birth to it? Absolutely not. 😂😂😂😂😂
@RandomPerson114 ok so once again, me or any woman who gets raped, should not have an abortion? And we should go through 9 months of trauma and giving birth to that bastard child?
Uhhhh if i got pregnant it wouldn’t be my fault because im on birth control and it can fail at anytime and im not going to carry an unwanted fetus for 9 months and go through giving birth for it. No thanks. It will be aborted
Yes but you can't know that either. They could also be the person who brings peace to many countries but since they got killed before they even took one breath, we could never know.
That's my point, any if can have the inverse that is far worse. So it's not really an argument for saying they may be a good person, because it's also likely they may be a bad person. Most of the time they'll be a person who does some good and some bad, but ultimately doesn't do anything specifically notable.
But they're still a person. They could've had a chance to appreciate life and grow up to have that experience but again. Their life had been terminated not by their choice
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