Agree or Disagree: Ronald Reagan is one of the most overrated US presidents in history?

[Anonymous]

As someone who's a right-leaning Libertarian, Conservatives glorify and worship Ronald Reagan as if he were America's messiah. Reagan has said a lot of things that sound like America first Conservatism, yet Reagan has passed a lot of bills that contradict his claimed political views. Reagan was the very reason why no-fault divorce came into existence, gun control laws have completely taken over 2nd amendment rights in California, and the list goes on.

A lot of the bills Reagan has passed both in California and Federally, goes against conservative traditional values. Funny enough, the very same conservatives who trash on Donald Trump so much for banning bump stocks, worship Ronald Reagan, who has done far more damage to 2nd amendment rights than Trump has ever had.

Agree

Disagree

Other

[WindAtMyBack]

When you start talking about politics with Reagan you completely missed the point. What made him great was leadership.

After the Vietnam War, the country was very split. It was very chaotic and out of control. We had back-to-back presidents of Ford and Carter, neither of whom did much. But that's exactly what we needed at the time. If they don't do much, it means they don't do much controversial, which would have fed the fire. It was a calming period that gave everyone time to take a deep breath and get on with their lives.

Then at the very end of the 70s we had a pretty serious economic downturn.

When Reagan came in, he was the right person at the right time. He was a leader that made people start feeling good about themselves and the country again. He was the coach who gave a pep talk and people reacted very positively to it. THAT is what made him a great president.

Yea, some of the things he did were not as conservative as they could have been. But he was was up against a Democratic Congress during both terms. Sometimes one chamber was Democrat, more often than not both chambers were Democrat. He was a realist and worked with Congress out of necessity. He got the best he could, and he was very good at it.

Working with the opposite party and getting much of what he wanted was one of his best qualities, and what made him stand out. Again, that was about leadership. NO other president in my lifetime could do that. Some of the presidents were lucky to get their own party on board, let alone swing the opposite party their way.

People loved him. He was a leader. He was a father figure. He was a man that people respected. Nancy was loved and respected as well.

Reagan was by far the best president in my lifetime. I wish we had more like him. Nobody, Democrat or Republican, has matched him since. He was a rarity.

[Anonymous]

You can't conflate his record as governor and president. Those are two distinct things. I rate him as a very good president for two reasons: 1. A solid economic record. He inherited an economy even worse than the one Obama inherited. The inflation he inherited was like it is today, around 10%. And unemployment was over 10% too. Yet a few years later, the American economy would be booming and it would be pretty good until roughly 2008.

2. His foreign policy helped win the Cold War/WWIII. His hardline policies against the Soviets forced reform. How come? Because after Reagan's massive military buildup, the Soviets recognized they could not win the arms race, a key component in the Cold War. Consequently, the Soviet began to embark on a series of reforms in the mid-1980s that ultimately led to its collapse. How many American presidents can claim a fairly successfully (albeit not perfect) economic and foreign policies?

He did run up high budget deficits, but most of that was caused by his massive military buildup. And this helped end the Cold War, so it's justified. FDR ran up record deficits too. Obama ran up big deficits too.

Just out of curiosity, which recent president to you rate ahead of Reagan?

[Anonymous]

No, but Biden is the first president ever that doesn't have a brain.

[OlderAndWiser]

"Reagan was the very reason why no-fault divorce came into existence"

1. No fault divorce laws are adopted at the level of state government and are not controlled by federal law. How would a US president be responsible for no-fault divorce? Anyone who understand federalism would laugh at this suggestion.

2. Even if the president somehow had some influence on that process, the president in 1970 and 1971 was Richard M. Nixon. Why is that relevant?

California adopted no-fault divorce in 1970 and Florida adopted it in 1971.

3. I lived through the 1970's (you did not,) I remember vividly our dispirited nature at the end of that decade, and I know how the country responded so positively to the Reagan presidency.

Judge him by whatever standard you choose, but I was there, and I know he was what the country needed at that time.

[Asker]

None of the Reagan supporters I've ever spoken with can ever name me a single policy under his US presidency, that has actually helped and benefitted all Americans nor could they for his time as California governor either every time I ask. They also couldn't explain to me why Reagan signed the Mulford Act bill thinking that would have prevented Black Panther members or criminals from obtaining guns and committing violence when all that really did was start a slippery slope for the very atrocious level of gun control that California now has.

[WhiteSteve]

“Trickle Down Economics” is just about the biggest pile of bullshit I’ve ever heard. Expecting wealthy business people to NOT just pocket most of the extra money…. just lmfao.

[NewtoTheSouth]

They pay high wages though. American workers are among the highest paid workers in the world. Where do you think you would earn more than in the USA? It's not a coincidence that America has the most rich people and the highest wages. That is trickle down.
And even if they put it in the banks, they banks loan out the money to help businesses, so they can hire more people. That is trickle down. American unemployment is low too.
And some of it does go to taxes to help poor and middle class people. Elon Musk just paid $11 billion in taxes. That is obviously trickle down.

[WhiteSteve]

@NewtoTheSouth Fair enough, but my standard isn’t based upon the next best available option. I feel like we do that way too much in America, the “well, how would you like to live somewhere worse?” The standard needs to be objective excellence, not excellence relative to anywhere else. Of course this is better than living in Bangladesh, but it’s still well short of what I’m looking for. I feel like the socioeconomic stratification in this country is more by design than occurring organically. The wealthiest nation in the world should have “zero” people struggling, I can’t be moved off of that position.

[D_Bone_Steak]

I sort of agree with you... I hit other though.

I would just say consider what was before him and how bad it was. Like, I think we might see it again after Biden gets through fucking us through the ground.

You're anon so I don't know if you're as old as me or older... or younger. But do you remember the lines for gas... lines for food? That dude did turn that shit around.

I also hate shit like keeping on with the keep on with the drug war. I still remember that speech he gave where his arm was just limp over the thing he speaks into... old... and it was sad there at the end... Like worse than Biden now. He did make things better than it was though... that's from my young memory.

If you're 60 you probably were way more aware of shit than young ass me at the time... seen and knew shit I didn't really understand.

[NamerOfStars]

Well, divorce laws are by STATE; the federal government has nothing to do with them, so Reagan would have no power on that issue outside of California.

But crippling the nation's mental health system, helping tear town legitimate governments all over the world in the name of "fighting Communism", creating a Ministry of Truth in the form of the "Office of Public Diplomacy", supporting Apartheid, Sewergate, the Grant-Rigging scandal, and the drug smuggling would all be enough justify tarring and feathering the guy, if the whole "committing high treason while in office" thing didn't do it first- and even THAT is questionably necessary in light of his McCarthy boosting in his earlier days. It's a mark of shame on the country that he never even saw trial.

Illinois has given the country three Presidents, and depending on how you prioritize their sins, Reagan may have been the BEST. Think about what THAT says about the state.

[loveslongnails]

Conservatives will never agree with this statement because as you said, they deify him. Reagan did a lot of damage, and "trickle-down Economists" was the biggest lie of its time. It was the forerunner to the Trump tax benefits laws for the rich. Reagan also single-handedly turned the college tuition situation upside down.

Here's one writer's views:
Reagan screw-ups

[NewtoTheSouth]

Except wages and the economy improved 1-2 years after Trump's and Reagan's economic policies. Brookings is not a right-wing think-tank:

www.brookings.edu/.../

[loveslongnails]

@NewtoTheSouth And so what... two years of growth for the rich and then the middle class disappears? Reagan's policies were the forerunners of basically everything that's fucked up for the now vanishing middle-class. He, and Trump, have done MORE to put money in to the pockets of the rich and accentuate the divide between blue collar and white collar than any two Presidents in recent history. Both of these guys suck.

[NewtoTheSouth]

The middle class didn't disappear under Reagan. The American middle class remains the richest in history. People around the world are entering lotteries and risking their lives to be part of the American middle class. newcanadianlife.com/.../

[loveslongnails]

@NewtoTheSouth Your link is irrelevant. The middle class has been slowly drying up for 50 years, and the stats prove this.
* The cost of living in the USA is more than 2.25 times that of the rest of the world. Look it up.
* Most Americans (22%) have $1,000 to $5,000 in savings
* 51% of Americans have $5,000 or less in savings, while 35% have $1,000 or less
* The median savings amount is $4,500, while the mean is $35,366
* The average household's monthly expenses are $5,577 per month, which means they could survive six months without income. If the main wage earner couldn't find work for 90 days, half their savings would be wiped out. That's middle class?

If you want to cite stats or articles, use a source that is widely regarded as unbiased, competent and thorough. That eliminates the Heritage Foundation, fyi. PEW Research is such a source.
www.pewresearch.org/.../

[NewtoTheSouth]

Yes, cost of living may be higher, but our wages our way higher. And just because we have lots of income inequality doesn't mean out middle class is suffering. We just have lots of super-rich people here like Musk, Gates and Bezos. According to this PEW Study, "On a global scale, the vast majority of Americans are either upper-middle income or high income. And many Americans who are classified as “poor” by the U. S. government would be middle income globally, according to a new Pew Research Center analysis."
www.pewresearch.org/.../

[loveslongnails]

@NewtoTheSouth Global standards of income are meaningless when you're living in America and subject to the cost of living we have here. What difference does it make if poor Americans here would be better off in Portugal when they're not LIVING in Portugal? In America, the majority of families live paycheck to paycheck with no more that a 3 to 6 month back-up in savings. Comparing what's poor in the USA to what's poor in the rest of the world doesn't and saying "look how much more you make here" doesn't mean squat to the poor here.

[NewtoTheSouth]

LMAO. You used global standard when you wrote "The cost of living in the USA is more than 2.25 times that of the rest of the world. Look it up."
Anyway, USA poverty levels have actually dropped since 1990. For your claim that the middle class is disappearing to be true, you would expect poverty levels to rise. Logically, if the American middle class is disappearing, they would have to fall to the level of poor. But they aren't.
www.statista.com/.../

[loveslongnails]

@NewtoTheSouth My statement was simply a fact of the USA's cost of living. Trying to argue what amounts to " Well, you wouldn't be considered poor IF you lived somewhere else" is not at all logical, because those people live here. The poverty rate dropped 2% in 31 years according to that chart, not much to write home about. It is on the rise again now too, logically as you say, because the disparity of wealth continues to grow.

[loveslongnails]

@NewtoTheSouth It's fine to disagree on what we consider to be middle class. In this case, I believe the median numbers are more demonstrative than the means.

[KostasKouvalis]

He also gave illegals amnesty and created a homeless and mental health crisis.
I remember a few years ago, CSPAN aired a re-run of one of his reelection debates and it was right after he had all those scandals abroad, and even though I knew he won, I was watching that debate thinking, "There's no way in hell this guy's gonna get reelected."
If he did everything the same and ran today, there's no way in hell he would've gotten reelected.
I think Nixon was a much better president to be honest. Nixon's domestic policies had a far more positive effect on the country.

[Anonymous]

You’re kind of an idiot if you think Conservatives “glorify” the man. You weren’t even alive back then. 🤦‍♂️

Hell, if anything I see the Libs on MSNBC talk about how wonderful Reagan was. Which just baffles me. 🤷‍♂️ They did the same thing with George Bush. Why?

Because they aren’t Donald Trump, silly. They are the GOOD kind of Republicans. You know, establishment neo-cons who write blank checks for war... sort of like what’s going in right now.

But I know, I know. You’re a shitlib and “Conservatives Bad!” Whatever. 🙄

[RolandCuthbert]

How is he overrated? Dude almost won every single state in the Union. 49 out of 50.

Policy wise, you can make some arguments. But he was beloved. And the Republican party today, is light years away from him on policy, on tone, and on the basic ideals of democracy and free/open elections.

Besides, the dems supported him in Congress. Back in those days, we could have a GOP President and a Democratic Congress, but they would work together to pass legislation.

[BCA6010]

Reagan came into office immediately after Jimmy Carter, who came after Ford, Nixon, and Johnson... It's not hard to be popular when the four who preceded you were all garbage, and the next four were a mix of mediocrity and rubbish.

Now that said, I do think he gets put on a pedestal way too much, usually by old geezer Republican politicians and pundits trying to make a stretched comparison towards a well-liked historical figure for personal clout.

[NostalgiaSenpi]

I hate that guy. "Reaganomics.", the basic thinking is that wealthy people are job creators, and the best way to boost a sluggish economy is to cut taxes on those job creators so they can, you know, create more jobs. In other words, the good fortune of the nation's richest citizens would eventually trickle down to the less well-off parts of society. Trickle down these nuts.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

He thought trickle down economics was good for the country and avenge citizen financial situation which is BS.

All that ever did was create a huge difference in income inequality and made greedy rich men even richer at the expense of workers getting exploited and America not receiving the right amount of taxes due to tax cuts.

To me that isn't a president that is good, but to be fair that's mostly all presidents of this country.

The system is just built that way.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

As I told you Reagan seriously hurt working American people with his "trickle down" BS

Watch this short 2 minute clip

https://youtu.be/aXrXtW89c9A

[NewtoTheSouth]

LOL. Just because some guy on YouTube says it doesn't mean it's true.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@NewtoTheSouth: Trickle down economics is BS.

[NewtoTheSouth]

No, it's not. A current example is in the news with that bank that failed in Silicon Valley. Here are the steps: 1. Venture Capitalists in Silicon Valley get rich. 2. They put their money in the bank. 3. The bank gives the money to help poor black communities. That is trickle down in practice.
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...Black-Lives-Matter.html

[exitseven]

No, Reagan was a very good president. He handles some things badly but his policies were good for America and the country enjoyed prosperity while he was in office.

[Asker]

Can you list me the good policies Reagan has passed when he was in office both as US president and California's governor?

[exitseven]

When the Air Traffic controllers went on an illegal strike he fired the whole bunch of them and replaced them with new ones. I met two of them that were making rally good money and had great benefits that had to take a job being dispatchers at a college's campus police for 15K a year.

[Asker]

What does that have to do with policies, though?

[exitseven]

Firing everyone that participated in the illegal strike was a policy. The policy is that if you signed a contract saying you would no go on strike and you did it anyway, you would be fired. Not like the way gutless administrators are dealing with the teachers unions today.

[Jay3344]

Terrible President. Check out Noam Chomsky or any liberal take on him. Then check out a conservative or neocon take. Sift through and figure for yourself based on your values. I think he was a good face but a very bad president.

[LiamJHayden]

It is usually unfair to judge people of the past using modern standards. Under Reagan the top marginal tax rate fell from 73% to 28%. In the context that is pretty amazing.

[LiamJHayden]

Also, he did win 44 and then 49 states, so the people at the time must have had a pretty high opinion of him.

[legalboxers]

To every Republican - any Republican is God to them.. Nixon.. Regan. Bush 1.. Bush 2.. Trump. Anyone with an (R) next to their names did a perfectly fine job.

[AngryCarl2]

He seems a lot more popular now than when he was alive. Having said that, he was a good friend to corporate America.

[Anonymous]

What kind of ignorant moron thinks Ronald Reagan is overrated?

[Snakeyes7]

Only by a little. I am not happy that he put in no fault divorce and banned machine guns from public use.

[Jerre]

Actually, he was the best rated President we have had in the last 75 years

[OddBeMe]

Agreed. Started the deficit and had some very illegal scandals. Like trump 10x honestly.