Should countries which have traded/imported Black slaves be made to pay their fair share of reparations money to be given to Black slave descendants?

[Anonymous]

Picture from article 1 below

Reference article 1: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roots_(1977_miniseries)

Reference article 2:
http://www.slaverysite.com/Body/facts%20and%20figures.htm

Note 1: I found the following information from the article 2 link above...

The top 5 “Slave Transporting European Countries”:



Portugal
Britain
Spain
France
Holland



The top 5 “Slaves Delivered-to Destinations”:



Brazil
Spanish Empire
British West Indies
French West
(***Note: there is a tie of 2 destinations for 5th place***:) British North America & U. S. / Dutch West Indies

Note 2: This question was inspired by the following question…

Do you support the idea of “Reparations Payments” being given to eligible Black persons “to atone for centuries of slavery & systemic racism” (& WHY)?

…and was specifically inspired by @grega239 saying this on that question: “Are the African coutries that sold slaves to europeans also [going to] pay reparations?”


Note 3: With the above in mind, “Should countries which have traded/imported Black slaves be made to pay their fair share of reparations money to be given to Black slave descendants?”

Note 4: Choose the answer-option that most closely matches your response to this question.

A - HELL YES

B - Yes

C - MAYBE — Depending on how much money each historical slave-trading/importing country would need to contribute to pay reparations to eligible Black descendants

D - MAYBE — Depending on SOMETHING OTHER THAN what’s stated in answer-option C

E - I’m NOT SURE

F - No

G - HELL NO

Updates

1 y

UPDATE 1 - PLEASE NOTE THE FOLLOWING:

This question is primarily intended to focus on whether the COUNTRIES WHICH BROUGHT BLACK SLAVES OUT OF AFRICA AND TRANSPORTED AND SOLD THEM TO OTHER COUNTRIES should “be made to pay their fair share of reparations money to be given to Black slave descendants.”

Updates

1 y

UPDATE 2:
Please state in your opinion which answer-option letter you selected in the poll to this question.

[Lliam]

I voted 'G'. People of other races and nationalities, other than blacks, have been victims of slavery throughout history, including in the U. S. and the Americas.

The English sent Irish slaves to their colonies in the new world, and to Tasmania and Australia, They tended to characterize them as indentured servants and criminals, but they, including women and children, many were essentially slaves.

Barbary pirates in North Africa were still active through the 19th century and captured Europeans for ransom and slavery. Many a young white woman disappeared in to a harem.

Some blacks in America even owned slaves prior to the Emancipation Proclamation. But even back then only a small percentage of people owned slaves. It was mostly large land owners and wealthy people who could afford "servants". It was acceptable at the time because slavery had been tradition throughout human history.

But these things are historical and have nothing to do with today.

Why are people of African descent being treated as a special case? Not even all blacks support this. It is being driven in recent years by certain anti-white racists (both white liberals and blacks) who don't represent all African Americans. And I don't even think reparations would satisfy them.

Plus, it's the government that would pay the reparations with tax money from all American citizens. Citizens are not all "white" by a long shot, and most them or their families immigrated after slavery was abolished. Many of their ancestors were mistreated. Look at the waves of immigration - Irish, Chinese, Italians, Eastern Europeans, Southeast Asians, East Indians, North Africans, etc. Should they pay reparations to blacks?

I am descended from Irish Catholics who immigrated in 1850 and went straight up the Mississippi to Wisconsin. I know for a fact that none of them had slaves or supported the South during the civil war. They were busy farming.

My parents were appalled by segregation. I even marched to end it when I was in high school and wholehearted supported programs to help blacks assimilate once the Civil Rights Act was passed. I never saw myself as being different from anyone else based on skin color, race or ethnicity.

Should I pay reparations? I think not.

[Asker]

Thanks for your very detailed historical & personal comments.

[Lliam]

You're welcome.

[LiamJHayden]

Reparations should only be paid by the actual perps and to the actual victims.

[Asker]

I agree. Nice short statement.

[juliammm]

I voted G.

Doing this would be a negation of humanity's evolution.

Our values are not the same as those of our ancestors. Our vision of the world is changing.

These people back then were living according to their society's values. We can only be proud these values have disappeared, at least in most places...

[Asker]

Wow. Excellent point, very well articulated.

[Asker]

PS: Your opinion is one of the finest I have ever seen on GAG — it is such an important point, and it is beautifully worded and speaking from a 30,000 foot view/big picture perspective.

[FreyaRed]

Ironically most African countries would be affected, especially along west coast of Africa which were specialized in slave trade.

[Asker]

Uh huh. I found this informative article…

www.britannica.com/topic/transatlantic-slave-trade

Which answer-option letter did you select in the poll to this question?

[FreyaRed]

No. No one living person in North or South America experienced slavery due their lifetime. According to logic of people who want reparation for slavery, Germany could demand reparations from Italy just because ancient Roman enslaved Germanic tribes 2000 years back. Ottomans, Berbers and much longer could be the list for reparations for slavery.

[Asker]

Ok. Thanks for the great historical reference.

[Avicenna]

There may be some people still alive who were slave laborers when the Nazis ruled Germany

[Guanfei]

No.

Unless you find a slave alive today. Good luck with that.

Also funny that arab countries are never mentioned in the slave trade, when they did it on a greater scale, and for a longer time.

[Asker]

Oh yeah? I’ll have to look that up.

[Avicenna]

The CCP uses slave labor in China and has for quite some time

[Sasahara]

G Hell no.

If leftists want to pay reparations, be my guest but I don't want to, and I prefer to not hold people accountable for what their ancestors did, its not modern people's fault.

[Asker]

Nice succinct way of explaining your opposition to the idea of reparations.

[BeMuse]

Because it's the truth. Everyone is in the same boat. Blacks aren't entitled to anything special over any other group of people. Slavery in one system or another affected all the populations around the world in the past. It was the idea of liberty that brought us out of it. By establishing law defined rights and responsibilities within a republic as inalienable rights and breaking free of monarchs people stopped being subjects and began the process of being free individuals. It was slow. It was hard. It was bloody and painful. Blacks have already been delivered from evil and been granted freedom. Many other brave men fought and died to make that a reality. Did Blacks do it for themselves? Hell no! Are Blacks thankful and grateful for other’s sacrifice? Apparently not… Blacks don’t seem to understand freedom, because they never yearned for, never fought for it, and never earned it with their own blood. It was gifted to them by other generous men, so like a spoiled brat they can’t seem to appreciate it. There are people that are trying to take us back captive and to re-enslave us all… They are unrelenting... This should be blatantly apparent with statements from the World Economic Forum that “You will own nothing and be happy”. This should be blatantly obvious when central bankers at the Fed tell you “The Fed has infinite money” as they depreciate your currency and steal your wealth through inflation. Do Blacks stand with the brave men that fight for freedom? Hell no! The majority of Blacks support BLM, a group that is directly controlled by those who wish to enslave humanity. Why? Apparently Blacks want to be enslaved again because they don’t understand freedom and they don’t know who the real enemy is… They have been fooled by the schemes of conquers with strategies of divide and rule. They ate the bait like a stupid ass fish hook, line, and sinker…A They need to wake the fuck up and realize what is really at stake here.

[Asker]

@bemuse
Not all Black people (or people in other groups) think and do things the same way.

[BeMuse]

That's why I didn't say "all" and used words like "majority ". Maybe you should stop trying to put words in other people's mouths for propaganda purposes and try to find your way back to reality.

[Asker]

@BeMuse
Lol. You should read your own words again…

“Many other brave men fought and died to make that a reality. Did Blacks do it for themselves? Hell no! Are Blacks thankful and grateful for other’s sacrifice? Apparently not… Blacks don’t seem to understand freedom, because they never yearned for, never fought for it, and never earned it with their own blood…Do Blacks stand with the brave men that fight for freedom? Hell no!…Apparently Blacks want to be enslaved again because they don’t understand freedom and they don’t know who the real enemy is…They need to wake the fuck up and realize what is really at stake here.”

[BeMuse]

See that's the thing commie, nobody needs your side of the story on what I wrote, because they can just scroll up and read what I wrote with their own eyes. You trying to "fact check" me with the facts right above you just proves that you're a lying sack of shit that tries to cherry pick words out of context to push a propaganda narrative. You just went full retard.

[BeMuse]

What's your next big plan? You going to report my comment and try to have it censored because it proves you're a lying bag of crap.

[Asker]

@BeMuse
Lmfao

[findacure4wokeness]

Maybe you should ask how much reparations do they think will be enough? Will reparations ever end? White guilt may turn out to be quite the cash cow.

[Asker]

I’m sure different people have different answers to those questions.

Which answer-option letter did you select in the poll to this question?

[findacure4wokeness]

G for HELL NO

[Asker]

Is this because you don’t think anyone/any country show now be punished and pay reparations money to atone for “sins in the past” — committed by others to others who are now long dead?

[findacure4wokeness]

Exactly and if we can't move past all these type of problems we are going to be in big trouble soon. Kissing minority ass has created problems that can't be solved through more ass kissing.

[jshm2]

Most already have. But it's only really the past 10 years or so that most have dropped off trying and are instead "investing" instead.

The USA is the only one that has done sweet fuck all in reparations. In fact it wouldn't even recognise it did wrong at all, until the Kennedy administration. Probably why they killed him off.

[Texaskid1]

Will Africa be included since those African blacks were the ones who sold slaves to the White European slave traders in the first place?

[Asker]

I think African countries SHOULD be included IF countries were made to pay reparations for slavery…,

HOWEVER the general question exists before considering that of “Should reparations payments even be given nowadays for something that occurred over 150 years ago?”

[Asker]

…so if the answer to the general question is “No,” then the answer to this GAG question is also “No.”

[OddBeMe]

Depends. I think firstly, whether that govt or country is still here and profiting. And second, does it make sense economically to help communities still feeling that pain.

[Asker]

From “Note 1” of this question — it appears that the top European slave transporters & associated destinations were the following…

* CORRECTION:
“French West” identified in Note 1 should have been “French West INDIES”

A. Portugal - transporting slaves to Brazil


B. Britain - transporting slaves to the British West Indies [which includes the Bahamas, Barbados, Bermuda, the British Virgin Islands, Belize, the Cayman Islands, Grenada, Guyana, Jamaica, Turks and Caicos, Trinidad and Tobago; and other islands] and British North America & U. S.

www.worldatlas.com/.../british-west-indies.html

C. Spain - transporting slaves to the Spanish Empire (which includes Florida & some Southwestern US territory)

www.worldatlas.com/geography/spanish-empire.html

D. France - transporting slaves to the French West Indies (which includes Guadeloupe and Martinique, Saint Martin, and Saint Barts Island)

www.worldatlas.com/.../french-west-indies.html

E. Holland - transporting slaves to the Dutch West Indies (which includes the Netherlands Antilles [Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao, Saba, St. Eustatius, and the southern part of St. Martin])

www.globalsecurity.org/.../nl-west-indies.htm

***QUESTION***:
Offhand, based on the above, which of the following countries — Portugal, Britain, 
Spain, France
, Holland — do you think should pay slavery reparations to their slave-destination-countries’ Black slave descendants?

[OddBeMe]

I don’t know. I don’t live there nor am I sociologist there. I do know the same American govt profited off the blacks like we slaughtered the native Americans. And we gave native Americans sovereignty and casino rights. I’m just saying from an economic standpoint: invest in the hardest hit domminities which just so happen to be ancestors of slaves

[OddBeMe]

*communities

[Asker]

Ok, but “invest[ing] in the hardest hit [communities] which just so happen to be ancestors of slaves” is very different than handing out “reparations payments” directly to the ancestors of slaves.

[OddBeMe]

Why is that so important to you? If we could do both at once why not? Are you really that petty?

[Asker]

I don’t believe in punishing nowadays people by taking their tax money and giving that away as “reparations payments” to other people for crimes that occurred greater than 150 years ago.

[OddBeMe]

Is it punishing for my tax dollars to go to a pork barrel project in Kentucky? Whilst I’m in Texas?

[Asker]

It might be.
But this question is about whether reparations should go to Black slave descendants.

[OddBeMe]

Sure and you just said “why should I be punished”. Is it really punishing when the govt uses tax dollars? Or do you not notice at all?

There is a clear domino affected history of slavery to Jim Crow to today. The loss of wealth. The loss of families passing down wealth, etc. That we can agree yes?

[Asker]

I believe tax money diverted to reparations payments are punishing, yes.
Thanks for your comments on this question.

[OddBeMe]

So you “feel” it everytime Native American communities get tax incentives or funding from our tax dollars?

[Dargil]

There should be no Reparations. In the USA, Johnson's War on Poverty and its aberrations have already transferred $Trillians of dollars to the Melanin afflicted.

[najekim]

No descendant should receive anything in reparations. They were not personally enslaved. Makes about as much sense as Italy giving each citizen of London money because the Romans occupied England for awhile.

[Jackblue]

Sure after European countries have recieved the reparations due to us from Africa and Asia for the Moors and Barbary pirates which should be about 100 times more than reparations for slavery and all other wrongs done by whites against blacks.

[cth96190]

I think that Britain going to war to end the slave trade and 600,000 dead in the US Civil War is sufficient ‘reparations’.
Perhaps we could round up all blacks and ship them to Liberia, as part of a package.

[Unknown29]

Heck No! That’s just plain liberal nonsense.

[Redcupsolo]

Ask blacks why they made slave babies. They will stop talking.

[Asker]

I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you mean; can you please explain?

[Redcupsolo]

You don't know how to make babies?

[Asker]

I don’t understand what point you’re trying to make by saying “Ask blacks why they made slave babies…”

[KostasKouvalis]

The fact their descendents aren't dying of AIDS and starvation in Africa, is reparations enough.

[FunkyMonkee]

If ANYBODY should!!

[Asker]

Which answer-option letter did you select in the poll to this question?

[Asker]

…and why do you think this way?

[FunkyMonkee]

A.
Because the whole thing is utterly pointless!! Those people that were slaves, as well as those that enslaved them, are all long since dead! What point is it in taking the money from people that had nothing to do with slavery and giving it to those that were never enslaved? How does that benefit those dead people? How would you ever be able to find out who gives and who gets? If ANYBODY should pay, it should be those that SOLD them into slavery!! And, as I've said elsewhere here in the past few days, my Irtish ancestors were also slaves LONG before blacks were so, when do I get MY money?
Besides, the entire idea is nothing more than a scam to get free money given to lazy blacks that won't get off their fucking dead ass to get a job because they want a free ride their entire life and they think they're too good to do work!!

[Asker]

Most people will accept free money if it’s handed out to them.

And it’s usually not good to generalize/stereotype a group of people into all doing and/or thinking the same way.

And the “entire idea [behind doing reparations]” could also just be a way to buy political votes, or “nowadays-guilt or remorse” over “sins committed by others to others in the long-ago-past, or some people truly might think reparations are the right way to “right wrongs committed long ago.”

[Asker]

FYI — for this question:
Answer-option A is HELL YES
Answer-option G is HELL NO

[FunkyMonkee]

But, these people aren't just ACCEPTING money that someone's chosen to give to them, they are DEMANDING money.
Right, it's not ALL just them, a lot of people are like this but, from what I've seen over the decades, it's MOSTLY them! One particular case stands out: 4 times a year at this one job where I used to work, we hired lots of temps to help us meet our deadlines. Most of the temps were black. Nearly every one of the white temps had no problem doing the work they were hired to do but, the bulk of the blacks thought we hired them just to sit there with their thumbs up their ass and talk to their buddies all day!! One of the things we needed them for was to write certain numbers on folder tabs, put the vouchers that came with that number into that folder and put the folder into a box. All of it could be done sitting in one spot. They were getting paid a few dollars more than minimum wage but, when we asked them to get this VERY simple work done, they bitched that they weren't getting paid enough to do this!! We're NOT asking them to lift several hundred pounds up 28 flights of stairs!! It's just a few minute of simple paper work!! It came in dribs and drabs so, they WERE allowed to sit there and talk for a good part of the day!
It's one of the things I did when I was first starting there as a temp and, after 2 or 3 of those peaks, they not only hired me full time but were talking about putting me in charge of the section where I worked! I ended up being second in charge!
Yes, I know what the entire idea is.

[Asker]

It definitely sounds like those temps you mentioned were definitely unreasonable and demanding more than they should have been compensated.

Thanks for your comments.

[FunkyMonkee]

Correct! And, nearly everybody else there thought so, too! The guy in charge (also a black man) even told them, if you're not gonna work, get out!

[Snakeyes7]

Oops I hit the wrong one

[Asker]

Which answer-option did you select in the poll, and which did you intend to select?

[Snakeyes7]

A and I wanted G. I accidentally hit it when I was scrolling.

I don't know if the slavery is still going on in that country but I'm pretty sure they aren't all slave drivers today so it would be immoral to make them all pay. Also I'd imagine that would count as collective punishment which is a war crime.

[Asker]

Ok.
War crimes “include such acts as mistreatment of prisoners of war or civilians”…

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crime

…but the Blacks slaves we’re talking about in general weren’t combatants or civilians taken captive in a war zone, so I’m pretty sure that their slave traders/transporters/owners would NOT qualify as having committed “war crimes”; but rather, “crimes against humanity”…

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimes_against_humanity

[Asker]

Just reread what you said…hmm…

It appears you weren’t talking about war crimes with respect to the slave traders/transporters/owners but rather to nowadays making all people in slave destination countries pay (through their taxes) slavery reparations; I wouldn’t call that “war crimes” but rather “civic/representative malfeasance.”

[Snakeyes7]

I guess I might have misunderstood what that meant. I would say that it should be a war crime but it wouldn't make a difference to those who want to do it.

[BeMuse]

No one owes Blacks anything.

[Asker]

Why do you say this?

[FeelingGroovy]

No...

[Asker]

Why not?

[FeelingGroovy]

Because slaves won't be getting the money.

[RockyHammock]

This is just a race bait topic. Man get new hobbies

[Asker]

I am NOT “race-baiting”…

“Race-baiting” is “the act of intentionally encouraging racism or anger about issues relating to race…”

dictionary.cambridge.org/.../race-baiting

…and I am NOT doing this.

I am facilitating conversations about reparations payments, which are currently being considered in California.

This question is a follow-on to another posted question, which I identified in Note 2 of this question. The precursor question had a reference article about the San Francisco Board of Supervisors currently reviewing reparations recommendations for Black San Francisco residents; and this question explores whether slave-trading/transporting countries — and not just destination slave-owning countries where slaves ended up — should contribute to the funding of reparations payments to Black slave descendants.

[michealoh]

Sure, why not... Since everyone that had and traded slaves prospered and flourished from it !!!

[Asker]

You’re ok with punishing some current day people (by making them pay reparations). for “something” (slave-trading/owning) they were never involved in, and you’re ok with rewarding others (by giving them reparations) for something (being a slave) they were never directly affected by because slave-trading/owning & being a slave ended greater than 150 years ago?

[Jerre]

G for Hell NO

[Jerre]

Thank you for the Like

[Asker]

You’re welcome