Germany just shut down all nuclear powerplants. Will this work out?

[DryGermanGuy]

After twenty years of debate, this weekend Germany shut down all their remaining nuclear powerplants. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_power_in_Germany#Closures_and_phase-out

2030 they plan to shut down all coal powerplants and use only gas turbines plus wind, solar and hydro. Long term there are concepts for green hydrogen. Do you think this will work out for Germany?

Ze German treehuggers are crazy!

I give them 50/50 chances.

They can do it, they are Germany!

Who/What/Where is Germany?

[NamerOfStars]

Let me see if I understand this: at a time when energy prices are spiking like crazy with the Ukraine war and the Nordic Stream blowout, the government has decided to abandon the safest, most environmentally friendly form of power known to humanity? And done so in the name of environmentalism?

The only people this will "work out for" are those who wish for misery and privation among the Germans. And the hucksters looking the smuggle in "solutions" from saner countries, I suppose; what's the German phrase for "Thank God for France"?

[DryGermanGuy]

No, the energy prices have gone back to pre-war levels (at least in Germany)... the spikes were mostly done by price hucksters and not because of energy shortage. If you would have followed the energy situation in France you would have noticed that 50% of their nuclear powerplants had to be shut down because of low levels in rivers (not enough cooling water)-

[NamerOfStars]

... Either your knowledge of basic economics or basic realpolitik is SERIOUSLY lacking; I've dealt with you enough to know you're not this stupid.

[DryGermanGuy]

I am not sure what you are trying to convey here? Please check this excellent link for current and historic energy prices: www.zeit.de/.../energiemonitor-deutschland-gaspreis-spritpreis-energieversorgung

[abc3643]

"the safest, most environmentally friendly form of power known to humanity"

Are you radioactive or something?
Nuclear power may be great for climate change, but it is not "the safest, most environmentally friendly form of power known to humanity".

Don't even debate me on this son. For one thing, you weren't even born when TMI or Chernobyl happened. But, also, I am a physicist and studied this shit - including nuclear engineering, reliability, and safety. Nuclear power is good, but it is very dangerous and the fuel still needs to be mined, so it is not renewable.

Germany is doing the right thing because they plan to be 100% on renewables in 12 years. They can do it.

[AviatorTom]

Germany has had a plan for many years to become more green when it comes to energy. They've built thousands of wind turbines and huge solar farms, especially Italy in the north. Shutting the nuclear plants is just one step in the big plan.

[DryGermanGuy]

Yes, these restructuring plans to green (er) energy have been in the making, or at least in discussion, since the 1970s (even more after the Chernobyl disaster). How it all works out - especially price wise - remains to be seen, though.

[Littlejugs99]

I believe so. I mean if you look at renewable energy here in the US it accounts for 12% of our energy which is huge.
I think this will encourage Germany to innovate in the renewable energy sector which will be good for us all.

[Cubus]

That's quite a silly decision.

Well, before war in Ukraine that would be logical. Germany would get rid of atom and create a space left in the market for the gas they would have a lot of thanks to Russia's supplies by Nord Stream 2. But because plans of cooperating with Russia kinda failed, now Germany isn't ready to abondon atom, but still decides to.

This shows how much a slaves of big political plans countries can be. "We already decided we are doing it, we already have documents prepared, we already have clercs that would coordinate abondoning atom, so we can't really stop it, because it would require a lot of law effort to reverse it at this point"

[DryGermanGuy]

Not correct. Because of the war, they already increased the usage timeline for another 3,5 months, to get safely over the winter. Now with American etc. LNG coming in over the new terminals, the need for nuclear power in the next winter is even smaller.
But I agree that Germany should keep the plants as a strategic reserve.

[madgoat]

We should have some nuclear. It provides a core of always available resource around which the green energy provision can be built.
Nuclear is also a source for heat batteries and hydrogen.
I'm guessing the French will be replacing their aging capacity. Perhaps the Germans are relying on this.

[DryGermanGuy]

Agree, it might be a good idea to at least keep the German power plants in some sort of hibernation mode, for the most unforeseeable events. Bavaria is currently suggesting the very same.

[AngryCarl2]

If I know anything about Germans they're not just making shit up as they go along. I'm sure they have a plan to generate energy going forward.

No more Chernobyls!

[goaded]

It's not like they could have just not turned off the switch and kept them going, it would have cost money to do so and it would have been a limited time only. I can see an argument for getting rid of coal first, but both is better.

[DryGermanGuy]

Yeah, I would have liked to have a solution ready to phase out the coal power plants first. Also, the needed energy mix for the winter 2023/24 is still a bit unclear.

[goaded]

They do seem to have totally eliminated the need for Russian gas, which is good.

[maj1nall]

It's a very logical decision on behalf of environmentalism when you don't take into account other factors. But the timing is wrong. How much does this make sense at a time when Russia is cutting off the flow of energy? The most correct scenario would be to gradually close it and make new energy agreements with other countries while doing so.

[noohair]

Well, I think Europeans in general have an inflated opinion of themselves.
Both World Wars were started By Germany.
I am from the US and I have a very deep distrust of the "Government" that I have here.

[DryGermanGuy]

No, to your first sentence.
And World War 1 was started by the assassination of prince Franz-Ferdinand in Austria by a Serbian terror group. After that, the events were triggered by lots of automated pacts of mutual assistance.
To your last sentence, where has that "deep distrust" lead you? Do you have gained any deeper knowledge or abilities? Someone coming from an authoritarian dictatorship talking that way, I can understand, but someone from a democracy? Weird.

[noohair]

I understand the assassination, was a catalyst for the first war. The German attack was triggered by Russian mobilization. Not an overt attack against Germany. I am 68 years old, and I do not see the democracy that I was born into. Opinion is now evil on all sides. And I do think that you might agree that tribalism has had a negative effect on democratic ideals. Classical liberalism has been hijacked by Progressivism, and Russia and The United States both do things that threaten world peace. The Ukraine invasion did expose one thing that I see in a positive light. The Russians have corrupted their armed forces into a paper tiger and the only actual force that they now have is nuclear weapons. American ground forces do not need to be in Europe and Europeans have taken advantage of their position in funding their own defense and they should take a more active role and responsibility for their own defense.

[Dargil]

That and the Mohammedan Invasion will cause them to descend into a third world hell hole.

[gorydetails]

Lmao. Nuclear is the most environmentally friendly power source we have with current technology.

[DryGermanGuy]

And you included long-term storage for medium and high-level radioactive nuclear waste in the calculation?

[gorydetails]

Yup. An average person’s lifetime nuclear waste is about the size of a soda can.

[CuriousMufuxka]

Kool Kool! Wait this is only a wiki..

[In_Trance]

They have plenty of coal to burn

[Oatmeal2]

They will regret it.