Do you agree that nobody in this world should be allowed to be a billionaire?

[msc545]

Agree - nobody should be allowed to be a billionaire

Disagree - anybody should be allowed to be a billionaire

[Curmudgeon]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vilfredo_Pareto (who brought us the concepts of Pareto Distributions and Pareto Efficiency) was right. A new invention or business idea, even if it ultimately improves all of humanity, will disproportionately benefit the first ones in on it. Rough ideas like the 80/20 rule are an example of this.

So, if you ban people from becoming billionaires, you end up hampering the new inventions, breakthroughs, ideas, technologies, etc. that will benefit even the poorest of us. The price of having such innovation - is having a small number of billionaires who will be making out the best from such improvements. To do otherwise is to have a stagnating and even vicious society where we don't improve conditions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77XxBUeWIKY

So what do we do about this? I suppose Jordan Peterson's suggestion - have a degree of public works and infrastructure type projects and programs so that the economic benefits do get down to even the poorest among us (better roads, parks, schools, hospitals, etc.) - is the best we can do.

[SotiCoto]

It is all fine and well to go on about innovation, but when things are innovated for the purposes of parting people from their money, they tend to be inherently flawed for the purposes they're presented as serving.
And innovations are made for other reasons. Quite often simply idealism or artistic vision. But THOSE innovations are also corrupted by capitalism as anything that has the potential to turn a profit invariably gets warped towards that end.

So sure... less innovation without that capitalist nonsense, but purer innovation that actually helps people, as opposed to what we have now: thousands of ways of parting people from their money for token personal gain.

[Curmudgeon]

@SotiCoto " less innovation without that capitalist nonsense, but purer innovation that actually helps people" - good luck with that. You are asking for Winter Of Discontent 2.0. People do things out of a desire to get really rich.

[msc545]

People do things for many other reasons.

[alice55]

Who care about new invention? 90 % of the worlds don't have our European / American invention and they're still happy for the most. No need for new invention especially at the cost of the health of poor worker.

[Curmudgeon]

@alice55 Uh, how does someone getting really rich impact the *existing* health care of a poor person? It's not like the really rich person would go to the low income clinic and heist the supplies...

[NaultD]

I Don't think the government should cater billionairs. They will throw as much money on the wall until it sticks but the true power comes from everyday people voting. These people are your peers facing daily challenges and just getting by every single day.

If we want to take away power from billionair donars it's to make voting as easy and assemble as possible. They will fear monger illegals and dead people can vote but follow the tread and no evidence but money throwen at the wall by said billionair.

[DrPepper12]

Three words: Public campaign finance.

[NaultD]

@DrPepper12 I just googled those three words and billionairs made a point to turn it into a shit show with ads just on those words.

I'm more confused then ever.

[DrPepper12]

So monied interests are self serving? Wow! TY!

[Anonymous]

There should be billionaires if they earn it. They just shouldn't get away with paying 700$ in taxes or nothing. Taxing the excessively rich fairly is the fastest way to balance the budget for once and start paying down the debt.

[IslaTheWitch]

nah... we had it already... it's called socialism or communism... everyone should be poor and stupid...

[Curmudgeon]

Bingo. Either we tolerate a Pareto distribution outcome, or we have the misery of Stalin and Mao. And even *that* had a nomenklatura or Party Bosses who got most of the goodies - without actually contributing anything!

[HawkPerception]

If someone earns their money, then I believe they should be allowed to keep it, HOWEVER I do believe that the system is imperfect and can definitely be changed/improved to resonate with and satisfy the majority of the population.

While I do believe everyone is entitled to keep the money they make, I also believe that thewl wage gap spectrum is too large. There should not be this many hard working people struggling to make a living while billionaires and multimillionaires are thriving and handing down generational wealth. I think that they need to increase minimum wages and decrease higher incomes and make extremely wealthy people contribute more than they are currently to close the gap.

This concept is NOT to be confused with communism.

[slatyb]

Most billionaires just became billionaires because the have large shares of successful companies. It's paper wealth unrealized until they sell some part of their equity. How could we prevent someone from having a billion dollars of paper wealth? Imagine someone with ten million shares of a company currently trading at $10/share. The current value of those shares is $100 million. Suppose that after a few months the stock is trading at $20/share. The current value of those shares is now $200 million. Where did the extra $100 million come from? No where. It doesn't exist. It's an unrealized capital gain. If the shares are sold, the money will come from the buyers who are willing to pay $20/share. Now suppose the stock continues appreciating and reaches $200/share. The current value of the shares is now $2 billion. If we "don't allow billionaires", what should happen? Will the government confiscate half the shares?

[SotiCoto]

The government already confiscates money. A little more taken from those who have too much won't hurt anyone who matters.

[slatyb]

@SotiCoto "A little?" I don't favor a tax on unrealized gains. I do favor a repeal of the Republican tax cuts starting with Trump and going back to Reagan.

[msc545]

I favor this too but it's too little too late now.

[ChicoFromThe305]

I think if they earned it then we shouldn't have the rights to take that away from them, personally if I was a billionaire that made all the proper decisions to get to that level I wouldn't want people doing 9-5s trying to sabotage my wealth, that's coming from someone that isn't rich, it just wouldn't be fair to the people that have taken all the risks to get wealthy, people are too scared to make risks and step out of their comfortzone and their 9-5 bubble and then blame people that have done the risks and have done all the extra work to get wealthy, just cause they have a lot of money doesn't mean they shouldn't have it, cauee anyone can do it, not everyone does and thats not wealthy peoples faults.

[DrPepper12]

Billionare kind of wealth is a potential threat to society. It must be prevented

[ChicoFromThe305]

I disagree, how so?

[alice55]

I agree, absolutely nobody in this world need so much money, when we know that in France our deputy earn 5000 euros per months and everyone want to kill them for earning so much money, I don't get on which rights a random person would earn so much money especially since this money come from slaving poor people and killing their health.

[Sonorous]

I believe that billionaires are inevitable. But I also believe that they're a reflection of just how selfish & greedy we are as humans.

I think there could be structures that would produce less disparity in resources. But I think it is reserved for a better species than ours.

Man could have the path to the highest of eudemonia written out for us & we'd still screw it up & turn it into some money game of who has the biggest toys.

[AviatorTom]

There is nothing wrong with a person using their skills and energy to become a millionaire, billionaire, or trillionaire. The wealthy often establish organizations that help society, and use their money to fund them. If that is bad, we're living in the wrong world.

[RingOfFire]

Who the hell is anyone else to tell you what you must do with your own property and how much you are allowed to have. Who do you think you are? Democrats?

Private property isn't a right you get from government. It's a right you get from your creator. Government stay the hell out.

[SotiCoto]

You'd probably expect the government-paid thugs to help protect it though.
"Private property" isn't a right at all. You just have things as long as you can keep hold of them. If you have any complaints, direct them to your "creator".

[DrPepper12]

So my mom? Thats an odd take tbh. Mom never had a problem telling me what to do with my money too!

[SotiCoto]

I don't reckon anyone should be allowed to be a millionaire, much less a billionaire.
Anything over a million should be taxed at 100%.

Alternatively, just make it legal for anyone and everyone to steal from the rich without consequence. See how long the greedy cunts stay rich for.

[Anonymous]

I do think there should be an upper limit, but giving turning it over to the government is not the answer. Garth Brooks said his great-great-great-great grandchildren will still have his money 100 years after he's been gone, and he's near the bottom of the ultra-wealthy. Meanwhile, tens of millions people don't have homes or food. Two-thirds of the world lives on less than $2/day.

[DrPepper12]

people dont understand what a billion is. They can't even concieve of "million". A billion is enuf for anybody. You get a trophy and a ribbon that says "I won the game of capitalism" and then iff with you to enjoy life.

[NathanDavis]

I disagree...

but that could be a good cap, in an idealized world...

one billion + a dollar

[exitseven]

If you can make the money honestly I say good luck.

[DrPepper12]

Dangerous thinking

[Anonymous]

Disagree. But I don't know how a person lives with themselves as a billionaire knowing that they could help a lot of people who need it and still remain rich. How much is enough?

[DaBiggestBird]

If you do it illegally yeah but a person shouldn’t be held back from success and embracing their true potential just because other people are too butt hurt and envious to appreciate what they already have.

[OfMiceandMen]

I disagree - certain people put the time and the risk, if they become billionaires doing it, then who am I to say they shouldn't make that much.

[DrPepper12]

Its a societal distortion and negative externality of capitalism. It needs prevention.

[alice55]

The rich aren't taking any risk, it's the poor people working for them that are taking the risk... Nobody care about poor people health because money is more important than them...

[DrPepper12]

True facts! The poor get fucked!!

[OfMiceandMen]

@alice55 In some cases, the rich don't take chances to get where they are (inherited wealth, etc.), but for those people that started from nothing, they took risks. They were poor like everyone else and worked hard to be where they are.

[msc545]

The majority of substantial wealth in the United States comes from inherited wealth. Every female billionaire, for instance, got her money by inheriting wealth or through divorce rather than through actually working.

[OfMiceandMen]

I agree, the poor do get fucked but not all billionaires are out to fuck them over. It's the billionaires in power that tend to fuck them over.

[msc545]

One cannot be a billionaire in the US and NOT be in power!

[alice55]

Doesn't erase the fact nobody should own so much money when so many in the worlds live in dumpster. And no they didn't took any risk at all cause they had nothing to risk since they already had nothing to lose.

[Anonymous]

I disagree because if you stop billionaires you might as well reintroduce slavery and pay nobody anything just give everyone their portion of ACME sustenance slop in their cell

[Anonymous]

disagree. only old white men like Trump shouldn't be billionaires

[LazerBean]

Everybody is entitled to their own money.

[serious]

Completely disagree

[ChinaGrove]

How brilliant of you.

[Redstang88]

Disagree