What do you think about President Trump's idea to eliminate the IRS and income tax and replace it with tariffs and a new EXTERNAL Revenue Service?

[RingOfFire]

Democrats never saw a tax on Americans they didn't love. But what do you think of President Trump's proposal to END the income tax and instead create a new EXTERNAL Revenue Service to make other countries pay up what they owe America?

We need to liberate the US economy from this authoritarian Washington bureaucracy of unelected Deep State bureaucrats who use their power to persecute the people they are supposed to be reporting to.

And President Trump has the best ideas to accomplish just that including ELIMINATING the IRS and income taxes altogether to bring the US back to 'richest period' in its history, to stop taxing US productivity, to stop making American citizens targets for IRS persecution and to make other countries who have been leeching off of and taking advantage of American citizens for decades PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE.

Tell the Democrats to STOP WORKING AGAINST America's interests and get with the program!

Eliminate the IRS and replace it with the EXTERNAL Revenue Service to liberate American citizens from this Washington tyranny.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/video/6367897550112

This is a GREAT idea! Finally someone is trying to do something about the sky high taxes Americans have to pay in return for a failing government!

I'm a Democrat and I LOVE forcing people to pay more taxes. The more the better. Do NOT let President Trump slow down the corrupt Washington Deep State gravy train!

[WhiteSteve]

Ok, here we go again…

THIS IS NOT HOW TARIFFS WORK. I’m dumbfounded that Trump doesn’t know this and know was told him yet.

Here’s the main thing that’s wrong with all of this tariff talk: THE OTHER COUNTRY DOESN’T PAY IT. THERE IS NO TRANSACTION WHERE CHINA OR WHOEVER ELSE PAYS ANY MONEY TO AMERICA. That is simply not what a tariff is or how it works.

Let’s say there’s an American company called Acme Construction. Acme has been contracted by a real estate developer to build some kind of building. Acme needs steel for the project.

Let’s not confuse the issue, and we’ll skip the part about buying American steel vs importing, and they’ve decided to import Chinese-made steel, by some imaginary company we’ll call ChinaSteel.

ChinaSteel sells steel beams for $100 per unit. With a 25% U. S. tariff, the steel costs $125 per unit.

Ok, so here’s where you really need to pay attention: Acme Construction will receive what is called a “tariff sheet” with the delivery of their product, essentially a bill for $25/unit extra beyond the $100 owed to ChinaSteel.

The U. S. government is the recipient of that tariff money, obviously. BUT WHO PAYS IT TO THEM? If you said “ChinaSteel”, you’d be wrong.

Acme Construction pays that tariff. Obviously no one is buying one unit of steel, but for the sake of the example let’s say they are: that’s $125 total, with $100 to ChinaSteel, and $25 to the U. S. government.

But here’s the rub: Acme Construction doesn’t just eat that cost and take less profit. They upcharge the real estate developer they’re building for. And then that developer isn’t just going to eat it either. The developer is going to be renting or selling the property when it’s finished, and that extra $25 per steel beam gets passed on yet again, to the renter/buyer of the property. And there’s nowhere else to pass it. And that goes for all kinds of imports across various industries and sectors.

So the moral of the story is that tariffs on other countries cost the American consumer money at the register.

There was once a time when tariffs were used to fund American interests, but it was in the 1800s, the country was nowhere near as big, nowhere near as populous, and didn’t have almost any of the infrastructure that we have today. There were no highways and paved roads, they barely had indoor plumbing, and the power grid was in its infancy. It’s just a totally different situation that would never work today.

But anyway, the “External Revenue Service” is a ridiculous misnomer, as no one “external” is paying anything. The whole thing is actually a horrifying acknowledgment that the President of the United States doesn’t seem to have any idea how our economy works. Not great, lmao

Imagine the incredible country we could have if people just shut the fuck up and paid their taxes, to, you know…. fund this incredible advanced and structured society we have around us🤦‍♂️😂

[WhiteSteve]

*I’m dumbfounded that Trump doesn’t know this and no one has told him yet.

[RingOfFire]

Your knowledge of this topic is limited and your analysis is very simplistic and not dynamic.

In his first term when tariffs were imposed on China it caused China to lower its prices by 15 to 25% to offset the loss of business from the tariffs. The net result was actually lower costs to Americans for Chinese products not higher. That's part of the reason why inflation average only 1.9% during Trump's first term.

There isn't a country in the world on which America is more dependent than they are on America. That's the most powerful weapon in America's arsenal.

President Trump brilliantly uses tariffs as a negotiating tool to force other countries which have been taking advantage of America economically for years and playing us for fools to either act in America's interest or pay the price.

He brilliantly replaced the Democrats bottomless desire to get America into endless wars with a non-violent replacement that not only doesn't get our people killed, but is actually effective.

One after another country's cave. We've seen it before.

The era of America as the economic patsy for the rest of the world at the expense of our own citizens is over.

And those with an outdated and discredited view such as yours are already being proven wrong.

[WhiteSteve]

Disagree, but this still doesn’t explain the “External Revenue Service” thing. China still pays us nothing.

What you’re describing is sort of the correct way to use tariffs. That’s the part I was skipping over to not confuse the issue. To put a tariff on Chinese STEEL, specifically…. that could help America and maybe revitalize the steel industry. I’d be all for that. I’m totally in favor of manufacturing at home and keeping it all in-house, provided we don’t destroy the environment in the process. But remember most Americans don’t want to do these kinds of jobs that produce products we outsource for. Nobody wants to work on assembly lines and all that. And they pay those people dirt, like slave wages, which we don’t and shouldn’t do here, but again…. thats gonna cost us more.

The missing step in all of this is that the people making the most money aren’t willing to make less of it so that it’s easier on others, for no reason other than greed. If you make $200M or 300M a year, what’s the difference, really? Nothing survival-related, that’s for sure. Just don’t buy the $80M yacht, and let all of us keep a little more in our pockets. Non e of these things we get gouged on NEED to cost that much, that’s just the lowest they’re willing to go without sacrificing their completely unnecessary opulent lifestyle. It’s never red vs blue in reality, it’s the rich vs YOU.

[RingOfFire]

China still pays nothing is incorrect. When President Trump levied the tariff on them in his first term they cut their pricing to offset the tariffs because they knew that if they didn't they would go out of business. That means those tariffs were a contribution to our Treasury effectively raising tax revenues by billions of dollars and shifting the tax burden from Americans to China.

[WhiteSteve]

I’m not sure what you’re saying here. Are you saying China paid direct money to America? Or just that it hurts China in terms of reduced business or lowered prices? Also, remember the other country doesn’t take tariffs lying down and will typically levy tariffs on OUR imports, costing US money.

Like at best, there’s collateral damage to China. I don’t think it’s the big decisive victory for America that you think it is.

The other issue is that we depend on China for a lot of things. Whether we need to or not is another discussion. But they’re a big part of the supply chain. All the economic hardship and heightened prices, Joe Biden didn’t do that, lmao, this shit happened worldwide, and it fucked yo supply chains. That took years to recover.

And the fact is, America is now a service-based economy, and much less a manufacturing economy. Again, whether it has to be that way or whether or not we should be is another topic for another time, but they’re bottom line is that it currently is what it is, and it will take billions of dollars and longer than Trump has in office, and maybe on Earth, to change that. It’ll take like ten years plus to become a self-sufficient manufacturer of all the things we need that we currently rely on importing to supply.

[lightbulb27]

I'd have to see the finances of that work out. We gotta pay our bills. Has it really been thought through?

This is a finance question...

I'll say this... what is the effect of massive tariffs? Reduction in trade, some justification to return production to USA... maybe? I think this is a boulder thrown into the water. Someone gonna drown. Not because it's good or bad, it's a shock to the system that govts cannot adjust for quickly.

As the french say... say lavie (spelling). So let it be?

[RingOfFire]

The tariffs on Mexico and Canada is to get their asses in gear to shut down the illegal immigration into America, stop the gangs that a destroying our society and the fentanyl poisoning of American citizens that is murdering hundreds of thousands of our young people.

If the lefties in Mexico and Canada do what Trump is telling them to do I predict the tariffs will be very short lived. And I think they will have no choice but to do it because it will hurt them FAR more than it will hurt us. Mexico is already in big trouble and Canada will collapse without America.

[RingOfFire]

As to China we already have experience with that. Trump put a tariff on them in his first term.

China, knowing that it would put them out of business if they didn't cut their prices, reduced their prices on everything they sell America by 15 to 25%. That was more than the tariff.

Net result? Americans MADE MONEY on the tariffs and CHINA was the one who took the hit.

That is one reason why inflation during Trump's first term averaged only 1.9%.

[lightbulb27]

I don't think they can solve it without USA, thats why I've said... merge it all into north america. Avoids having to build 6000 miles of wall and police it.
Yes, everyone has high debt, lowering their sales will be a problem, as rates rise, currencies collapse. Thing is, they could try to shift to other markets... but China is hurting as well. Asia doesn't need them other than the oil.

[exitseven]

I think if the budget can be cut and we can find enough in tariffs and fees it is possible. It's a big IF though.

[AnonAndrew]

Sounds a bit unrealistic.

Your answer choices are so biased it's not even funny.

[Dargil]

T47 is going to be an interesting ride.

[Dargil]

Not completely but I like the idea.