For me it's just another reason to home school your kids. I remember when attending schools in England most of the class could barely read or write as it was, classes were overcrowded, bullying was rife, students were getting stabbed and there was a serious problem with grooming gangs. I'm not sure what the UK government intends with this nonsense based off a tv show on netflix but as usual the UK government doing anything but tackling real issues.
Well, the answer is Yes and No and it should apply to all kids.
Here's the Yes part:
Kids need to learn ethics and proper behavior, period. If they do that, then they don't grow with "toxic anything".
Kids also need to learn respect for authority and logic.
Basically, if a kid gets a good education, they won't be toxic, Republicans, or idiot Trump voters.
Now, that education partly comes from school but not as part of the lesson plan - nor should it... which brings me to the No part.
Here's the No part:
For the most part, education is handled at the state level, not the Federal level. And with Trump trying to eviscerate the Department of Education, setting standards on something like that is just not going to happen. Chances are any Federal standards on this area would be unconstitutional anyway.
But, just as important, this is the sort of education kids are supposed to get from their parents and life experiences (and that includes media consumption). Unfortunately, if the parents (especially the father) are fuck-ups, they just teach their kids to be fuck-ups too and then we get guys like Trump and Andrew Tate who are both icons of "toxic masculinity".
In this subject area - or any area involving behavioral education - parents need to take the lead until the kid is old enough to recognize right and wrong.
... and an occasional ass-kicking (figuratively) is warranted in this. My old man set me straight when I was (accidentally) rude to my mother. (I never intended to be rude to my mom; we got along well.) Growing up in the 1960s and 1970s, I got my shit straight (and most of us did for the most part) because that's the way the culture was trending although, I must admit, treating women equally (from a woman's perspective) was not happening in practice in the adult world at time (*). I grew up with all sorts of prejudices simply because of the times I grew up in. But, the most important part was learning how to treat people and that did come from the time I grew up in.
(*) Star Trek was a good example of this. Star Trek is really an idealistic liberal show but, at the same time, it still was a bit sexist. Those miniskirts! (And guess what! I just learned this! Grace Lee Whitney, who played attractive Yeoman Rand was the one responsible for suggesting miniskirts; originally women crew members were going to wear pants like men, but Grace - no fool regarding the attention from men - felt the miniskirts would help with ratings.)
No, quite the opposite. Masculinity needs to be ENCOURAGED, supported, and accommodated. There's no such thing as "toxic masculinity" - masculinity is not toxic; being toxic is toxic, and plenty of women are toxic, yet we don't talk about "toxic femininity" even though we could.
Women have been trying to pussify men for decades, using concepts like "toxic masculinity", and they're LESS happy with the world they've created instead of more happy. So why would anyone believe that doubling down on something that didn't work is going to make things better?
Tons of parents who CAN are pulling their kids out of public schools, and the trend is accelerating, and it's exactly because of crap like this.
I can start a long discussion about FEMALE toxicity. Want to have THAT conversation? Should we put women in classes and indoctrinate THEM? Do you think that would help?
This is exactly why the Department of Education is being eliminated and we're returning that power to the individual states. And why many parents are taking even more direct control of their kids' educations. This crap is GOING TO END. It may survive longer in a few places, but it's all going to get shut down LEGALLY sooner or later - the cases are already making their way through the courts.
Soon, you're going to have to do something other than blame everything on men (or boys, in this case).
Nope this is something parents should make them learn not school, school already don't have enough time to finish the program no need to get it heavier, also in my school we had consent and lessons against homophobia well it did not change a things at all children have their own view and one lesson. is not gonna make them change their minds.
I say no because all kids should be taught how to respect people, keep a baseline of understanding and not have a go whenever they feel like it.
I think most kids have a pretty full curriculum rather than piling more on to their plate.
@Gwendoline stress does them no good you're right
If you think about it. Kids are travelling 1-2 hours per day, 6 hours per day 5 days per week at school, then two sometimes three hours of homework plus studying an hour or two at night. It's insane.
Think that's why so many kids are leaving with no education. They are essentially being educated by a system that was set up to train good factory and agricultural workers and those jobs no longer exist and schools are basically a babysitting service so both parents can work and pay tax to the government
I agree to a certain extent... I think it depends on where they're being schooled as here there are a lot more practical and applied learning paths kids can take from 16 onwards and they are essentially apprenticeships with some taught material on the side. That's something at least but less shoehorning into college courses would also be great!
Opinion
52Opinion
As a man, what is interesting is I’d say empathy, compassion, and respect in a co educated school environment did more wonders than having ‘toxic masculinity’ workshops.
The thing is, you can’t enforce: ‘Masculine qualities bad’, though you can shift focus in a positive healthy way to be empathetic, compassionate, and respectful to all members of society whether black, Jewish, Muslim, female, male, etc. through the resources and upstanding role models in their day to day. As I said before, it takes a village to raise a kid. A little ‘toxic masculinity’ seminar ain’t going to do a damn thing.
Health Class can discuss topic of date rape, consent, birth control methods, periods, etc. to educate men on the subjects which makes them treat women as people & understand the struggles they face.
No. Forcing one gender to do something the other does not have to do is not just wrong, its illegal. Its a violation of the civil rights act, as well as Title IX.
I think those that are pushing this should lose their jobs, and be banned from working in education. Its stupidity at best, dangerous at worst.
How bout we bring back Recess in elementary school. that will curb a lot of issues. Oh and how bout we stop drugging little boys who just need an outlet for their energy. This is my issue with feminized education. Its very female centered, meaning little boys are expected to behave as girls or be drugged. Fuck that.
What is recess?
Recess is like a little break that use to happen at least twice per day in school. Once in the morning, and once after lunch, where people would go to a play ground, and play sports, or play on the playground equipment. If you dont know about it, you're not part of the generation that had it unfortunately. When i was in school it was something i looked forward to because it got me way from my teacher.
Schools need to get back to doing their real job. Parents, it's the schools job to educate your kids. It is not their job to raise them for you. Teaching them values, teaching them right from wrong, that's YOUR job, parents! We're on dangerous ground when we start using the school to teach anti-misogyny and the like. Boys used to be brought up to respect and care for women. That used to be done by their fathers. What's happened to fathers?
The purpose of a school is to educate. If we as a society feel like educating our children a certain way, then the best approach would be to do it with our schools. Also my parents couldn't help me with my math homework, so what makes you think they're suitable to teach me about complex themes like these?
@rybukakes by a certain age I didn't need help with my maths homework and I was taken out of a failing school and homeschooled
Why just boys?
What about anti-misandry classes for the girls? How about teaching girls to accept responsibility for their actions, as well? How about teaching them not to embrace the double standards that work in their favor.
By all means, send the boys to special classes, but let's likewise send the girls to classes, too.
Precisely!👍
No schools should not be teaching kids basic social skills and how to be a good person. That has always been and is best taught at home by engaged caring parents who don't want to turn a problem loose on society at age 18.
But what if dad's a gang banger or mom's a meth addict? What if the values that get passed on are straight out of a Klan manual? What if daddy's angry and beats mommy weekly? What are THOSE kids gonna learn.
So we have a conundrum. Let those kids grow up to be ticking time bombs. Or try to do something about it. Even though it's not the taxpayer's responsibility to clean up after every low life who ignores their kids social development.
I'm split. The schools are absolutely not the ones who should be picking up the slack on the taxpayers dime. But they are the last line of defense when parents, extended family, and communities fail.
@rybukakes ,
Because I see that as THE basic job of parents.
1.) Keep your child safe.
2.) Keep your child healthy with good food, exercise, and medical care.
3.) Provide an education for your child so they grow up to be independent adults.
4.) Socialize your child to interact with other people in healthy constructive ways.
It's a really simple set of tasks. But it requires 24X7 involvement by a parent for about 21 years. The parents spend more time with that kid in those 21 years than anyone else. A teacher sees that kid for 1 hour a day or 1 hour a week. What chance does that teacher have of turning a kid around if their home life and role models are straight out of hell?
No, this is not a job for school systems or government. It's a job for parents. But some people are miserable failures as parents. That puts their kid on a collision course with a tough life. It endangers society as a whole when these 2nd generation assholes are turned loose on the streets.
So as I said before, schools or other social programs become the last line of defense for society and the last hope for these kids. You could make an argument for mandatory training of the parents. But good luck changing a 45 year old alcoholic who beats his wife and kids. Good luck getting Meth-Mom to show up for the parenting classes. What you're never gonna get is preconception personality profiling for wannabe parents to approve them as parents.
The reason this bugs me is that we have a significant number of people in the US society who are absolutely failing in their civic duty and their duty to their children. THAT is the problem. Unfortunately I do not see a solution.
We don't live in caves anymore, we don't hunt for our food or gather berries, we don't live in tiny tribes anymore either. Everything you're saying makes perfect sense if you go back in time 10.000 years ago, but now we live in a modern society. This means we are exposed to more people and things than any parent could prepare a child for. We kinda have to let our schools parent our children, because parenting nowadays requires expertise that not a single parent on this planet can do all by themselves. And I don't just mean expertise to teach math, science, and literature, but also to bring in general knowledge on how we're expected to behave with others. Because children go to school with other children with possibly other backgrounds and values. It's actually quite impossible for a school to not take a role in parenting a child.
This is nothing new. Even when I was at school - which was about 25 years ago now - there was already something called "personal and social education" on the curriculum.
This would teach all sorts of things, so for example, not just the practicalities of safe sex, but also about healthy, respectful relationships. Basically, stuff that isn't strictly academic, but is aimed at producing decent, well-adjusted, functional human beings, who are an asset to society. That is a school's job, after all - not just to produce employable workers.
What you're talking about would already be covered (I'm a qualified Teaching Assistant, so I know not much has changed).
Having said that, it has never been a substitute for good parenting, and many parents need to do much better.
Helping boys with growing up would be too much of a hassle :D
Telling them they're the problem is so much easier.
I just feel bad for every boy who doesn't have a man they can turn to to help them in this time. Going through it alone is a challenge you could say.
No. That sounds like part of the woke agenda - feminizing boys, teaching LGBTQ and radical feminism.
How are boys supposed to grow up to be strong, healthy men if masculinity is treated as toxic?
Schools are supposed to teach things like literacy, math, sciences, and thinking skills. It's up to parents, not the state or woke teachers, to instill empathy and ethics.
I have a better idea. Arrest and prosecute violent criminals.
LMAO "Just another reason to home school" You're 18 years old. Listen up.
A) Do you think that all parents can AFFORD to home school, and live on one income?
b) Even if they could, do you think they have the necessary SKILLS to teach their own kids, or any kids at all?
The truth is that "educating kids" is not a priority for most governments; grooming and indoctrinating them to be good little servants IS the priority.
Most kids learn on their own by a certain age and there's a reason so many kids are being failed by schools.
" Most kids learn on their own by a certain age " --- huh? Learn WHAT on their own? Kids failing at schools happen for more than "a reason"; there are a multitude of reasons, and invariably they start at HOME, which is where you think they should be schooled in the first place. Schools are designed to indoctrinate for the most part, but so is the home environment, and that's usually worse. Schools failing kids has been by design, as I said in my previous statement, you know, the part you don't a retort for - this: " The truth is that "educating kids" is not a priority for most governments; grooming and indoctrinating them to be good little servants IS the priority."
If you want to speak on the subject with some knowledge, kindly read "How Children Fail" by John Holt, or any of dozens of books on the subject.
* omission - "don't have a retort for". And note, I also said "most governments". There ARE governments around the world who actually WANT kids to excel in all areas, and help them to do so. You can Google them yourself. When you do, you'll see the US ranks 24th in math, 24th in science and 38th in reading as of the last PISA tests worldwide.
Absolutely. Everything begins in the childhood. First and foremost all bullying should be eradicated and criminalised. That is the root of all school related trauma.
Parents of kids who bully other kids, should be penalised. And the bully kids should be sent to psychiatric counseling.
I think bullying is a circular thing. A lot of bullies are being bullied or bullied at home or there is problems at home ie alcoholic parents or divorce
A big one is no father in the home.
Then the root is further down - some people do not deserve to have kids/ be parents 😞
Did you see this outrageous BBC interview?
Funny, not expecting any netflix documentaries or BBC coverage about the grooming gangs...
https://www.youtube.com/embed/5Ajn_u9_4sgEven if you believe that the lessons would be fair and useful, that is not the role of schools, it´s for parents and other relatives or role models outside of school.
And, honestly, does anyone think that giving some hardcore leftists a soapbox in such lessons won´t end badly...
No. But they should make girls attend self-defence and anti-misandry classes.
But with the US department of education gone. There are going to be no US schools teaching anything. So the question is moot.
Girls self defence classes don't actually work. I've attended a few. I tried a few moves out on my brother and partner. Nothing worked.
@rybukakes I'm surprised how open schools in the US are, basically any non student seems to be able to wander into school grounds without meeting a locked door.
Um like where do I start? We needed this like yesterday? How about add Palestine solidarity training, trans* awareness and inclusivity, Islamic education, safe spaces for black and brown bodies, and so so so much more!
When would schools fit in mathematics?
To @genderqween instead of divisive like you listed, just teach "respect everyone" like at church. Too bad atheism lacks new testament.
@strateguy632 LIKE church? LOL that's the least respectful thing by threatening people when they die of eternal harm if they don't abide by bronze age morality that was interpreted in the IRON age by MEN who wanted to control the masses of illiterate ignorant populations?
NO
No. If you want men to become more so this is how you do it. It's the exact same to the anti-smoking lessons ya know what that made us want to do? Smoke lol
@rybukakes I think he's right, kids rebel. For instance Andrew tate is probably more popular now because schools in the UK have banned him.
Well not only do kids like to rebel but it's also the way they teach it.
They try to push it so hard.
Which is not something anyone appreciates.
It's part of a Backfire effect, you end up causing them to have an emotional response back rather than the logical one.
Logically the kid should think 'oh okay cigs are bad.' But emotionally it's not what they get from it. Emotionally they get 'Ah what bs I don't need to worry about this.' or even worse 'Now I'm going to try it in spite screw you school.'
I don't think what you propose works, but I also think something should be done. I would prefer a class where both boys and girls attend together and learn about this stuff together. The way I see it, the more men and women are seperated, the less understanding they have to another. So a class were biases towards men and women are discussed and pitfalls they both encounter through social pressure, is something I think would be good for both boys and girls to attend.
u if that were to work... all of the problems in this world would be solved in one generation...
Giving boys an education that isn't designed for girls to succeed and has a greater emphasis on experiential learning instead of academic book like learning that is successful for girls and reintroduce competition within academics to reward progress and achievement.
Education sectors should bring more male teachers in as there are far too few capable ones in the younger years able to provide boys with the education they deserve.
Aw hell no!
More liberal brainwashing to pussify the male gender.
@rybukakes well in the UK the government is worried about influences like Andrew tate meanwhile grooming gangs prey on young girls
@Gwendoline, I was being sarcastic, wasn't that clear? This is not a rhetorical question, because I want people to know when I am being sarcastic, so if it wasn't clear please tell me.
We will be ran through by a stronger nation one day if this BS continues. Which it won’t because it’s antithetical to our biological and psychological instincts inherent to each sex, if this BS continuous will just be creating domestic terrorist here the times will change because men are the enforcement arm of every society.
I'm ok with education and training, but this sounds extreme. don't know, don't like those labels.
get into a war and people will want more toxic masculinity.
It sounds terrible in England for an education, but unlikely to be more than one stabbing. Can we say the same in the US with gun crime in schools? If they don't want to attend classes probably better they stay away from school!
Only if there are classes for girls how to NOT become a weaponized feminatzi girl/woman.
The schools can't do everything. Parents need to teach their children character.
That's my thought to and where would the time for these extra lessons come from? Kids at school are pretty overworked as it is.
Why are you specifically targeting men? I'm not sure if you have looked around but females aren't exactly doing very good either. Most men will agree with me
Will the girls have to attend equivalent classes?
I have been to sexual behavior classes at work. Where you would watch a scenario and hold up red or green card to show your opinion. What a waste of time!
Let boys be boys, the culture beating men down needs to stop.
i think the usa is probably in the top 10-15 safest places for women.
@rybukakes not even top 20, but i guess that's for women. it could be different for girls in school?
Stick with the basics. Once schools have mastered that, which is unlikely, they can delve into social topics for both boys and girls.
Only if the girls go to , toxic feminism avoidance, class.
no... just adults shouldn't give bad examples...
Yes, if the same schools teach girls how not to be gold diggers !!!
You don't have any gold.
But some guys have LOTS of gold, and some girls use their boobs to get it !!!
No.
The entire "toxic masculinity" idea is bullshit. As soon as someone says those words I know they aren't even worth listening to.
My child would not be attending such nonsense
Only if girls are forced to attend classes to prevent toxic femininity.
I haven't actually seen that series, but just seeing the description makes me think, "God, I wish I was like that kid when I was a teenager."
I thank government schools should teach mathematics, English language, English literature, civics American history and Earth Science.
Sounds like leftist for castrate and lobotomize, they need cannon fodder for the EU's newo-nazi army and before the sick can use them as sexual playthings
Why not force them to let girls step all over them? That'd be quicker.
@rybukakes
I have two! So 😝
The problem I have with things like this is: who's to say what misogyny or toxic masculinity really are, or rather, how do we define them? These terms are so often misused in today's world that they've lost their meaning.
I thoroughly belive toxic masculinity shod be taught in schools. God knows the passes having kids aren't teaching men to be men these days.
Not unless they also have classes for the girls because plenty of them worship female celebrities who openly hate men.
The more you supress it the more it will explode
@rybukakes no but suppressing it will increase his curiosity more
Apply this to ALL kids.
No double standards under any circumstances.
Perhaps every time so something for women so we have one for the prevention of toxic men and other one for women then it might work
Sure, go blame boys again for everything, tell them they're bad from birth, that will surely not fuck them up.
Already covered in NYS health curriculum. We're good!
As long as it's taught by the right people.
I. e. NOT trump
Hahaha hw is too busy president closing holes in border And cutting democrat spending, to teach.
@strateguy632 I wouldn't want him teaching anyway, much less running the country, guy needs to be in prison, not running the country, fucktard
Yes. How can there be misogyny even in a developed and free country like US? I think misogynist men should be sterilized.
@Shiprex what do you mean?
Well, do you have anything to say about men being misogynists, Mr. Know-it-all?
Men being misogynists could have something to do with society treating them like disposable, expendable ignored and unrepresented in contemporary society. So they act out against perceived villains who have all the privileges and opportunities thrown at them.
Men have zero inherent value in society until they PROVIDE something. Women turn up and as women have automatic value BECAUSE they can PROVIDE babies even if they don't actually do that. THEN they get preferential treatment because they're women (segregated sports, preferential education system, access to higher education more easily, accelerated management progress, "unwarranted access to boardrooms without being on the shop floor, etc). They get treated better, less likely to be homeless, unemployed (they don't NEED to work as men will do that and support them), killed in work, crime, etc.
So maybe having a simple thought of the life of men is something feminists could perhaps spend a bit of time on instead of blaming them for everything bad around, telling them they're slower than girls while growing up, undermining their development by letting them learn by themselves, and perhaps recognising that it's STILL MEN providing all the backroom services you're taking for grated for your lifestyle. Oh and that men are worse than wild animals seems to be a toxic feminist trope at the moment
Okay
If you can't read, that is worse than masculinity issues.
no, math and science and English.
School isn't there to raise the child
Nope leave that for their parents to teach them
Geez. What is going on in the UK?
No that’s ridiculous
Dunno
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