What do you think about simple libertarian structures that prioritize autonomy and social order, with Distributive Free Market the main ecnomic syst?

[WilliamPamer446]

Updates

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Oh thank you sorry

[Syntosi]

From what I have seen of libertarianism its just wishful thinking. It has never worked in practice and often if not always falls apart when you start actually thinking through the consequences.

A lot of people wish the world was that simple, either because they dont like complicated situations or perhaps because they just want to focus on themselves. But the world does not work like that. We live in a community and people need to start accepting that.

[seeyounexttuesday]

that's hilarious coming from a commie.

[Syntosi]

@seeyounexttuesday Oh really? What makes you think I am a communist?

[seeyounexttuesday]

Most of you who are unsuccessful at life are commies.

[Syntosi]

@seeyounexttuesday Speaking from experience? You do sound like a loser to me.

[WilliamPamer446]

"Never worked in practice"

I think u mean anarchy and Spanish and African colonies both had libertarian structures and ye they have worked

It not about morality/social expectations fuly it's about Governing

[WilliamPamer446]

I'm a "community" focused libertarian. I think your focused on ridiculous sterreootypes. I'm an anarchic minimalist.

[seeyounexttuesday]

Bahahaha. So a dumbass with more words.

[Syntosi]

Again, I have never seen a libertarian system work and anytime a libertarian gets any kind of power in any government they just screw things up. I dont know what you in particular believe in either since it feels like most libertarians have their own versions of how the world should work in their own head.

[Syntosi]

@seeyounexttuesday Go away kid. Nobody likes you.

[seeyounexttuesday]

how am I going to recover from that biting retort?

[Syntosi]

@seeyounexttuesday You dont.

[seeyounexttuesday]

oh no, it's over for me because some retard on the internet doesn't like me? How could this have happened?

[WilliamPamer446]

Syntosi you think your a tough guy, for defending centralized structures

My philosophy is grounded, constitutional working republic as a framework for the Minimal Structure.

Working People with Distributist support

[Syntosi]

In your head, what is a "minimal structure"?

[WilliamPamer446]

A government like structure that punishes violent criminals and uphold order in a decentralized, liberty focused framework.

[Syntosi]

So no investing into medicine or protecting national parks or national defense etc?

This is the point where I am most confused about your peoples position. The government is not the size it is because someone in charge wants a large government. It is required for it to do the functions expected of the government. If you want to cut down on the size then you are also going to have to cut down on the things that the government does.

[WilliamPamer446]

Who the hell said we can't take care of parks or have a military

I'd still have a military bro

[WilliamPamer446]

No it's that minimal simple structures to handle things without beuracracy not that we don't handle those things just less centralized authority

[Syntosi]

Bureaucracy exists to make things as small and simple as possible. You do realize that right? Trying to do all of this without bureaucracy would be nightmarish.

[WilliamPamer446]

In a authoritarian way bruh. Why do you keep using far left authoritarien arguments.

[WilliamPamer446]

I would have less not none. I believe autonomy not adult babies.

[seeyounexttuesday]

Wait, an "anarchist" thinks bureaucracy exists to make things simple and are efficient by nature? BAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA. I've heard everything.

[WilliamPamer446]

I'm not an anarchist you have bad reading skills

[seeyounexttuesday]

@WilliamPamer446 I'm talking about the dummy you're attempting to have a good faith conversation with.

[WilliamPamer446]

He's a authoritarian fool

[Syntosi]

@seeyounexttuesday Yes, that is what Bureaucracy is, fundamentally speaking. It establishes a persisting hierarchy in government that does not change with elections, and thus does not become destabilized and facilitates the transition of power as well as enables cooperation and mobilization of the nations resources and people.

To my knowledge this can't happen without a bureaucracy and human history preceding bureaucracy is a clusterfuck.

[Syntosi]

@WilliamPamer446
How would USA function without bureaucracy then? I dont even think the transition of power would be realistic with such a large nation without a dedicated core of professionals that always sticks around.

[WilliamPamer446]

You don't understand what libertarian is id still have functional systems

[WilliamPamer446]

I told you I was distributiv so of course we'd take care of national park it just would be in a different way

[Syntosi]

What other way would possibly even remotely come close to the efficiency of the current system of bureaucracy? If you want to have a system that is decentralized then you are going to build an extreme amount of redundancy, even by government standards and they will not have the resources nor the ability to cooperate that we have today. Furthermore, there would be SO many department conflicts between different groups that has overlapping responsibilities.

As an example, there is already a huge issue regarding the water rights of the Colorado river but imagine if every local group has the same "authority", how would that clusterfuck ever get resolved?

[WilliamPamer446]

Authoritarian, controlled opposition

[Syntosi]

Oh really? Look here, you want decentralization right? USA just so happens to have a fair bit of decentralization going already. Namely, the states being separated from the federal government.

Now look at all the bullshit the states are doing AGAINST each other and then imagine a world where they WILL field state armies to "resolve" these issues. Just saying, it would be a clusterfuck.

[seeyounexttuesday]

@WilliamPamer446 as I said, you're trying to have a good faith discussion with an utter moron.

[WilliamPamer446]

It's already a authoritarian clusterfuck

[Syntosi]

@WilliamPamer446
I suppose you could call it that. The problem for you is that the decentralization of the US government has not helped to address the issues that you have. Which leads me to the question, why do you think that going further would have the desired results?

[WilliamPamer446]

Constitutional minimalism

[Syntosi]

Contrary to your beliefs, would not help. It would just cause infinite redundancy and massive bloat to the overall size of the government.

[OneViewpoint]

I think it’s delusional. Never gonna work. People left to their own devices will optimize outcomes for themselves but not necessarily for the society as a whole. It would never be balanced once anyone gained power.

[WilliamPamer446]

U want authoritarian central authority better?

And my system would have constitution and legal meters, it wouldn't be toxic

[OneViewpoint]

No I want a strong federal government with oversight regulating commerce.

What you are suggesting is just Laissez-faire Capitalism by another name. It does not work. Just like trickle down economics. It’s just as naive.

[OneViewpoint]

How long do you think you “free market” will be free with no counterbalancing force to prevent unfair practices?

[WilliamPamer446]

Im a distributist I'm not a die hard capitalist

[WilliamPamer446]

I want mixed economy

[seeyounexttuesday]

I believe in libertarian principles, but unfortunately we've seen that corporations can be just as tyrannical as governments.

[WilliamPamer446]

I don't want corporations I want minimal structures that are forced to uphold liberty, justice and order

[seeyounexttuesday]

But that power vacuum always creates room for authoritarian behavior.

[WilliamPamer446]

That's why there'd be a Constitution. I'm a libertarian who believes in checks of power.

[seeyounexttuesday]

Right but that's where the slippery slope occurs. Checking power leads to regulations.

[WilliamPamer446]

I'm a authoritative libertarian in some fiscal and social issues. Free spirit libertarian in less consequential social issues