What is the root female cause for a decrease in feminine women?

[Vegasrunner]

Please no equality argument. Seeking female causes of this problem.

[MzAsh]

Femininity still exists, but only in the presence of men who make it safe. When he’s cooperative, trustworthy, empathetic, generous, and secure in himself, she has room to lean into it naturally. When he’s controlling, selfish, or expecting one sided sacrifices, she doesn’t shrink anymore.

Femininity isn’t gone. It just doesn’t show up for men who haven’t earned the environment where it thrives.

[Vegasrunner]

@MzAsh Please read question. No equality argument.

[BonzoInBitburg]

She answered it perfectly. Femininity is still there within but it doesn't come out for weak men. If you can provide and are a good man, women become feminine again. There's a balance of masculinity and femininity in a relationship and the less masculine a man is, the more masculine a woman has to become and the more masculine a man is (in a healthy and positive way), the more a woman will feel comfortable being feminine.

[MzAsh]

Not an equality argument, a reality one. Femininity isn’t missing, it just doesn’t waste itself on the wrong men.

[Vegasrunner]

@BonzoInBitburg Unfortunately no, she simple used the all to common excuse of females blaming men for their flaws, I'm seeking to certain the flaw in the female.

[Vegasrunner]

@MzAsh It's textbook equality argument and one of my three E's of female logic. Instead of addressing the flaw in the actual female, the accountability is pushed on the man. Adults are responsible for their own actions or are you making the argument that females aren't adults?

[BonzoInBitburg]

@Vegasrunner This probably hasn't happened to you but good confident men turn strong independent women into feminine women

[Vegasrunner]

@BonzoInBitburg Please read, no equality argument. The question is seeking to certain the role women play in their own flaws.

[SolitarySolace]

One root cause is that femininity stopped being tied to duty. Men still face shame if they fail to provide or protect, but women no longer face shame if they abandon nurturing or feminine roles. Modern culture praises women more for being ‘strong and independent’ than for being feminine, so femininity is treated as optional or even mocked. If provision and protection keep flowing to women regardless, why would many feel the need to embrace femininity at all?

[WindAtMyBack]

Feminists who hate being women and want to be men. They hate everything that's female, including femininity. They want to be men, and want all women to act masculine.

Feminists reject being female. They cut down and degrade everything female. It's all about becoming masculine.

[blackeagle007]

Then they wouldn’t be feminists. They are more about being masculine

[PretzelBeanie]

This is an interesting question. I think this would be more likely caused by how women see ourselves now, rather than caused by which women had the most kids in the past. If you could tell me more about what you mean by "feminine" women in particular, then I could try to make a more specific theory of explanation.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie I believe you answered the question sufficiently. The fact that in one sentence you provided an opinion and then in the next admit you don't fully understand the question is a great example of decreased feminity.

[PretzelBeanie]

Do you consider being able guess correctly based on limited information to be an un-feminine quality? I am curious what you do consider to be feminine, if that is true.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie I can't speak to that because I'm not aware of anyplace in this conversation that happened. The "decreased feminine part is the need to blindly challenge" My question as for reader to provide an answer instead, you provided a statement and then asked me to re explain the same question. That I masculine behavior because he who ask questions controls the conversation. The feminine part was giving yourself credit for something that never occurred.

[PretzelBeanie]

I don't think I challenged your question. I did give an answer, and I did like your question. I wanted to give more detail in my answer, but I am still not sure what kind of femininity you were talking about, so I kept it as general instead of giving specific examples.

Now that you have told me you think challenge and control are masculine, and lying is feminine, I can add more to my theory for how women see ourself now being the root cause of the decrease in femininity.

I believe most women now see ourselves as unique individuals first, independent of femininity or womanhood generally. As if we can choose whether we are feminine or masculine based on how we choose to dress and act. This means we are not as attached to femininity as past generations of women were, and we are more likely to abandon femininity if we feel that masculinity would better serve our individual goals in life.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie Whether you think it or not doest change the fact that you did. There's no such thing as '"a kind of feminity"
With that said you make sone interesting points, I agree most women see themselves as unique despite the fact that they are actually all pretty similar. I also agree that women are provided the opportunity to pick and choose based on which role best fits them. This is partly why women aren't respected as much for their achievements. A great example of this is in corporate America where a woman competes alongside men for promotions and status, however wants to receive special treatment and face less competition because she's a woman.

[PretzelBeanie]

Thank you, but I meant that women pick and choose how we behave, either femininly or masculinly, based on what we want to achieve or how we want to present ourselves.

Whether women are allowed by larger society to choose if they want to be treated as feminine or masculine, without changing their own behavior, is a different thing. That would not be a female cause, it would be caused by larger society both women and men.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie That's where we disagree. I believe woman choose how they behave based on how much it benifits them, not based on what they want to achieve. For example If a woman wanted to achieve financial success and multi-millionare status, studies show the best way would to be married to a successful man and then divorce him, however in order to retain a successful man long enough for him to marry you, women would have to adhere to his program, which would include submissiveness and accepting the fact that he's going to have other women. The society part you would have to elaborate on because I don't see where I mentioned anything like that. Corporate America is simply one example out of thousands that show how women seek to use the privilege of being a woman to attempt to compete alongside men. The WNBA would be another example.

[PretzelBeanie]

Yes, but if a woman wants to achieve her own financial success, rather than sharing a husband's financial success, then marrying rich would not be the best way to do that. Goals are often more complex than a general thing like "money" or "fame." Very few people would take purely the most effective option to achieve something general like that. They have other smaller goals that guide their decisions along the path towards the larger goals. This is why I think women choose to act differently based on what we want to achieve.

If I wanted to play in the WNBA for example, I may act masculine to compete for such a challenging job. But if I also want to be seen as attractive by men, I may act feminine after I get the job to portray that image of myself to the fans, even though it could make me look weaker to my female opponents. I do not see myself as inherently feminine as a woman, but rather as an individual first, and so I do not try to be feminine when I feel being masculine would better help me towards my goals.

That is what I mean about women causing it ourselves, rather than the larger society or systems like corporate america or pro sports letting us simply choose how they will treat us without us actually behaving any less femininly.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie The stats and reality would disagree. Most of the richest woman in the world all inherited their money, and overwhelming majority of women who make 7 figures or more did so through selling sexuality in some form. When compared to what it would take to make comparable, as an employee or entrepreneur, then marrying a rich husband would absolutely be the best way, and no financially educated person will say different. Goals are tangible, you're making them complex because you are young and haven't figured out what you want yet. Humans always take the path of least resistance, if they didn't you and I wouldn't be here.
Your WNBA example seems to validate my point. Whenever you believe there is an opportunity that benifits you, you camaflouge your behavior. If you are making the case that this is what women do, it would also support the original questions premise that there is a decrease of feminity in the world rn.
I agree w/ woman causing it themselves, as asking for the root causes of why. You introduced society into the conversation so, I can't really respond to that unless you can explain why you keep mentioning society?

[PretzelBeanie]

It seems like you are starting to understand that I have answered your question well, and we have agreed about that answer this whole time. Lol! The only difference that keeps confusing the conversation seems to be wording. I do not think women "camouflage" our behavior. We just change it. I would not "pretend" to act masculine, I would just act masculine. It is not a lie. Women are not only "seeming" to become less feminine. We actually are less feminine. Unless you believe femininity is some kind of intrinsic quality, rather than kinds of behaviors as we have assumed that women can choose to do or not do them.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie Go back to my initial comment. I stated from the beginning u answered the question. Yes, I believe woman change their behavior based on when the opportunity best suits them. Change is a synonym of camouflage and you already stated women do this to benifit themselves. The fact that you agree woman act masculine underlines the original premise of the question.

[PretzelBeanie]

No, change and camouflage can not be used interchangeably in this case. Change can be used to camouflage, but camouflage is used to hide yourself. When women act masculinly, it is not hiding anything.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie That tangent while false isn't relevant to the original question. If I understand your position you're saying women cause decrease in feminity because they understand that they have the ability to switch from masculine to feminine when it best suits them?

[PretzelBeanie]

Yes, that us what I said. Switching between feminine and masculine behavior when it suits us, not in order to hide or camouflage.

[Vegasrunner]

@PretzelBeanie Agreed. That actually makes sense.

[OneViewpoint]

I’m more interested in understanding why so many men today are so feminine. They whine like little bitches instead of doing something with their life.

[Vegasrunner]

@OneViewpoint Please read question. No equality arguments.

[Anonymous]

It's not a problem for me, I prefer sporty & tomboyish type of girls, because they are more likely to take initiative. I like sexually dominant girls.

Especially if they look like Lara Croft, or Xena, or some other girl of action ;)

Yes, it's me, never had a relationship.

[Vegasrunner]

@anonymous So you like womem who don't like you?

[Opinion Owner]

Yes, usually... well, some of them like me as a friend only.
On the other hand, women who like me are usually not my type.

[Vegasrunner]

@Opinion Owner That means you're a failure.

[Opinion Owner]

No, it just means I have a type and integrity.

[Vegasrunner]

@Opinion Owner Getting rejected by wo. an isn't integrity

[Vegasrunner]

By women

[Opinion Owner]

It means that I stick to my principles, so it implies integrity and consistency.

[Opinion Owner]

No, they are hypocrites. Unlike them, I'm consistent.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Maybe your constant whining and moaning about women is causing them to become "masculine" before you?

[Vegasrunner]

@hispanic-cool-guy Read Question. Please no equality argument.