Another mass shooting. When will the government finally start removing firearms from the general population?

[MrShaun]

I know there are those who love their guns. I get that. Their solution seems to be to arm everyone. I'd hate to think of the only way to be safe within society is to carry a firearm.

Others claim it's a mental health issue and to have better help out there for the mentally disturbed.

The one thing I come back to is that it doesn't seem that countries with strong gun laws have these kind of problems -- at least with the frequency the U. S. does.

It seems like it might finally be time to remove guns from the general population.

At least two are reputed dead; multiple others are wounded.

[Orion84]

I own guns, and I think more should be done to restrict gun ownership.

The way I look at it, we should treat guns sort of like vehicles. You should be required to carry a license in order to own one, and in order to receive said license, you should be required to complete mandatory training and testing.

Once you have the license, and the gun, you should be required to carry insurance on your guns. Thus, in the event of an accident (which should be minimal, with compulsory training), you can be held financially liable.

In the event of public shootings, such as if a kid takes their parents' gun, the gun owner should be held liable for failing to secure their gun. The shooter should obviously still be charged, but if the owner had secured their firearm, the shooter shouldn't have had access.

I don't know if it would help, or how much, but I feel a lot of our problems could be at least minimized through more responsible gun ownership.

[MrShaun]

Those are ask excellent suggestions.

The status quo doesn't work and we need to find certain solutions.

[OlderAndWiser]

" it doesn't seem that countries with strong gun laws have these kind of problems"

1. It may not SEEM that way, but your intuitive guess is biased by your political perspective, so. . . your intuition doesn't really mean anything.

2. Children whose mothers refuse to breast-feed them commit more crimes when they reach adulthood, while breastfed babies grow up and commit fewer crimes. Therefore, breast milk prevents criminal behavior. Post hoc, ergo propter hoc is fallacious thinking.

[NoDecision]

You might better ask "When will mental health care be more obtainable and free?" People don't get help because it takes weeks to get an appointment and proper treatment is expensive along with any prescriptions needed. It is not always about the guns. It's more about the people crying out for help and getting none. People kill in many different ways. Using a gun is just quicker and less personal than stabbing someone 20 times and slitting their throat. The problem is that people today are just getting too offended by everything and not knowing how to cope with it. Get everyone proper mental health care and the shootings will mostly stop.

[DrPepper12]

Lol. So it's not the 300 million privately owned guns?

[NoDecision]

@DrPepper12 No. I would say most gun owners are responsible and keep their guns locked up. And not locking them up can be a problem. How many of these shooters got their guns from their parents closets or who gave them the guns for hunting purposes? Most people obey the laws. It is the criminals that get guns on the street and don't worry about gun laws or any others. Legal gun owners have over 300 million guns and over a trillion rounds of ammo. Seriously, if they were the problem, you would know.

[Agape93]

Like I discussed with another guy, zip guns are easy to make. I made one from shit at the hardware store that could fire a.22lr :/ so even if all guns are banned, you can still make one at home for less than 50 bucks.

[Agape93]

The day our constitution no longer matters, where we are ok with our fundamental rights are void, and when we are ok making ourselves less safe infront of criminals who will keep guns just to make you feel safe.

Don't like it? Get the fuck out.

[MrShaun]

Thankfully, that's not the way it works. People can work within the system to come up with better solutions.

[Agape93]

Good luck with that, because I'll be damned if I give up my rights and my safety for your comfort.

[MrShaun]

It all comes down to accepting whatever legislation gets passed. The Constitution can be amended and laws written that SCOTUS accepts as being constitutional.

[Agape93]

Yeah good luck with that. Even IF guns got banned, I won't give up mine, not for your comfort or because someone else wanted to be an dick and kill some people.

[Maybe_Maybe_not]

Never?

Banning guns in USA is like asking French to stop eating baguettes. It's a freaking tradition and even more than that, as seen in the comments, proliferation of guns is seen as the inviolable right to defend yourself. In turn, mass shootings are probably seen as necessary evil? Also connected to the political and philosophical standpoints of individualism and freedom aka "don't tread on me", in such a framework, any individual would live in a bubble of their own design, unrelated to the lives of others, only responsible for themselves. In a society based on self-made persons, if someone gets shot, it's someone else's problem.

[DJB72]

Switzerland made gun ownership mandatory at one point and it's the safest country in Europe.

Guns aren't the problem. Attitude is. I used to teach shooting and safety. The problem today is you're not allowed to smack the asshole fooling around with the stock if the loaded rifle he's in danger of killing everyone with. It "cruel" or something such bullshit.

I'm not American, I'm British. Our right to bear arms was lost decades ago - unless you're an illegal immigrant, in which case the cops are fine with you open carrying a machete 🙄

I'm also a marksman and a hunter. Guns are not toys but too many people treat them like they are. First drill safety into people, then guns aren't the problem.

[Agape93]

Exactly.

[spartan55]

@DJB72
American here. Is the knife violence out of controk over there in the UK? The media makes it seem like it, but we all know how the media works.

[DJB72]

I'm in South Africa at the moment, but I was back there a couple of years ago - 2017-20. It was nuts. I'm a big guy and I know how to defend myself but you won't catch me in London, Birmingham or Bradford.

People of pale complexion get hauled in for carrying a Swiss Army knife while certain others from certain religious backgrounds wander around with machetes and nobody says boo.

Look up independent news not legacy and you're more likely to get the truth

[spartan55]

Wow. That is crazy. Here in America the majority of the violence is in a handful of areas. Aside from that it's very random and very low.

[DJB72]

@sparyan55 Exactly the point. If the problem was actually the guns then the violence would be everywhere, not clustered in certain areas. Ever noticed how most gun crime is in the cities with illegally obtained handguns, yet those wanting bans focus on the "assault-style" rifles used in high profile mass shootings - usually the AR15 - which were purchased LEGALLY? It's targeting the wrong people. Their target is law-abiding citizens who enjoy certain pastimes and not the criminals with the illegally obtained firearms who commit the vast majority of the gun crime - using handguns, not any kind of rifle.

That's exactly what the UK has done with knife crime.

Why? Because they know the majority will comply because they ALREADY comply with the law.

Look at three societies that banned personal ownership of firearms and where it took them: Soviet Russia after the Communists took over from the Tsar. Lenin and Stalin. Butchered millions.
China under Mao. Butchered millions.
Germany under our chap Adolf.

Look at the similarities of those cultures:
State ownership or control of almost everything with a few oligarchs getting very rich.
Personal liberties stripped away - especially freedom of expression, speech and association - and serving The Party above all else.
All criticism of the government - especially in the form of Christianity - crushed ruthlessly.

The methods are identical. Remove the ability to fight back and brainwash the population to see the innocent as the cause of their problems. Encourage neighbours to turn in their own people.

And despite the warning of History it's happening again, but this time the scale is global.

Don't confuse politics with ideology, and education with indoctrination. What's the biggest danger to any ideology? It's people who don't buy into it rising to a place they can do something different.

[spartan55]

The first step in any dictatorship is to disarm the citizens. Frightening to say the least.

[DJB72]

And it doesn't matter if the supposed ideology is based on Marx or Maslow, the playbook is the same: start by disarming the people you can't brainwash. Then kill them. There's no such thing as Right or Left in a dictatorship, only compliance or rebellion - and rebellion results historically in curtailment of personal liberty, access to anything except propaganda, and a group that's the "scapegoat" to blame.

The thing from outside is it looks more like the Democrats are the ones blocking access to free speech - the Tiktok ban by Biden - the desire to disarm the population despite the 2nd Amendment and the Bill of Rights is always the Dem platform and it's always the guns you might actually be able to effectively fight for freedom with. And now - even when he makes objectively intelligent legislation - MAGA is the Extreme Leftist's scapegoat.

On the other hand, Trump is deporting immigrants likely to vote Democrat - historically that's a fact, but it doesn't look at legal/illegal. He's saying (allegedly, I've never heard him say it about adults) people can't modify their own body to resemble the opposite sex or "identify" as a gender besides male/female, and the Democrat leadership itself becomes the "scapegoat".

The big difference is that at no point has Trump spoken of disarming the population - not because he's bought by the gun lobby - he could buy them - but because he's a gun owner himself.

Either way it scares the crap out of me to have the US destabilising in front of me!

[goaded]

I realise that this is an old thread, but I thought perhaps it was new, what with another mass shooting, and all. Anyway, I'd like to make two points:

1. "Is the knife violence out of controk over there in the UK?"
No. It's not great, obviously, but the US has more knife murders per capita than the UK, and 70% of US murders are with firearms! "Knife crime" is a very flexible charge that the police can use to detain almost anyone in the UK, so the numbers are inflated.

2. "I'm a big guy and I know how to defend myself but you won't catch me in London, Birmingham or Bradford."
My daughter lives in central London. She's safe enough.

[DJB72]

UK knife laws are insane. And the recent arrest of a 14 year old girl in Dundee who needed an axe and a knife to prevent her friend being kidnapped and then likely far worse by an illegal immigrant instead of arresting the guy trying to take her demonstrates that perfectly.

Statistical studies repeatedly demonstrate men are significantly more likely to be physically assaulted (historically, anyway) than women in the cities I mentioned. I wish your daughter continued safety and joy in England. Maybe after Starmer finally decorates Traitor's Gate I'll be able to go back without fear of being arrested.

[goaded]

Ah, I see you have only seen the lies. Here are the real facts:

"Chief superintendent Nicola Russell said on Wednesday: ‘We are aware of misinformation being shared on social media in relation to an incident where a Bulgarian couple were approached by youths in St Ann Lane, Dundee, on Saturday 23 August 2025.

‘A 12-year-old girl has been charged with being in possession of offensive weapons. She will be referred to the relevant authorities and our inquiries are ongoing."
metro.co.uk/.../

The fact remains that London is objectively safer most US states, let alone US cities.

The US has 7 cities (population 300,000+) in the top 50 for homicide per capita worldwide, South Africa has 4, the UK has none (of 16 that fit the size criterion, in case you think that's a cop-out; the US has about 70).

[DJB72]

I lived in buckfastleigh in 1992. At that time it had the highest murder rate in the UK following two murders based on the "per capita" statistics.

I live one mile from an area of Cape Town now that the gangs control and the police are afraid to enter.

The real question to me is what the fuck makes a girl in Dundee feel a need to arm herself in the first place? Statistics can be used to "prove" anything by manipulation of the numbers.

[goaded]

Talk about "manipulation of the numbers"! I went to school in Tavistock, before your time. Hell, someone was shot to death in the house I grew up in nearby, before we moved in. You're using the same bullshit argument that says Norway is incredibly dangerous because of one event in 70 years. The cities I was talking about have been in the top 50 annual murders for years.

Why would you be scared to go to London, if you "live one mile from an area of Cape Town now that the gangs control and the police are afraid to enter"?

The answer to your question about the girl is probably: to feel powerful. Alternatively, because she's been taught nonsense by the right wing and is afraid of everything.

[DJB72]

Not much before my time.

And yes, my point was that numbers can easily be manipulated.

My issue with London is you can't predict where the danger is and the innocent people who simply want to be able to defend themselves are more likely to be harassed by the police than actual perpetrators.

In Cape Town the gangs - generally - stay on their own area so you're "safe" unless you get caught in crossfire on a territory border.

[goaded]

Yes, London's pretty much uniformly safe, that's what's so scary about it...

There were just over 100 murders across London last year. England and Wales have fewer than 600 each year.

"Hundreds of murders have been reported in the Western Cape in just seven weeks, prompting urgent responses from the South African Police Service and calls for improved policing strategies."
www.murdermap.co.uk/.../

"Cape Town ranked 10th most dangerous city in the WORLD"

"Crime statistics released on Friday reveal that South Africa experienced a staggering 12,734 murders in the first half of 2024."

[DJB72]

https://9gag.com/gag/1864277

Sadly this isn't photoshopped. Too many people see this...

[HawkPerception]

I live in Canada and we don't allow guns. But I genuinely think society would be better off if everyone had guns. The general public are responsible with guns. It just gives them a means to defend themselves from criminals. Criminals will always find a way to get guns, so why not equip innocent people with the means to defend against that?

[Spencer10]

Actually Canada does allow guns. With restrictions. Hunting rifles are not difficult to obtain. You must take a course and prove you meet the security requirements and store them safely. Handguns are restricted and military style weapons are banned. All pretty reasonable. But in my opinion to know why Canada puts limits on firearm ownership all you have to do is look to the south. In no way does the proliferation of firearms make a society safer. Americans die at much greater rates than Canadians per capita from firearms.

[HawkPerception]

@Spencer10 You actually taught me something about the country I've lived in my whole life. I think most people here have the misconception that it's illegal to own guns because there's not a single person I know that owns one other than the people I've met in BC that hunt.

[Spencer10]

I bought a specialized weapon when in BC for protection from Grizzlies when I hiked. Its a shotgun that fires special slugs. Small and compact to fit on my pack. It was not a difficult process to get the required permits. Firearms are very important tools for hunters and farmers so to restrict them would be silly. You just have to prove you are responsible and knowledgeable. Now why anyone needs a AK47 which has no purpose other than battle and killing people quickly and efficiently is beyond me. I have no problem with them being banned.

[MrShaun]

@Spencer10 true. It's time that we look at other countries to see what works. It's never going to be perfect but what we have now clearly does not work.

[loverguy123123123]

Why is it always leftists shooting places up? Number one it’s good people with guns who stop shooters. The same people wanting to take guns also want to defund the police but then defend criminals when they commit crimes with guns while bashing as well as blaming legal gun owners.

Number one if someone wants to do harm they are going to find ways to obtain firearms. All you’re doing by taking guns away is making law abiding citizens sitting ducks. Those are the only people who are going to willfully give their guns away is legal gun owners.

So let’s take guns form legal gun owners. Defend criminals who commit crimes with firearms as well as defund the police. Unless it’s taking guns from people.

The solution? MORE guns… More armed security in schools. More armed law enforcement officers/peace officers. As well as arming teachers and other school staff. To stop that shooting immediately before it even stats.

[strateguy632]

Those are unrelated. Ask yourself the same words "40,000 Traffic Fatalities in 2024", and yesterday, "another" death by car crash, "When will the government finally start removing cars from the general population".

[Lliam]

That's like saying "Another fatal car accident! 😢 When will the government start removing cars from the general population?"

Millions of people die every year. Tens of thousands die from falls, poison, drowning and other things. Do you obsess over those? No. You just obsess over whatever the news puts in front of you. You just hate guns and love authoritarian government. You love taking rights away from others.

[DrPepper12]

It's the guns.

Register, home inspection, renewable licensing, tax & liability insurance are long past due!!

Seems they "forgot" to rise up against a tyrannical government...

[Agape93]

Yeah no

[FunkyMonkee]

For what purpose, so more shooters could kill more people?
If a criminal wants a gun, he'll know of ways to get one!
If nobody else has one, how can they protect themselves, or others, from such people?
A few years ago, some psycho opened fire on people at random in a church in Texas! Two or three other guys with guns pulled them out and shot him!! Had they not been there to stop the psych with THEIR guns, a LOT more people would've died!

[Douglas1180]

I suggest you read up about this place called Europe. You can move there and enjoy having all your liberties taken.

[MrShaun]

Or work within the system here to change what needs to be changed.

[Douglas1180]

Sure, be a sitting duck like they are in Europe.

[najekim]

That's just another knee jerk reaction which wouldn't solved the core problem (s).

Besides, more crime is prevented by a citizen with a firearm but that never gets reported because it's against the media's agenda.

Firearm marksmanship and safety classes need to be brought back into the schools for kids to learn at an early age that they can be dangerous and how to properly handle them.

[onedarkcloud]

If you removed every gun shop and gun show in the world,, the only ones that would have guns would be the bad guys. Why do you think that would be because they are the bad guys and they DONT go to gun shops, legal gun shows, and reputable dealers to buy guns. Here in NYC, they go to the corner and they can buy anything from a twenty two caliber gun to an RPG, NO GUN SHOP NEEDED, and special order an Abrams M1A1 tank for next week's murders

[Agape93]

Plus pipe guns and zip guns are a thing. I can make one with shit from a hardware store

[onedarkcloud]

@Agape93 My bad, I forgot about those. These are weapons my generation would build. The bad guys are more sophisticated today and may lack the brain power to figure out how to build ZIP guns [ old people from the 40s and 50s like me call them zip guns]

[Agape93]

True they may just 3d print them or something.

Yeah they're not hard to build. Hell I built one a few years back that could fire a.22lr. Fun shit

[onedarkcloud]

Aside from being makeshift guns, they will still kill. All joking aside

[Agape93]

Oh easily. I wanna make one capable of handling 00buckshot. Or at least some 9mm.

[Avicenna]

Ever bother to imagine how violent criminals would run amuck if they knew law-abiding citizens couldn’t be armed? MS-13 and other gangs would love that. Think home invasions would increase exponentially?

[JesseP1nk]

"When will the government finally start removing firearms from the general population?"

Short answer never.

Reasons: 2nd amendment, weapons manufacturing companies give massive donations to politicians so nothing would change, bad U. S education system that grows new generation of clueless people that are easily manipulated by those same politicians.

[Gwendoline]

We've a similar in the UK with knives but can't defend ourselves

[Agape93]

Sounds like in california, where you can defend yourself from murder or rape but you still risk going to prison

[Gwendoline]

@Agape93 it's worse. Say you kept a hammer or knife or a baseball bat by your bed in case anyone broke into your home in the night and you used on someone who was trying to rapd or murder you well that is premeditated murder or assault on your part by having a weapon by your bedside.

[Agape93]

Yeap sounds like California.

[exitseven]

Guns are not the problem. It is a symptom of the sick society we have today. These shooting did not occur before we had the internet.

[DrPepper12]

I thought it was rap music!

[exitseven]

@DrPepper12 rap music, video games, social isolation , the breakdown of families.. There are a lot of things that cause mass shooting s but guns are just the tool. People have driven cars into a crowd resulting in mass casualties.

[DrPepper12]

Uh huh

[exitseven]

@DrPepper12 it just haooened again two days ago. 11 people were killed.

[jahaims]

Someone doesn't understand anything about firearms or mental health. I feel bad for someone who is your age and still lacks wisdom.

[astralpro300]

its not the guns that are the problem its the people who have became extreme in every way possible, we need to teach people to leave extremism of any kind as it has done nothing to us but harm

[Staximus]

In 2023 19,252 people were murdered in the United States and not all of them were killed by guns. Also in 2023, there were roughly 95,000 alcohol-related deaths. Do you want to ban alcohol too?

[Phoenix98]

It's not a gun problem it's a people problem.

[LiamJHayden]

Never. It is a fantasy to think that stripping people who've done nothing wrong of their rights will prevent criminals from misbehaving.

[bddddd]

I do not forecast it will happen this year. The USA is a country that was forged under fire. It is a long legacy.

[jamesgoldman]

Son of a cop, even if you pulled GP guns this one would likely still have happened

[Sal_Monella]

Never. When somebody rammed a crowd in Minnesota did they ban trucks or women drivers? Maybe they should have.

[DCVsMarvel2]

People feel emboldened now, because of the kyle shittenhouse case. Yes, I meant to write it that way

[OldBlu]

Start with illegal drugs. Once you've gotten rid of those then I'll gladly hand over my guns to you personally. When are you planning on starting?

[noohair]

The shooter got the guns from his step mother who is a Deputy Sheriff

[EmmaMary]

Very sadly once again Only In America. smh

[astralpro300]

it happens everywhere many people have became extreme in any way possible i call it mental illness

[MrShaun]

@astralpro300 out doesn't happen everywhere, at least in the amount like we have on the U. S.

[Kelly6]

@EmmaMary
Lol you stole my answer, 😆

[chrissykerdock]

another lost boy

[contentious]

Never going to happen.

[jshm2]

No. It's a form of US population control

[SmokesTheScrapper]

Well, as you've already mentioned

[seeyounexttuesday]

never. gun grabbers can fuck off.

[Phoebe85]

When it one of them doing something.

[Pterodon]

Move somewhere else

[Agape93]

Liberals 🙄

[QuietRunner]

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