Think that parents have been victims of roofing/contractor fraud?

[Anonymous]

they paid to have a roof installed on a second home they own around May and contractor has never shown up. well they paid a deposit which was a large % of the total cost at that time and he's yet to ever show up or have any materials ever been delivered to the address

its now almost November so getting kind of late to do a roof here as we have snow by Dec , they have been in contact with him but get endless excuses and he has never offered to give the money back

but reality is he took the $ money and hasn't done the job , isn't that fraud? it seems like it

Updates

1 y

found out more , tracked down building supply store , he never paid the bill and they have no scheduled deliveries of materials to our address for remainder of year. also found his home address a run down apartment building in another town 25 minutes away. and he posted an add to facebook in August wanting to buy a boat and said he had $4000 to spend on it

Updates

1 y

( the scam is mentioned on a site i found ) The Disappearing Contractor
Never let a contractor talk you into making a large down payment “to pay for materials.” The contractor may cash in the deposit and never finish – or even begin – the job they were hired to do.
Keep down-payments to a minimum (we recommend 10%) and never pay the full amount of the contract before the work is all done. Remember, legitimate home renovation companies have enough credit to buy the materials they need.

[slatyb]

That's definitely fraud, but it could be hard to recover. Have you tried talking to an attorney? Could you file in small claims court? The contractor's business assets may be subject to seizure if you get a judgment.

[Asker]

his business is apparently still open and he is doing other jobs , but his page on facebook its most recent post is from May ( same time he took deposit and didn't do anything ) also is only 1 new review on his google and rest all from a year or 2 ago

so not entirely sure how active his business is really , we have a law here that says if contractor doesn't do job within so many days so can legally cancel contract and ask for money back he is already past that amount of days so they can get out of contract

but if he gives money back? right

[Anonymous]

Seems like it

If it was my family he'd be paying with his kneecaps

[Asker]

think that i might have to talk to police about this next week and see what they have to say.

[Asker]

i talked to my parents more about this and update , they said they talked to him in the spring and saw him in person 3 times , he was at house to measure , but his truck doesn't have a business name or logo on it. and he provided no business cards but does have a business name in the emails

i also looked through the papers , one really weird he cut off the name of building supply store where he planned to buy materials, bill says unpaid , its only an estimate. i figured out which store it was from and went in and talked to them , they were surprised and said there is no scheduled deliveries to that address for remainder of year and he has not paid the bill for the materials.

i also figured out his home address its a run down apartment building in a smaller town around 25 minutes away, it used to have a restaurant in it but now closed. he also posted an add to facebook in August looking to buy a boat and said he had $3000-$4000 to spend on one

[Opinion Owner]

Sounds like you need to tell the cops unless you have a power drill handy

[Asker]

i'm going to try and get them to speak to the police next week if he doesn't show up next week and attempt to start job. he claimed in a conversation with another relative that he'd do job next week but that was 2 weeks ago and we haven't heard a word since and people living at house have never seen him there to pre or check roof or anything

[Asker]

more update somehow he heard i had been to building supply store looking into this and he sent parents this weird message saying he's still committed to doing job this year ( despite fact its Nov and snow soon ) also claims to be dealing with unknown life issues or something , but offers no start date or committment to order materials next week

i'm trying to get parents to go to police but for some unknown reason there reluctant and still think he's going to show up to do job. i recall reading seniors defrauded by grandparent scams are often reluctant to report it and could never understand why. not really sure why they don't want to go to police at this point

[Asker]

( from an actual police website , reason this is fraud cause he told them in May he needed deposit immediately to buy materials , but never did , then claimed to be too busy to do job )

It can be difficult to differentiate whether or not contractor scams are criminal or civil.

The key elements for the scam to be criminal are that:

The individual or fraudster used:
Deceit - concealment or distortion of the truth for the purpose of misleading;
Falsehood - a false statement or a lie;
Fraudulent means - being dishonest or cheating a person.

To defraud them of:
Any property
Any service
Money

[Opinion Owner]

I'd go to the police and be ready for the shitstorm

[Asker]

i went into town after i posted the updates and tried to speak to the police but was after 4pm and apparently is no one there other than officers who deal with actual emergenies and they were unable to speak to me

but still plan to try and speak to them again

the message he sent earlier today was seriously weird , i don't get creeped out easily and it featured a couple parts that were and honestly to send something like that to a customer crosses a line in my view to even think it was approiate to send to us.

i'm going to try and get access to parents computer tomorrow to try and print it off , i only briefly viewed it , i can't actually read it on my computer as it was sent to there facebook not my computer

[Asker]

more lies discovered i took another look through his " google reviews " he has good reviews on google and all 4 or 5 star

but after more careful inspection some appear to be fake or from people who clearly did not actually have a roof installed

of his 17 reviews , 7 appear to not be legit

but why would a roofer get people to leave fake 5 star reviews on his google page? seems kind of sketchy

[Asker]

the questionable reviews leave no comments only 5 stars and when i clicked on profile they had only left 1 review and it was for his page and they even use fake looking pictures

[Opinion Owner]

Sounds very shady

[Asker]

i got access to the facebook message , i can't post it here but here are quotes of the 2 comments that left me creeped out and serious questioning what is going on with this person

1 " I've just been going through life and so many different ways with my family , but i'm still getting things done "

2 he used this quote to end message " i just need to work with me instead of against me "

so left wondering? what is he dealing with , marriage issues? family issues? substance abuse issues? health issues? mental health issues Like what is off with this dude

[Opinion Owner]

If I was working and had issues that led to a job being untouched for 6 months I'd return the clients cash

[Asker]

well i said the same thing to parents , that a legitimate contractor would of apologised by now and offered to return the money as there reputation is worth more in the long run than losing it over one job gone bad.

its not exactly clear what his personal issues are or how they relate to him not being able to finish the job

i personally wonder if he has substance abuse issues and spent the deposit on drugs , but i don't have any proof of that but his strange comments about me against me do lead me to really wonder if that may be his issue

[Opinion Owner]

Yeah not having the money would be the obvious reason as you say substance use maybe gambling

[Asker]

according to parents records the cheque was cashed on April 5th of this year and he was suppose to use it to order the materials and job would start in early May

its now Nov 9th , so over 7 months , my parents have also not seen him inperson since the day they gave him the cheque in April , only communication since was through email or phone but he stopped answering there calls around Sep

[Opinion Owner]

I'd go to the police with what you know might be he's ripped of several people

[Asker]

well yeah gambling is another option , he could of used money to pay rent or vehicle payments , was clearly something he felt was more important or critical enough for him to justify doing this at the time

he might of also used money to help his business in some other way and had hoped to still do our job but is now too low on cash to do our job and unable to secure other funds

[Asker]

i wonder about that too , from what i read online , there is often multiple victims when contractors do this sort of thing , we have a lot of season cottages here so very possible he ripped off people who own them or other seniors

or its possible he just ripped off my parents and that money provided him with enough funds to cover whatever he needed at the time , according to there records the cheque was for $12,500 , the estimate for job was around $20,000 so he asked for a deposit that was more than 50 %

but parents didn't realise it was a red flag cause he showed them estimates from real suppliers for the materials and told them he was going to use the money to order the materials back in April

[Asker]

i talked to a police officer on Tuesday and told him what i knew , he said that if they paid a deposit in the spring and contractor has not shown up entire season to do job that it has to be a scam and fraud. he didn't feel that it could be anything else and said there was no chance at all that he'd show up to do job.

but i cannot file a report myself as it wasn't my money , so parents will have to do that , haven't talked to them yet and unclear what they will do

you can also sue someone in small claims court for fraud here but can take over a year for it to issue a decision and perhaps even longer to get money back but if your dealing with an actual criminal they might not even show up or honour judgement which they already know will be against them

[Opinion Owner]

Here is pretty much the same so hence the power drill and kneecap route because most surrender at the threat and the few quite after the first

[Asker]

were not even sure exactly where he lives , the address listed on there papers is from march and he told them back then he might be moving. his truck also does not have roofer or business name on it so i wouldn't like see it around either

[Opinion Owner]

Yeah that's tough

[Asker]

an update , they still have yet to go to police. however did send him an email saying they would like to mutually cancel the contract and have deposit back.

he sent back some angry response basically hell no and claimed he was still going to order the materials despite it almost being Dec and its forecast to snow here this week and next and be way too cold and miserable to do a roof

i'm still trying to get them to contact the police , hopefully today or maybe later this week

[Opinion Owner]

Show them the email or it's just execution time

[Asker]

its suppose to snow here tonight and into the week and even colder next week , no way anyone doing a roof here.

i'm not sure what parents are hoping to get out of this by now , pretty obvious he spend the deposit on something else long ago

still hopefull that they'll report it to the police soon , is a 1 800 # they can call

[Opinion Owner]

I hope it snows, they can't really deny it then

[Asker]

its not snowing yet possibly tonight into the next couple of weeks

not sure what there doing though , i tried to get them to contact another roofer / contractor for a second opinion in the hopes they would recommend they contact the police. but couldn't get them to make the call so i did and didn't really get much out of lady on phone , she said its still possible to do a roof during the winter here but she wondered too if this roofer was legimate as he took deposit along time ago with no work yet

[Anonymous]

Sure seems like it.

[Asker]

he claimed back in May that he needed deposit to buy materials but they never showed up

they have still been in contact with him but my father is hard of hearing and not really sure what he's been saying to him in facebook message's they've exchanged since

but something about it does seem really off and even if this contractor has been through some sort of family or financial crisis that doesn't make it right for him to take the money and not do job , its still fraud