Girl's Behavior 
Guy's Behavior 
Flirting 
Dating 
Relationships 
Fashion & Beauty 
Health & Fitness 
Marriage & Weddings 
Shopping & Gifts 
Technology & Internet 
Break Up & Divorce 
Education & Career 
Entertainment & Arts 
Family & Friends 
Food & Beverage 
Hobbies & Leisure 
Other 
Religion & Spirituality 
Society & Politics 
Sports 
Travel 
Trending & News 
There are 2 sides to this:
The strong protecting the weak: it is an obligation a man has to protect those who are weaker as compared to him (kids and women in some cases). Even if the man is about to die, it is considered an honorable act because strength was used to protect an innocent soul
Getting in trouble after protecting someone: there have been lot of cases where a man has protected a kid/girl, only to be accused of certain charges later, like the kid's mother accusing the man of kidnapping when he saved it from an accident or a girl accusing the man to be the rapist while in fact he protected her from the rapist
In the modern society, the second case (of getting accused) is getting much more common and it makes sense to mind our own business...
Makes sense?
This is something most men instinctually do and was most women instinctually take for granted. There is something about hearing a woman cry for help that triggers something deep inside of most men vs. when men do it.
A good person will look to help both. But a woman in (legitimate) danger created a literally chemical reaction in most guy’s brains.
You’re arguing will they not should they.
Personally I think if women are “equal” they should be treated no better or no worse than a man. Yes they are usually weaker physically. But some men are weaker physically too.
But most women are better protected than men are. Society does it without even realizing it.
Opinion
13Opinion
Ideally, anyone capable of protecting others from harm will do so when those others are genuinely in harm's way. I don't fault people for falling short of such ideals but I think we should at least have this as a cultural ideal regardless of the nature of the social climate. I can try to make a self-interest case that's independent of morality if we factor in that we're creatures of habit.
Suppose we find a stranger of a woman drowning in a lake and screaming for aid with no one else to help her nearby but ourselves. As a stranger of a woman, she could end up being completely ungrateful for the help. We might have far more to lose than gain by taking the risk of saving her from drowning, especially if we lack a heavy conscience.
But if we abandon people in such situations, it can turn into a habit. Being an effective protector and risk-taker requires practice, and so we might find ourselves unable to protect even our loved ones in a future scenario where the person drowning isn't a stranger, but someone we love like our wives. So I think it's in our self-interest to challenge and condition ourselves by taking on such risks every rare chance we get.
In my case though, all these situations offer far more to gain than lose even when complete strangers are involved, since I can't help but be the type whose conscience will haunt me indefinitely if I abandoned a stranger in need this way (men, women, children, perhaps even animals in some cases) by letting them drown without even attempting a rescue. Yet I think there can be a self-interest case to be made for it even for those who lack this type of conscience.
There was a time Ide do anything I could to help others and allowed their suffering and loss to effect me greatly more so if I could have prevented it. Now however I see there’s nothing protecting me from them if they turn it into an issue. Say I touch a woman’s breast when saving her from downing… she might actually win that god damn lawsuit. As long as that’s even a possibility unless she’s someone important to me I’ll watch her drown and then when her friend that can’t swim jumps in to save her I’ll laugh at her stupid ass. Ide have to second guess myself before jumping in to save a child. Ide still save the drowning kid but the statements absurd. I’m more likely to save a man then a woman but still unlikely… as for animals. I still save frogs and snakes at my job and feed the trash panda at work (his names George) and we have some stray cats I’m trying to feed but they run from me. I’ve homed many stray animals one lives with me now. I have much more empathy for animals and children then adults.
I think it's understandable these days. There's definitely more risk involved than the immediate danger of the situation trying to aid others in a corrupt society with corrupt systems that could punish us for it even when we survive the immediate danger of the situation. That certainly elevates the stakes.
I've always been of the mind though that we have to strive to be the bigger person and try to influence change via example. I see no great peace to be had between men and women, or communities to form consisting of both men and women if neither of us -- collectively speaking -- are willing to take on the risk of looking out for each other.
At the end of the day, we all die, and I've come to find that the greatest type of "wealth" I can pursue is not found in material or hedonistic pleasures, but in being able to simply reflect back and say that I was more good than bad in this life regardless of whether I was externally punished or rewarded for it. I don't know if other people are wired the same and that's appealing to values and ideals, but I've found that very much the case for me.
I agree without going first I can’t expect women to follow and as a man and leader that’s my job… except I’m tired of leading the fucking charge. For the last 20 years it’s been man up, be better, you first… straight up it’s time women earns the rights they took for granted.
That's very understandable. I'm not sure I can make a sound argument independent of appealing to morality here.
The way I look at life though and even morality is somewhat analogous to Poker. Poker is a very counter-intuitive game of chance that can punish us for good decisions and reward us for bad ones.
What makes a good decision in Poker is that, while the decision might be susceptible to bad luck causing us to lose the hand and our stack, repeating such moves over and over in similar circumstances will yield what we call a positive expected value. Meanwhile, a bad decision is one where, if repeated over and over, it yields a negative expected value.
Morality is still a matter of optimization as I see it in that sense like learning to become a great Poker player. Yet it's very counter-intuitive because some people can have the worst luck, like ten bad beats in a row in spite of making the best decisions. And some people can have the best of luck, like runner-runner trips/straights/flushes ten times in a row in spite of making the most horrible decisions.
There are no guarantees in life as I see it, but it's about trying to navigate it in a way that maximizes our chances of success.
Well. Using Gambling, especially poker, is ironically an accurate comparison to dating. The difference is in poker you can count cards whereas in interactions there is no cheating to win… Even if you win the risk compared to the potential gains too much.
What do I have to gain from saving a woman from getting her ass stomped? Sorry but if you can’t contribute to my life I see no value in you.
Well, if we go purely logical, I can offer one possible scenario that actually happened to me. I rescued a couple from a gang beating long ago outside a nightclub by intervening and allowing them to escape. It did have a heavy cost on me though. I was hospitalized and received the worst beating of my life. I think I even developed a mild case of PTSD from it.
But the nightclub security and owners observed what I did as well as the police and many witnesses. I got called a hero in the local newspaper, the couple sent me flowers while I was hospitalized, and my friends thought I was a badass in spite of being a small guy.
After I recovered from my injuries, I returned to that nightclub and the owner and security recognized me while high-fiving me. The owner then gave me lifelong VIP access. He told the staff that not only do I never have to pay the entry fee again, but I get VIP access (~$50 value) every time I enter.
In the VIP room, I also got to meet some celebrities including a swimsuit model I dated. I got so many connections hanging out in that VIP room which I milked and wouldn't have been able to afford so often on my own.
So you know, I got my external rewards from it. Of course, results may vary for everyone. Some people might have the worst luck and not get anything but hospitalization this way. But it's a game of chance as I see it.
In the end, though, say I got no external rewards even though I got a bunch. I still get to die saying I did some really good things here and there in my life.
On top of dating that model who was the hottest girl I ever slept with (although admittedly not the greatest of girlfriends, and it was a short-lived relationship because she went to the Philippines and later New Zealand for photoshoots after the Summer), I also had people taking me out to dinner all the time.
For example, the owner and staff of that club introduced me to an owner of a really fancy oyster bar. Then the owner invited me to his restaurant, on the house, and that was the first time I ever chucked all-you-can-eat massive raw oysters with champagne and he also introduced me to all sorts of attractive women. I looked at the menu and estimated that I consumed over a $1,000 dinner for free that way, and all because of the clout I developed rescuing that couple.
I can go on and on but I got so many external rewards from that one act that a small guy like me, working a boring job as a software developer, should normally never have. It was the closest I've ever gotten to feeling like a local star in my area.
Sounds like a fairytale. Not saying I don’t believe you just saying I can’t even imagine it happening. Besides. I’ve done tons of stepping up… I’ve yet to get anything out of it. Again it’s risk vs reward and the risk and cost of failure can be your life or future. The reward? I can’t even imagine being rewarded for helping someone.
Especially not women whom expect it. It’s nothing special just to be expected being a man.
It does admittedly sound a bit far-fetched. It wasn't exactly happily-ever-after though. I found myself strangling a complete stranger one time after heavily drinking after that, and I think that was the PTSD thing combined with extreme drunkenness. I also ended up punching one of my friends in the stomach when they were trying to play with me while I was sleeping, and then I shocked everyone with my reaction. I found some angry and violent side of me there that I didn't recognize in myself and I think I had some screws loose from taking so many blows to the head that I never quite recovered. I had to take some months off from drinking after that because of it.
Also, the couple that I saved were not really nice people. I got to know them later and it made sense why they managed to piss off a Nepalese gang so hard. They were troublemakers. But they weren't the ones who rewarded me so much as the people who witnessed what I did.
But yeah, it's definitely, risk vs. reward and it might even be more common that we take all the risk for no reward. I just wanted to offer that case that happened to me if you can manage to believe it. I don't know what the odds are involved there. Maybe I sort of won a lottery with the rewards there.
A video on Poker that covers what I was talking about:
https://youtu.be/C2kEQSiCsmU
I think people often see Poker as a game of mastering other people's psychology, and that certainly gives us an edge. But the bigger challenge is mastering our own psychology in the face of being punished for making good decisions, e. g. Mastering Poker overlaps to a great degree with concepts from Stoicism, Buddhism, and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy.
my opinion is independent of whether the one needs protecting is a woman.
if you have the ability to stop bad something from happening and the one on the recieving end doesn't, then you should help.
now if we talk about women specifically, i guess most of the time it would have to do with agreeableness or physical strength. in which case i would gladly help, but if i see that they are somewhat fine then idc.
if a speeding car was approaching and was about to hit a woman and i knew that i would die if i save her, fuck that. same with military, no reason women shouldn't be soldiers unless they don't meet the standards.
I'm all for 100% equality of the sexes, Die hard progressive type... but* yeah, I'm still going to dive head first into a moving train if that's what it takes to help a lady off the tracks or whatever hypothetical situation. Women and Kids first, always no exceptions in life and death crisis situations.
Appreciate the response but disagree. Things have to balance out for people. Your want equal it means equal. You can’t act like a hard ass… be asked out… be chased… be strong and independent… and then complain men help you but don’t help.
We need real balance between the sexes.
VanillaSalt, Please explain... What conflict do you see with my views.
I’m conflict is this. Your point of view is better for society and I recognize this however society has left men personally behind so I’m not about to sacrifice myself for it.
Furthermore… It’s possibly, regardless how likely, that I save a woman then get sued for something stupid and have to suffer for it. Today’s legal system don’t protect me and society don’t protect me… Somebody has to put me first.
My last point. Equality means balance. There’s absolutely no balance in any way between men and women right now. I could give multitudes of examples but honestly… I’m not in the mood to. I do not owe anyone regardless gender anything.
Lets put it this way. If I see a woman being attacked, I don't turn my back.
Usually I will call the police first, tell them what I'm wearing so they know who to arrest, then I warn them to back off. If they don't? Well then there is several years worth of IDF Martial Arts heading their way!
NEVER.
Women have lost the privilege of having men risk their lives for them.
They hated on men and claimed they were “strong and independent” so they can prove it and take care of themselves.
Aside from my wife and daughter, I would never put my life in danger for a female.
If you look up “Man saves” in google and then look up “woman saves” you will see that men as a whole risk their lives to save any and all living things... women seldom if at all will risk their lives for a living thing, especially a man.
The fact that you've managed to reproduce is both horrifying and amazing at the same time...
@CasuallySamsonite Your petty shaming tactics and personal attacks do nothing but show a desperate pickme simp attitude.
There is no "should." If anyone decides to protect anyone else at their own self-sacrifice, that is a supererogatory act: praiseworthy, but not morally required.
Not should morally but should logically.
What do you mean logically? Logic can't make non-conditional imperatives.
What is the "if" then? What is the goal or rule that if that's true, then men should either protect women or mind their business?
A different way of looking at it would be this… people have a moral imperative to protect others but what if protecting them risks themselves? Should a man say save a feminist with a history of man hating or false allegations or someone that’s just a bad person? So morally we SHOULD protect women… logically as dangerous as it is SHOULD we risk the consequences.
Perhaps there’s a moral and logical side to it and they might diverge or converge. I just care about the logical argument. I’m not a… morality type person.
That's that's exactly the same. That's just moral. And again I'm gonna say I think it's not a should. People should protect others generally, but when it's at great risk to themselves it is not a moral requirement. If they do that's good, but if they don't that's not morally bad.
And any further "should" will come down to your personal goals and context.
If you are in a crowd of people and a man-hating person has fallen in front of an oncoming subway, then it depends. For you personally, is possibly saving a life and being seen as a hero by some people worth possibly losing your life and being seen as a bad person by some people? That comes down to your personal goals and beliefs in that situation.
Same if you are alone at night and see a bad person being attacked in some alley. There are different variables here, but the same rule applies: weigh it against your personal priorities. Neither option is morally wrong when you would be putting yourself at risk to help someone you have no prior committment to.
I strongly believe men should protect women, bit not in a condescending kinda way, but in they day and age some women should learn to protect themselves too
What? Not in a condensing way? You either do it don’t I said I didn’t want to make it complicated.
Yes men should do it
I mean, I would protect any woman I care about regardless, Especially my mum
That’s not women… that’s people you care about regardless gender I asked about women in specific.
My answer still hasn't changed
Can’t you just say yes then?
My apologies, yes
Not anymore. No. Men should be protecting himself unless he has a family of his own to protect.
Protect the women in your life. Wife, mother, sister, aunt, daughter, niece, cousin, girlfriend and female friends. F*ck the rest.
I know it's not something they have to do and I don't expect them to protect me, but I feel lucky when guys take care of me because I don't feel safe in certain places/situations. So, I'm always grateful for that and let them know I appreciate that.
Your looking at should from a perspective of morality I’m looking at should as a logical argument. So logically speaking SHOULD MEN, considering the state of society today, protect women?
Yes, to protect others is a choice... sad that men today aren't weak and cowardly. Equal opportunity within society regardless of gender should not prohibit men from taking on the traditional role of being completely expendable members of the overall whole of society if needed.
I mean, when you feel unsafe in certain places / situations... it's not *other women* you need protection from- I'm assuming?
@CasuallySamsonite No, I hate to say it but some men make me uncomfortable or even scared.
No. Even if things are fucked up is not and shouldn't be an obligation for men to protect us.
I wanna say this is enough but… look at society? Are men running to save you and other women today?
I’m curious. Have things overall gotten better or worse for you as a woman on a personal level since all this stupid anti relationship shit started becoming a thing?
I don't know if men and women can fully understand the struggles and sacrifices each gender faces… Hell I don’t even understand the struggles other men face and even fail to understand where I’m lacking from time to time… That being said it’s not the Instagram bimbo keeping society going (though there’s an argument to be made as to the value of entertainment) it’s me and factory men like me that build the shit that made your schools, homes, and hospitals that expand and extend your lives… yet somehow instathot is more valued in society than me?
If that’s society… I don’t want any part. Why would I, a young man, sacrifice for a society they don’t value me? If my example is similar to other men I suspect will see a lot more pain when real suffering comes to America and other westernized nations.
What’s going to happen when due to no babies taxes aren’t able to keep up with expenditures? All these single mothers and their kids growing up to be useless because they don’t have 2 parents to help. Increasing violence as less men have male role models. Amongst incarcerated men the leading commonality is fatherless homes. Expect that to rise. Less men less GOOD men. Less taxes more tax burdens with single mothers and incarcerated males. Less reason to interact further dividing the sexes…
People think I’m crazy assuming so much… but it’s happened to me. It’s been proven many times… United we are strong but as individual women hate and are hated by everyone and everything else… it’s gonna take ww3 for us to come together. And we can’t even agree in that…
But I did a poll few months back… more than 80% of people on here I think it was didn’t care about society at all.
Nope. Women want equality, that means defending yourself as well. Everyone for themselves unless it's kids or animals
My question would be what incentive do I have to do it.
Not really, no. Women have lost that privilege.
How about, we all protect each other. Good?
You can also add your opinion below!
Most Helpful Opinions