Are some women contradicting themselves by saying they want marriage but aren't looking for a traditional relationship?

[Anonymous]

By living together with a boyfriend for 4+ years, cooking for him, giving him sex, sharing bills, helping him with household chores, etc but then wanting a proposal... that's not aiming for marriage since that's not a traditional man. If they wanted marriage, what are they doing in a modern relationship?

Imagine claiming you're a vegetarian but then keep going to normal restaurants and still complaining that your vegan dish hasn't arrived yet instead of going to a vegetarian restaurant.. straight to the point. Similar concept.

She wants the tradition of getting married but isn't following a traditional relationship. She's not being traditional herself either by moving in with him.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

What you described as “modern” is an incredibly traditionalist relationship. She’s cooking for him, caring for him, cleaning for him, she’s taken on the role of homemaker quite clearly even if she’s helping to pay bills. That’s the only part you described as no -traditionalist. And your metaphor is also garbage, a majority of restaurants outside of very few exceptions have some kind of vegetarian/vegan dish on their menu, usually in the form of a salad that can often be modified to fit the needs of the customer.


If it’s been 4 years of her supporting his home and doing so much for him and he hasn’t proposed then he’s not dating her out of love, he’s dating her to be a child to a mother figure. It’s a shitty imbalance and she should leave that. Marriage is a partnership first and foremost and the primary goal of marriage is not nuclear family ideals, it’s incredibly adaptable and you sound fairly ignorant to suggest it can only be one goal.

[Asker]

But there has been lately increasing stories of women waiting for the man to commit, complaining that they've been living for 6 years and he hasn't proposed yet. In the past, she didn't give him any of those free benefits if she was just a girlfriend and they got engaged at a faster pace. So those women are waiting too much.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

I agree, she shouldn’t be centering the man in her life as much as women are encouraged to do

[GOLDFISH_smile]

To use your comparison, wanting non-traditional marriage is like a vegetarian wanting a full meal like main dish and sides at a restaurant, instead of just one big side dish like a salad. They can do this by making it themself or going to a restaurant that can do it (there are many).

Marriage is like getting it at a restaurant vs at home (non-married). The meal being vegetarian or not is it being traditional or not. So you can have both (non traditional marriage), it may be a little harder to find but certainly not impossible or self-contradicting.

[MisterWack]

“If they wanted marriage what are they doing in a modern relationship?”

The way I see it is, I don’t go by labels and however / whatever people deem as a “traditional” or “modern” is up to them though they should go by themselves & their partners not generalize it to fit in a box that someone can check off as traditional or modern….

Just do what makes both of you happy for your situation and just don’t care what others think. Clearly they are abiding by that instead of wondering what people would think, let them live their life in peace lol.

Same way how I just be myself and don’t care about the labels thrown around on my being, I’ll try to clarify though if they don’t want to be educated on what makes me…. Well me then tough shit I ain’t changing just for you.

[Lliam]

I think you are trying to justify your refusal to have sex before marriage and to use your pussy as an incentive for a guy to marry you. Good luck with that.

I wouldn't waste my time on a woman who was "saving herself" for marriage.

At the same time I don't believe in renting a place together before marriage.

And a woman is delusional if she has been with a boyfriend for years and he hasn't married her, but she thinks he will. A woman who wants to get married needs to use common sense and move on after a couple years max if the guy is unwilling to commit.

[Asker]

It's either that or not moving in together if he's not my fiance. I can understand it's not for everyone though.
I have to agree with you on your last paragraph. If a proposal isn't coming within the 2-3rd year mark, then likely it'll never come. What I'm finding in those ''we've been living for 6 years, why won't he marry me, when will he propose'' stories is that the woman moves thinking it's a step towards marriage and is already expecting a proposal within a couple years, then it's shocked when he gives excuses, stalling, stringing her along.

[Lliam]

I agree. I think moving in together and acting like husband and wife is a bad idea. It leads to what you are talking about.

[asarjam]

We women in the West have been indoctrinated ideologically against most of the traditional aspects of marriage. Feminism was once important but now has radicalised a lot of young women into an anti-male or confrontational role.

On the flipside, what do you mean by traditional? The traditional marriage should be shared roles, shared responsibility, but more defined by biology - empathy and nurturing is usually better from us ladies, hence child-rearing and taking care of the home. Why is that bad? You can still have it all while still allowing your man to be the alpha. I am not impressed in some of the female politicians' husbands... at all. So its all a balance.

[Asker]

What I mean is that acting like a wife and dedicating so much on a man when she's still just a girlfriend (not even engaged at least) isn't already giving it all away for free without commitment. They're not even engaged and she's already living together with him, sharing bills, cooking for him, etc.

[Anonymous]

I'm not about to tell anyone how to live. But I do think people understand relationships are not a buffet where you can pick and choose the parts of it you like and discard the rest. No I don't think a woman is contradicting herself by not wanting to be traditional, yet still be married. But she needs to understand that could shorten her pool of men who'd want to marry. I mean that's like a guy saying he'll marry but he wants it to be an open marriage. You'd assume most women would not be down with that (I say you'd assume because with a lot of women today I'm not really sure anymore).

[SixFootSexy]

Women gatekeep sex, men gatekeep commitment.

Women who don't understand this simple concept screw themselves especially if they don't communicate their desire for marriage and family. Pretty soon they're 35+ with a boyfriend of 10 years who will never marry her because it's too easy for him to leave when she's too much to handle.

[Anonymous]

What nonsense. You can be in a marriage without always cooking and cleaning. This sounds like some incel nonsense, I can't believe I real woman would be so confused.

[Asker]

What I meant is they're centering their lives so much on a man and providing him all the free benefits of a relationship without getting commitment. Off she can work and help in the house too even after marriage but she at least has a commitment and a child within marriage.
Then we hear the overwhelming ''we've been living together for 6 years, why isn't he proposing, why won't he marry me, when are we going to have kids'' stories. Now instead of the man waiting for the woman (when she wouldn't give him sex without getting engaged at least), the woman has to wait for the man to commit. The longer she waits, the more she's delaying her own motherhood if she wants marriage and kids.

[Opinion Owner]

It sounds like you're imagining a very specific situation then asking why it's happening.

[Asker]

I'm not imagining. It's happening so much nowadays. If you go check ''What do I do, my boyfriend won't propose after 7 years of living together'' on here and other sites, you'll see those stories. They're on the rise. It happened to my friend's older sister too. The guy wasted her precious years and by the time, she realized that live-in boyfriend wasn't ever going to propose and have kids with her, she was already 29 when leaving him.

[Opinion Owner]

Everything you're saying is contradicting yourself, even your original post is a contradiction. I don't think you even know what you're trying to say.

[WhitneySnow]

Because they see living together as a prelude to marriage. My parents lived together before they got married.

[Asker]

There are exceptional cases (if a timeframe has been established from the very beginning) but that's not what happens to everyone. It really isn't a prelude to marriage. Otherwise we wouldn't be hearing too many stories about the forever girlfriend waiting for her man to propose.

[WhitneySnow]

I’m not sure if my parents established a time frame from the beginning. Never really asked them. But they did end up getting married.

[Nikki1989]

Traditional marriage often conjures images of specific gender roles, but modern relationships are diverse. There are ZERO good reasons for having to follow the traditional route.

[Abbycado]

How to say you are a dude, without directly saying it.

[Asker]

Nope. I'm all for sex in marriage. I'm just tired of hearing the same stories from other women complaining about not getting their proposals but yet giving him everything for free.
What's wrong with being a woman calling out on things my gender is doing wrong?

[mandyfire98]

So what exactly are you saying? Men and women shouldn't move in together unless they're married? That sex shouldn't happen until marriage?

Yeah that's a disaster waiting to happen. So you find out you aren't compatible sexually or living together until you've already gotten married? That's divorce just waiting to happen. All the work of vetting should be done before you even get married and that's with EVERYTHING.

I'm also giving you the benefit of the doubt on this as far as you actually being a woman. I'm being charitable today.

[Asker]

Personally I am waiting till marriage and would obviously have to seek a like-minded man. That's how it was in the past and has worked out for a long time. In fact, the people that have a history of living together for 5-10 years but only been married for 2 years are actually more likely to get divorced soon. Studies have proven this. I'm not saying that always will happen but many times it will. Only 1/4 of those marriages ending in divorce come from those who are engaged or married before living together while 3/4 of divorces are from those cohabitating longer than their marriage.

They can move together all they want to but the man is more likely going to take longer to propose vs dating to get married without living together.

[Anonymous]

I really don't understand women and girls today, y'all complain that you want a guy who takes care of himself, works hard, loyal, will be a good father and provider and love her... Even that isn't good enough in today's world.

[Asker]

yes, I would be happy with all with the man I'll give in, marry and give kids afterwards (not kids out of wedlock)

[Anonymous]

Lol, vegans DO go to normal restaurants, more and more vegan option there too because surprise there - shit changes.

[KrakenAttackin]

You are surprised by women contradicting themselves?

[Asker]

yeah but after a while of hearing the same ''Why won't my live-in boyfriend of 6 years propose'' stories over and over, I came to that conclusion. Personally I'm actually waiting till marriage (never done it with anyone) and that way, he can't give out any excuse nor any convincing lines to make me change my mind.

[Anonymous]

Today's women want to have their cake and eat it too. How's that working out for them?

[Asker]

Yeah, you can have it all. It's either one or the other. If they just move in together early in the relationship (with the expectation of a proposal within 2-3 years), they're already agreeing to the modern relationship, replacing commitment for long-term dating and delaying their own motherhood period.

[msc545]

How is this your problem?

[Asker]

It isn't but I hear the same ''we've been living for 4-7 years, when will he propose'' stories over and over. They've been on the rise and that's the conclusion I came up with.

[beefcakebradybatson]

Yes if they want a good marriage.

[Asker]

Indeed. I see the same theme in those stories. They want their bfs to propose after 6 years together. What the heck are they doing giving him everything for free, living together with him if they wanted marriage?
By cohabitating with him, they just aimed for a long-term boyfriend, perpetual dating and a longer childfree period, not marriage.

[beefcakebradybatson]

Nothing wrong with a long term boyfriend or girlfriend, however.

[Asker]

Though both have to be on the same page from the start. If one is ok with a long-term partner but the other person moves in with the expectation of a proposal within 2-3 years, that's when goals and timeframes aren't equally matched.

[Danny_dan92]

Yes they are