Why Both Genders Should Split The Bill On Dates

[Iquestioneverything]

I’m probably going to get a lot of hate from women, but this needs to be discussed.

I grew up being told that when dating and being married the man must pay and take care of the woman. My Parents generation men still were drafted in war and women still did not get equal pay as men, or it was very difficult to get self supporting pay without college. My Grandparents generation Men did most of the working and war was present, women generally stayed home and raised the children, and women who could not have kids had a hard time finding a Man.

In today’s world, both genders can get equal pay and great jobs. Both genders can get self supporting jobs. There are plenty of options for places to watch kids so Moms can work. Women are now expected less to only be baby making machines that stay home and cook, though some Men still think that way and I disagree with that stereotype. On the other hand, this means that Men don’t have to be the sole money providers anymore either being there are so many ways Women can earn money.

This brings me to the point solely about WHY Men used to pay for dates, but now it is not economically relevant anymore. Both genders can now afford to pay for dates.
Now for social and gender reasons, Men don’t have to be the only providers being Women can now work. Remember, many years ago women could not go out and work, so the Man had to be the money maker and provider he had no choice. Womens jobs were to cook and raise children. They both had a job to do in the relationship because the other gender could not do both roles.

How do you think Men feel in todays day in age when first impression all he thinks you care about is that he has to work hard so you get handed things for free, when he knows you work and earn money so you CAN split the bill on dates?

This brings me to my next points why as a Married Woman, I did not want my Man to feel like I am using him. I accept that nowadays I can play an equal part in our relationship, and not be thought of as just a cook or mom. I am proud to have a great job and was able to financially care for myself if I chose not to get married. I have been on dates where Men offered to pay, but I felt more responsible, equal, and independent offering to split the bill. Once you are married, you BOTH play equal roles anyway if you want the Marriage to last. It’s not one persons job to do everything while the other leeches off of you.

So why do so many Women still think you are doing yourself a favor by using Men to get free food or items on dates? You wonder why divorce rates and single moms are so high nowadays?

You also have to consider, what if you the Woman refuses to work because you feel it’s a Man’s job? Your Husband suddenly gets hurt or sick and no longer can work. By you not having a job how will you afford anything? Disability income does not support anyone these days you need other incomes, cost of living is not what it was many years ago where you made enough to live off one income.

I know of many Men that feel they had to pay on dates, and the Woman thinks he has to if she is to date him. What you don’t hear is how many of those Men end up cheating with another women, or the guy you think is perfect and has the looks and money turns out to be controlling and abusive later on because you were too dependent on him. This doesn’t always happen, but Women who rely on Men too much are very easy to take advantage of, and that’s not something I think you want to be thought of. I certainly don’t!

To wrap this up… I suggest BOTH of you pay for dates and split the bill. Discuss ahead where you want to go so you don’t feel obligated to overspend if you are on a budget. Being honest, especially on first dates, you don’t know if you’ll ever see that person again. Instead of you both putting more pressure and nerves on one another, splitting the bill relieves some of that on both ends and it shows a Man you aren’t a gold digger. It also shows responsibility and that you aren’t using one another for free food or whatever you decide to do. Heck, first dates can even be free like walking in a park or at a library.

Remember, if you both are seriously in love and plan on spending your life together, you both will end up contributing to costs of a home, cars, children, food, taxes, etc… Better to show you both are willing to do that before getting Married! I love my Husband, and I never based our love over how much he spends. Money can be taken away, but real love has no price tag.

[Anonymous]

I’m not reading all that. It’s 2025, women wanted equality so yes both should pay their own share. It’s only fare. I love how some women say I’m taking the time to get ready, all the products I use, my clothes, etc. While part of you may be doing that for him, you’re also doing that for yourself to try to land a man. Trying to look your best in hopes of meeting someone. So ladies please stop saying you’re doing it entirely for the men. Many of you have no logic. When men say you do all that for men, a lot of women say no we do it for ourselves. Then when it comes to dates now all of a sudden you’re doing it for the men cause you don’t want to contribute financially to the date. Again like I said you’re getting dressed up for yourself as well to make yourself appear better to increase your chances of meeting a man. The other thing is even if your facial products cost $2-$300, you’re not using that entire $50 bottle or $25 lipstick all on one date. You’re using a mere % of it. You bought all that stuff before you met me, so it’s nothing exclusively just for me. Because if we aren’t compatible, guess what? You’re still going to use all that war paint for numerous other dates. You’re not going to toss it out cause it reminds you of me or something. The other thing is most women don’t have to do much other than show up. Sure you say you have to do your makeup, pick out the perfect outfit, etc, etc. But in order for that man to even get a chance w you he’s most likely had to build himself up somewhat for you to even say yes to a first date.

[RingOfFire]

Yeah whatever. The only problem with all of that is that nature never changes. Millions of years of evolution designed women for the purpose of having babies and nurturing them until they are old enough to survive. And it designed a man to provide for and protect the family so that woman and the children would have food, shelter and protection against the dangers of the world.

You can't change the fact that women are both physically and mentally designed for their role, and men are physically and mentally designed for theirs. It's a physical fact.

Humans deviate from this at their own risk. These roles are essential for survival of the species. Men cannot have babies. If women don't do that job that will be the end of the human race. It's the most important job that anyone has.

The problem isn't that women are relegated to the job of having babies and taking the primary role in raising the children, it's that views like this demean the value of that role. Equality isn't about a woman being able to be "just like a man," it's about appreciating that men and women have different roles in a healthy family--which is the building block of a healthy society--and understanding that both roles are equally important to the survival of the human race.

[Iquestioneverything]

I have a female cousin in the military. She took leave to have a baby, when maternity leave was over she went back to work. Her husband stays home to watch the baby and run errands and do other chores and cooks her meals. They are happily married and reversed “gender” roles. Granted her salary is equal to two incomes so her husband doesn’t financially have to work. My point is women can work and have babies, they don’t have to be stay at home moms anymore. And if both parents worked there is daycare or babysitters or family members to watch the kids.

[Shiprex]

THIS dynamic doesn't get enough recognition from ANYWHERE to be something FOR men to aspire to. I for one would imagine modern men would LEAP at the chance to NOT have to head and sacrifice to the grind and eye rolling turmoil of working life. Staying at home, being your own boss, COOKING and learning on your OWN TERMS. JFC that's like nirvana
BUT how many women would even entertain that comedy of loser FE-man (NOT IRON MAN) of an existence let alone show any respect for one who has this aspiration for their future.
It seems feminism has created a culture of women who want men to STILL be the masculine provider protector security blanket for them AND to deliver a male girlfriend partner to HER who does all the romance stuff but also backs up her insecurities and doesn't call her out her bullshit.

[incorrected]

Daycare and babysitters I would not trust. There are also studies on this, and kids who are left to third party carers tend to have a much higher incidence of abandonment issues. It's a choice, I suppose, but it isn't one I'd willingly make.

[RingOfFire]

"There are also studies on this, and kids who are left to third party carers tend to have a much higher incidence of abandonment issues."

This is absolutely correct.

I've lived long enough to see American society start to crumble because starting with the "Womens' Liberation Movement" in the 60s and 70s, women have been made to feel that there is something demeaning about taking the primary role in nurturing and raising the younger children. In fact it is the #1 most important job on the planet. Children need to have a parent, not some stranger, with them when they are young to nurture and support them emotionally... and this is what women are built for, this is the role nature designed them for. The purpose of the evil "liberation" movement was to destabilize and destroy Western society and it is working like a charm.

[incorrected]

After the post war baby boom there was a fear or a population explosion, and I don't think it's a coincidence that fundamentally anti-family ideology started to be pushed on society top-down soon after that. There was some room for women's rights, of course, but the medicine was mixed with poison. It had to be like that, to get people to accept it and fight in defence of it. The result, along with other factors like wage suppression and other managed economic decline, is the greatest drop in birth rates the world has ever known.

[RingOfFire]

@incorrected

I agree with you on all your points. Very well stated. Having lived through it and seen the transition first hand, I think I have a good feel for the causes and you are right on.

[RingOfFire]

It appeared for some years that "liberating women" was improving the quality of their life. At least that's what they were being told by the political left which pushed that movement.

But then women started realizing that they now had two full-time jobs instead of just one. They were expected to take care of the children in the home and also go out and work to bring home the bacon! Slowly they started to scratch their heads and realize that maybe it wasn't the panacea that they thought it would be.

Sure there are two cars in every driveway now instead of one. But there are also two full-time workers in that house. This is not a quality of life improvement. And it's subjecting the children to a life without adequate parental care and guidance.

[PeachyPie93]

I don't split on first dates unless I know I'm not interested in the guy and have no want to meet him again.. Reason being guys are just not loyal or interested in one person anymore. So to help weed the losers out its better to make them all pay if they plan on trying to proceed with me. Since why should you give time to a guy who doesn't even value you and is sleeping with 8 other girls on the side.. That is the dating market today, if he won't pay he is most likely trying to use you as a free whore because he is showing low effort. I am not attracted to low effort men.

[incorrected]

There are a lot of guys like that. In general, if he's attractive to you, he has options and is using them. Expecting them to pay will not act as a useful filter for commitment either though, that will usually just increase expectation, afterall if you value him as a wallet, is that really valuing him as a person? Why should he pay and not you? Vast numbers of women are spinning plates as well, so the logic of your filtering has to work in both directions or it won't work at all.

[PeachyPie93]

@incorrected Exactly so why would I help him out to be able to afford more dates with other woman. I'm sorry but I don't need to, plus if he isn't willing to pay for me but probably pays for others why would I bother to see him, it saves me time by elimination. I don't value a man as a wallet because I have my own money, the thing is until we are official I won't be chipping in for a guy who is most likely wasting my time by trying to get into my pants. If I get less dates it's all the better because clearly the guy who doesn't want to pay wasn't really interested lol. Since I am not desperate, I'm not compromising for guys who don't want to pay. It's not my problem how man take it they have the option you either pay first date or move on to someone else.

[incorrected]

The same rule can be applied the other way around though, you "probably" have other guys on the spin, so why should he pay for you? What it boils down to is judge of character. In the past your rule would have worked because men were expected to be providers, but these days paying isn't a sign of interest. Most guys still pay, and a good chunk of them just expect sex all the more because they paid. It's just not a useful filter, more of an entitled attitude.

[PeachyPie93]

@incorrected I don't care tho.. It weeds goofs out and since I am all about protecting myself and my chastity I couldn't give a fuck what guys think. There are guys who pay and don't expect sex so that's all that matters.

[PeachyPie93]

Also when I date guys I date one at a time not multiple people because I like to get to know them honestly and see if there is anything actually there feelings wise so when a guy is wasting my time he really is wasting my time..

[Iquestioneverything]

I can tell you that’s not true for every guy. Not paying on the first date doesn’t mean no commitment or using you. How does he know you aren’t using him for a free meal either and meeting another guy after? People are letting their insecurities take over too much in dating. If the guy is interested in you there will be a second date. Doing “what ifs” never helps. Iykyk

[PeachyPie93]

Yeah but if he thinks I'm using him, then he can go away.. I'm not scared about missing out on guys. As they say there are plenty more fish in the sea if he don't want to pay pick some other girl, it's pretty simple. It isn't insecurity it is picking a man who will go for what he wants and not make excuses or whine about what is fair. If I wanted a girlfriend I'd be gay..

[incorrected]

So, you think of men as providers. Are you similarly willing to play your traditional role as a woman?

[PeachyPie93]

@incorrected Yeah I don't mind.. I just want to be with someone I love and loves me. Since I work we would just share the money and I would still take care of the house.

[Iquestioneverything]

You seem like you think you’re a Princess. Your attitude seems immature to me. Maybe that’s why you are still single..

[PeachyPie93]

That's nice what you think.. it's better than being a pick me lol. I had a 13 year relationship where he did treat me like a princess and I didn't even work at the time, so why would I ever date a guy who doesn't treat me special? And I could always go back to that guy since we still talk and he still wants me. If I choose to be forever alone that doesn't bother me in the slightest, since men are usually more burden than they are worth.

[Shiprex]

YOUR strategy would show modern guys that YOU'RE not about being generous as well. That you're expecting HIS work and earnings to go to you while you are able to sit on the fence and be approached. Everyone knows that women ALWAYS have options whether you say so or not. A guy who believes you if you say that is gullible and soon likely to be (ab) used as a mug by women. Financial parity between women and men is now present and it's time for women who are still the chased (not the chaste of bygone eras) ones and there's very little movement away from that dynamic which tells us there are some who like to have and eat their cake from traditional ways but aren't too keen to evolve themselves out of comfort zones to show some commitment to the ones putting in the effort.

[incorrected]

So, this guy DID treat you like a princess for 13 years, and you still go back to him, but you still left him... I don't understand how that makes sense?

[incorrected]

Taking care of the house isn't what it used to be. In bygone eras that division of labour was required because even the washing required manual labour, using a dolly-tub and manually agitating the washing for hours per load, then rinsing them manually, mangling and pegging it out or hanging it by the fire, which was also manually lit and stoked, and that was just the washing. These days, you put it in one machine and then another. The carpets used to have to be beat and the floors swept, whereas now you just run a vacuum over it in ten minutes every couple of days at most. House work isn't work anymore, it's just a small mark of respect for kept women who have it cushy to do.

[Shiprex]

@incorrected Roll on the backlash to the feminist push out of the home into the workspace for men to become the stay at home adult in relationships... oh such fevered dreams!

[incorrected]

@Shiprex Hahaha, yeah, curious how that hasn't become a common thing and doesn't tend to last eh. It's almost as if thousands of years of selection pressures have given us gendered rolls that are not socially constructed eh!

Marriage used to be between a man and a woman, now it's an agreement between the state and a woman to enslave a man and remove his rights from property and children.

This woman nailed it 50 years ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Manipulated_Man As you can imagine, she got death threats from Feminists. There were cruel problems in the past. My own mother married a malignant narcissist in a naive hurry, and she couldn't leave without her kids being taken away. Her opinion on the way things have become is that now it's just unfair in the opposite direction. If you ask me, Feminism has been a top-down push to maintain state control over the affairs of the populace by screwing with the dynamics between the sexes. Sure, some good things have come from it, but the overall effect has been the emergence of entitlement and reductive interpretations of the past; the notion that it was just millennia of men "oppressing" women is absurd on its face. Both men and women had brutal lives and the division of labour was necessary. There were no welfare systems, so families needed to be large so that they could support the elderly while provisioning for themselves, their kids and even provide a basis for the next generation to get started. These days there's a central contradiction within Feminism, which is that they are supposedly equal and yet require the support of men and the state to maintain that supposed equality. Why should all men be taxed to support women's "independence" from them? That is just dependence without reciprocity obfuscated through systems implemented and maintained by the state.

[PeachyPie93]

@Shiprex I don't get why you all care about my strategy anyways since I am one person. I will never force a guy to pay, if I was to go on a date and he said "okay so we are splitting" I wouldn't care and I would pay.. and that would be our last time meeting.. on to the next lol
I chose who I am willing to date and who I won't. I feel my strategy protects me from fuckboys and guys who are not my type..
I am the type if you wanna know me then climb my walls, or don't, it doesn't matter either way but no one gets easy access unfortunately. I also work now and don't plan to be kept by a guy because it sucks and is boring lol.
@incorrected As for my ex we weren't sexually compatible.. like at all.. I could have it everyday and he hardly wanted it. So I found it lonely and boring.

[Shiprex]

@PeachyPie93 it's a wall that has no real purpose apart from removing from you the people who are as good and if not better than the ones who still follow out dated practices and fit the conventional man as the leader narrative. If you're open to this from before the first date then those who are flexible with expectations or say something like you pay this one, I get the next then there's two dates you both get to initiate and then the balance is made.

[incorrected]

It's not really about you per se, it's a topic of conversation with differing viewpoints. I couldn't care less about you personally, it's not like we're ever likely to meet. When it comes to filtering out 'fuckboys', your strategy is suboptimal. When it comes to 'your type', I think the unacknowledged truth is simply that you want to be paid for, as in the traditional way, but you also want your cake and eat it? I could be wrong about that, but reading between the lines it looks like that. There's nothing inherently wrong with that choice, if I'm right about that, as long as it's open and honest. People are allowed to want what they want, even if it's one-sided, and others are free to take them up on that offer if they so choose. :)

[PeachyPie93]

@Shiprex I like guys who are still traditional tho and I don't really want a guy who whores around.. so I assume if he is like a modern guy in the dating world he is pointless to get to know. Plus I don't want to spend my whole relationship feeling like we have to do everything fair, like who cares.
@incorrected it's not really that I want to be paid for since I don't mind living alone and paying for myself but money is the only thing they have to offer since most guys lie about everything. I like a guy who jumps hoops to show interest because if they don't I just don't feel they really like me. It's all just a game to try to get to the fucking. Honestly I haven't even been dating for a year because my last boyfriend I dated for 8 months borrowed $280 dollars and never paid me back and I even gave him $80 just as a gift and as soon as we broke up within a week he had slept with 2 other girls.. so now I don't want to be generous with guys and I won't compromise on that. I honestly don't really even like guys anymore but sadly I'm not gay so one day I will eventually have to try again lol.

[incorrected]

Most people are liars these days. If you want to filter out men who just want sex, the very best way to do it is the traditional way, i. e. a long courtship. You make clear from the outset that you won't be having sex for the first two years, or perhaps no sex before marriage. If you want traditional, you have to BE traditional. Most men who pay are still going to expect sex, or seek it. Last I checked, and this was around 20 years ago now, 80% of men watch porn. A genuine traditional man will not be doing that. I am 36 and from the ages of 18 to 24 phased porn out of my life, increasingly turning to my imagination. Do you know what happened? My imagination turned more romantic, and I wanted to "make love" rather than "fuck". Porn is basically a stimulant drug, and every climax re-enforces desire for whatever is being interacted with, and in the case of porn it's just perversion.

It sounds like you're not taking the time to thoroughly get to know men before jumping into bed with them. You need to pay very close attention to everything they say and do in order to figure them out. Trust nobody by default. It's not about "giving them a chance", that's just naivety. It's about taking the time to properly vet them before you trust them.

[PeachyPie93]

@incorrected Most guys won't even take me on a date if they have to pay, so it helps weed out a good number who hit me up. Tho there was a guy who wanted to go out but I figured he was out of my league so I cancelled the date. I haven't tried dating since then. But considering I only had sex with 2 guys and it was after a few months I don't think that is too fast.. but I know I messed up with the last guy by even giving him a chance. I guess I was just lonely and naive at the time.
2 years is a really long a wait once you had sex.. I suppose you can do it but I don't feel any guys will stick around for that, especially in these times when you can find easy woman pretty much anywhere.

[incorrected]

Yes, changing gender dynamics mean that paying is no longer fair. In times where men were expected to be providers they were paid accordingly, but now we have equal pay in almost all work it's no longer fair. These days, if a woman expects to be paid for, it's a red flag for entitlement. We're living in a time where equality is seen as one of the highest values, yet the expectations on men haven't changed, i. e. it's 'having their cake and eating it'.

The fact that they won't stick around for that is the point of it, it filters out guys looking for sex... If they're spinning plates, 2 months isn't much wait time. A compromise of 6 months might work better, since most men are impatient these days, but sex hounds will still struggle too much with 6 months.

Whether a man pays for you or not is no indicator of whether he's just after sex or not. 2 Months is barely enough time to get to know anybody, by the way. You should get to know them properly before sex, so you actually know something about them. Anyone can pretend for a couple of months lol.

[PeachyPie93]

@incorrected LOL what you say is true and the 6 months wait is a good way to be, but as for changing the pay factor I probably won't since at the end of the day the only person it effects is me and I like when men do for me. I probably am a bit spoiled and have a princess complex but my dad treated me really good and still gives me money now just because he loves me so if a guy won't do that willingly why do I need to know him.

[incorrected]

It's a valid choice. We each put forward for what we want and what we're prepared to give in return, and people either accept our offer or they don't. :)

[MzAsh]

In the beginning, the man is typically the one showing his interest, so if he insists on the date, he should insist on paying.


In the long term, though, yeah it’s not a bad idea to split all responsibilities, and not just financial. That means splitting domestic chores and child caring too. It’s risky for a woman to depend on a man financially. Typically, I wouldn’t recommend it.

[Iquestioneverything]

To address the first part of your reply. Many women expect the man to ask them out first. It’s becoming more common for women to ask a man out first, but it’s not “socially” accepted as much as it should be, yet! So for this reason you are basically forcing the man to ask you out and pay, knowing you’ll never ask him out first. It doesn’t sound fair if you put yourself in the man’s position. Asking someone out is enough to show interest, you shouldn’t force payment to show interest. Leave that if you continue to go on dates, he’ll voluntarily offer eventually. If he never offers to pay anything at all after a few dates then I’d say that’s a clear indicator he’s not into you.

[Apple1996]

Nah I need to know the man is generous and a provider. If he can't show me those traits then he ain't for me. There's always gonna be a man who is willing to pay so why would I settle for one who doesn't? There's no point in that.

[Iquestioneverything]

Sorry girl you just sound like you are out for money.

[Apple1996]

Nope it acutally has nothing to do with the money itself. It's more about the meaning behind it. Like i know a man respects me if he's willing to pay

[Iquestioneverything]

He respects you if he doesn’t expect sex right away, listens to you, wants to spend time with you, appreciates you for you. Payment has nothing to do with respect hun.

[Apple1996]

I expect sex right away, I'm quiet and I'm anti social so none of those things matter to me 😂 i need him to prove that he can provide. It's just basic biology that women want a provider so they know it's safe to mate with that person and know he'd provide for the family

[Apple1996]

Doesn't matter much since I'm already married. I don't need to care about who pays for a date when my husband pays for my whole life

[Shiprex]

A man who puts out his vulnerability should be enough of a commitment to someone about his interest to get to know a woman. Being generous with THAT is something you don't seem to value. Just turning up seems to be the limit of the effort here. Like he's doing that AND being vulnerable AND risking rejection AND then being expected to PAY for your time.
Come on most men don't gaf about the time and cost of make up to look more appealing in the first place, what is YOUR contribution to the interaction?

[Apple1996]

@Shiprex a woman's time should be valuable to a man. That's the whole point of dating a woman. If you don't value her time enough to pay then go date a man who will go 50/50

[Apple1996]

@Shiprex there is currently a male loneliness epidemic. Men are dying for the chance to spend time with a woman just not to be lonley 😂

[incorrected]

This! I have no idea why it is, but a lot of men and women just don't seem to have any idea what to look for, they're so busy using completely useless sorting criteria... On some level I'm suspicious that they're not really admitting what they really want. In the case of expecting to be paid for, I think they want to be treated like princesses but don't want the negative stigma they catch for wanting that, so they pretend it's about something else. I could be wrong about that, but it's my gut-level intuition at work.

[incorrected]

By 2030 45% of women are projected to be single and childless. There is a male loneliness epidemic that gets talked about a lot, but there's also a female loneliness problem too, and a 'side-chick' epidemic. More broadly speaking, there is a massive global epidemic of loneliness that spans all generations in an increasingly socially disconnected social, or rather 'asocial' landscape.

Curious that you would use a 'laughing with tears' emoji for that one. You weren't kidding in that other comment where you described yourself as "anti-social" eh? At first I thought you just meant "asocial", but now I consider that you meant it when you said anti-social. Are you diagnosed with ASPD, per chance?

[midnightmoon05]

I am a very traditional woman. I loved being treated like a little princess when going out on dates. especially early on…
door opening, chairs pulled out… I don’t want to take away the job of the one who will care for me, when I am having a baby, I want him to be my man to be there for me… care for me and our baby…. in the long run…. We become a team and help each other
Once I see that he is a quality man who takes care of me… I too will return 100 more… by giving him love and a family.

even when I make more money…I don’t want him to pay all the time… I pay too.
he is now a stay home dad… he cooks and runs the family and care for the kids…I go out to work because I love love my job…

I don’t want him to cook alll the time and don’t want him to do all the house work… so we hire our cleaning ladies and gardeners…. that way we both can enjoy life and not be a slave to cookimg and cleaning.
love is to want the best for our partner… we share love and care.
I didn’t read all that you wrote… whatever is working out for you… I wish you the best.

But I will have to disagree that splitting bills on dates… I do that with my friends… not with my hubby….
sometimes I treat sometimes he treats.

[malarkey]

You shouldn't split the bill, you should just pay for your own shit (separate bills). That way you know what you are getting yourself into. You can order whatever you want within your own budget without anyone feeling like they are getting used or owe anyone anything. If you want to spend $10 or $500 that night it gives you that control. Then you can take the date to get to know them honestly.

[Iquestioneverything]

That’s not a bad idea either 👍

[Shiprex]

Yeah that would be fair and equitable then no one feels pressure for anything other than GETTING TO KNOW someone over a meal

[malarkey]

@Shiprex Yep, and it also keys you into how they spend their own money. It's one thing when someone is spending your money, but when they have to spend their own money are they responsible and sensible or are they a spend thrift. When people are spending their own money you can gauge their lifestyle and spending habits more accurately.

[Raphaëlle]

Looking both from my culture and my own perspective of the dating culture nowadays, I don't expect my date to pay for me ever. In my opinion if it's a male female date, expecting the male to pay feels outdated. Sure it's nice if one person wants to pay for both on a date but it's not expected where I am from. It wouldn't matter either if the one who asked the other on a date or the other attending the date would pay. It's more of a nice gesture to do if you want to. Also this is coming from a culture where it's more common that everyone pays for their own bill at the restaurant (doesn't matter if it's with family, friends or date).

[LiliTyaka]

Mmm i pay for myself when i go on a date i domt want a guy to pay for me my Bills since its mine not his, when im in a relationship i Look that things get splitted like my boyfriend pays for the rent i pay for the food when we go out sometimes i pay sometimes he does but before that i pay for my own shit re-state//background_color_rgba (0, 0, 0, 0), font_color_rgb (77, 77, 77), justifyLeft

[kmg9150]

Dont be fooled the gender pay gap is a crock of shit. It 1920, women averaged the same or slightly higher salary per tax return compared to men…. Their were also quite a number of women who filed head of household, which would be contrary to the belief that it was an anomaly. Remember this is in 1920 when women had “no” rights, couldnt vote, couldnt get a bank account, ect……. So I call bullshit. I have the documents to back it, The IRS docs

[Iquestioneverything]

That may be true, but it’s the fact that most did not have to work at that time era due to gender expectations. I think you might be talking about single women, or perhaps women whose husband were at war. They would have to work in that situation. Still, at that time men did not want anyone to see a woman out earning them, and that’s the truth!

[Shiprex]

Most didn't have to work because they didn't NEED to. Like that's such a bad thing? Pretty sure I'd prefer to stay at home and be able to avoid commuting, clients, customers, colleagues and so on to improve my own living space.

[incorrected]

Paying for each other or splitting bills should be left until you're already in a relationship. While you're dating, each should pay for themselves.

[Iquestioneverything]

That could work too 👍

[Anonymous]

I always pay on a first date, but if she doesn't offer to pay or split the bill, she won't be getting a second one with me.

Many of today's women are extremely hypocritical. They fight against traditional gender roles, except the ones that benefit them. You can see it right here in the responses from some women.

[Iquestioneverything]

I asked this on another site where women are 30’s and older and many said they like to split bill, so perhaps on here and many younger women on here have different views. Your strategy of dating seems fair enough to me that if a woman is interested she will reciprocate and pay next time. I don’t however get why so much emphasis on money to determine if someone likes you. If there is a second date that’s a clear indicator you both like one another.

[Opinion Owner]

It's not about money. It's about a mindset of entitlement and self-importance.

[genericname85]

if you're a woman and you're looking for a traditional type relationship it would be stupid to insist on splitting the bill. cause doing that, you're basically signaling to the guy that you're not looking for the type of relationship that you actually do want.

[Anonymous]

Splitting the bill makes it sound like you’re going out with a friend instead of a date , I think the person who asked is the person that pays or depending on the money situation between y’all , if y’all have the money to trade off where one person gets it one time and the other person gets it the next so y’all feel equal , yes this is one of the oldest and most confusing parts of dating.

[IslaTheWitch]

split doesn't work... everyone pays for themselves... so then there is no drama that someone has a tight budget and another person ordered something expensive...

[Anonymous]

Men have always been the ones to pay for dates because they are just supposed to. It has worked fine forever, so why change it? If I'm going to spend all the time to get ready for a date and give a guy a chance, he should do something to impress me too.

[Shiprex]

Because it's one side (men) having unfair expectations placed on them. Aren't we told women dress for themselves and not men? It is also largely true that men are fully aware of the effort of "getting ready" but prefer natural instead of made up versions of women but it seems women don't want to listen to that.
Stepping out of the comfort zone and risking rejection is (or should be) a way to impress but if you've never done that (99% chance you'd wouldn't be rejected as a women 99% chance a man would be so even then women still don't shift that "expectation") then you'd never know how shit that experience is.

[incorrected]

Women get equal pay now. Men used to pay because women weren't equal. Equality means equality just the same as no means no.

Only a woman could possibly think that getting dressed is a service to others...

[Shiprex]

@incorrected For some it probably is though so there's that...

[Phoenix98]

I'm more old fashioned on the matter if I am taking you out then I will pay that is just the way it should be in my opinion whoever is taking the person out should pay I think that's fair.

Or you can do it where I pay for dinner and you pay for desert or vice versa, something like that.

[Unit1]

yass. A girl, that Doesn't see me as free money on the first dates stands out to me from the money hungry girls.

[olivetheweirdo1084]

I just hate how society nowadays preach about equality and ditches all the traditional values. I honestly don't mind splitting the bill or even paying for the whole meal. But a man's willingness to pay for the bill tells a lot about his traits as a man because after all, women don't want to date liberal soy boys who demand stupid equal rights. And yeah don't ever bring up the toxic masculinity crap as an excuse to be such snowflakes.

[Iquestioneverything]

You are 14, your Dad still pays for you. That’s not the same as dating.

[Anonymous]

TLDR. To be honest, if I'm asking a girl out, I'm psyched enough about it to pay.

[MzAsh]

See this is a good attitude to have 🙌

[Opinion Owner]

@MzAsh Hahaha! Glad you agree. I'd much, much, MUCH rather pay for a date with a girl I'm psyched to go out with than go half-sies with a girl I'm not interested in. I'd do the first, and skip the second, personally.

[Iquestioneverything]

That’s up to you, if you want to that’s fine. I just feel like it should only be voluntary, not expected or forced.

[Opinion Owner]

Of course it's voluntary. But it's not unreasonable for it to be expected either. After all--the dude asked the girl out. I suppose if she asked him out it's a different story.

[Shiprex]

The dude asks out so he makes the first move. He made himself vulnerable to her. She has the choice and should show her some effort to commit to making it work that's above turning up. With his labour and wealth being used as well he's also committing even more to the potential for something to happen.

[Anonymous]

No i actually agree, people should pay their own half in a relationship. I also believe that both partners should have employment not just one. A lot of people may disagree, but i think thats fair.

[naartjie]

Men nowadays want to be the woman so bad and women are encouraging it! People are so lost

[Shiprex]

You mean men are expecting women to show that their wealth and labour are as worthy to be spend on each other or that men SHOULD be paying because that's their purpose?

[naartjie]

No men are becoming more feminine and wanting to be treated how women should be treated, so much so that men don’t even know how to lead anymore.

[Guanfei]

It's simple, you split because I'm not a wallet, I'm not free food, and you're a grown woman with a job and her own money.
Imagine thinking you're so important that I have to pay for your time. That also has another name.

[Drumlin2001]

Both genders? I thought there were 150 genders these days. I need a spreadsheet to list rules for who pays in each circumstance