Do you believe in the Trinity?

[Anonymous]

[HippieVeganJewslim]

No. If G-d is Our Father Our King (Avinu Malkenu), how can Jesus (peace and blessings upon Him) be His only son? If Jesus is G-d, why did He say: I know not what my Father knows? Didn’t Jesus say something like ascend to My Father and Your Father? Didn’t Jesus ask G-d’s permission to perform miracles? Didn’t Jesus perform extraordinary miracles, but couldn’t make two (or maybe four) nails disappear? How can a man (Jesus) pray to himself (G-d)? If observant Jews believe in the Father (Avinu) and Holy Spirit (Ruakh haQodeš), wouldn’t that be a Dinity? Wasn’t Jesus a prophet? Why would G-d make Himself a prophet? For those who reject evolution, didn’t Adam (peace and blessings upon Him) have no mortal parents? Wouldn’t that make Him another begotten Son? Didn’t Jesus say to obey the Commandments and one Commandment is to have no other deities? If G-d was crucified, would the Romans/some Jews not defeated G-d? The Qur’ān states several naturally scientific facts that no man at the time of Muhammad (peace and blessings upon Him) could’ve known, how come the Qur’ān also states G-d is One, ever-lasting refuge, having no sons nor parents, and nobody is equal to Him? If A=B, and B=C, then A=C, elementary, how come, although the Father would be G-d and G-d would be the Son, the Father ain’t the Son?

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Also, Jesus’ name Yeshua came from Yehoshua (Joshua), which means YHWH is salvation. How can G-d’s name have the Tetragrammaton in it?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

100, yes. God is one consisting and manifesting Himself as 3 distinct beings, The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit.

God The Father reigns Supreme over all, The Son (Jesus) is the word of God and Savior of all mankind that believes in Him unto salvation and The Holy Spirit operation is to indwell believers and guide them into all truth regarding God's word and testimony of Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:6-12

This is He who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ; not only by water, but by water and blood.

And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is truth.

For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

And there are three that bear witness on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.

If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater; for this is the witness of God which He has testified of His Son.

He who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; he who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed the testimony that God has given of His Son.

And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.

He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.

[Asker]

MumboJumbo and unbiblical theology, but whatever rocks your boat.

[sean1234]

"... and these 3 ARE 1! " Not separate beings. Don't think from man's perspective.

John 1:1, 14, 18 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

2 John 1:3
Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.

... so the Word,"Jesus" IS God and God IS the father. There are no separate beings, just a false catholic doctrine. Only 1 God as it says in the 1st commandment.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sean1234: Jesus is not the Father. Jesus himself said the Father sent Him and that He was going back to the Father as He resurrected.

Jesus is God's Son.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

*when he

[sean1234]

... is God's son and is also God, that's the point.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sean1234: I said that in my original statement. Jesus and Father are one and that Jesus is image of the Father who is Spirit.

[sean1234]

So do you believe Jesus is God?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sean1234: Yes, He just isn't the Father, but the Son.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

I wrote a Mytake about that years ago.

Contrary To What Many Say, The Lord Jesus Is 100% God In Human Form! ↗

[sean1234]

If God is the father and God is Jesus, then Jesus is also the father, not just the son. God is God. I guess it doesn't have to make perfect sense, like the fact that God has always existed, but it is what it is.

1 Thessalonians 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

It's why people also say Jesus is Michael.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sean1234: You just don't understand. Believe what you want. I'm done.

[Asker]

@hispanic-cool-guy
Your clinging to the catholic doctrin, renders God a lier in the Bible. If Jesus is not Jehovah and Jehovah is the only God we should workshop, like Jesus did, then they are not equal as the trinity claims.

If Jesus is the first creation, then he is not coeternal either.

If the holy ghost is not God (and the scriptures do not say so a single time at all), then the trinity fails.

You also ignore the doctrine of the first sentry Christianity but buy into the 4th sentry Christian only. Meaning you claim is the apostles was wrong, but the church fathers were right.

[TacosRAwesome]

Its one of those things I grew up with so I don't really care about it since it doesn't make a difference to me.

[Agape93]

Nope

[Stazz76]

John 1:1 wasn't written in English.

Quick grammar lesson.
A *definite* article is usually prefaced by 'the'. The car. The dog. The president. The object.
An *indefinite* article is usually prefaced by 'a' or 'an'. e. g. A car. A dog. A president. An object.

Translations aren't always concise. Notice that there is no clarification of the type of object with 'the' or 'a' in the English translation. "The Word was [a the] God". This is vague, and a terrible translation which has led to this debate.

The literal translation of the original Greek is more like "God was the word" or "Godlike was the word" as the word for God is both a noun and an adjective. Arguably, the latter makes a lot more sense in English. e. g. son of a horse is a horse. son of a fish is a fish. son of a man is a man. son of a God is a God. In this way Jesus is a literal son of God, and is 'a' God without being 'the' God. This is consistent with him diverting all credit to his father in heaven.

[Asker]

All angels are called gods and sons of God.

[andreasderjuengere]

It's a religious theory to me that's meant to 'explain' certain concepts of how ''we'' perceive God and his effects on us.

Namely: to explain certain manifestations of God as we as humans experience him.

As for religious doctrines (as in: organizing and administrating religion for a human club membership), I take Jesus by the word (or what's left of it) and accept God as ''the Boss'', Jesus as his authorized spokesperson, and the ''Holy Spirit'' as the good will to try and do the right things.

[Asker]

The difference between believing in Jesus and the trinity is who the God we worship is.

[andreasderjuengere]

It's really a difficult thing. I know Muslim views who interpret ''trinity'' as believing in three Gods. There's a lot of (purposely?) miscommunication around.
Myself, I'm not even in line with ''my'' own indoctrinators.

[Asker]

@andreasderjuengere
The Trinity is one God is 3 persons, while still being one God. Of course, this is MumboJumbo and not even God or Jesus agree with it.

However, Christendom seems with a handful of exceptions to agree that the bible is actually lying about God because you are implying that when beleaving in the trinity.

[andreasderjuengere]

Believing is not the same as knowing. But some religious functionaries pretend that they do :D

[Asker]

@andreasderjuengere
You can believe in the bible as in it is true, but you can know what it says and the meaning of the words regardless of you're beliefs.

[Guy13]

Yes but which model are you using ⁉️ What denomination or faith are you ⁉️

[Guy13]

You understand there are varied denominational approaches to Trinity that are not Orthodox, right?
And you know there are basic ways to explain Trinity to a false religion such as Apostolic, Islam, and Buddhist. I have influenced or brought to Christ each of those.

Your question is very loose. It would have been helpful to have written Background…SOMETHING 🤷🏻‍♂️.

[Asker]

The video explains it very well, it's incomprehensible MumboJumbo and unbiblical theology, no attempts for explaining the unbiblical theology are needed.
Only the actual content of the Bible matters, not incomprehensible interpretations that violate other scriptures.

[Guy13]

What denomination are you ⁉️ Why are you afraid to say that ⁉️ No one that is of God does this whether they think Allah or YHWH or Trinity is God. You are FALSE….

[Guy13]

Ashamed of your God, obviously

[Asker]

No but don't want to debate other theological issues various demonstrations have, so demonstration preferences doesn't matter.

[Guy13]

What’s your position?

[Asker]

My position is basically this, the trinity is contracted in the Bible so claiming the bible teaches the trinity is demonstrably wrong no matter the denomination and beliefs anyone holds.

You are entitled to your own beliefs, but not your own facts.

The trinity can't be true if the bible is true and vice versa.

[Guy13]

You make a claim with no Evidence. Support it⁉️

[Asker]

Evidens have already been provided in the video.

[Guy13]

It’s a video. Think for yourself. You have no idea when comes to Orthodox and Heresy.

[DaySpring]

Treat others how you want to be treated...

[Guy13]

@DaySpring Sweetheart, I am. I cherish an honest debate with a mind that is not hooked on you tube for thinking. What you got as you can not even regurgitate the video back to me.

[Asker]

It's not about youtube, it's about the evidence. The denomination debate is a detract strategy, I am not falling for it.

[Asker]

@DaySpring Now that's biblical :)

[talka20]

No i dont believe in trinity... God is one n only. No fathers no sons no parteners etc... He isn't begotten and has no one as begotten... it is just Him only

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Reminds me of sūratul ahad. Are You Muslim?

[talka20]

Yeah

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Assalamu alaykum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh!

[talka20]

Wa alaikumassalam wa rehmatullahi wa barakaatu

[TroyDT]

Do not see any other way to reconcile what the Bible says about God.

[Asker]

The video shows how to reconcile what the Bible says about God.

[TroyDT]

Not really. This glosses over passages that clearly identify Jesus as Deity, which occurs repeatedly throughout the NT. He is clearly not the Father, yet is not a false God. He is Lord, yet Scripture says there is only one Lord. Frankly this video sounds like JW propaganda. As the Watchtower Society has repeatedly proven itself to be a false prophet, it can be safely ignored.

[Asker]

@troydt
In essence, if JW believes it, then you don't regardless of evidence, scriptures and common sense!

The bible prover over and over and over against, the trinity in its core to be false. You misconstrued the divinity of Christ as being the trinity, but it's more about the personhood of the holy ghost than of the divinity of Christ.
Than set aside, Chist is not the God Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, his God however is. All angles are called Gods, so if that was the definition, it would still not be a trinity.

To believe something as stupid as the trinity, based only on the fact that JW doesn't agree, is in itself stupid.

[Asker]

JW do not belive the earth is falt, do you also belive the earth is flat then?

[TroyDT]

Do you know what a straw man argument is? Obviously because you used one. I did not say that the JW's are always wrong, but when they are making theological pronouncements that conflict with the full context of Scripture and with the historic faith those pronouncements can be safely ignored because the Watch Tower has REPEATEDLY proven itself to be a false prophet. 1914, 1915, 1918, 1925, and especially 1975. Just some samplings from JW publications:

” . . . the ‘battle of the great day of God Almighty’ (Revelation 16:14), which will end in A. D. 1914 with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced,” (The Time Is at Hand, 1908 edition, p. 101)

[TroyDT]

“Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the Apostle in Hebrews 11, to the condition of human perfection,” (1918 Edition of Millions Now Living Will Never Die, p. 89).

“There was a measure of disappointment on the part of Jehovah’s faithful ones on earth concerning the years 1914, 1918, and 1925, which disappointment lasted for a time. . . . and they also learned to quit fixing dates for the future….” (1931 Vindication, pp. 338, 339).

And yet:

"It did not take the brothers very long to find the chart beginning on page 31, showing that 6,000 years of man's existence end in 1975. Discussion of 1975 overshadowed about everything else. "The new book compels us to realize that Armageddon is, in fact, very close indeed," said a conventioner. Surely it was one of the outstanding blessings to be carried home!" .. Brother Franz. 'Does it mean that Armageddon is going to be finished, with Satan bound, by 1975? It could! It could! All things are possible with God. Does it mean that Babylon the Great is going to go down by 1975? It could. Does it mean that the attack of Gog of Magog is going to be made on Jehovah's witnesses to wipe them out, then Gog himself will be put out of action? It could. But we are not saying. All things are possible with God. But we are not saying. And don't any of you be specific in saying anything that is going to happen between now and 1975. But the big point of it all is this, dear friends: Time is short. Time is running out, no question about that." Watchtower 1966 Oct 15 pp.629,631

[TroyDT]

And as always, the JW's ignore that there is one True Deity, one First and Last, and both the Father and Jesus are identified as each. Just because your fallible human mind wants to limit the infinite and cannot understand does not make it false. You choose to limit God by what that fallible mind can comprehend. I choose to let Scripture speak for itself.

[TroyDT]

What is obvious from reading the answers here is that almost no one even understands the doctrine. Kind of difficult to discuss under these circumstances. Signing off.

By the way, my grandfather was friends with Raymond Franz so I have access to basically the entire old library if you are interested. Message me.

[Asker]

You ignored the bible evidence contradicting the concept of the trinity. What JW believes is irrelevant, since we are talking about the trinity not other denominations failures.

[slatyb]

No, it's just word salad. It sounds profound but it's just nonsense about non-entities. There's no there there.

[sean1234]

The trinity is purely Catholic doctrine. Jesus is God.

[sean1234]

In other words, No.

[sean1234]

Oh!!! To note, there is only one God, not 3 god's.

Exodus 20:3
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Exodus 23:13
And in all things that I have said unto you be circumspect: and make no mention of the name of other gods, neither let it be heard out of thy mouth.

Deuteronomy 5:7
Thou shalt have none other gods before me.

Deuteronomy 6:14
Ye shall not go after other gods, of the gods of the people which are round about you;

[TroyDT]

The doctrine existed earlier. Tertullian coined the term in the 2nd Century to explain what believers understood about the nature of God. The organized church did not exist till after the ascent of Constantine more than 100 years later.

[TroyDT]

The Triunity of God postulate One God in three persons, not three Gods.

[sean1234]

It's saying the same thing, which is why the Catholic church has deleted the 2nd commandment, to worship other God's. The Vatican is filled with idols everywhere.

Job 13:8 Will ye accept his person? will ye contend for God?

Deuteronomy 10:17
For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:

Job 13:8
Will ye accept his person? will ye contend for God?

No where in the bible it says he's 3 separate individuals, 3 persons; nor does it even say he is a person.

[sean1234]

It's hard to say what the 7th day Sabbath Christians believed back long ago when they were being completely wiped out by Rome/catholic church/vatican.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Protestants (or at least many of them) also believe in Trinity. YHWH’s Witnesses don’t believe in Trinity.

[sean1234]

They also worship a Sunday sabbath which their own Bible preaches against.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Sabbath comes from Hebrew Shabbát, or Saturday. Russian and Arabic and even Spanish name for Saturday came from Shabbat: subbóta, assabt, and sábado.

[sean1234]

Yes. If only there weren't so many indoctrinated and brainwashed people with ancient Babylonian traditions that the catholic church adopted.

[jshm2]

Nope. It's not even something taught by Jesus or his half brothers.

[Iamcoming]

No. Jesus is not God because Jesus eat sleep and drink as we as God is one and it is become perfect. We Muslims believe Jesus he is a prophet but he is not God.

[Anonymous]

No. It was created by three priest to fix the blasphemous concept of worshipping three things in a monotheistic religion.

[Anonymous]

The is only 1 God. That trinity stuff is garbage and ruined a lot of religions.

[AndrésC64]

I don't believe in the existence of any god (s)

[HippieVeganJewslim]

So You’re atheist.

[AndrésC64]

Yep.

[Asker]

I have greater respect for an atheist than that trinitarian. You can disprove the trinitarian doctrine in the bible, but I can disprove the atheist arguments.
So an atheist holder better cards so to speak :)

[AndrésC64]

You can disprove atheist arguments? Do tell.

[Asker]

Can't, it was a misspelled word 😄

[HippieVeganJewslim]

So, Asker, can YOU disprove the trinitarian arguments? Tell me, please. I’d love to know!

[AndrésC64]

@HippieVeganJewslim It is not up to the asker to disprove a claim. It is up to the person making the claim to provide evidence for it. Can you prove or even provide evidence for trinitarian arguments? Tell me, please. I'd love to know!

[HippieVeganJewslim]

No, @AndrésC64, as I’m also against the Trinity. You may see my reason of why G-d is One, the One on Whom everything depends, has no sex, fathers, mothers, offsprings, or equal.

[AndrésC64]

@HippieVeganJewslim So what's your reason for believing in this God?

[HippieVeganJewslim]

The Qur’ān states many naturally scientific facts that Muhammad (peace and blessings upon Him) couldn’t have known by Himself other from others.

[Asker]

@HippieVeganJewslim he also said a lot of crap. A pedophile warrior isn't a good role model.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Don’t assume crap, Asker. The only things we can be certain is that we can’t be certain of anything.

[Asker]

@HippieVeganJewslim we can be certain that the trinity is not bible based.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Based? Maybe. Is it in the Bible? Probably not. Didn’t the Bible mention that Yeshua said I and my father are one? Does that mean one being, or something else?

[AndrésC64]

@HippieVeganJewslim What scientific facts?

[HippieVeganJewslim]

You can find them here: https://zamzam.com/blog/scientific-facts-in-quran/ There are more, as well. The bee (female or male I can’t recall) has 16 chromosomes, and the 16th chapter is called the Bee.

[AndrésC64]

Too silly to even respond to. I got through the first three and decided that the rest were pointless too.

[Asker]

@hippieveganjewslim Yes, the false Quran is kinda stupid, the evidence of the stupidity is massive.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Explain how all those scientific facts in the Qur’ān got proven by natural science.

[Nikki1989]

I don't believe in fairy tales.

[talka20]

U dont have to believe in faily tales... u can always look up for things... like prooves, signs, science, nature n then come to some point

[HippieVeganJewslim]

@talka20 I looked for proofs, etc and concluded the Unity — G-d is one.

[Varanus]

No, I'm not a crazy person

[Jeansnowstarkbastard]

Yes i do believe in the trinity..

[Caramelpie]

Nope. Never have, never well.

[nawtee_me]

absolutely I do...

[HaveNoName]

Man made horse shit !!!

[HaveNoName]

Just for the record... I am a person of faith and a believer.

[BCRanger10]

Yes, I do.

[Robbey]

I do believe.

[Dinosaursandanime65]

Does it say that in the Holy Bible?

[Asker]

No, but almost all denominations say it does despite the evidence to the contrary.

[HippieVeganJewslim]

Actually, it says the opposite in the Holy Bible.

[Dinosaursandanime65]

Well pingas

[cyclist89]

yes .

[jimmy2]

I am a man , a father and a husband what so hard

[Asker]

That you are still one person not three.

[Asker]

^Then you are still only one person, not three persons in one.

[Anonymous]

What?