I find that white people get indignant at the thought of this. Mainly white men.
I guess you *feel* it more if you're not white: -Growing up and having relatives or friends actually pour honey into their dark brown eyes in hopes of making them lighter. -Having friends buy skin lightening soaps, creams, lotions, etc. -Seeing friends straighten their beautiful afros or extremely textured/kinky hair. -Being told "you're pretty for a Mexican/black/Asian girl." -Hearing people say "oh to find a white girl with a black girl booty". -Seeing petty fights with the "#teamlightskin vs #teamdarkskin". -Attractive black girls always being asked if they're mixed. -Relatives being happy you're with a white person because they can pass "nice hair, nice eyes" or other "good genes". -Having trends idolized if taken by white women yet shaming non white women for the same features/styles. (I'm on the fence on this one). -Not seeing "dark" women/men in the media. (when they do show black/Latinos/Asians, they tend to be "white girls dipped in chocolate" or "whitewashed") -In nearly all novelas, it's mostly white or very light skin Latinos. There's nothing wrong with that, but that's not the majority of Latinos. We can be very dark, tan, or very white. Also, when there are dark skin actors, they are often depicted as poor, unwanted, "ugly", mean, the antagonists.
This isn't meant to offend. It is becoming less and less of an issue, but it's still there. I know some of y'all will just roll your eyes at the mere title of this and say "shut up stupid ugly dark skin girl, face it. White women are superior". Or something like that. But I'd still like to hear y'alls thoughts. And non whites any similar experiences? https://raceandtechnology.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/gabourey-elle.png
I'm a white person and I DO NOT believe in Eurocentric beauty standards.
I'm a white person and I DO believe in Eurocentric beauty standards.
I'm not a white person but I DO NOT believe in Eurocentric beauty standards.
I am not a white person and I DO believe in Eurocentric beauty standards.
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I guess this is also to provide insight on why so many non whites keep asking if "we're desirable, to whites mostly, but other races as well.
I forgot to include Asians who are notorious for white worship. The eye surgeries, double eyelid surgery. Wanting pale skin.
1. There certainly are eurocentric beauty standards, because we life in a country which is majorly white. In different countries those photoshops would look different. This here is a good example (yes, it is not scientific, but gives a general idea): diply.com/.../51274
2. You have to keep in mind that women of all ethnicities are on average lighter skinned than their male counterparts. Thus it is quite safe to assume that a lighter skin is inherently more attractive.
3. People are attracted more to their alikes. This is ultimatively true to all ethnicities. Whites prefer whites, blacks prefer blacks, hispanics prefer hispanics, etc. Thus in a country where the population is 2/3 white its only natural that most advertising campaigns focus the majority.
4. Supply and Demand. Companies aren't charities and thus they don't give a shit about petty issues as long as they have their profits.
5. Whitewashing? Really? There are examples for both cases, but how exactly does it matter? Here is a super common blackwashing example of a chracter meant to be as white as snow: cdn.bleedingcool.net/.../thor-3.jpg
I could go on, but those are the key examples. Is there are purposefully, brainwashing way meant to put down the looks of non-whites? Nope. Sure, there are probably some messed up exceptions, but the majority just does it because it's simply natural to them. The US, Canada and Europe are ultimatively white countries (maybe in a few decades not anymore considering the birthrates) and thus its only natural there is a white beauty standard. It's human nature and not mean-intended.
Of course there will be collateral damage like blacks trying to have straight hair in order to fit in, but that's bound to happen. Nothing can change that and I don't think it's not societies job to change it. Get comfortable in your own skin, but don't expect others to do that for you.
Also I don't even get into the topic of Asians who white worship. Let's face it, a lot of Asian cultures are rotten to the core at this point.
"you're pretty for a Mexican/black/Asian girl."
I don't see the problem with it. I think it is the girls association with it which makes it negative. She thinks "mimimi, he says blacks/mexicans/asians aren't so attractive" instead of hearing "I normally aren't too attracted to blacks, mexicans, Asians, but you are pretty". Actually this is a compliment which is stronger than a normal "you are pretty", because the guy finds you attractive DESPITE not being normally attracted to your ethnicity.
There are much, much less examples of "dark washing" than white washing. Much less.
"You're pretty for a _____". Is not a compliment. If it is, it's more of a "backhanded compliment". If you think it makes us feel better for you to put down our heritage, our ancestors, our family. You're wrong. I'd rather hear no "compliment" because, that's not a compliment.
Personally I am not very attracted to Asians and blacks. Let's say I see a black girl I still find attractive I think to myself "She is pretty cute/attractive/pretty for a black girl". It has nothing to do with her heritage, ancestors or family. Why would I attack them in the first place?
So it still comes down to the association. I agree that the choice of words in said compliment isn't the best, because it can be misunderstood, but I stick to saying it is meant as an honest compliment just with clumsy wording behind it.
I guess that's part of the differences. We aren't that individualistic in other cultures. That's why it's common for Latinos to say "if you mess with my brother/sister/cousin/etc, you mess with me". I don't agree how sometimes they'll jump you or whatever. BUT the point is, if you insult me or someone like me, we see each other more as "part of each other" and it's like you're insulting me. If you say my sister or brother is ugly or whatever, you're basically insulting my family and you're insulting me. This is why we don't see the whole "you're pretty for a ____" as a compliment. Because we're not individualistic like the US or other countries like that. Many of originate from a culture where the "family name" is more important than the person.
I see your point and get what you are saying. Yet, it comes down to the same point I made. It is a matter of negative association you have there due to a different cultural background. My argument is solely about the compliment being actually a positive one which is due to said association seen negatively. And also my point is that the choice of words really isn't the most sensitive, but by no means do I think it is a negative one in the most cases (exceptions proving the rule).
The problem with hearing that is that it used to be so common. Now, we don't hear it as much. I don't hear it as much, but I don't really get complimented as much when I was younger. I still hear it here and there, and I explain to the people why we don't like it and don't really consider it a compliment. I think Asian cultures are similar, where the family name is more important than the individual, though for them it's probably even more important.
I still think the Media in the west is meant to be more for white people. Why? More white people. And that's where the money is. Why would they care about representing the I don't know 2% of the Native Americans in the US, considering especially they tend to be the most poor, when you can profit from the many white people?
I should have put that first. Because white people tend to shun ANYTHING we say and think it either makes no sense, racism isn't real, we're pulling the race card, or that we're just babycrying about yet another issue. But until you grow up with it, you won't really get it.
And if you hear the motives behind it, maybe it's mostly money, maybe not. But you will think we're just looking to be victimized. We are not. But we do get fucked over for things we cannot control. And when we do try to control them, we still get fucked over "ewww. Those black girls with their ghetto weaves." "why are they bleaching their skin?" "who would pour honey into their eyes to make them lighter and why?" etc.
Naturally there are disadvantages of being a minority. People like to stick around likewise people and thus whites in a white country always have a headstart over the other ethnicities. That being said most of those things I personally think are exaggerated.
I've been there and experienced racism. Yes, I have experienced racism as a white german in germany. Sounds absurd? Not when you are from the former GDR (east Germany under control of the soviets) and go to school in the west of Germany. I have heard people trying to bully me for my accent, for being from the east, for being less intelligent, for being happy about bananas (because you couldn't get them in GDR shops). I never found it to be a big deal though since I simply made it clear that I do not care and like any other bully - they only keep on bullying you when you let yourself being bullied.
If think it's true and I'm a white dude. Being a white male is really a leg up on dating. I don't think I'm better than other people for being white but society definitely props up white beauty standards. I live in a small town that's like over 90% white and nonwhite girls are far more bold chasing me than even white girls are. I rarely get hit on by white girls but Hispanic and black girls seem to be really into me and it probably has something to do with jacked up beauty standards. I'm not complaining because I don't discriminate when it comes to dating or relationships. All racial/ethnic backgrounds have an equal opportunity 😜
I don't mean to make light of the issue because it's a very serious one. I hope beauty standards keep diversifying over time and at a faster rate.
That's true. Also on online sites, there are studies that show just how desirable the white man is.
Why do you think so many white people refuse to believe that maybe there are white beauty standards? It's not saying that white people are ugly and undesirable without them. But they do play at least a small factor to who we find attractive.
I think a lot of people don't like to think that they have it easier especially if they aren't successful with the opposite sex to begin with. It's also hard to see things that don't directly effect you. I never have to go around through life being conscious that I'm white. I never think about what race I am. I think this is something that's unique to whatever the majority is in whatever country. Then when people are confronted with race it and how it still matters in modern society, it makes them uncomfortable.
I'm white, of course I believe in it. I mean, I dunno, I think you'd have to be pretty stupid not to believe in it. You see so many people on here saying how they wouldn't date black girls, or so many people saying that white girls are the best, when white women are often congratulated and considered interesting and beautiful for physical characteristics that have always been in other cultures but have been mocked when found on anyone who isn't white, when I think a year ago it was something like 80% of models in the fashion week were white, it's hard to look at all that and think that there isn't some kind of beauty standard where people who do not have those features are undeniably at a disadvantage.
Lots of people, mainly white people seem to be adamantly against the mere idea of it. I guess you experience it when you're not white. And when you're young, you don't know what it is. Like before I thought it was just a compliment to hear "you're pretty for a Mexican". And now, I'm just like, wtf? How is that supposed to be a compliment? I don't know. I guess all the things I didn't quite piece together, I knew they were off, but I didn't realize the significance behind them or why they felt "off".
I am not white, I am black but I definitely see it amongst people on this site men trying to find out the likelihood of white women wanting a black man or dark women wanting to know how attractive they are even though they are dark. I say love your skin and your race and stop trying to attract a race that doesn't want you. I have never felt undesirable due to my skin colour, but I did not grow up or live in a predominantly white society so that changes things for me. Many white men and women find dark skin unnattractive whether it is preference or whatever everyone is entitled to their preference, but superiority when it comes to Eurocentric looks is something I will never support/
I don't support it either. But I do see it. And when I was younger I saw it, though I didn't get what was going on.
Yea. It's kinda disheartening to see all those "do white girls/guys like Latinos/Asians/blacks/etc" questions. Of course, there have been other questions asking if non-whites like whites, but I've seen more of the other way around. And from what I take, this site is mostly white. Or has more whites than any other race. So based on that, the proportion of "would (insert race) like (insert race)?" types of questions is off.
yes, I do believe it's a real thing. Which is really quite a shame. I think all the brown and Asian girls who live around my area and dye their hair light shades of blonde/brown/bronze look a million times better with their natural black shade.
Everyone should embrace their natural beauty rather than try to conform. The grass is truly greener on the other side with most white girls getting spray tans or going fake-tanning, while most of the media airbrushes anyone coloured to be a couple shades off of being white. -_-
Yes. I wish other features were celebrated like afros or textured hair. I think on some women it looks gorgeous, better than straight or wavy hair.
I'm not saying white people are evil monsters who's sole purpose is to oppress us any means possible. Because even our own people perpetuate this whole "white/light is better" beauty ideals.
I just can't wait until we finally embrace all features. And for when we don't put so much emphasis on "beauty".
It's a shame most white people fail to realise that many Asians esp in the south do have naturally lighter hair skin and eyes and this doesn't mean they are trying to be European. Media brainwashing makes whites assume others are trying to be like that without realising that other continents have the largest variation in eye hair and skin shades than Europe!
@BlueAngel0 ... I don't know if that's aimed at me or not though it doesn't really describe my views on that accurately. However, please do share which continent you think has the largest variation in eye/hair/skin shades if not Europe?
Of course I believe it's a real thing. As this model says, beauty is not just physical signs of health but also a legacy. And in the past few centuries Europe and it's descendants have dominated the world, so it makes sense we passed on traditionally European beauty standards , such as fair skin, big eyes and light hair
I love it when people reference "TED talks," like they're some font of unassailable wisdom that trumps all other opinions in the rock-paper-scissors contest of dueling ideas. Moses didn't give this talk, but rather a brain-dead 22 yo model who thinks the the continent of Europe was named after the euro currency.
@BigJake the point I was referring to which is that beauty is not all about health but also comes from the passing down of a legacy, is not controversial. It's well researched and well accepted
Well-accepted by whom, you? If "legacy" had anything to do with attraction and beauty, then white men and black women would be attracted to one another. They're not, even though these two groups have lived side by side in America since the 17th century. Why are the two groups not attracted to one another? Because they don't find one another to be physically attractive, nothing more. There are no issues of legacy to it, it's just pure physical attraction, or a lack thereof.
If it's all about "legacy," as you claim, then people of a common society who live in close proximity to one another would come to be attracted to one another over time.
What "ideal"? That's the thing, there is no ideal. If there were, why is there a "big butt craze," as another poster called it, that's driven by the desires of black rappers? Why then, is Thailand the number 1 sex tourism destination for white American men? There just isn't any such standard. This who topic is just minority women complaining that things aren't "fair," as if fair had anything to do with life. Guess what, mating isn't fair for most white guys, either. Most of us aren't 6'7" and muscular with the savoir faire of George Clooney. We're not what most minority women are looking for, either, so the street runs both ways.
@BigJake clearly there are beauty standards that are cultural and not inherent. And cultural standards change with... well culture, so by region and time period. Good example would be the big butt craze. Entirely cultural. These days tanned skin is more in style, in the past it was pale skin. Similarly with weight, now we prefer thin women, it used to be chubby
I think it's fair to say people who are attractive by innate standards are attractive in general. But there's more to it. Two women that have the same facial symmetry and waist to hip ratio and all that stuff might be judged differently when one has white skin the other black, or one is chubby the other thin. Those are cultural ideals
Thailand, many reasons, mostly it's cheap and legal and tropic. You can hardly go to Saudi Arabia to see a few hookers. You could to the Netherlands however it's rainy and expensive. Clearly there are a lot of factors that influence such things, not solely that men find thai women most
As for skin color specifically, women of any race usually have lighter skin than their male counterparts so it makes sense men prefer women with lighter skin than themselves, but it shouldn't make a huge difference for women in other women or when there is no comparison
He doesn't really care about any facts or evidence presented. He just thinks non whites complain too much. He's made racial comments and he thinks his experience are all representing. I'm not interested in debating someone who will literally ignore evidence presented to him, and say "case closed" when he "counters" with just his anecdotal evidence.
No, most white American men find Thai women to be very attractive. THAT'S the reason they go there for sex vacations. There are two dozen other countries that are cheap destinations, but Thai women are considered to be among the most attractive, much more so than Chinese, Vietnamese, or Japanese.
So black people have different tastes than white people. Why is it, then, that you don't hear white guys whining that we don't meet the "black beauty standard" for men? Why don't you see articles written by white guys lamenting that black women hold racist beauty standards that favor black men? The reason is that we realize that freedom of choice is a fundamental part of living in a free society, and that people are free to choose who and what they find attractive. Minorities, on the other hand, have come to believe that it's both possible and preferable to legislate choice, that it's an admirable goal to want to force white people to mingle with black people. Therein lies the rub.
Most of those things you discussed are just plain weird. The only one that truly got me indignant though, was pouring honey into one's eyes. Why would anyone do that?
As for the magazine covers: bleaching the heck out of Beyonce strikes me as a pointless thing to do. It makes her facial contours and eyes easier to see than in the other, poorly-lit image. However, it also changes the fact that bleaching her skin doesn't make her any less of the kind of trash that would marry a lowlife like Jay-Z, and would get together with Obama and celebrate the murder of Chris Stevens.
I don't know this Gabourey gal at all; I can tell you that bleaching her doesn't make her any more attractive to me.
After that lewd performance at the 2014 Grammys, I lost all respect for Beyonce. What should have been a celebration of achievement in the musical arts became a celebration of pornography and witchcraft and occult sexuality making a sick mockery of the priesthood, in which true talent was ridiculed to the point of one artist up and leaving in disgust while every form of sacrilege and assault on Vocational Destiny and the Laws of Nature was in full display. I wanted it to rain brimstone on that stupid "award" show, it was so disrespectful and evil.
When I see Beyonce, all I see is Chris Stevens' bloodied and sodomized corpse crying out for vengeance from the grave against Obama and Hillary, as well as Jay-Z's victims. That's all she is to me.
They do it because there are enzymes in the honey that supposedly react with your eyes and change its color a few shades lighter. Because you know, deep brown eyes are "ugly". There are many crazy things people do and have done to get "beautiful/lighter" features. I'm sure there are some the other way too, lighter to darker
I feel like most white people try really hard to have the skin of brazilians. Tanning beds has been a booming business in the states for awhile and it's only growing.
If you want to fight this then you have to put down your damn fashion magazines because that's where this is happening. You notice this irritation mostly from the men because we don't read those magazines and thus are not subjugated to being pressured into looking a certain standard. So many men have absolutely no idea where these women are getting their insecurities from because we don't read your magazines your fashion blogs or any of that crap so we simply just have no idea why women are stressing about their image. You can't exactly blame the men because so many have no idea where the source of womens insecurities come from because we don't waste our time reading fashion stuff. It's your magazines and fashion blogs made by women for women that are the problem here. Just stop reading the damn things and SO MUCH of this issue would disappear.
You yourself just proved it. You showed a magazine doing this racial preference thing. Men don't read this filth so we aren't corrupted by it. Women should do the same.
I know it exists. But I don't know much about it nor do I really care. People will do what they want and my caring about such things won't make a bit of difference. I understand your concern in this area. But the things you mention are often are certain people of color trying to imitate "white" features, not whites trying to make them go that way.
I am one who has different features that I like, regardless of color. And in some cases, there are features of other ethnicities than my own that I think are great.
I think I made it clear to you long ago that I think you are very attractive and would not want you to change anything to try to be more "white" (or anything else). The same goes for my thoughts on lots of people of other ethnicities. Nobody needs to change themselves to be appreciated by me. And I know there are many other out ther that feel the same.
Funny. :-) I am "white". But funny since Native Americans are to me the real citizns of this country. And they are also the one group that fights for this country in larger numbers than any other group. They also honor veterans more strongly than any other group.
I wouldn't be surprised if it were a thing. The US and Europe are apart of "Westren culture", and the West is made up of a lot of whites. So, if you want to appeal to consumerism to get those to buy your products, you're probably going to market to Whites.
I've seen that this "beauty standard" changes though. I've seen ads for a gym in the inner city that featured many black women working out. I also think that in Asia they feature women who are Asian for their ads.
Do these beauty standards that appeal to whites a majority of the time suck? Yeah. Is it probably going to change anytime in the near feature? No.
"Eurocentric beauty standards"? LOL you people invent some new racial outrage every day. There are no beauty standards. Guys like what they like, and you either pass the boner test or you don't. No, white guys aren't attracted to 300-pound black women or Hispanic women who are wider than they are tall. Sorry if that offends you, but it's reality. We're not required by affirmative action to be attracted to ugly non-white girls. Freedom of association and choice hasn't been legislated out of existence just yet.
The reason you see mostly white girls in the media is because white people hold 85% of the wealth in the United States. Advertisers know this, and they market their products to appeal to folks with money. White folks are attracted to white folks, just as black folks are attracted to black folks. This is why 99% of black women only want to date black guys. It's comical that young people today are so filled with Kumbaya, forced-diversity bullshit that they don't understand these simple realities of life.
You don't think they're real? I don't know why people get so indignant to hear it. This doesn't mean white people are bad people. White being the majority in the US, of course you're going to find your features more attractive.
Of course I don't want people to be "forced" or "shamed" into being attracted to someone. But when white people see questions regarding race, or puffy afros, or dark skin, by us. They're there for a reason. These features were regarded as "unprofessional" or "ugly". This isn't saying that white people are best looking or that you'll automatically be beautiful for being white.
They're not real. We get indignant to have stuff like this thrown at us because it's social fascism, for one thing. Every other racial group is allowed to be attracted to and associate with whomsoever they choose, but not white people. No, we're required to be attracted to other races of people. If we aren't, then we're labeled racist and held up for ridicule by the social justice warriors. It's a blatant double standard, and one that I'm tired of hearing.
And no, I'm not more attracted to white girls because they're the majority. I'm attracted to white girls because I'm white. People strongly tend to be attracted to people who resemble them physically. It's why 99% of black women are only attracted to black men. I would be attracted to white girls regardless of the society I lived in.
It's not social fascism. And no one is angry for you not being attracted to other races. Well, some people might be, but I'm not. I don't care who you see most attractive because it has a lot to do innate, though to say it has nothing to do with cultures or exposure would be disingenuous.
And to say they're not real is being disingenuous as well. Of course they exist, maybe today not so much as to "subjugate" but more for monetary reasons. Why would the media work so hard to represent like the 2% of Native Americans, especially considering they tend to be race most in poverty, when they could represent whites who make up more of the population and have more money than the other groups? From an economical view, it'd make sense to market towards them more.
No, it makes sense to market to people with money. White people hold the vast, vast majority of wealth in this country. In fact, when I checked, it's actually about 90% of all wealth in the US, which is even more than the 85% figure that I stated earlier. Advertisers aren't interested in public outreach programs, they're interested in cash. You can't get water from a stone. If you want to earn cash, you have to target those with cash as your customer base.
And no, exposure to different cultures doesn't change attraction. If it did, then black women would be attracted to white men. But they aren't, even though they live in a sea of white men. So that pretty much destroys your theory. The reality is that people like people who look like themselves, and there's nothing wrong with that. I would never condescend to tell black or Hispanic to whom they should be attracted. They have their own "beauty standards," and they're entitled to them.
And it's clear you only want to argue, because I said that it makes sense for them to appeal to who has most money, white people.
And really? Black women aren't attracted to white men? Online studies have shown that white men have the highest response rate, even with yes, black women, and white men. They're attracted to them.
And that makes no sense. You're saying that if you never even knew they existed, you still wouldn't be attracted? Exposure makes somewhat of a difference. It's probably not the "deciding" factor, but it does make a difference. Because how would you know you won't like it if you've never been exposed to it? And I don't think so. Because many non whites, especially darker, tend to like not like themselves. Many dark skin, dark eyed men prefer blonde blue/green eyed women. Why? Not because they're like themselves, but because they are different. They like to see the differences. Of course everyone is entitled to their own beauty standards, I'm saying that in
.. Western media, it's mostly white beauty standards being shown. Though it's slowly diversifying. Because there are not so many whites anymore. Though it still largely caters to white, as I've said before, they have the most buying power so it's no surprise really.
“And really? Black women aren't attracted to white men? Online studies have shown that white men have the highest response rate, even with yes, black women, and white men. They're attracted to them.” What studies? The only thing I’ve seen was an article by OkCupid claiming that white men had higher response rates than other groups. That’s not exactly a controlled research investigation. And besides, the fact that a black woman in an online dating site would respond to white guys does not equal attraction. White men are known to have the most overall wealth of any group in America. It makes sense that desperate women engaging in online dating would want to try to find a guy with some resources. Women of all races engage in this type of behavior. It’s called hypergamy.
Now, if black women were actually attracted to white guys, you’d see more of these couples in real life. As it is, these couples are rarer than a 10-pound pearl. This is the proof that these two groups aren’t attracted.
“Exposure makes somewhat of a difference. It's probably not the "deciding" factor, but it does make a difference.”
Again, this theory is blown away by the lack of attraction black women feel for white men. They’ve been “exposed” to white men for 400 years, and still they prefer to be with black men almost exclusively. Case closed.
“Because many non whites, especially darker, tend to like not like themselves.”
Now that’s rich. Black people tend to have the highest self-esteem of any demographic group, even when they have no reason to have any self-esteem whatsoever. There are homeless, unemployed, illiterate black men who think they’re god’s gift to women. Conversely, there are Asian men with six-figure incomes and Ph. D. s who wonder if any woman would ever want them. The very last affliction black people suffer from is a lack of self-esteem, that’s for certain.
“Though it still largely caters to white, as I've said before, they have the most buying power so it's no surprise really.”
You’re confirming here that the preponderance of white people in the media is about money. This invalidates your notion of “beauty standards.” This is simply a matter of catering to those with money, which, in :America, means white people. It’s about courting customers, not establishing some nebulous “beauty standard.” P&G isn't interested in social engineering projects, they're interested in cash. White people have cash, so they mirror white people's tastes and preferences in their advertising. That's it. It's no more complicated than that. There's no grand conspiracy to make black or Latin women feel inferior.
I've either rebuked or debunked every point you've advanced, so clearly I'm taking it a lot more seriously than you in that I've put a lot more thought into this topic than you.
You are just saying on your experiences and then saying "case closed". Like as if you're experiences are an all deciding factor. I see black women with white men. It's not like they're the rarest thing in the world. I do see rare is black women with Asian men.
You're not really refuting, you're just saying "nope, it's this way. So that theory is completely wrong" and yet all you have to back those statements are your experiences or viewpoints. So yea, you're not taking this seriously.
LOL So your opinion is gospel, and mine is just my opinion? You're funny.
This no attraction between black women and white men. That's not my opinion, that's a fact. There are are so few marriages between black women and white men that they're the exception that proves the rule. I live in a city of 6 million people and I haven't seen a white guy with a black girl, ever. That's a fact. I see all other groups getting together, but not these two. That tells me everything I need to know.
You claiming that "exposure" breeds attraction is patently false. The proof of this is just as I stated, black women aren't attracted to white men (and vice versa) despite 400 years of exposure. Exposure has nothing to do with attraction. Attraction has to do with attraction. It's very simple, but apparently you haven't grasped it just yet.
We're both stating opinions. But I'm not saying "case closed" after mine like it's a definite rule.
And I live in Chicago, I've seen many black women and white man couples. I've seen many black men with white women, so it's not a "Fact" that blacks and whites are not attracted to each other.
Exposure is not the deciding factor, but it does make even a slight difference. If you think that's wrong, then I don't know what to tell ya. The whole "big butt" craze is an example. That one model from the 1920s, Coco Chanel, how she basically put tanning on the map. There are soooo many examples how just the mere of exposure got more people either liking, or willing to admit they like certain features.
Chicago is probably the most segregated city in America, rich white folks in the north, poor blacks in the south. It's comical to think that such a divided city would be this anomalous locale where black women went crazy for white guys. If anything, it'd be the opposite. Resentment and disdain for whites would be over the top in Chicago because of the segregation and income disparities. So I don't buy your assertion at all.
The "big butt craze" was created by and propagated by black men--rappers, to be specific. White men have no attraction to 250-pounders with big, fat asses. That's what black guys like, not white guys, so I guess this is a case of "black beauty standards" taking over the media. Thank you for unwittingly proving my assertions for me.
And yes, it is a fact that black women and white men aren't into each other. If they were, you'd see these couples everywhere, and the reality is that you do not.
I am white. I am very well aware that white is the standard of beauty, although it's something non-white people seem to believe and promote just as much, if not more, than whites. I have blonde hair and blue eyes which some girls love and some find undesirable on a man. I don't care. My girlfriend is a pale brown eyed brunette - I love it because brown eyes and hair on a girl look warm and welcoming.
I'm sure this is not politically correct thing to say, but if I'm honest, other races, especially Asians, look all the same to me. It's like there's only one look that they have and one body type. Then again, I live in a part of Europe where everyone is white so I've never been exposed to racial diversity.
Sometimes, I agree. Because many times nonwhites around me, seem to go crazy for "white girls with booty". I think those features are more seen as "feminine" and for women, a lot more men of any race would prefer.
Lmfao. If you're not part of the race, I think everyone looks similar. And within your own race and ethnicity, you can see the difference. Like "He mistook me for Guatemalan? Haha no. I'm clearly Mexican/Salvadorean/etc." I'm sure like Russian and Polish girls get mistook and they think "how could they make that mistake?"
Yes, but I think that is due (at least in part) to the fact that White people are the majority in countries with Eurocentric beauty standards as well as historical legacy. Now, the whole light skin craze in places like India and East Asia don't make a lot of sense to me unless those standards were there before Europeans showed up. There is evidence that pale skin was highly desired during the Tang dynasty in ancient China which was nearly 1000 years before Europeans came to set up their colonial empires. I'm white by the way.
I get it. It'd kinda be crazy if there weren't. Like why wouldn't they appeal to the demographic that is largest and that holds most of the resources and money? Why would they put so much money and effort to appeal to the 2% Native American population, especially considering they are the group most in poverty, when they can appeal to the masses with more money? It'd be a really stupid move on their behalf.
White has always been seen as right lol That's kinda fucked up. But what can we do. I think that was because the nobility was indoors, while the peasants were outside toiling away in the fields? So the paler you were, the more status you had and were not a poor person.
I think everyone loves white girls with booty. That's like the "ideal" of the ghetto.
Yes I think it was tied to the fact that you had to be part of the nobility because you could stay inside all day rather than in the rice paddy working. That's funny, it's also the ideal in waspy areas lol
Uhhhh well i can't say i don't like women more but i have 2 say i would prefer a Brazilian girl over a white girl any day. Plus its more of the mind set people have right , Like my ideal girl is a blonde hair with green eyes , The reason i think i want that is because its rare. Its like wanting something because not everyone has one. OR the curvy girls saying they wish they were skinny or the skinny girls wishing they where more curvyLook at the upside the white population is dying out because they are only having 1 to 2 kids :)
Yea, I think it's interesting though that this is what non whites say when preferring "white/light features". And it's a common reason people say "hey, non whites like whites because they have different features than them". And then "white people like other white people because they're like them and everyone goes for their similar". Hmmmmm.
So white people like white people because they are the same Coloured people like white , light people because they are different Then with that logic why don't coloured people like Asian's? You gotta think brown people don't date blacks or Asians (not common) Asians don't date blacks But every race is willing 2 date a white person , so you conclusion should be white people are more desire able because of there features there for that's why they like white people more than any other race
Depends on what you mean by white. Personally I'm pale and I feel like most of the people in advertisements and Hollywood are tan.
As far as why lighter people are used more than blacks I think it comes down to what jacquesvol said about them having the most purchasing power.
I don't think it's this conspiracy where the media doesn't want minorities to be attractive, I think they just do whatever they think will maximize profits.
Tanned people are becoming more common yes. But I've said this before, "tanned skin is loved. Tan skin is not". Basically, tanned skin (on pale skin) is seen as desirable. Probably for that reason "they have enough money to go travel" or whatever. But tan skin, skin that is naturally darker is not desired. Because you can't "go back" to being pale.
I agree. But I don't know if this was always the case before, though I do think it is why it remains now.
But tan skin, skin that is naturally darker is not desired. Because you can't "go back" to being pale.
I disagree. I don't think whether or not you can "go back" has anything to do with it.
It just has to do with how tan. Light to medium tan complexion have the most mass appeal, regardless of whether or not its natural. Actually I might even say the natural ones are more attractive since they tend to look less orange.
It's starting to become more accepted, but I wouldn't say it "beats" pale skin just yet. Especially when we consider other countries and cultures as well.
Maybe it different where I'm from but being tan has never been not accepted. Getting a tan over the summer was always seen as a positive thing when growing up.
I'll agree that darker skin ie seen as less than ideal but tan is usually preferred over pale. At least I'm my experience.
I guess I'm disagreeing because I also watch consume media from other countries. Like Mexico, South America, and parts of Asia. I know in novelas, it's still the "porcelain skin, colored eyed" women who are the beautiful protagonists. While the dark/naturally tan women are portrayed as the cleaning ladies, the servers, the poor, the uneducated. The blonde/light hair, light skin, colored eyed actors and actresses usually get portrayed as protagonists or leading roles. While the darker skinned counterparts get the secondary, unimportant, or antagonists parts.
That's why I see, that even in our community, tanned skin is hot, while tan skin is not so much.
That's another thing. Also like in BET and "black" media, even the black celebrities are getting lighter. Not just because of skin bleaching, but even just the celebrities themselves. No more Tyrese, Kelly Rowland, Wesley Snipes - there aren't that many "new" dark skin black celebrities. I'm on the fence with this one because it may be representative of how interracial relationships are a lot more common and on the increase now.
I never denied that lighter is often preferred over darker, nor am I denying that it provides an advantage in dating. The question is "how much lighter"?
With women, I'll concede that pale might be preferred in many areas, its often said as being more feminine. Not saying I agree that its more feminine, but its often claimed.
But with men, I feel like women want the cliched "Mr tall TAN and handsome". Whenever I see a guy girls go crazy over, whether it be in real life or in the realm of celebrities, they usually have a light to medium tan. They aren't pale.
So for women, being pale might provide an advantage, but for men, I think having a light to medium tan is better than being fair skinned, although being fair skinned is probably better than being really dark.
I'd agree on that. But, there's a limit to how dark. Being tanned/olive like Italians is probably what most people like for men. But that same color isn't what's preferred. Though it's being more accepted. Though it still seems it's more of a preference for tanned skin, not tan skin. So white people tanned vs a naturally tan non white, I'd be willing to bet the white tanned person would be rated more attractive. Especially for the men.
I think it's real. What I chew on most is: suppose we, in predominantly white Western countries were to eliminate this practice, what about other countries where people (like India and Korean) give themselves surgery or skin-lightening treatment? Would that continue? I grant that not all of these practices are to try and look more 'white'.
That's a good question. And I've always wondered as well. I think for most of us somewhat concerned non whites, that's the goal. Or at least not as common. Or women with textured hair getting weaves or chemical straightening treatments. I've seen mothers do this to their daughters as young as 2. I'm not against it completely, because they should be allowed to fix their appearance how ever they please, but what's troubling is how "normal" this is now within our communities. And how "rare" otherwise common features are now. Like I've been exposed to many blacks, but very few wore their natural afro or kinky hair.
It is a real thing. It's been a real thing since European culture became the global dominant - which happened between 16th and 17th century. Even when people from other "races" are praised, it's because they share some traits considered attractive according to European standards. In this case, those individuals are considered as having an "exotic beauty". Which means: pretty according to European standards, but without losing some traits that indentify them as belonging to other cultures.
That's basically it yes. The times we are seen as "attractive", it's because we have enough "light" features to compensate for our "lesser features". The Latinos with the colored eyes or that can "pass as white". The "#teamlightskin" black people are seen as more attractive.
I am non-White but I do believe that Eurocentric beauty is a real thing. But here is the catch: I believe that it is natural. I objectively believe that White women are the most beautiful because they happen to possess the evolutionary traits that we've come to desire most. Males of every culture across history have seemed to prefer them (including myself).
That said, I also believe that physically at least, Blacks are the most attractive males for the same reasons.
Is it fair? Of course not. It sucks to be Mexican and know that I'm merely somewhere in the middle. But it doesn't bother me too much, and nature isn't concerned with my feelings.
Cultural programming is usually just a reflection of nature, albeit an exaggerated one. Furthermore, I grew up in a pretty multicultural environment (the Bay Area) and I'm Mexican-American, yet I've always found White girls to be the most attractive. I think there is something inherently cuter about them, especially since I have a bit of a foot fetish and they always have the smallest, cutest feet.
Yeah I think you're right. Culture certainly plays a part. Historically it has always been that beauty is defined by the superpower and/or the elite. For example, many occupied societies used to adopt the beauty standards of the Romans. But I like my White girls; it's not that other girls are pretty too, just that I find White girls to be the cutest and prettiest.
i don't believe in them personally, because women of different ethnicities are beautiful. however i know that eurocentric beauty standards exist, which is really unfortunate, but as you mentioned at least they are getting better.
I agree. I wish we would embrace other features as well. Like afros and curly/textured hair. I don't know why we still are making such slow progress. Oh well, I guess slow and little by little is better than no progress :/
As a very white slavic person I don't really care. I'm not a big fan of the germanic fair look since you get so used to it around here. Not saying local slavic women for example are ugly, it is just that the most attractive people I usually find to have mixed heritage (some hispanic, some european, some asian/indonesian even)
But I do have to say I prefer black people the least, but that has to do with physical features rather than skin color.
Definitely, there are certain elements of beauty which are universal such as symmetry but mostly it's just fashion and convention. The modern convention is closer to European than anything else, next closest would be east Asian. The ideal of beauty though, doesn't look like most Europeans either, it's just closer to them.
That's what people looking at me would say. My skin is pale, dark eyes and black hair. Frankly past my parents (who I resemble) I think it's silly for anybody to claim to be anything. We don't know what our ancestors got up to.
Yes it does exist and to deny this is ridiculous. You've got to be delusional to think it doesn't exist and isn't pushed by the mainstream media.
I am a white male and I believe it is, I also get irritated when non-white men try and tell me I am more desirable to women when most women don't look at me as being handsome but as rather unsightly.
It's funny because as a white man I am more attracted to women that aren't pale and white skinned.
It's mainly because of like online studies that show that white men are the by far most responded to group by like every race of women. So that probably does or does not translate to the real world as well.
Hmmm... Maybe Eurocentric beauty standards are a thing. But think about all the tanning salons, fake tan products and the 'get a tan' thing that so many people are into. Tanning products fly off the shelves because people want darker skin. Also, things like cornrows or dreadlocks (I'm not sure about the proper word to use) are super popular, but if a white person has them, it's cultural appropriation and it's not allowed because that white person is belittling and/or imitating another culture apparently... Tbh I think it goes both ways.
I don't think that's enough to say "they're the same". While I disagree with cultural appropriation, it's not the same nor nearly the same as the Eurocentric stamdards.
Oh I agree that they're not they same. I'm just saying that everyone gets a little bit of the hate and everyone is put on a pedestal for physical attraction at some point. It's just some receive one much more than the other. But then again, I'm European, so I can't really say anything?
It's not to the same degree either. And only recently that has occurred, though many places and cultures still value "pale beauty".
It's not on the same scale as to what non whites will do, have done, and are still doing to look "more white". It pales in comparison.
Though I do think that the standards are changing, and allowing us slip through the cracks once in a while. Progress is slow. And it would make sense in a purely economical standpoint to appeal to whites. More white people, and white people tend to have more money. Why would they bother appealing to the 2% Native American population, who also tends to be the group most in poverty, when you can appeal to white people who have more money?
And you're being intentionally ridiculous. I clearly asked this question mainly for white people, To say "I'm European, so I can't really say anything", you're being dismissive on purpose. If you're not gonna take the question or discussion seriously, don't bother replying.
Well considering I'm a white European person, even if I agree, people shame me and say, "You have it so easy, you're white" and "You'll never understand so stop trying" or "What would you know? You're the type of person that fits this criteria, stop pretending you care!". So in fact, what can I say? If I agree people go crazy because I 'have no experience', and when I try to put across a different point of view, which yes is to a different degree, but still something to consider, I'm apparently not "taking the discussion seriously" despite the fact I'm trying to progress it and understand what I can do to help. So actually the fact that I am a white European girl really does mean I can't say anything. At least not without being told I'm wrong whatever I say- so actually I'm being intentionally dismissed because I'm the 'desired' standard apparently. And trust me, I take these things extremely seriously.
And that's the shit I'm talking about that gets annoying. Because this question was clearly aimed at whites, why would I ask for y'alls opinions and then dismiss them? That makes no sense -_____-
Also, "you will never understand so stop trying", I wouldn't say that. The whole point I literally wrote all that crap of what non whites have been doing for YEARS, no CENTURIES, and still continues to this day is so white people can see why we feel the pressures of Eurocentric beauty standards! Why the fuck would I waste my time putting those, which there are still many more, I forgot to mention the white worship in Asian cultures, just to tell you "you don't understand, stop trying"? That shit makes no sense. I get it, there are some non whites quick to dismiss white people when it comes to discussions of racism and prejudice. In no way am I assuming you live the life of a queen because you fit the ideal. Of course you still face hardships. BUT you are dismissing the conversation with
.. those remarks. And it doesn't make sense to me, because the question presented itself is asking for y'alls opinions, and the details are to help y'all understand. Just because you won't experience them, doesn't mean you shouldn't hear about them This is to help y'all understand why we feel pressured. Why we feel ugly. And this is changing though, because I feel that the standards are being expanded at least a bit. Pale was the ideal, but now tanned skin is more accepted. Though not tan skin. And yes there's a difference.
What I'm saying is I'm putting my point across, but generally, it gets ignored or pushed off the table (with examples like I gave previously) because I'm the supposed 'ideal'. That's why I've given up trying to talk about things like this because people get angry because I'm trying to explain to you why I don't understand- because I'm the person this stuff caters for- and that I'm trying to put it across in a way that I can relate to. I'm trying to talk to you because you actually want to hear what I think. But I have to be careful because people (not you) go on the defensive when I talk about this stuff- because they think I don't care etc. I'm genuinely not trying to dismiss it. If I didn't care, I wouldn't have bothered replying. I'm trying to explain to you my side of it and understand yours. Most people who want this 'debate' as such, don't want white people to get involved, although I really don't understand why, because the only way to tackle these things is to work together.
There's honestly no denying it. Especially when little girls of color think they're ugly because they're brown or because they don't have blue eyes or because they don't have straight hair.
for sure. my grandma gets all up in my face when i come back from the beach tanned. she's like NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! BEING PALE IS SO IMPORTANTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT! and i'm like... yeah, but... the beach... :p
my hair is naturally wavy a little, but i straightened it too... but i did that because i think i just look more professional that way and i had a bunch of interviews at the time. my afro-caribbean friends wear weaves and have described their frustration with feeling "weird" with their natural hair. eurocentric ideals are real and will continue to persist.
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