Pro-natalism = They thinks having children is an important parts of life, may want some themselves and thinks it's morally right or beneficial to have some. They believes in the continuation of the human race, thinks it's both good to be born, have a family and thinks it's selfless to give birth to someone to take care of them. Some even claims having as many children as possible are a honorable duty or task.
Anti-natalism = They're not necessarily pro-abortion, but thinks it's good to avoid having children and beneficial for the humanity to die out naturally. They thinks it's a way to avoid all evilness and suffering in the world, arguing bringing another human being to existence without consent are both immoral and cruel. While they're against everyone having children, they often criticize families having inheritable diseases or have been born into poverty and war mostly for passing it on their children.
It's not uncommon for anti-natalists to be existential nihilists and atheists, and pro-natalists to be religious and seeing life as an enjoyable experience. There doesn't have to be a correlation with religion and the point of view though. #Kids#Antinatalist#Pronatalist#Natalism
As the proud and doting father of three, whose whole world lights up when I get home and I hear three little voices excitedly shouting, "DADDY!!!", and whose second job is "Official tickle monster," put me down for the natalist camp. This also taking account of the fact that, in the rather broad sweep of the question, to recall that the human race, for good or ill, would not be here were it not for the natalists, both conscious and unconscious.
Frankly, I am not sure of the provenance of this question. It appears to be the standard pro-life/pro-choice dichotomy tarted up in a broader framework. on the abortion question, I offer my views through my answer to this question: Are you pro-abortion or anti-abortion? ↗ My answer appearing as the MHO under my "Nightdrot" nom de guerre.
In the broader context of the question, however, the pro-natalist can also cite a certain - at least in general - generosity of spirit and ethic of self-sacrifice. Truth is, in pure economic terms, babies are almost all costs. They produce nothing in a material sense and consume resources that they had no part in producing.
Pure rationality - man as homo econimus - would have the human race slowly go extinct. Although actually, not even that is true. As places as diverse as China and the United States can attest, as the birthrate drops and the population ages, productivity declines, economic growth slows, future material wealth becomes harder to come by. Indeed, the welfare states that are the pride of so much of the world become insolvent as they are fewer taxpayers to pay in and more beneficiaries taking out.
Leaving that all aside, few things bring out the best in human beings. A willingness to sacrifice, to take pain for another human being for no obvious advantage, that sense, when they put your newborn in your arms for the first time of, "I just met you and yet I would throw myself in front of a train to protect you." There is, in being natalist a certain inherent if not conscious generosity of spirit and self-sacrifice that runs against every ounce of narcissism and selfishness that is so much otherwise a part of the human condition.
As to those who argue that more babies is more a strain on the world's resources, besides the economic arguments against that view noted above, there are the words of Sir Alistair Cooke, who said, “In the best of times, our days are numbered anyway. So it would be a crime against nature for any generation to take the world crisis so solemnly that it put off enjoying those things for which we were designed in the first place: the opportunity to do good work, to enjoy friends, to fall in love, to hit a ball, and to bounce a baby on our knee.”
I'm not necessarily an anti-natalist, mainly because I don't really care about other people or their situations.
But I am negatively utilitarian in my views and I do believe that having children is pretty much the most selfish thing a human being can do. For this reason, I hold parents inherently responsible for everything that happens to their offspring, and I feel strong disdain for those parents who expect any sort of courtesy or obligation to them from their offspring in return.
We've similar views. I also thinks it's up to people if they wants to have children or not, but that these ones choosing to have some should be able to take care of them and that children doesn't need to love their parents if they doesn't treat them well. I think it's worse if someone gets a child into a war zone or extreme poverty than into a good and happy middle class in Europe.
Pro-Natalist. I never understood why people think that somehow people who want to have a good number of kids are somehow problematic people for bringing children into this world and contributing to the overpopulation.
First off, most people who talk about adoption, don't do it themselves. Secondly when I looked around choices for adoption of kids, I came across social media posts concerning childless parents who wanted to adopt, I discovered why many of them hesitated to do so and adoption isn't as easy as those people tell you that it is. There are even true cases of a couple legally adopting children from their poor parents but a few years later the original parents showed up because they want their kids back. No kidding. No one gonna come to my house and want my kids back if I got my own biological kids. I want to have my own biological kids, but in any case that I can't, either because of infertility or never getting married to begin with I would adopt children.
Also, kids don't always remain kids. They are the ones who will grow up and become the next generation that will run the world! We already had the millennials that are a whole generation raised poorly by their baby boomer parents. After this we need a new generation that must not turn out like the millennials. People have become so pessimistic about parenting, it's saddening.
And I'm not very worried about the finances. You don't need a money to live stably and sustainably. Your living costs will reduce the moment you get rid of the consumerism mindset.
For the most part, anti-natalism seems to resonate my views towards childbirth, hence making me part of the minority who does not intend to have children. However, I do not openly discourage others from having children, as I find it futile to compel others to abstain from parenthood, particularly if it is their prerogative of having such. I acknowledge others' decision of venturing into parenthood as long as parental obligations are fulfilled without contravention of human rights.
I am somehow repulsed with the idea of natalism, particularly if this would not be anchored with readiness of all sorts on the part of the parents— financial readiness (for parents to sustain expenditures and to invest in their childrens' education), mental readiness (for parents to raise level-headed children), and physical readiness (for parents to ensure that children would be physically healthy).
I would say I'm in the middle. I don't think having kids is the moral thing to do or against moral. It's ok if people want to have 10 kids but they are not better or honorable in my eyes for doing so. Same way, someone that doesn't have kids to avoid their suffering aren't better for me as I don't see beign alive as a suffering that must be avoided.
When it comes to society, over population is a problem, but lack of newborns and youth it's also a problem. There should be a balance. So I'm not pro or anti natalism, and I believe people shouldn't be forced to have or not have kids, and they can all hold the idiology they want as long as they don't impose it to me. I'll have kids, but I won't have a lot.
I believe you should only have children if you can give them a good life. It's wrong that people who can barely feed themselves choose to have kids. Similarly why would anyone bring kids into a war zone or where they'll have a miserable life. The human race doesn't need to die off but it does need pruned back a little.
Have the human race die out? Wow. Nihilism. My parents gave me and my brother a chance and a good start. I tried to give my son the same and I hope he chooses to share his love with another person and maybe have a child or two. It's paying it forward. And aiming to make things better every time around. Everyone doesn't have to have children. But children help make the world go round. I had a great childhood. I wish that for every c hild born everywhere.
I'm not pro- or anti- any movement I've never heard of, off the bat. I can't identify with either. I fully support any family that wants children and support those that choose not to. I believe that only those who want to be parents should become parents. Unwanted children live a lifetime of grief and cost society dearly. People who pressure others to have children that they don't want harm everyone, especially the parents and children.
0
0 Reply
Anonymous
(25-29)
+1 y
I'd say neither. For some people having children might be important, whereas for other people not so much. I understand both sides and I'm not judging them. I don't see why we need to have a name/label for everything. That's one of the main problems of our society
I'm never commenting on your questions again, CuriousNorway, because you always thumb down my comments, without any explanation. It's a bit unfair, because I'm always polite and spend time writing my answers
I've not down voted you and I've never done it. Just because of you've a blue thumb down doesn't mean it's me. There's other people who's down voting everyone here.
I definitely all in the pro category. I love love love life and would be so honored to have the opportunity to reproduce with someone who I love and is married to.
0
0 Reply
Anonymous
(25-29)
+1 y
There was once a famous anti-natalist that led a childfree movement, nominally for the sake of avoiding overpopulation. He quickly realized that all his members were people who werent going to have children regardless. Theodore Kaczynski was right about these types.
Two at most are best and 1 at Least is somewhat good. Wherever this falls , I'm that type of person. Maybe my wife's wish is not included so it may change with her wish 🙄😌
Most Helpful Opinions