Would you support the right to shoot these attackers?

[lightbulb27]

If the woman inside the house had a gun, and shot all 4 the attackers, would you support her right to do so?

And some of you want to restrict gun rights and magazines? There's 4 attackers, it would take a lot of rounds to take them out.

I don't want to hear about issues about accidentally hitting her husband, or errant bullets. Question is does she have a right to blast the attackers?

https://www.foxnews.com/us/connecticut-man-fights-off-4-men-attempted-carjacking-suspects-flee#spark_wn=1

I'd defend her right to shoot

No, she'd have to warn them first and give them first chance at a shot

Reserving judgement

[WhiteSteve]

I don’t think any piece of property is worth someone’s life or serious injury, not for the owner or the thieves.

This dude here is actually a fucking dumbass. You’re required to have your car insured, so the odds that this thing just got dropped off in his driveway that morning and he hadn’t put in the paperwork yet are extremely slim, and thus, the car is protected, ultimately.

Mistake #1 is this dude didn’t check his ego. He likely decided on some level that “that car belongs to me, and I’d be less of a man if I allowed another person to take it from me”, and that is just a highly flawed line of thought. This is one of my main reasons I don’t love a lot of people out there walking around armed, the gun emboldens you to be more confrontational or aggressively responsive over dumb shit that usually boils down to ego more than right or wrong.

This guy, however…. look…I respect the honor of fighting with your hands, I endorse the hell out of that…but not in robbery situations. Box your way out of a corner and run, or in this guy’s case, stay the hell in your house and just get that call into the cops for your insurance claim. Forget the car, the car is gone. Such are possessions in life; easy come, easy go. Insurance will get you another one, and you can get the black one this time if you had buyer’s remorse with the red. (Buddy of mine was gifted a new Acura by his parents when we were like 18 or 19, he didn’t like the color, and he left it unlocked with the keys in it overnight in the grimiest area of Boston he could think of, lmfao, and he got a new one in the color he wanted🤦‍♂️😂)

But this dude came out empty-handed, like the car thief is just gonna shoot him a fair one in the driveway, lmao. Also, why would you think he’d be alone? You think he drove himself there and parked down the block, and he’ll come back later for it? Walked? Took an Uber? Nah, of course there are 1-3 others in a nearby car watching out for shit to go sideways. Dude got off light, all considered. But it’s his bad. Well, it’s those guys’ collective bad for trying to steal his car, but after that, that’s his bad, use your head, that’s like a 17 Awareness rating in Madden, lmao. We need to change the way we live and view life if we’re willing to die over a sport sedan, YIKES.

[lightbulb27]

I wouldn't attack them either for the unknown risks, but assuming insurance addresses the problems is false.
I know of quite a few examples of people around me that lost their possessions and they had to pay for them. In some cases, they lost their kids strapped in the car... the ones I know got their kids back, can't assume they will. Some examples: Insurance has deductibles, insurance will only pay for the first catalytic converter theft... none after... and they are expensive, you only get the replacement value for the car so the homeowner ends up losing $ each time,
Ask yourself how that family develops a sense of security and how much fear they live in going forward. Many people around me have gone through the same, their Kia's being stolen or ransacked. Lastly some cars stolen get crashed, like it's intentional. These thieves cause accidents, destroy property, and injur people... and pay no consequences if they are under age. That... is bad as peoples work and lives are being impacted.

Lastly, are we really valuing he lives of these crooks by letting them damage others lives rather than catching (either by shooting or otherwise) and correcting them? I'd say no, we are devaluing their lives and those they prey upon.

[WhiteSteve]

I don’t know, I still say the car isn’t worth the risk of your life. I think it’s additionally complicated that, to ourselves or those who care about us, our lives are of the utmost importance, and that clouds our vision from the reality (in my opinion) that, in a vacuum, all life on planet Earth has an absolute value of|0|. None of us matter a lick, we’re a dime a dozen, and our personal actions, good or bad, do nothing to change that. I feel like we lose sight of this in our own self-importance.

[lightbulb27]

humm... I'm not so sure about that belief system. I think our lives do matter, when we make them matter. That may even be the purpose of life.
We are a dime a dozen, agree. The harvest is great, the workers though... are few. Even I fail often and I ask for strength to be better.
* I agree those lives are important, but as well, they are not only worthless as is, but hazardous to others. They are destructive humans.
* Humans need correction and guidance. Without it, they can be destructive as locusts... or worse.

[zagor]

BS. It was the thieves who decided their lives were worth less than that car. Your way of thinking is why you can't park your car in much of SF without getting your windows smashed.

[WhiteSteve]

@zagor Well, that’s complicated, because the problem didn’t just start with someone’s decision to steal a car. Rather than just car thieves, what needs to be resolved is what kind of conditions or circumstances lead people into stealing cars. No one seems to want to do the heavy lifting for that, but it needs to be done, not just some low-energy, lazy-thought resolution of just waiting to see who fucks up and remove them from the population. Just lmfao @ that whole concept. Prison has been around for centuries, and I’m pretty sure there was some variation of it in early America, as the concept pre-dates the United States. So I don’t think the threat of punishment is anywhere near the deterrent that people seem to think it is, crime still happens all the time.

Not for nothing, but not to open a whole other can of worms, but I’d already contend we’re over-concerned with “street crime” and under-concerned with “corporate crime”, which actually might have most of us in much worse positions than we need to be in since those go largely unchecked. But let’s not even start on that here, lmao.

[WhiteSteve]

@zagor Anyway, I think the common denominators are poverty and psychological trauma in most cases. That would mean it’s preventable, if our society does right. Im not entirely sure how to handle the already-damaged, who’s past the point of return and who just needs a hug and a job opportunity. That’s tricky, but I don’t think the answer is just “lock ‘em up.” Life is nuanced and can’t be solved with black-and-white answers like that. Shit, the way things are today, those dudes might even have jobs and are still having to resort to theft to make ends meet. It wouldn’t excuse doing it, but I think stealing cars is probably pretty hairy, you don’t want to be hitting licks like that regularly, you’d get locked up your first few months.

Also…. this is supposed to be a nation of laws, right? Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, all that? I understand this guy is being caught red-handed, but still, no judge would give him the death penalty for this crime. Judges are chosen to be impartial and apply the law fairly. The owner of a car that’s being stolen is emotional and highly partial, so why should they logically be permitted to sentence someone to death on the spot? In addition to being plainly psychotic, that whole logic just doesn’t hold up. Even in the oldest civilizations that we call barbaric in the modern Western World, the penalty for theft was getting your hand cut off, and most of us view those people as savages by today’s standards.

[WhiteSteve]

I hear ya, I guess I just take a more macro view of it. I don’t believe humans to be the most important existence on Earth, I don’t value us any higher than a snow leopard or a fire ant or a bluefin tuna. Fumbling for a quick a sloppy analogy here, but I feel like humans are in our own Truman Show in a sense, only there’s no audience watching us, yet we still hold the belief that the fabricated reality we live within is true. Obviously everything occurring is tangible and real, but the overall “show” isn’t at all what we think it is to the Earth’s existence.

[zagor]

I do see your point to an extent; recently there have been 3 well-publicized shootings where people thought they were protecting themselves from a) someone who knocked on the wrong door, b) someone who was turning around in someone's driveway and c) someone who got in the wrong car (something I almost did 2 days ago). So I disagree with the Florida/Texas pols who seem to think everyone should walk around with guns all the time, and that teachers should be armed. But a lot of people who are committing crimes, I would say most, are not at the end of their rope and desperate to survive - they just want fast money with minimal effort. And tbh, some just like the excitement. I doubt the flash mobs robbing stores in Chicago and L. A. were doing it to feed their families.

[lightbulb27]

@zagor fascinating these stories are coming to light or happening. Guns without restraint.. e. g. God, or valuing the human life, is a problem. There has to be a moral code inside the human to value the other life. It doesn't mean you have to value them more than yourself, although some Christians/Buddhists might. Just opening the heart to value the other removes that risk. People living in fear of an invasion... will result in mass deaths.
this issue is as old as the hills... it's just human emotions. We thus, must begin reprogramming the hearts again to love, joy, peace, happiness, contentment, self control... ahemm... we can start with Jesus of N and go from there.
That said, if someone is attacking my wife at her car, I protect her. They are still wrong.
It does raise the impetus to help those whom ask for help in a peaceful way, I think we can all grow in compassion, for most people I've run into, are reasonable humans. Compassion is the way out of this.

[lightbulb27]

Steve... what? If someone is attacking my wife and cousins baby at the car, I cannot assume he has good intentions. If he won't leave when challenged, then there is an issue. Baby could get killed in a second. The problem is time... we'd be in our "stress" minds. If it can be slowed down to a peaceful discussion of "needs", then we can have coffee/tea and talk to the criminal. But these thugs don't care about life, they want what they want, they are poorly disciplined children grown up. They will get shot dead like the others. Most of my high school class was dead after 25 year reunion because of this training in hopelessness and poor discipline. Only salvation for these kids is: Christ, or the military, prison, or death.

[Aerissa_Jade]

Insurance won't actually get you a new car, they only pay out the value, which for many means (If they bought it new) that they still owe on a loan for a car that was totaled or stolen.

Plus any valuables you may have that can't be replaced. Insurance often doesn't cover customizations to a car, like glow lights or other add ones. They only cover basic things.

I know cause my car what totaled when a guy rear-ended me and I got screwed over by the insurance.

It helps, but not as good as people think it does. I do think laws need to be changed to make insurance replace your vehicle, not just say... here is what it is worth and leave you worse off than before.

[lightbulb27]

@Aerissa_Jade Agree. coverage for my stolen motorcycle was really good... as long as I had proof, they paid me for the extra parts. but cars seem to get the shaft and have to fight with adjusters, an often losing battle.

[Aerissa_Jade]

@lightbulb27 That is the thing, if I KNEW I would get another car, of equal or better quality, same make, year, etc... I'd probably let the thieves have it, IF no one was in danger.

It is actually insurance laws that make me more likely to shoot someone.

My worse fear though would be they drive it like shit, hitting pot holes, jumping over bumps, major damage to suspension and other components, then abandon it and it gets recovered and police say we found it at this impound lot, come get it out of impound and you have to pay to get it out.

Now there is thousands of dollars of damage that aren't necessarily visible to see, treated more like maintenance issues from bad driving. I know of no car insurance that will fix an alignment job for you, if someone hits a pot hole hard, or repair tie rods or other damaged components, even if thieves did the damage.

I'd rather the thieves lose their lives than I have to pay for that. They are the ones who made the choice, not me. The life of a thief is worth zero to me. They deserve to die.

Yes I do know someone who's car was found and he had to pay $500 or so for towing fees and to get it out of the impound lot and his insurance did not cover any of that.

[lightbulb27]

@Aerissa_Jade I know someone that happened to, trashed car, it's a mess. Theives trashed my motorcycle years ago... total trashed. No consquences... and get a load of these videos, if you aren't up to date on how kids are being trained in school...
it's the lack of consequences that's the problem.
Shoot a kid though, save bullet for self. The balance of power is off.

Spot on... in every video, we're trained a generation to not undersatnd punishment... have to take over the schools!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBacUz2e5HQ&t=664s

[Lliam]

I'd absolutely support the right to gun them down once they began attacking.
Nothing gives me more joy than watching videos of pieces of shit like that getting ventilated.
Punks like that are more afraid of armed citizens than they are of getting caught by the police. More of them need to be put down by armed citizens. And it should be perfectly legal to do so.

[lightbulb27]

Here here, so right!

[Aerissa_Jade]

Absolutely, I would support her in doing so. Simply watching while calling the police, they could kill him in the meantime.

Then if you live rural like I do, police are over an hour away... then what?

I'm sure some liberal is going to suggest, that her husband should of let them have the car to avoid getting hurt or killed. That's liberal logic though, back off and let criminals get away with it.

The option to shoot from the house, if you have a open window or run out front to get closer to shoot, if you don't necessarily trust yourself at that range with all the movement, might be the better option but either way I support it.

Criminals do not have a right to not be shot while in the act of a dangerous crime.

[lightbulb27]

I agree, take sniper position inside and take them out if a good shot.
LOL... someone in that video, I think the police, recommended not engaging the criminal because they could be armed and people get hurt. They said they've had a lot more of these and nationally.
Scumbag liberals destroying the country, I have no problem calling them out. I can only hope and pray these people were liberals and this will help change their thinking.
Can see how fearless these thugs are anymore... thug could have run, but didn't, chose to fight. Why, there are no consequences and likely rewards. If the homeowner makes a bad move and kills him, he can get "the big payout" in court like so many others. It's win win for the criminals.
#SendLiberalsToTheirOwnIsland

[Aerissa_Jade]

Chances are those first shot or two, hit or miss... one could hope the thugs would run off at that point when they realize what is going on.

I hear you though, when criminals can break and enter, sue a home owner because they got hurt in the process and win, that is stupid asf.

[Agape93]

Absolutely. Kill them all. You lost your right to life the moment you threatened mine.

[Surely]

I think that public whipping should be brought back. If you commit a crime against someone. The victim should be allowed to give the first few cracks of the whip or cane to the offender.
Providing that they were not shot first.

[lightbulb27]

I support that idea. This country doesn't have the guts for that right now, especially for select colors. But we could make such people foreign dignitaries to Singapore. When they throw their trash on the ground as they are trained to do, then they learn the discipline.

[TheUniqueOne96]

Yep.

I'm from the UK, so guns aren't really much of a thing here, but from what I understand, they're for self defense in the US and a situation like that, completely calls for it.

[Dargil]

If the woman inside the house had a gun, and shot all 4 the attackers, would you support her right to do so?

i would buy her ammunition.

[ObscuredBeyond]

Make them phosphorus rounds. One shot, and the attacker bursts into flames! Bring Hell upon this house, you burn in it!

[LiamJHayden]

It is easy to say "just let them take the car" but in the moment one does not really know if that is all they will do. In a 4-1 I'll just assume they mean to do me mortal harm and proceed accordingly.

[Avicenna]

Absolutely. A person's life is at risk when attacked by four criminals.

[exitseven]

An extra ten points for every one that you kill.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

I'm all for killing criminal p. o. s. especially the ones that attack others with force.

[Anonymous]

The rights of criminals are protected more than those of law abiding citizens.

[ShadezMcgee]

Weapons free, honey. Take em out.

[Anonymous]

Absolutely 100% shoot to kill all 4.

[Opinion Owner]

Futhermore I completely agree that fully automatic weapons with extended magazines, even big hundred round drums etc are totally legitimate for home defence, because those guys could all have had guns and you DO have a right to defend not just yourself but other people AND PROPERTY.

The long and the short of it is that when those guys attacked that man on his property that was a declaration of war and at that point they should have no expectations of any kind of protection, I would be completely happy for them to have been fired on even while fleeing.

It is completely obvious that the best thing those 4 guys will ever do for society is go into a hole in the ground and the sooner the better.

There is absolutely no argument what so ever which can justify or excuse their behaviour, they know with complete certainty that what they are doing is totally wrong and they would not tolerate the same thing being done to them.

Frankly I am surprised that you guys don't have full autos and rpgs, I wouldn't give a shit if that road looked like the fucking Somme in an effort to waste those degenerates, those cunts need dead. The guy driving behind, the neighbours, everyone should have been unloading into those motherfuckers.

[lightbulb27]

I'll only say collateral damage is a real issue I consider, I don't want to shoot my neighbors by accident or passer by. But I agree with your points in general, this is a revolution from within the USA, promoted by the left/progressive/liberals, and the areas that do deploy RPG's and torch the criminals... and defend the home owners, is the area I will move into, as I'll protect my neighbors.
The only hope for this kids is religious, finding Christ/crucifiction of the heart... else they will be what they were trained to be, independent gods of destruction.
I blame ourselves, the real war was to stop the left from promoting destruction... that war is ongoing.