I'm against multiculturalism. Does that shock you? And you, are you for or against multiculturalism?

[Julie4]

[KostasKouvalis]

A little bit, because from what I gathered from some of your other posts, you seemed more like a moderate progressive to me, and you never seemed nationalistic and you're always praising the U. S. And when we were talking about your Spanishness, you said, "I AM FRENCH!" So you seemed like someone who believes nationality is more important than ethnicity. So in your eyes, what makes someone "French"?

And this is where you and I differ, because I think ethnicity is more important. For example, I consider the black/mixed people in your overseas departments French by nationality, but not by culture or ethnicity. I wouldn't even consider Alsace people and Corsicans as true French.

But when you have such strange geography and colonized so many places, it's impossible not to have multiculturalism, and most people in France think it's good you don't ask for your racial demographics. If it was up to ME, France would be entirely White, but that ended centuries ago. Multiculturalism has been woven into the fabric of French society for quite a while. You've had blacks and Arab Muslims for decades, so there's nothing you can really do about it. And based on your views, if they were born in France, they're French. I know many non-"White" people get upset if you don't consider them French, even if they were born there. Which once again leads to the question of, "What to you makes someone "French"?

I live in a very multicultural society myself, and I sort of agree with Poppy's answer. In terms of the U. S., I think unity IS strength as long as you're uniting with the RIGHT people." So as someone who's fascinated with travel and other cultures, I love that I can experience cultures I might never get to experience, without leaving my borders. And for someone like my dad who has no passport, this is the only opportunity for him to experience foreign cultures. Also, I saw your post of the Buddhist temple. So I don't think you hate multiculturalism, as long as it's a decent culture. I think like me, you hate immigrants from shitty third world countries who cause crime, leech off the system and don't assimilate. Or even people who are born here but still have one foot in their ancestral motherland.

I'll admit, I'm a bit of a hypocrite because I love experiencing other cultures in my own country, but when I travel somewhere, I want to experience the culture of THAT place, so I don't really want to see multiculturalism, even if it's part of that society. I might make exceptions for places like Dubai. But even in South America, I don't like that there's so much German stuff. If it's a culture I'm not particularly I want to see White people, but of it's a culture I like, I wanna experience it at it's most pure😂 So I don't want to see any White people even from other countries. I was annoyed because I went to Greece to get away from Polish people and was surrounded by Polish people😂 The Russians in Turkey were even more irritating😂

The only minorities I'll always seem to make an exception for are Indian girls, as I'm somewhat infatuated/obsessed, and have a soft spot for them. I loved that there were so many of them in Kauai. And in Rome for instance, I despised the Africans, but because I wasn't particularly fond of the Italians either, I was actually happy there were so many Indian girls😂 So Indian girls are the one minority I'll make an exception for😂

[KostasKouvalis]

Indian and FRENCH😂

[Julie4]

You're right, it's a fundamental difference between the two of us. I don't have an ethnic definition of a nation.

The great French Monarchist historian Jacques Bainville wrote in his book on the history of France: "The fusion of races began in prehistoric times. The French people is a compound. It's better than a race. It is a nation. "

Michelet would write in the 19th century, "England is an empire, Germany a country, a race; France is a person."

France is an assemblage of different peoples, Celts, Germans, etc., to which were added the Romans and finally the Franks, who dominated the whole politically. France was an artificial creation of these kings, who gradually conquered regions either militarily or through marriage. For example, Lyon and Burgundy had absolutely nothing to do with France, and had very distinct cultures. The conquerors, the kings of France, assimilated these regions, or at least tried to, by forcing them, for example, to dress in the French style, but at the same time allowed these different regions to retain an aspect of their own cultures. That's why the French regions are so rich and different, whether in terms of food or other aspects.

A humorist added "You take the most ungovernable people in the world, you mix them together and you get France" 🤣

[Julie4]

That's why a French writer once wrote about France

"France is the garden of Europe. Through the Rhone valley, France opens onto Italy; through those of the Moselle and Rhine, we are in Germany. Roussillon is Spanish, Provence is a composite of Greek cities and Roman municipalities; Lorraine is a miniature of the German Empire, where French and Germans are intimately intertwined. Toulouse is a half-successful Rome; in the Capitol, the city's archives were kept in an iron cabinet, like Roman flames. Normandy is another England; nestling in the heart of the plateau of the two Sevres, which used to be called Little Holland, La Rochelle believed itself to be an Amsterdam, of which Coligny would have been the William of Orange, before Richelieu laid siege to it and brought it down; the flat country of northern France is the same as that of Ypres, Ghent and Bruges. The Breton language is of the Celtic family, like Irish Gaelic. And as for the Basque who has seen," says Michelet, "all the nations pass before him, he doesn't even care to know when he was born. "

[KostasKouvalis]

That honestly sounds like such a French thing to do😂
You aren't wrong that there is no such thing as a "French ethnicity". So what kind of multiculturalism is it that you hate?

[Julie4]

Oh, what seems so French?

France is a nation defined by its culture, and the foreigners we welcome have very different histories, cultures and mores. That's why multiculturalism is a problem.

That's why we need controlled immigration, and why we need to assimilate those we accept, and if they don't assimilate, we need to kick them out.

In the old days, that was the French system.

[KostasKouvalis]

So what would you consider "French culture"?

[Julie4]

French culture is a way of living in society based on a particular conception of secularism, where religion must be discreet. It's also a way of dressing, its gastronomy, its architecture, its history and, of course, its language. It's a way of seeing the world that has its roots in Christianity, and that goes all the way back to the philosophers of the Enlightenment and the ideals of the French Revolution.

A foreigner who wants to become French must assimilate to all of these. For example, a foreigner from Mali, well, if he's really assimilated, he'll forget his country's traditional clothing, polygamy or Malian heroes, and adopt the French heroes...

[KostasKouvalis]

I see. Forgetting polygamy is fine, but why should he forget his traditional clothing and history? I mean, he should dress French, of course, but expecting him to completely erase and forget ALL traces of his heritage is wrong. Like I was born in the U. S., but there are still many aspects of Polish culture I take pride in. Does that make me less American?

Also, I'll admit that I tend to equate "multi'cultural" with "multi-racial", even though they aren't necessarily related.

[Julie4]

The history of the USA is different. Assimilation doesn't mean total oblivion of one's original culture, but rather the abandonment of a part of oneself, one's roots, to adopt the customs, lifestyle, history and way of thinking of one's new homeland. It's an imperative hierarchy of belonging and cultural norms.

In short, you can keep a certain level of your native culture, but in a discreet way, and you must consider that the great heroes of French history, for example, are also your heroes.

[KostasKouvalis]

Okay, that's fair enough. Like you said, "French" is also a mentality and way of life.

[Julie4]

This assimilation is something very difficult, even for Europeans who came to France, let me give you a concrete example.

Between the end of the 19th and the beginning of the 20th century, France welcomed around 3 million Italians, and we sent 2 million back because they weren't assimilated.

[KostasKouvalis]

Oh Lord. I'm not surprised. Italians belief they have the greatest culture on earth.
We didn't sent ours back, but there was a lot of discrimination. Now, I don't know how the Italians 100 years ago were, but if they were anything like today's Italians, then I'm honestly not surprised you guys deported yours, and we discriminated against ours.

[Julie4]

Well, to be honest, Italian culture is exceptional lol

[Lliam]

I definitely see the problem with countries whose cultures evolved over centuries and whose people are rather homogeneous, such as in Europe. I don't think they should embrace multiculturalism.

The USA, however, has always been a country of immigrants from all over the world. I love the rich diversity.

A big problem within the U. S. arose with the foundation of Israel. Now we have dual citizens serving in government who are more loyal to Israel than to their home country, the USA. That should not be allowed.

It's fine for people to celebrate their heritage, foods and traditions, and even to form communities like China Town, Little Saigon, Korea Town, Little Italy, ... Mexicans, Swedes, Germans, Russians, Irish, Indians, Middle Easterners, etc., etc. But citizens need to have one loyalty.

[KatherineJ]

I don’t believe any society can long survive without assimilation to a point. However, it’s also important to take the best of any particular culture and meld it into society. If that makes sense?

[Anonymous]

I'm against it if it causes cultures and norms to mix in my own society and affect our lifestyle, but if each nation live their own culture within their borders, I have no issue with it.

[RavVid]

No, I remember you explaining the French view on this and it seemed quite reasonable to me.

There are some aspects of some cultures which are simply unacceptable such as endemic sexual abuse.

One demand Australia makes is baggage is left at the airport. It is no surprise I expect that with Gaza there may be sections in Australia that aren't happy with each other. Peaceful protests are OK but violent protests or incitement to violence is not OK.

Mostly we don't make that many demands on immigrants but if they don't consider themselves Australians why did they come here is a question people do ask.

If you want to live under Shari law than obviously Australia, France, US, UK and many others with judeo-christian liberal law system are not a good choice to settle in quite simply.

Multi-culturalism cannot go so far as to invalidate the fundamental rights in an immigrant country yet some immigrant groups appear to want to.

[Soteris]

Does not shock me in particular, many people are against multiculturalism. What shocks me is, why? When looking through human history the one theme that always follows national success is multiculturalism where as monoculturalism is generally linked to stagnation and the death of nations. As such, I find it the height of irony when "Patriots" themselves always appear to support monoculturlism when that is literally the biggest threat to their own country.

[Julie4]

That's why assimilation exists: with controlled immigration, foreigners can be assimilated into the culture of the host country, while their cultures of origin add another nuance to our complex culture.

[Soteris]

You know that is pretty much nonsense right?

[Julie4]

Just because you don't understand it doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.

[Soteris]

What you just said is intentionally ambiguously vague to mean either actual multiculturalism or just monoculturalism which again is what often leads to the death of nations. Considering it has such a huge spread of meanings, most of which is contradictory, it becomes virtually meaningless itself.

[RyanEC]

Something you and Thaïs have in common
even if you don’t have all mutual views.


But I agree I hate that France and the rest of Europe is heading down the same road as America with immigration and multiculturalism.


The death of Lola Daviet, the attack in Arras recently are caused by multiculturalism.

[Julie4]

I think it's slightly different for the United States, because their history and culture aren't the same, and the U. S. has a long history of welcoming different cultures, even if a significant proportion of the immigrants it welcomed were European.

I'm in favor of assimilation. I don't believe, at least not in my country, that we can coexist with several cultures that have different values, cultures and histories. That's why we need controlled immigration.

[RyanEC]

But I think asking non French people to assimilate is like asking them to pretend to be French.

[KostasKouvalis]

I read about the Lola one, and I wouldn't blame that one on multiculturalism. You know how many White people have done similar things to children?

The Arras attack was definitely multiculturalism though

[Julie4]

Why would they be fake French? Anyone pretending to assimilate would be too conspicuous, because assimilation is demanding.

Alfred Grosser was a center-left German refugee who came to France at the age of 8. His father had served as a medical officer in the German army. In a lecture, he says "WE" when referring to the French army. And he says: "I thought, as I continued to speak: Assimilation fully successful. Joan of Arc is my great-grandmother, Napoleon my grandfather and Goethe a great foreign writer."

[love_conquers_lust]

I’m for cultures that don’t subjugate women or oppress them-US, Canada, Europe, Australia. Places like India, Middle East, Africa, many parts of Asia can stay put until they fix that in their own borders. Call me a xenophobe, I’ll retort with they’re gynophobes. Xenophobe implies I’m so scared I won’t even learn about them leading to prejudice. I’m not enslaving women out of fear they might learn to drive a car or vote.

[Guanfei]

Against. It never works. A multicultural society is just a multiconflictual society.

At some point, one of the cultures will try to take over the rest. Especially when one really different. We see it in Europe, and seeing everyone trying to make it work when it obviously doesn't work is beyond retarded.

[purplepoppy]

I think it's like seasoning food, a little sprinkling can improve a dish but too much ruins it.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

I'm 100% against it too.

Multiculturalism inherently just brings about conflict eventually as one culture always trying to impose their culture and way of life upon another especially the naives.

Everyone has their country, let your culture stay there where it belongs.

[Hanrej]

Against.

I don't mind other peoples culture but I don't believe a society works well if it's expected to cater to different peoples needs. Aside from that there are lots of conflicts and discrimination when you introduce multiculture into a society. No one could claim discrimination in a monocultured society.

[AviatorTom]

@purplepoppy said it perfectly.

Interesting that there is no US flag in the picture, considering that the US is a nation of people from all kinds of cultures.

[petera1987]

So is Australia. In fact, it's far more multicultural.

[AviatorTom]

@petera1987 4th flag from the left, 3rd row down... isn't that the Aussie flag?

[petera1987]

Yes, it is.

[FreyaRed]

I like multiculturalism of enemies. It destabilizes their society and culture so it makes them weaker and easier to eliminate.

[Mansearching]

If we don't have it, we'd be like Iceland. We might end up marring our cousins. Iceland has to do blood tests not to test for disease, its to test if you're related.

Does anyone here want to marry their relatives?

[exitseven]

I am okay with it, just don't shove it down my throat.

[zagor]

In what sense?

If you mean inviting huge numbers of people from another culture into your country, and then adapting YOUR standards to fit THEM, then I agree with you.

[slatyb]

What do you mean by that? You don't like interacting with people different from yourself?

[DarkLegacy]

Where it impacts upon my countries own culture and identity which it has done so the yes.

[Dargil]

I believe in E Pluribus Unum. Not E Unum Pluribus.

[petera1987]

Why would it shock anyone? Multiculturalism has been shown to not work, so it's only natural to be against it.

[Anonymous]

I'm an Indian, and as an Indian we respect diversity and their uniqueness.

[KostasKouvalis]

🤣🤣🤣🤣 You're joking, right?

[Opinion Owner]

What is joke in this? It's been our history. We have welcomed Jews even with respect and given them place when all other countries were discriminating them. India is now home land for many religions many cultures. Each state has there own culture and we do enjoy them all and we feel them all as our part. What is joke?

[gorydetails]

Did you see even Henry Kissinger state that multiculturalism was a huge mistake?

[Jennz6]

The United States 🇺🇸 is multi cultural

[Julie4]

I know haha.

[Jennz6]

Your profile says that you are from the USA? You don’t like it here?

[Julie4]

I'm not American but French. When I registered on the site from the mobile app, they told me I lived in the USA, so I can't change it from the app.

[Jennz6]

I would love to see Paris

[Julie4]

Haha , well considering how Paris has become you might be extremely disappointed lol.

[Iron_Man]

What has it become now?

[Anonymous]

No. I’m against it too. It doesn’t work.

[jahaims]

No, I already knew ignorant people like you exist.

[MaxUsefull]

Kinda against it

[Anonymous]

Somehow that’s not surprising

[Anonymous]

I’m all for it