Should President Trump have refused to give up power to begin with?

[Anonymous]

Yes

No

[smne35]

If I was Trump I get on my plane in a minute. I took off sky right in the air to all you who are against me. Bye and go buy me a island and just living peace man but he didn't doing that. He's fighting to preserve his reputation slanders man. I mean how much more can a man take when you got your government attacking you citizens attacking you in all your trying to do is do good help them build up America cuz he loves his country. I wouldn't take all that but that just goes to show kind of man he is and I ain't rallying for the guy. But from what I have known and I know of the man, he's a decent man. I can't say that about what's running the country. Now we need to take this country and our government back and we need to let them know that don't matter if your Democratic Republican or whatever you want to call yourself. Your job when you elected is to work together for the betterment of this country. Us in this country not up there. Fighting and arguing him. Acting silly because of your own views. Share your views. That's what you're there for. Help each other. Help this country help us become stronger. One nation one people not dividing us like they're doing now. Categorizing everybody and the way to go man. We got to get everybody over 65 out of there. Go to retirement home. I mean you and your '70s '80s '90s 300-year-old the hell you doing in there man for retire go fishing. There's a lot of good politicians in this country in this government but these older ones man they got to go vote them out. Let him know it's time for you to get out of DC man then. It's so damn long you got real roots growing up growing up your ass man. You guys got to go and you guys just destroying s*** try to relive the old 1800s or 1890s. Whatever man and so are you s*** you want everybody else to retire by 65 whatever your ass still there at 205 that's arrogant man. This is America. We don't do arrogance and our government. We do justice for the people so get the hell out and go to a retirement home. Anyway, I hate talking politics

[NamerOfStars]

Of course not- he lost the election, fair and square. While he didn't accept it with good grace, he also didn't act like a toddler and order the troops out. We don't need more immaturity in people with nuclear weapons; we have too much already.

[Anonymous]

No! I want Biden to win again. I want America to turn into a steaming pile of shit.

[sawno]

He didn't refuse that now did he? Pointing out the blatant oddities in the election and advocating to get it checked and fixed is not the same as refusing to give up power. Because at the end of the day he still left office calmly when required to. Did he summon the army? No. Did he prevent biden from entering? No. Did he obstruct the administration itself? No. But did he believe he lost the election? Also no, so he used his rights well within his means.

[goaded]

Did he organise people to pretend to be electoral college voters for him? Yes. Did he pressure officials to lie for him? Yes. Did he summon an armed mob and send it to the Capitol? Yes. Did he know he'd lost the election? Yes.

[sawno]

@goaded Evidence required for pretty much all of these.

[goaded]

Read the Jan 6 committee report, or wait for the trials.

[sawno]

@goaded I do not consider the Jan 6 committee to be a neutral body so I purposefully do not follow them.

[sawno]

But if there is particular unedited evidence from those trials feel free to link those separately.

[Asker]

nothing more American than spelling organize with an S

[sawno]

Neither of us are American, but from the looks of it both versions are correct.

[supercutebutt]

@sawno You are a "special" individual to be both foreign and in the Trump cult.

[sawno]

@supercutebutt Foreingers sometimes understand your country better than locals do. I follow American news almost daily.

[goaded]

@sawno You have heard of the fake electors, haven't you? There have been multiple indictments. You've heard the Raffensperger phone call, haven't you? You saw Jan 6, didn't you? Tell me how they'd have been there anyway if Trump hadn't called them and told them the election was stolen.

[sawno]

@goaded The protest was an obvious blunder. But you did not just say that he summoned a protest which is in his rights. You say armed as if a large part of that crowd was armed. If they were and were intent on using it then where was the violent gun battle? And yes I have seen Jan 6, both what team orange did in the building as well as the actual protestors being waved in and essentially invited by the police.

Was the call the "Find the missing votes?" call, because thats not a call for fraud either. Thats a call to investigate uncounted ballots he was certain were there.

The fake electors I have not heard about so I need evidence for that.

The inditements are not credible so I see those as a political witchhunt by a corrupt system.

[goaded]

No, I said he summoned an armed mob, lied to them, and sent them to the Capitol to stop the peaceful transfer of power. How do you think he thought they could do that by peacefully protesting? The march to the Capitol was planned in advance, of course.

Look up the fake electors, there are three separate state indictments and the Georgia RICO case that describe what happened.

The indictments are credible, your purported beliefs are not. Especially as you admit to not knowing about the details.

(If shots had been fired by the mob on Jan 6th, there would have been no force on Earth that could have stopped the National Guard from intervening and quelling the attack; they were minutes away.)

[sawno]

@goaded "I said he summoned an armed mob, lied to them, and sent them to the Capitol to stop the peaceful transfer of power" so come with the receipts then, burden of proof is on you.

The "Fake electors" I need a credible source for. Search engines aren't helping me here and its to long ago to easily consult my own sources since mine are mostly in the video format and unlikely to use the loaded term. The closest I can get is Wikipedia, not the article of course those are always biased but the talks page where the bias of the article is discussed : en.wikipedia.org/.../Talk:Trump_fake_electors_plot . They are pointing out this is about alternate electors, not fake electors. And I do vaguely recall that part where alternate electors were present, after all its a contested election so if it were to result in Trump's favor those would have been needed. But those aren't fake or used by default, it seems to be part of their political process but every search engine is spammed with "Fake Electors" news articles with a corporate bias. I don't trust those at all and want to see raw information how alternate electors function and how they are introduced, or not allowed to be introduced to find any of this credible evidence against Trump.

We already hit multiple cases now where things you mentioned are not unbiased and likely not credible, and its obvious your source is the political spin within the indictments or the reporting of the indictments. We also know some of the people involved in those indictments are politically biased against Trump such as judge Juan Merchen who donated to the Biden campaign and as a result is not impartial.

[goaded]

Why do you think Trump sent the mob, that he called (even you can't deny that, surely) to DC, to the Capitol? What were they supposed to do, exactly? How would that have stopped the ceremonial counting of the electoral votes?

Alternate slates of electors are for when the outcome of the election in that state has not yet been finalised. That was not the case in 2020.

Keep saying "not credible", when talking about things that investigations, judges, and juries have all found credible, it makes you sound really authoratitive.

[sawno]

@goaded You still have not provided me with raw evidence, only references to partisan sources.

[goaded]

No, they're references to reputable sources, including court documents. Read them to see the raw evidence.

Remind me, what was your answer to the question of how a peaceful protest could have stopped the ceremonial count of certified electoral college votes?

[supercutebutt]

Comrade @sawno , Please tell Putin that Americans will NEVER elect Trump again. Then maybe he'll find you another job. Perhaps you can be his food-tester? It has to be demoralizing wasting your entire life as a vile troll 😞.

[sawno]

@supercutebutt Putin prefers Biden

[goaded]

And Putin never lies. Just like when he said Russia didn't interfere to get Trump elected.

[supercutebutt]

@sawno "Putin prefers Biden!" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
🤪

[sawno]

@goaded He didn't dare invade Ukraine during Trump

[Asker]

Russia was already funding a proxy war with separatists. And occupying Crimea. It just got exponentially worse two years ago.

[goaded]

And Trump called it "genius".

[normalice]

He only ever ran because his business was failing and he had no other way to avoid prosecution for fraud. He should have never been president but right wing media primed what became his base to be desperately thirsty for anyone in the mainstream to validate their rage and hate, since reality stubbornly refused to provide any evidence that it was justified.

[exitseven]

Even though we might all be better off today if he didn't he really had to. He will live to fight another day.

TRUMP 2024

[supercutebutt]

Trump will never be president again. How will you deal with that fact? With violence?

[exitseven]

@supercutebutt It will be the greatest political comeback in history. Better than a game 7 win.

[supercutebutt]

It will never happen. Your hero is a vile criminal. I hope you will be able to find meaning in your life when reality sets in.

[exitseven]

@supercutebutt I hope you do not stay in your bedroom with the shades drawn for more than a week.

[supercutebutt]

If you could go back in time, would you tell your 10yo self that one day, you would idolize a chubby rapist-insurrectionist? Or would you want your future self to be surprised? 😲

[Lliam]

No. And he didn't. But he was right to question the outcome of the election based on well documented "irregularities".

[goaded]

He did. Until the adults showed him he couldn't.

[FunkyMonkee]

At least until the could've proven there was no voter fraud.

[Friendlybro79]

Refuse lol... He had no choice hence why he left. He lost fair and square. Refuse... hahaha

[laly520]

president?

[goaded]

Citizen. Some prefer "Defendant".

[Anonymous]

trump will win

[supercutebutt]

The only thing he'll win is a place in your evil heart. And then Satan will welcome you both home. 🤘😈