How long do you think Trump will be in prison or jail?

[msc545]

I think the maximum sentence is 4 years, but I am betting he will get 6 months or less. It might be the best thing that ever has happened to him if he gets a psychiatric evaluation, which he definitely needs.

[abc3643]

The maximum is 1 year per COUNT. In theory, he could get 34 * 4 = 136 years. However, that would be overkill to hand out consecutive sentences and concurrent sentences are appropriate here.

Most folks think Trump won't get jail time.

My money is that Trump __IS__ sentenced to prison for between 1 month and 1 year. I'd guess 7 months because that would make him miss the election and any inauguration.

Why jail time? In sentencing, the judge is allowed to look at the convict's past and present behavior including past (and possibly current) trials. Trump has a serious attitude problem and disrespect for the legal system other than using it as a tool to harrass and bully others. That same legal system, thus far, has not been able to address this. Incarceration is just the next step.

Let's take a look at some examples of Trump's behavior that will play into the sentencing...

• He committed 10-as-in-TEN violations of his gag order in just this trial alone. He's attacked the very judge who is about to hand out his sentence; not smart.
• He shows no contrition about this case or any other case he's lost.
• He lost his civil E. Jean Carroll sexual assault trial and, after shooting his mouth off defaming the winner, he promptly lost the subsequent defamation trial and owes 83 million for that. This is all in the past year or so!!
• He and his company were found liable in a civil trial over fraud and this is going to cost him about $400,000,00. This was this year!!
• The Trump Foundation which was supposed to give money to charities but instead was giving money to the Trump campaign. It was shut down and ordered to pay $2,000,000 to charities.
• Countless examples of stiffing contractors instead of paying what he agreed to pay.

How many more examples do you need? Trump's legal problems go back over 50 years to 1973 when the Nixon (Republican) Justice Department went after him and his father for racial discrimination in renting apartments.

He doesn't have respect for the law or the rule of law.

I think Judge Juan Merchan is going to craft a significant Sentencing Memorandum and Order which will highlight all of this and he will summarize that, for decades and trials and public statements, Mr. Trump has illustrated that he is, to this point, incorrigible and that a prison sentence will give him time for some self-reflection.

I also think that Merchan should also require Trump to go through psychiatric care to attempt to correct his narcissistic personality disorder.

[abc3643]

* 4 years per COUNT... sorry.

[msc545]

Personalty disorders are not treatable.

[abc3643]

This is from Google Gemini...

PROMPT:
Assess this statement: "Personality disorders are not treatable."

RESPONSE
The statement "Personality disorders are not treatable" is an oversimplification. While there is no cure for personality disorders, they are treatable and manageable. Here's a breakdown:

* Challenges: Personality disorders are complex and can be difficult to treat. People with these disorders often have ingrained patterns of thinking and behavior that can be resistant to change. Additionally, they might not see their behaviors as problematic, making them less likely to seek treatment.

*Treatment Options: There are no medications specifically approved for personality disorders. However, psychotherapy, particularly Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT), can be very effective in managing symptoms, improving relationships, and enhancing daily functioning.

* Treatment Goals: The primary goal of treatment is not to "cure" the disorder but to help individuals manage their symptoms and improve their quality of life. With therapy, people with personality disorders can learn healthier coping mechanisms, regulate emotions more effectively, and build better relationships.

In conclusion, personality disorders are treatable, although it takes time, dedication, and the right approach.

(more)

[abc3643]

This is from ChatGPT:

PROMPT:
Assess this statement: "Personality disorders are not treatable."

RESPONSE:
That statement is not accurate. Personality disorders are indeed treatable, although the effectiveness of treatment can vary depending on factors such as the specific disorder, its severity, and individual differences. Treatment typically involves psychotherapy, medication, or a combination of both.

Psychotherapy, particularly approaches such as dialectical behavior therapy (DBT), cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT), and schema therapy, has shown efficacy in helping individuals manage symptoms and improve functioning. Medications may be prescribed to alleviate specific symptoms or co-occurring conditions, such as depression or anxiety.

While personality disorders can present significant challenges, many people with these conditions can experience improvement and lead fulfilling lives with appropriate treatment and support. It's essential for individuals struggling with personality disorders to seek professional help from qualified mental health professionals who can provide tailored treatment plans.

[abc3643]

On a lark, I decided to follow up with Google Gemini...

PROMPT:
What is the standard of treatment for someone with Narcissistic Personality Disorder?

RESPONSE:
The standard treatment for Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) focuses on psychotherapy, also known as talk therapy. Medication isn't generally used to directly address NPD, but it might be prescribed for co-occurring conditions like anxiety or depression.

Here's a breakdown of the treatment approach for NPD:

Psychotherapy:

* Types: Several forms of psychotherapy can benefit people with NPD. Some of the most common include:

- Transference-focused therapy: This explores the patterns of relating that the person with NPD brings into therapy, helping them develop healthier ways of interacting with others.

- Schema therapy: This identifies underlying emotional patterns that contribute to the person's narcissistic behaviors and works to change them.

- Dialectical behavior therapy (DBT): This teaches skills for managing emotions, regulating distress, and improving communication.

- Cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT): This helps identify and change negative thought patterns that contribute to narcissistic behaviors.

* Goals: Therapy for NPD aims to:

- Improve self-awareness: Help the person with NPD understand how their thoughts, feelings, and behaviors affect themselves and others.

- Develop empathy: Build the ability to understand and share the feelings of others.

- Improve emotional regulation: Learn healthier ways to manage emotions and cope with stress.

- Build healthier relationships: Develop the skills for more fulfilling and supportive relationships.

(more)

[abc3643]

Additional Considerations:

* Finding the right therapist: A therapist experienced in treating personality disorders, particularly NPD, is crucial. The therapeutic relationship is essential for progress, and a therapist skilled at navigating the challenges of NPD can create a safe space for exploration and growth.

* Treatment duration: There's no quick fix for NPD. Therapy is typically a long-term commitment, often lasting for months or even years.

* Motivation for change: People with NPD may not always be motivated to seek or continue treatment. It's important to understand that treatment success often hinges on a willingness to change.

Overall, while NPD can be a challenging condition to treat, psychotherapy offers valuable tools for managing symptoms and improving quality of life.

[msc545]

I am a practicing neuropsychologist not an AI. What's your computer program is telling you is wrong. Nobody I know and I know quite a few people tries to treat personality disorders because they are always disappointed in the results. People do not get better and in fact often get worse. Moreover, many personality disorders are extremely dangerous to the providers who try to treat them. Both things along with low reimbursement rates and a necessity for extremely qualified professionals along with substandard pay discourage almost all providers from treating personality disorders.

[abc3643]

THIS:

"* Motivation for change: People with NPD may not always be motivated to seek or continue treatment. It's important to understand that treatment success often hinges on a willingness to change."

Yeah, that's not going to work on Trump... LOL.

[abc3643]

The two AI systems basically echoed what you just said although you did furnish some extra realism about the front lines. Thanks!

[msc545]

He doesn't have narcissistic personality disorder in my opinion. Instead, he has borderline personality disorder which is far more severe, particularly in men. The self-aggrandizement that you see is a feature of borderline personality disorder, as is the grandiosity. I have colleagues who disagree with me slightly on these things, but the truth is that it's probably all of everything we've said and more. Personality disorder diagnosis is fraught with difficulty and what I call borderline may be called something else by someone else. The important part of this is the prognosis and the likelihood of successful treatment. In Florida and in narcissistic the prognocence is very poor and the likelihood of successful treatment is very low.

[msc545]

I would also like it if you could consider my diagnosis of type 1 bipolar disorder. Trump doesn't sleep very much and in fact rarely sleeps. His speech is extremely disrupted which may be indicative of but brain lesions, a brain disease or just bipolar disorder. His speech is rapid and often nonsensical. He has a great deal of difficulty sticking to the point he speaks far too fast and he often does not make sense. The rapid speech. The difficulty with performing words and the other signs and symptoms that you may have noticed in your speech and in his presentation in general are usually associated with bipolar 1 disorder. Trump has been known to be up in the very early morning hours frantically typing away at things that truly don't make much sense and don't make much difference and yet he does this repeatedly. His judgment and insight are completely absent for the most part. These two r signs and symptoms of bipolar 1 disorder. Additionally, his lack of insight, empathy, and inability in his inability to think critically and his judgment disorder are all signs of bipolar 1 disorder. Fortunately, these conditions are relatively amenable to treatment, but it is questionable as to whether or not that would be practical given the situation. I would imagine Trump would resist vociferously and that it would be quite difficult to get him to adhere to a medication regimen. He also would need cyclic therapy and again he would be quite reluctant if to participate in this. In my opinion. Because of these things I think it's prognosis is very poor

[msc545]

He also may have some brain's disease or brain lesion, but given the fact that I have not examined him, I would be very reluctant to assert this. Other than to say, I have a moderate level of suspicion regarding this, particularly given his speech difficulties and his recent difficulty with orientation and auditory production.

[msc545]

This is a man with significant psychiatric illness and rather than putting him in jail or prison it would be far more humane and effective to render some treatment for him so that perhaps one day he could return to society as a productive member. As it stands right now, he is a danger to others, but this probably will not always be true. When that passes and I certainly hope it does. It would be nice to have him back given the fact that he is a very bright and interesting man that has a lot to say and when he is well he may contribute a lot to our society.

[abc3643]

Well, keep this fact in mind...
He's been an asshole since long before you were born.
He first entered the public consciousness in 1973 when the Justice Department of the Nixon Administration filed a lawsuit against both him and his father for racial discrimination in renting apartments in violation of the 1968 Fair Housing Act. Despite the overwhelming evidence against the Trumps, the Justice Department let them settle out of court. Of course, he touts that he wasn't guilty and no wrongdoing was found, but the Trumps did have to make some changes (*)...

=====
This was on the front page of The New York Times...


(more)

[abc3643]

That front page article...

www.nytimes.com/.../...-city-us-accuses-major.html

Major Landlord Accused Of Antiblack Bias in City
By Morris Kaplan
Oct. 16, 1973

The Department of Justice, charging discrimination against blacks in apartment rentals, brought suit in Federal Court in Brooklyn yesterday against the Trump Management Corporation, a major owner and manager of real estate here.

The corporation, which owns and rents more than 14,000 apartments in Brooklyn, Queens and Staten Island, was accused of violating the Fair Housing Act of 1968 in its operation of 39 buildings. Most are in Coney Island, Brooklyn, and in Jamaica Estates and Forest Hills, Queens.

Seeking an injunction to halt alleged discriminatory practises, the Government contended that Trump Management had refused to rent or negotiate rentals “because of race and color.” It also charged that the company had required different rental terms and conditions because of race and that it had misrepresented to blacks that apartments were not available.

At the corporation's main office, 600 Avenue Z in Brooklyn, Donald Trump, president, denied the charges.

“They are absolutely ridiculous,” he said. “We never have discriminated, and we never would. There have been a number of local actions against us, and we've won them all. We were charged with discrimination, and we proved in court that we did not discriminate.”
...
===
(more)

[abc3643]

When Trump began seeking the Presidency, the NYT did a "Looking Back" piece for digital subscribers.

LOOKING BACK
1973 Meet Donald Trump
BY DAVID W. DUNLAP July 30, 2015 2:20 PM


CAPTION: Donald Trump “getting into his Cadillac to begin a day of real estate deals,” was the original caption of this 1976 photograph. Credit Chester Higgins Jr./The New York Times

Some Americans are just getting to know Donald Trump. Readers of The Times have known him for 42 years.
[Then photo I posted earlier with the front page headline.]

They first met him, on the front page no less, on Oct. 16, 1973. Then 27 years old, Mr. Trump was the president of the Trump Management Corporation, at 600 Avenue Z in Brooklyn, which owned more than 14,000 apartments in Brooklyn, Queens and Staten Island.

“Major Landlord Accused of Antiblack Bias in City,” the headline stated. The Department of Justice had brought suit in federal court in Brooklyn against Mr. Trump and his father, Fred C. Trump, charging them with violating the Fair Housing Act of 1968 in the operation of 39 buildings.

“The government contended that Trump Management had refused to rent or negotiate rentals ‘because of race and color,’ ” The Times reported. “It also charged that the company had required different rental terms and conditions because of race and that it had misrepresented to blacks that apartments were not available.”

Donald Trump’s first quoted words in The New York Times expressed his view of the charges:

“They are absolutely ridiculous.”

“We never have discriminated,” he added, “and we never would.”

(more)

[abc3643]

Two months later, Trump Management, represented by Roy M. Cohn, turned around and sued the United States government for $100 million (roughly $500 million in today’s terms), asserting that the charges were “ irresponsible and baseless.”

“Mr. Trump accused the Justice Department of singling out his corporation because it was a large one, and because the government was trying to force it to rent to welfare recipients,” The Times reported.

Under an agreement reached in June 1975, Trump Management was required to furnish the New York Urban League with a list of all apartment vacancies, every week, for two years. It was also to allow the league to present qualified applicants for every fifth vacancy in Trump buildings where fewer than 10 percent of the tenants were black.

Trump Management noted that the agreement did not constitute an admission of guilt.

Mr. Trump himself said he was satisfied that the agreement did not “compel the Trump organization to accept persons on welfare as tenants unless as qualified as any other tenant.”
...

Here's the URL to that that I had forgotten:
archive.nytimes.com/.../

=========
(*) This from the article is what the Trump's agreed to almost 2 years later:

Under an agreement reached in June 1975, Trump Management was required to furnish the New York Urban League with a list of all apartment vacancies, every week, for two years. It was also to allow the league to present qualified applicants for every fifth vacancy in Trump buildings where fewer than 10 percent of the tenants were black.

[WhiteSteve]

Tough to say. I wouldn’t want to bet on it either way.

On the one hand, Michael Cohen did like a year, thirteen months, something like that, for the same crime, and we can now say without the “allegedly” qualifier, that his crimes were committed at the direction of Trump. So by that measure, Trump should see AT LEAST that much time, just based on equal dispensation of justice.

But Judge Merchan, at least when it came to Trump flagrantly violating a very legitimate and well-earned gag order, was very reluctant to jail him, and he even said out loud that he was averse to it BECAUSE of who Donald Trump is, which I don’t think is a good precedent to set, but the fact remains…. Trump continues to receive special treatment. He caught $9,000 in fines, which is nothing to him.

So I don’t know if he’s scared or is just being measured so crazies don’t have a leg to stand on when they try to delegitimize the case on the whole. He might come down with the hammer, he might not. Or I’d maybe say he’d lean towards less jail time than more jail time.

The real problem is Trump’s lunatic supporters, worrying about what they’re going to do in response to a misperceived slight. Some of these folks will straight up resort to terrorism. So I’m glad I’m not the one having to decide on the sentencing. Do what’s right/standard vs let MAGA bully you into letting shit slide for safety’s sake…. and it’s especially dicey because the right wing has manufactured enemies in this whole ordeal but those people aren’t the ones to blame. Fuckin’ conspiracy-minded nutjobs are going to be the downfall of America, claiming their the ones trying to save it all the way down, lmfao🤦‍♂️😂

[WhiteSteve]

Goddammit….*claiming THEY’RE the ones trying

Realized it just as I hit submit, like “NOOOOOO….”, lmao

[GoodGuyBreakingBad]

I would think 6 months

[provokeesmokee]

Zero. I think the American institutions will not be set up to deal with the sheer amount of fascist fanboys and willingly corrupt officials that will press for a complete wiping clean of the slate.

America has never had a convicted felon as President. All that means is their systems are ill-equipped to deal with this reality.

The Founding Fathers assumed their successors would have, y'know, kept up with the times. But instead rich old white men decided they want to preserve a document from the 1700s over their current day democracy.

I predict Trump wins, triggers several global and civil wars, and we will witness the first livestreamed meltdown of a modern empire.

I have less than zero faith in America and what it used to represent. It's no longer a country, it's just a corporate slave at the end of late stage capitalism.

[AviatorTom]

Most of the experts are using the standard rules for sentencing. He has no criminal record, this offense did not physically harm anyone. They think he'll get community service and pay a fine, not any jail time. The judge is also expected to take into account how difficult it would be to have a former President in jail, with 24/7 Secret Service protection required. Perhaps a house arrest, but that could be considered election interference, preventing him from campaigning.

Putting him on trial and finding him guilty is the main thing. Sentencing him is not that important.

[NathanDavis]

it was known upon, and even stated by those who lean democrat (and do know about this stuff) this is not a felony that carries jail time

it's just the kind of stuff that rich people can get away with with just a smack on the palm of their hands

[slatyb]

Martha Stewart went to prison. The maximum penalty for each count is four years.

[msc545]

I don't think this is correct. In theory he can get up to 4 years for each count, but of course that won't happen. However, I don't think he's going to get off without doing some jail time at least.

[Chazmatazz269]

It’ll definitely be a wake up call regarding his popularity. Ell oh ell!
If New York pushes prison time, Drumpf will push for federal sentencing, and he’ll probably get it. Christ, they gave it to Chauvin so he wouldn’t have to serve his time in state penitentiaries.

[lightbulb27]

Agree id like to see a psych eval but good luck convincing anyine they are fd up… especially in state controlled facilities.


6 months let go in two.


4 years for this is insanity.


And to think… did stormy pay taxes on that income … and get away with that? Its not about fair and right but power.

[northerngal]

I used to think he would never go to jail... now I am not so sure. Would a "regular" felon who is showing no remorse and attacking the judge and the justice system get jail time? Probably. Maybe thats what he wants? With Trump you can never tell.

[Twalli]

Well there are 34 different counts, and that's only in New York he still has GA and federal charges pending which will not be able to be served concurrently with the New York ones, which means he may have 3 prison sentences that have to be served consecutively. I am expecting a few years minimum for each. Obviously, he may be released early on appeal.

[Anonymous]

I'd laugh hysterically every minute he is in there, but it won't happen. Rich entitled losers get away with breaking laws all the time.

[DryGermanGuy]

First time white collar offender with a class E felony probably means a suspended sentence? It’s the other cases he will get real time for!

[exitseven]

They will give him a year is Attica. He will last less than a week before somebody kills him. The democrats will say it;s a shame.

[AngryCarl]

There is no "they". The judge will decide the sentence. Merchan seems pretty lenient.

[exitseven]

@AngryCarl Merchan is a Democrat hack. He is working with Bidens DOJ. He will do what is necessary to get Biden re elected. The verdict made Trump more popular than ever and once he gets in the White House along with a Trump supporting congress there will be a lot of investigations and many indictments and trials in the years to come. They really only have one move left

[AngryCarl]

The judiciary is independent of the DOJ. Any judge with integrity (so not Aileen Cannon) can put their politics aside when adjudicating a case.

[exitseven]

@AngryCarl I have more integrity Than Merchan. And I was in sales for 20 years.

[DryGermanGuy]

Enough with your silly assassination fantasies already!

[exitseven]

@DryGermanGuy You just watch. Biden is tanking in all thr polls and democrats have nobody that can replace him. kamala Harris is more unlikable than Biden. Trump is raking in millions for his campaign and is getting more independents the more the democrats try to imprison him. They know that on day 1 Trump will hire a REAL prosecutor to investigate the Bidens and all the 51 intelligence agents that signed a document saying Hunters laptop was disinformation. Their backs are against the wall. What else are they going to do?

[msc545]

I am a Democrat too, and it does not affect my work at all. I hope being a Republican doesn't affect your work.

[msc545]

You are beginning to sound delusional my friend.

[DryGermanGuy]

Yeah, yeah. I just watch. You babbled the same conspiracy theory about Judge Merchan setting up Trump by ordering him to be present at every court day (that’s the law). Nothing is going to happen.

[DryGermanGuy]

And God forbid, a Democratic presidential candidate having to accept that he has lost the election! That’s unheard of! 🙄

[exitseven]

@DryGermanGuy are you kidding? After Trump won democrats including Hillery insisted he was an illegitimate president.

[DryGermanGuy]

First of all, Hillary conceded defeat the same day and smoothed the transfer of power as it should be expected from every candidate. When later on the amount of Russian interference became obvious, she gave her opinion. The same way that Gore gave his opinion about the dubious declaration of Bush’s victory through the supreme court’s decision. Only a completely delusional person could equate the events from 2016 with those of 2020.

[jimmy2]

No he get probation and house arrest
But look out what ever they do if it restrictions to Trump as the Republican canadiant then it seem as election interference and boy will his supporters rract

[SoJust]

I don't think he can get out by paying money, but the constitution and law will prevent this. Even if he goes to prison, he will be the boss of the place.

[DrPepper12]

Unfortunately he won't be seeing Rikers island. He'll have probation and a fine as a "first" time offender

[DextroShade]

Jailing Trump now would destroy the country, but that what you globohomo leftards want, isn't it?

[Anonymous]

0 prison time.

Hillary deserves 25 years and didn't do one day.

Clinton deserves 7 years that everyone else would get just for perjury, and he didn't do one day.

[RedInnocent69]

Agreed. I’ll be surprised if he gets prison at all.

[nawtee_me]

They will fine him and give him probation. They won’t put a sitting president in jail. He will be the next president, watch and see…,

[JacobJordan]

He will more than likely receive zero time actually. As he is running for president he is not a flight risk and setting a bail is stupid since he can just pay that

[msc545]

The time for bail is long past. This is a sentence - it does not involve holding him for trial - that already happened.

[JacobJordan]

Doesn't change anything ultimately. Reality is the appeal will clear him of all charges due to the discrepancies in the case in addition to the judge instructing the jury on how to proceed among many other facets that made the entire trial illegitimate.

[msc545]

The appeal is not going to clear him of anything - at most, it will find legal errors and remand the case back to the trial court for retrial.

[Anonymous]

Zero, he'll be assassinated probably as a martyr to by a 'leftist' as to serve the l
Right wing agenda

[EmmaMary]

We all know that's never going to happen.

[Kelly6]

@EmmaMary true, jail is only for others

[Alex-Snow]

I wish it were forever just to shut him up

[Staximus]

I don't think he's going to jail

[AngryCarl]

How about zero?

[Kelly6]

Zero days

[HurremSultan]

Hopefully he won't