Shouldn’t there just be murder? Not 1st or 2nd degree?

[OddBeMe]

Basic difference under law: did suspect have a chance to think about it first. The fuck does that have to do with anything?

Yes we need 1&2 degrees of murder

Just one: MURDER. Period.

[RavVid]

We have murder and manslaughter. Murder is the intent to kill whilst manslaughter is a reckless act resulting in death. A boss who has unsafe work practices could be found guilty of man slaughter.

I think there is justification to have these two categories because there is a great deal of difference in intent. But overlap is possible where I am so reckless that I am knowingly taking a chance on killing or not killing. Say I am wanting to scare you off by sending a round whistling past your ear - what is that?

Not sure what 2nd degree is but have always equated it to manslaughter;maybe incorrectly.

[OddBeMe]

Sure for murder and manslaughter. But 1st and 2nd degree murder? No just murder

[RavVid]

It seems that don't understand the distinction of 1st and 2nd degree.. What is it?

[RavVid]

Having read other comments I have a better idea of 1st and 2nd. It now seems to me these distinctions give a jury some ability to have more say on what the punishment should be which in the system I live in would be entirely at the discretion on the judge.

[Drewtate]

1st degree murder is basically cold blooded planned with the clear intent to kill.

2nd degree murder is murder that is not premeditated. You might shoot someone say during a robbery or beat someone to death in an assault but with no real intent to kill.

Then you got voluntary manslaughter which is a called a crime of passion where something occurs that you aren't mentally fit to handle such as a spouse cheating or a child molested that you lose control temporarily and kill someone.

Involuntary manslaughter is stuff like death caused by drunk driving or shooting the ceiling of your apartment and killing your neighbor. Speeding.

[GOLDFISH_smile]

The person who makes a fast decision to murder doesn't need as harsh correction to learn their lesson as the person who had a lot of time to think about what they're doing and still goes through with it. That's the idea. I think it makes sense.

[OddBeMe]

Actually the one so uncontrolled seems more dangerous to society

[GOLDFISH_smile]

All they have to do is learn to be better controlled. That's a lot easier to teach than morals.

[OddBeMe]

Now you're talking about recidivism and prison reform. All for it. But murder is murder. If you fly off the handle and kill that seems worse to me.

But the flip side is psychopathy. Which I'm glad to say is more recognized in paroles.

[Still-alive]

there's this thing a lot of courts cover called 'crimes of passion' where you were so heated that you lost all sensiblities that you murder someone... so yeah thats different from a person who planned a murder days months or even years in advance. those people are pretty dangerous in my opinion.

[Still-alive]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_of_passion

[GOLDFISH_smile]

Yes, murder is murder, but it can have way different motives. If the goal is to stop future murders then the motives should be taken into account don't u think?

[chrissykerdock]

it's very different one you plan to kill your wife the other you see her in be with a man a crime of passion very different than planning

[chrissykerdock]

in bed

[OddBeMe]

If you’re that violent…not really

[Telekinetic-Potato]

The idea is that a person who decides to kill someone, plans it out and covers their tracks to get away with it is different from a person who did it on accident and should have known better or someone who was using excessive force during an altercation... Roughly

[NaultD]

First degree is evil as you stew in it plan every step.

Second could be a mistake like driving.

[ProbablyClueless]

No, murder needs to be distinguished based upon the killer's intent. That's the only way to litigate crimes fairly.

[Sevenpointfive]

if you say oddbeme's name slow, it's o-b-a-m-a

[Juxtapose]

Intent matters. Hence 3rd degree murder.

[OddBeMe]

Sure. But intent to murder is separated by manslaughter. Murder by rage (2nd degree) seems even more dangerous to society

[Juxtapose]

Well an instance of second degree murder could be the killer of your wife taunting you after having just killed her and you have no justifiable reason to kill that guy instead of having him thrown in prison. You kill him anyway and get charged with second degree murder, you were inflamed by passion.

First degree murder is Dexter from that serial killer show. He had plenty of time to think about it and he is fully committed to his killings. Think of Ted Bundy if that does not ring a bell.

[OddBeMe]

That seems like the law blaming the victim

[Juxtapose]

More like it's recognizing we are only human and can take only so much. Same deal with the fighting words doctrine.

[OddBeMe]

Maybe