POLL question. Should Hungary and Turkey be removed from NATO?

[Anonymous]

Resminize bir başlık ekleyin…

Yes

No

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Hungary yes, Turkey no.

[Asker]

So why?

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Hungary:
1. Is clear that is in close relationship with Russia and Putin, not feeling ashamed to show up with a criminal.
2. Same for the communist lider of China, Xi
3. Doesn't aline animore with the European values of human right and tolerance, been a country who is not JUST TOLERANT with LGBT, but officialy against them. (I'm against them, but i don't want them to be ban from any humanitarian right like laws, hospitals, educations, social security... i just want them to keep it low profile and do theyr stuffs in theyr homes, Hungary don't want that, is you are straight 100% or ilegal).
4. Promote hate in the hungarian minority in Romania, showing up with big Hungary map and talk of thous hungarian are opresed. (is not true, they have theyr own schools in hungarian language, they win same money like any romanian and they even have UNFARLY political representants in Romania Parlament).
5. Hungary promote a politic against imigrants and against Ukraine.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Turkey:
1. The Bosford Strait in the city of Istanbul is an incredibly important strategic point, perhaps too important in the current context.
2. Although Erdogan is a dictator who does not respect people's rights and is also incredibly corrupt, he does not put Putin's interests above Turkey. Turkey being one of the countries that carried out very important maneuvers against Russia.
2. a They blocked the Bosford strait for Russian (and American) military ships, but not those from Europe>UK, France, Spain, Greece, etc.
2. b They sent numerous Bairactar drones as well as marine drones + opened a drone factory in Ukraine
2. c They promoted a negotiation policy both with Russia and with Ukraine in order to stabilize the grain situation, a situation that ultimately benefited Ukraine more.
3. Turkey has one of the strongest armies in Europe and is one of the most developed and liberal countries in the Middle East.
4. Turkey's membership in NATO creates some stability between Greece and Turkey, these being rival nations, being in the same camp, they are forced to collaborate in favor of peace. Both can be sanctioned based on international and NATO laws.
Turkey only benefits from Russia while Hungary serves Russia. Turkey "The end justifies the means", Hungary "The bowed head the sword does not cut".

[Asker]

Thank you for this very important information I think I mostly agree with you

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Can i ask where are you from?

[Asker]

Southern Italy

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Ciao fratelo! Romania brothem here!

[RebelinSteel]

Nope

[Asker]

Why do you think that

[RebelinSteel]

Why should they be?
Zero reason for that.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

If they crate disfunctions in the aliance and not participating active to the aliance actions and they are even against them them is becoming a problem.

[RebelinSteel]

@Alexandrubaschet08 that is a very short looking view. If you keep the countries close, you can help the people, if you let them move towards Russia, you lose the people and they do not get freedoms. It is being managed.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

I know, and i can agree but evrething have a limit. Afghanistan and Vietnam had theyr limits as well.
The main idea is that nobody will come to make order in the countries with dysfunctional systems (Hungary/Turkey).
The people need to vote and decide what they really want, other way thous politicians will keep stay in power and will push the countries away from the alliance.
Nobody force a country to stay if they don't want.

[RebelinSteel]

@Alexandrubaschet08 true they cannot make the government stay, however this then greatly restricts travel, airspace, leaving NATO would likely push the EU to take action.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

NATO and EU are 2 diferent institution, one is economicly, other one is military.
You can leave any of them but that doesn't mean you will be take out from both of them if you respect the agreements that you signe when you join them.

[RebelinSteel]

@Alexandrubaschet08 thanks for letting me know they were different 🤦‍♂️. Within the EU, they are blocking funds to Hungary at present that around €9 billion which would be in its national budget 2024 -2026, about 5% of its GDP, not a small about. The EU are also debating about enforcing article 7 against Hungary, this would remove all their voting rights. This would not be kicking Hungary out, however they would have no money coming in from the EU and no voting rights.

[Alexandrubaschet08]

Yes, i know. I'm in favor of them. But if Hungary will still persist and not reform themself in order to be in line with the European values and keep aline with the oriental criminal regims, EU will not need to keep "captive" a stat in its aliance.
The people from Hungary need to vote agains the partys and politicians that doesn't expres theyr values. OR if thous one reprezent the people, theyr places is not in the European family or NATO.

[Agape93]

Yeap. If you're part of a club to protect each other from bullies, and 2 members are giving the bullies weapons and aid, safe to say they're not on your side.