It looks like the more successful and independent the women is even if she is pretty the less older successful men wants to be with her.. why is that so 🤔
I married an independent and successful one. I mean she's not a millionaire but she was ambitious enough to start from a lowly intern to the head of a publishing company as writer and editor. She achieved her career goals in life, so to speak, and from the ground up.
It's never been important to me whether or not a woman is very successful. I do quite well for myself as a software engineer. Independent helps a lot since I value my own independence, but I just enjoy it when a woman is passionate about something. It's like with my wife, her love of books generates endless new subjects to talk about each day as she reads more and more books. I like this.
With that said, I think clueless is kind of an oversimplification for more people than not. I do find some people only seem to have distractions in their lives and no major goals and passions, and I do find that incredibly dull. Yet, for example, I find a motivated dancer who is passionate about her dancing career, even if she wasn't the brightest in skill, to be brilliant in her own way... and same for artist, musician, athlete, etc.
you are absolutely right. be successful in whatever feild you are in. I noticed independent secured men are okay and quite supportive to the success of their women. You are a showcase of that. Thank you for sharing this here 🌹
Cheers. I think in my case, I dated all sorts here, and one thing that's definitely important to me is independence... not just because I value mine a bit and don't want to be joined at the hip with a woman, but it also feels more genuine to me. It's like I don't want to be needed like an addict needs a drug. It makes you question if they truly desire it or just need their fix to feel okay. So it's like when a woman has built her own success and independence, and she has her own world, it feels more genuine to me, like real love, when she invites me into hers, and I invite her into mine. So I like independent women who are enthusiastic with about a lifelong goal that doesn't involve me -- the success part was never so important to me.
A clueless girlfriend has no appeal to me but what I question is how independent is the other option? Does she still have needs that a relationship can satisfy or because she is independent would she rather be single? Please explain in your mind the difference between an independent woman and someone not independent.
0
6 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I appreciate the fact that you asked me and didn't just assume 🌹 Independent in the sense of financially, mentally and emotionally stable that you can trust her even in your absence to take the right decisions and to have your back. So if god forbid something happens to you, you know that she is strong. And that she has boundaries when dealing with others, respect the privacy of your unity, and is not influenced by random opinions. For me being independent does not mean being rude, stubborn or a man hater! I see it as a quality you gain when you have experience in life, strength, confidence and wisdom. All men are not independent either and it is not cool as well. I would rather be with an independent man who is secured within himself, then being with a cutie with six packs and empty essence. Now, there is no absolute independence. Men and women both need each other. mentally, emotionally, sexually or even for just companionship. I am, yes, independent but I have a heart that faces fear, doubt, loss, or joy just like any other human being. So why wouldn't I need a man to share my life with. And when I say need I mean in a healthy way and not the obsessive clingy way. Needing is not bad when its for the right man. Otherwise I'll wait and nothing wrong with that either isn't it?
Of course because no one is a mind reader I appreciate you expounding on your thoughts and putting context to your words, providing not only a definition but some examples.
Yes, in that context an independent women is completely desirable; I would label those traits as maturity. As you said, someone who can take over and carry the complete relationship when I am down and out; who also trusts me to carry the weight when she feels vulnerable.. that’s the ying/yang harmony that healthy relationships thrive in.
I guess in summary I view your question to men as would they prefer a clueless woman whom they can control and they have the decided power over or do they prefer a woman who is their equal and can no longer be manipulated. For me I want my partner to be strong, independent, confident, and powerful because she is my partner in the world and is my better half. Why would I ever choose a weak or clueless better half?
Well said about being a human being even when having maturity; I agree everyone has needs and no one is perfect. It takes authentic strength to admit your fears and trust in your partner to help you feel safe. Both people crave the security the other can provide on all levels as you said and when their relationship is rock solid they can do amazing things in the world!
I posted a question that wasn't anonymous and was surprised by the answers. I guess I'm new to all this internet/ social media interactions kinda thing. So I just became curious to see if people didn't know who behind the question will they be any nicer or understanding or is it going to be the total opposite.
I learned that some men think women want to be independent because they don't need them or that they hate men. A huge misconception of the reality. But my question purposely was aimed to exaggerate the classifications into two extemes. So I expected a wide range of answers and that is fine we are diverse and we like different things. Some were extremely rude and offensive but that doesn't really bother me rude people exist everywhere. I just reported, deleted and forgot about them
I'm 27 so I'm not within the criteria of this question, but I'll give my opinion for additional perspective.
I think it's very important to have some form of self responsibility and efficiency skills. I wouldn't want to be with somebody who needs to be dependent on others, or a partner.
There's this one girl I know-- she lives off a large allowance from her family overseas, and her entire aspiration in life is to find a man that can fully financially support the life she wants. The only thing she works on to improve herself is working out, making sure her hair is good, and wearing a lot of expensive makeup everyday. This is the exact type of person I would absolutely not date, under any circumstances.
All that being said, there is a completely different demeanor that women present when they are successful and independent, and not in a good way socially. And the problem is: They're usually competitive with everybody, and as a result, they rarely see anybody as an equal. They put most people below them: all men, other women, people that make less money, people that are more selfless, etc.
Successful independent women (mostly in America) lack modesty, and they call that absence "being strong". That's what drives men away. Not bringing attention to your success, and devaluing yourself out of courtesy, is something most of these women will never do, nor understand.
If you're wondering what I'd want after depreciating both sides-- it's someone who's driven by a passion that's not money. If you work to be happy, that's more attractive than anything to me.
1
3 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Wow that is an impressive well stated point of view I couldn't believe your age. I agree in general terms to everything you said and sure there are many variables contributing to it including cultural understanding of what a strong woman mean as you correctly stated. My question neglected to address these aspects you mentioned. So I want to clarify that I didn't mean a person who is not a human first, kind, loving and generous to others. Strong does not equal a bully, narcissist, or self inflate person. I enjoyed reading your answer and I wish you the best of luck in your life 🌹
Thanks for listening. I think it's important to contribute a new perspective to a topic to add value to others' understanding. Seeing the other people responding, you've definitely received a wide array of variation. That means you asked a good question! All the best to you as well 🌻
If men don't like successful independent women then how come majority of them are in relationships?
Which comes first career or relationship? Men love independent ambitious women, I do, and I only date independent ambitious women. I find them very desirable.
What men don't like women married to their career who put their career or ambitions before relationships. If her career is more important to her then I have absolutely no interest whatsoever. Same with independent woman who put her career first but now all of a sudden wants a relationship.
Another thing I don't get. She is independent ambitious women but not when it comes to taking half his possessions after divorce?
Guys have to be careful, if she is not putting effort in relationship then obviously its not going to work out, its best for men to avoid such women.
Another reason I think is they were so fixated on their careers that they've left it too late to find compatible partners. Like I said independent women have absolutely no problem at all finding partners because relationships were priority to them, they are happily married.
So the problem is not being independent and ambitious but which comes first relationship or career?
I'm not that old, but I would lean away from the "successful independent" woman.
For one thing, those often turn out to be code words for entitled and arrogant.
Also, what I would identify as a "successful and independent" woman at a glance, is unappealing. I don't like the attire and presentation.
Another thing is that it also generally means the women are older; they spend all this time building up at a career, but then they're somewhere in there 30's or older, still without a long term partner and just aren't as attractive as they used to be. If they were men, then focusing on their career would get them more attention from women. So perhaps women's perception of that leads them to feel that their education and career will appeal to a man. But it doesn't work like that.
Lastly -- and perhaps most importantly -- I assume they work a lot, why would I want a partner who is working all the time? If I'm working and being busy often then I want someone who is going to actually be there and be available when I'm not working. I want someone who is going to actually be there to take care of any kids we had as well; I don't want a nanny to raise our kids. So I want someone who is going to be there to contribute to the piece that's missing from me life that having a partner would fill -- the social aspect -- and your "success and independence" does nothing for that.
0
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I agree to a certain extent to what you have stated in your comment and respect your approach and opinion. Thank you for shedding some light and for contributing.
Successful? Her job doesn't attract me to her. Independant? She doesn't need a man in her life? Well, I am a man so no need for me... I will go for the girl who needs a man and love.
If women believe this than feminism has lied to you. Also that career satisfaction trumps marriage and family for 'most' women.
This isn't the road to joy, contentment and happiness for most women... even though that is what they think.
Compete to be like a man, abandon all in pursuit of a career, sleep around and soe your sexual oats, you do not need men... maybe when you are 35 and on top you'll settle down if some dude is good enough for you... not that you need anyone.
Looks at those twits who pursued love and marriage at 22 who are stuck with a husband, home, 2 kids... a family. Theyare missing out. That might make 1 out 20 happy. Simple, weak women. Career and independance is all 90% need.
1
0 Reply
Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
Either woman would be perfectly fine, so long as she was easy to be around (and hadn't been around). However, an independent woman would have the edge simply because it makes for a healthier relationship. This is providing the independence came from the true self, rather than the adversarial ego.
It's the same with the definition of 'successful' as well. It's all about how you carry it. if a woman is not humble with her success, then I have no time for her. Most men spend a lot of time on guard in life and want to come home to warmth.
0
4 Reply
Opinion Owner
+1 y
You said ''I learned that some men think women want to be independent because they don't need them or that they hate men. ''
Above is a good example for the definition of egoic independence as mentioned earlier. When it comes from the true self, it's about sharing and being two different sides of the same coin, both able to stand alone, but both choosing not to.
My second comment is about what happens to us when our ego takes over, Vs who we really are underneath (dissolved ego). When we are our true self, independence is expressed in a powerful way, but if the ego is dominant, then it's expressed in a way that alienates.
I prefer , a Woman that knows what she wants and isn't afraid to tell a guy. Its nice to have a independent woman but sometimes if she a little too much on the independence that's a deal breaker. I like a bit of both clueless and successful Independence.
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Nice to know what you like right. thanks though for your contribution here
1. Youth for fertility purposes 2. Innocence both less body count and less worldly experience. 3. Not materialistic. 4. Caring and sweet 5. Loves to cook clean writes thank you cards etc. Stuff that helps me and compliments my life make a house a home stuff.
An independent successful woman is not going to meet most of these requirements. Therefore I usually don't even find them attractive at all. I think of them mostly like dual purpose man/masturbatory toy. Like you can treat them like a man and you could have sex with them. But they aren't good to keep around at all because they have nothing to offer my desires. See above.
@Ally247 they could. I didn't say they couldnt. They are just far less likely to be a majority of things on this list.
Most successful women have to learn to be aggressive and that absolutely takes away from being as sweet and caring in your personality most of the time.
@Ally247 very accurate. Can she be sweet yes but sometimes if she's aggressive it negates it. If a woman ever acts that way with me i would not be interested. I want someone always sweet. Not sometimes sweet. Even just capable of being not caring would be a turn off.
I didn't say it meant always. I'm just saying, you may have strong mixed up. Strong people aren't aggressive- they don't need to be. This type of woman you're describing, isn't an example of a strong woman. Don't correlate the two.
@Ally247 nobody is even talking about strong. in my opinion a woman who is the things im looking for is strong to stand up for her femininity and her household. The question is about "successful independent woman" which i initially assumed you mean when you say strong. Successful women often must be aggressive to become successful. And that is a huge turn off to me when im looking for someone to grow their nurturing side instead.
I'm independently wealthy (retired doctor) and I have been with several beautiful women, who were pretty much clueless. They all had $$$ in mind. They seemed to be extremely self-centered and self-absorbed and used people for their advantage.
I've also been with several successful women, and I was never good enough for them. They had such high expectations, and I doubt they would ever have a healthy long-term relationship.
1
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
Thank you for sharing your experience. So interesting. I don't understand what more would they expect from you but I'm sure you were as confused as I am now lol. I guess finding love or a good partner is not really that easy. Everyone seems to be facing difficulties! But I hope you find love soon, I really do.
Not over 40 but why would a guy want a self proclaimed “sTrOnG iNdEpEnDeNt wOmEn” who love to scream how they don’t need no man. Why would a man want a girl like that. You don’t understand men very well. Guys want to feel needed. And you women who go around saying you don’t need men and even act like men and are masculine of course guys don’t want you. Plus women like you are often high maintenance, assholes, narcissistic
1
2 Reply
Asker
+1 y
well thank you for stating something that is a reflective you only. Generalization is only the language of ignorance with all due respect. Anyway thank you for passing by just don't get too excited attacking someone you think you know based on a perception. I have never claimed in my life that I don't need a man or that I hate men or nothing of that nonsense. I meant independent financially and strong to deal with life hardships and stand by her man side regardless. Mentally strong to be patient, kind, wise and understanding. Also I pay for my own stuff how can I be high maintenance to a guy 😹.. find a trophy girl she will suck you dry for beauty and material things. Anyways, thank for passing by Im not here to argue as you are entitled for having an opinion. have a lovely day.
Cluelessness is annoying. The interest of an independent woman means something. She doesn’t need me but wants me anyway.
1
1 Reply
Asker
New+1 y
A very successful wise man once told me, I feel proud walking next to a confident, successful, independent woman. It shows that I have such a great essence to offer and that she loves me for who I am and not what I have. He also said that is why I don't restrain her from spreading her wings or control anything she does ''she is with me by choice'' and I am with her by choice.
Beautiful and clueless. What in the world are women thinking when they think men want a "successful independent" woman? They've been watching too much television.
Men want to be the head of the household and the ruler of their kingdom. It's nature. Yes, some men are more gay than others and probably like a woman who is more like a man. But normal men want a women, not another man.
Beautiful and clueless. That way she will obey all my commands ( i. e. make me a sandwich) and I have somethong nice to look at. And if she doesn't talk even better.
Of course the chances of finding a women who does not talk much are close to zero. But a man can dream.
It looks like the more successful and independent the women is even if she is pretty the less older successful men wants to be with her.. why is that so? it is because putting two big ego together in one place isn't likely work , especially on long term..
0
1 Reply
Asker
+1 y
I see. It could be the case for some it is true. Thanks though.
IT depends where in the world the man finds himself like if he is in a a south America country he would go for the clueless one to work with and enjoy it mean wild any clueless or successful woman in those countries are interested in what they can get out of him
You are setting yourself up for failure. If your career paths conflict (job location, hours worked, etc., especially when kids come along) you will both be miserable. Who needs that.
Independent whether she is successful or not. I could never deal with a clingy dependent woman. I don't care if she's highly intelligent or below average. I don't care if she's beautiful. But she does need to be independent.
I'm not over 40 but I don't think I will change my view on this: I'd rather go with a clueless sympathetic, sweet girl than with a unlikable boss ass successful bitch.
Most Helpful Opinions