Do you think men should just say no to dating and marriage and just give themselves to whomever they want whenever they want?

[VanillaSalt]

Considering the rate of divorce, unhappy marriage, family court cases, infidelity, among other things... Should men just say no to monogamy?

Where is the benefit of monogamy for men? Why should men control their desire with “these women”, you know who you are, are out there doing whatever?

Monogamy

Polygamy

Other. With comment.

[SunsetRise]

I could say the same about women. Shouldn't we just give up dating and marriage and give in to hookup culture because so many men are against monogamy now? Especially younger guys today.

To answer your question "Where is the benefit of monogamy for men? Why should men control their desire with “these women”, you know who you are, are out there doing whatever?": The benefit will always be the same for each gender in the end - both parties want to achieve happiness and love within a committed relationship. They want to live out their days with one specific person, perhaps have a family. Happiness in life can mean different things to different people. If being in a committed relationship is it, do that. If hooking up with someone different every night is it, do that. But in the end, hooking up with different people to never see them again can be quite lonely. No one likes being lonely, humans are social creatures. Also, we can say the same about men: "Why should women control their desire with 'these men' who are out there doing whatever?" It goes both ways.

Men are already saying no to dating and marriage as we speak. Some are really against it, for some reason. Maybe it's because they think their personalities aren't good enough but the way they use their dick is? Or because toxic feminists bash them for everything they do so this is the way they're revolting? Or because they figure they can have kids at any stage of life so it's better to wait? I don't want to put this kind of pressure on anyone but women don't have that kind of time. We're looking for men who are open to having a family in their late 20s-early 30s. That's when we can have kids before our reproductive systems start maturing. But if you really want to say no to a lifelong commitment, that's your prerogative. Just know that lots of loyal women are out there ready to get married and have kids and share their lives with you.

[Abtraction]

you're delusional, men want a relationship and families, most of the women file the divorce and then divorce-rape their husbands.

Add to the problem with many young women rather ride the CC than start a family and then get older and the older men are not interested in families after any research in the risk of marriage.

The problems is the Family courts, they are totally corrupt and it's just too risky to deal with women.

[VanillaSalt]

Women can say no but this is about men not women.

[VanillaSalt]

I also wanna say I’ve seen none of these loyal women. I’ve seen cheaters, users, and generally annoying women but the women you’re talking about are free and fat in between

[Elena_the_Star]

So you would be okay with children being born without any kind of " family"? Where your step-brothers or step-sisters ( no real blood siblings because who would tap that again and again?) are the result of a one night stand and so are you and everyone would have different baby daddies? Where your mom and dads ( if you know who he is in the first place) have a series of fuckbuddies coming and going?

[Browneye57]

If you never commit to a woman you never experience those benefits, that level of loyalty and commitment in return. It's all fine if you're never going to start a family.
Love and commitment is an outward emotion - where you're filled up with everything life gives and ready to share it with someone else. Some people just never get there, and that's fine too - they should not marry.

OTOH, abundance mentality and not getting into one-itis does have it's benefits. Some call it spinning plates. You have several plates, some fast, some slow, some will drop themselves, some you drop. If one in particular is especially appealing, then you can let the other ones drop.

[exitseven]

Just before I met my wife I went a little bit crazy. I just ended a long term relationship. I dated 5 or 6 girls during a 8-9 month period. Sometimes I dated more than one simultaneously once I was with two on the same day. Some of these girls were bimbos but some were nice. I treated them all badly. I regret this but also, I was not very happy during that time. I met my future wife after that and I knew that I just wanted to be with her. She made me happy.

[VanillaSalt]

I’m happy for you. I think most men strive to have what you have. I have Cole to the conclusion most men will never have it though. Especially with so many men either turning off or alternate options like sexual orientation and porn.

[exitseven]

that is sad.

[Anonymous]

I think guys should do what is in their best interest. To that end, for most guys, casual sex and friends with benefits relationships are best. Marriage is a bad deal on multiple levels for most men today and should be avoided.

[SunsetRise]

Why do you think that?

[Opinion Owner]

@SunsetRise "Just know that lots of loyal women are out there ready to get married and have kids and share their lives with you."

Sure, OK, that's no surprise to anyone. But here is the reality men face today. Half of marriages end in divorce, and 70% of those divorces are filed by women. And when a woman files for divorce she has the backing of a very pro-female, anti-male court system that ensures women almost always come out ahead in divorce settlements and child custody settlements. And let's be honest... women almost always take FULL advantage of that when the time comes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlSwsE22nX0

Let's also be clear about the fact that men get far less from marriage today than they used to. Let's take a peak into the past and consider the life of a married man. He would get up every day, have breakfast with his family, prepared by his wife, kiss his family goodbye, go to work, put in a hard days work. He would come home to a home to an appreciative wife, a clean house, a home cooked meal. When the weekend came he would get to do something fun with his family and work on home projects.

[Opinion Owner]

@SunsetRise

Today, the same man gets up every day and splits the duties of getting the kids ready for daycare, maybe takes the kids to daycare on his way to work, he puts in the same hard day's work, but instead of going home to a home cooked meal, he probably stops at the dry cleaner's to pick up the laundry, picks up the kids at daycare, stops and the market to pick up groceries and supplies, and when he gets home he prepares dinner or works on the house chores that his mother did during the day 3o years ago. The weekend he gets to look forward to is one of chores and tasks that his dad would have done during the week.

Marriage is not at all what it used to be for men. Nor is it what it used to be for women, but whose fault us that? Whose choice was it that resulted in an economy that requires a dual income for the average family to survive?

Did men ask for this? Nope. Are they happy about it? Nope. Are women happy about it? Nope. Is marriage a good deal for men today? Nope. Are todays men excited about getting married? Nope. Are tomorrow's men going to continue supporting the institution of marriage? Nope? Is marriage going to survive more than another generation? Nope. Is it men's fault? Nope. Is it women's fault. Mostly, yes.

Do men still want sex? Of course, and they always will? Have women decided to make sex easily available to men outside of marriage? Obviously. Does that motivate men to want to get married, despite all the disadvantages women have created for men when it comes marriage? Ummm...

Did I answer you question?

[SunsetRise]

Kind of, thanks for the info. But it makes you wonder why it's women who always file for divorce, right? Like what did the man do for his wife to want to divorce him? Why do we have to blame women for everything that's gone wrong within a marriage?

It's a different time and I think it's completely fair that men should do the same amount of work as women do in or out of the house. They should know how to cook and clean and change a diaper. Women are not their husband's mothers, we will not baby them like we used to. And I think men are upset about that. Sorry not sorry, women are in the work force now too and we need to work together in the relationship. How else is it going to work?

My mother is the bread-winner in our household while my dad comes home early and makes dinner for the family and does outdoor work before she comes home. They love each other, even when my mom can be difficult. My dad would do anything for her, even if he's lazy some days. You can't expect a woman to do everything for you today, unless she wants that life with you.

You can't tell me that you're disappointed that a woman makes her own money and expects more from her husband when they both get home from work at the same time. They both need to work together. Give and take equally.

I also don't understand... What specific disadvantages have women caused for men in marriage? If we're the ones who want to divorce them? Whether it's for cheating on her or not raising the children with her or just not the man she married years ago?

[Opinion Owner]

@SunsetRise "What did the man do for his wife to want to divorce him?" Lol, like most women, and society in generally, you automatically assume that the man did something that caused the woman to divorce him, which the fact show is wrong. ifstudies.org/.../lets-stop-blaming-men-for-divorce-a-response-to-harry-benson

Your assumption, no doubt, is that men cheat and that's the reason women divorce. You should educate yourself instead of feeding your bias with tired old stereotypes. Here are some facts you should start with. The average age for divorce is age 30, and at that age the rate of cheating is virtually the same between men and women, and during their 20s women actually cheat significantly more than men.

www.businessinsider.com/alarming-facts-about-divorce-in-the-us



Consider that 70% of divorces are filed by women, and the number one reason for divorce, by far, is lack of commitment. www.insider.com/why-people-get-divorced-2019-1 Today's women lack commitment, and they are enticed by a female-biased court system and a self-serving nature to take full advantage of it. Women are clearly the primary reason for divorce today, and they are destroying the institution of marriage and the primary victims are their children and husbands, and society in general.

In the past neither men nor women worked nearly as hard in their marriages and their counterparts do today. Why is that? Because the economy has fully adjusted to the two-income household model created by feminism. Both genders have suffered as a result, and men are NOT the ones who asked for it.

Regardless of whether marriage is fair today, it is not attractive to men, and that is because of women. Marriage is dying, and that is because of women. Society is hurting at every level because of those changes, and that is because of women.

[SunsetRise]

I don't agree, but okay.

[Opinion Owner]

@SunsetRise Of course you don't agree, because you have been lied to for years about what is happening, and when you hear it the truth stings. And yet you as a woman are complacent and feel just fine standing by as your gender destroys the institution of marriage while you do nothing about it.

[SunsetRise]

I'm sorry you feel so bitter about it but I simply don't think it's true. I think there's just a lot of complaints from men who have been rejected or divorced. And you're right, I'm going to stand by and watch as all of my fellow women become stronger and not as willing to baby their boyfriends and husbands. Good luck in your future relationships, if you have them.

[Opinion Owner]

@SunsetRise Nothing wrong with being strong, as long as you do the right thing and take responsibility for your shit, something today's women are terrible at. It's time you women stopped blaming men for everything and started taking some ownership for all the harm you are causing to men, children and society.

[Abtraction]

@SunsetRise lmao, I don't agree is not a response. it's either I'm too weak to accept it or too dumb to provide any counter argument.

[Opinion Owner]

@Abtraction Agreed. Facts are what matter here, not opinion.

[VanillaSalt]

@SunsetRise is not about who’s did wrong. It’s about what that wrong costs. A man unable to make his wife happy shouldn’t lose the house and kids. And it’s common for women to Cheat file divorce and win the same as if just the man cheats.

[Abtraction]

Men should never marry, the women can't commit and the risks are far too high.

This is a fact.

[VanillaSalt]

I disagree with your “they can’t commit” comment. I think it is however unlikely and divorce destroys most men in one way or another usually financially. As long as that’s possible marriage isn’t the answer.

[Dchrls78104]

Given what you are saying, all men should be celibate! Why bother to have anything to do with females in the first place?

[VanillaSalt]

Or just sleep around. But yes that’s the point. What’s the point to a system that’s stacked against you?

[Anonymous]

Works both ways. Don't complain if women decide to be polygamous too.

[VanillaSalt]

If you pay attention a large portion of women are polygamous. Look at sex partners before marriage and rate of infidelity in marriage. There’s definitely a push for more open relationships.

[SunsetRise]

@VanillaSalt I feel we are more polygamous only because men don't want committed, long-term relationships. We are most times forced to have open relationships or speak to many men because we are impatient or unlucky in finding a loyal boyfriend or husband. And then we're called sluts or whores because of this. Seems messed up to me.

[Abtraction]

@SunsetRise ehhh, you must be slow. It's women who are leaving husbands. That is a fact. You can complain all you want but women do most of the filing. Young men may not want to commit, that's understandable. But for existing marriages it mostly women who bail and ruin the family.

[VanillaSalt]

@SunsetRise studies show 80% of women choose the same 20% of men. These women CHOOSE. Men don’t choose women choose. If we date he asks she says yes or no. If we have sex she says yes or no. Men will list sky rays yes yes to sex. You need to accept the responsibility women have for making bad choices.

To be clear. I’m not attractive. I’ve been told yes 3 times. I made the first move all 3 times. They cheated all 3 times I have never. I spent years growing best the best I could. I make 70k/year. Is not amazing but she don’t have to work and can have a comfortable life. I have many desirable qualities. Where’s my amazing woman that exists out there?

I’m not crying. I just want you to understand being good isn’t enough. Being able isn’t enough. It bothers me that you can’t understand where average men come from and yet want to throw most of today’s relationship issues at men’s feet.

Also. Who do you think most men value more. You working hard all the time too tired to care for him or the woman that devote herself to him? It’s against men’s nature to settle down. We do it cause we found someone special... or to get sex. But we can get sex easy now without settling. And women have become more what they want and less what we want. Marriage isn’t a good deal anymore.

[Abtraction]

lmao, SunsetRise knows nothing about relationships. She's young so I give her some space. But at the rate she's going, she's in for a rude awaking at 26 or so depending. Thanks mostly because of her inability to see the facts presented to her. Just like most of these women in their 20's. They think I'm here just to hurt them or make them look bad, I'm here to present facts and help them.

[VanillaSalt]

Facts change depending on the angle and light you look at them through and from... you are not all knowing either. I agree but I’m not here trying to change minds. Just make people understand what’s coming. Let them make up their own mind by seeing this...

[Abtraction]

never said I was, but definitely smarter than the average bear

[SmolSlav]

I personally am in support of polygamy, monogamy just seems rather pointless

[VanillaSalt]

I support monogamy. It’s just I don’t see a future for monogamy with today’s people. Hell I have always loved helping people and I find myself just saying fuck it to women changing tires on the side of road and well people in general. The world’s gone to hell and I’m not getting caught in it.

[SmolSlav]

@VanillaSalt I don't understand what you're saying

[Anonymous]

Infidelity isn't monogamy, but unsatisfied polyamory. That is the problem. Monogamy is for life term. You keep that, you don't get the problems you stated.

[Anonymous]

It is a personal decision but I can understand men who decide to eschew marriage and also guys who still want marriage

[jshm2]

Why?

That's as daft as saying governments should just throw money out onto the streets.

Get your head examined.

[VanillaSalt]

You provided so much reason to what your saying. My god I might have to convert tonight!

[Joshua213]

Why should they?