I really want to make peace with a family member that I put up a boundary with. But she refuses to chat with me in private?

[Anonymous]

I got a lot of anger towards my mother. It’s not about the mistakes she made but it’s about her attitude about the mistakes she made. She’s the type that believes admitting fault = admitting defeat. I can count the times on one hand I’ve ever heard her apologize for anything.

I’ve gotten both professional and spiritual advice on how to deal with I it. I was told to keep a respectful yet superficial relationship. It’s been very tough but that’s how it is. I just can’t trust her advice/judgment when I am dealing my problems.

Any way we have very limited communication for the last few years (my choice). I was very direct that I wanted to speak with her privately about issues because she’s afraid too. She always brings my dad as “her enforcer/bodyguard” with her. He will defend even though he knows she’s very wrong about some issues.

Fair or not that would be expected when I was a teenager living under the house. But I’ve been a fully independent man for literally 20 years now. It’s completely insane she can’t talk directly to her own son (who is a grown fully independent man) if it’s about something that might make her uncomfortable.

With all that said I keep getting reminders that life is short and mortality is very real. I am not putting up with a boundary to nurse a grudge but rather it’s about resetting the dynamics of how my mother talks to me (extremely critical and inappropriate).

But she’s used to always getting her way as an adult (my dad always caved into her). She doesn’t want to change. I just wish there was a way to say what I want to say. It’s not about holding a grudge but about reconciling it.

[Amy10223]

If your Mother refuses to meet with you in private, then it says more about her, then it says about you. First of all, let me commend you for being the brave one to want to speak with her. She obviously, from the little you have described about her, has many emotional/psychological issues. To be honest, you putting up a boundary was good for your own health. We all need to and should, put up healthy boundaries with many people. Especially if she was critical with you.

That said, do what you can. If she refuses to meet in person, write her a letter, explaining what you feel and what you had hoped for with the relationship between the two of you. I'm sure you will not be judgmental about her, or write harsh words, from what you sound like. Once she receives the letter, she can choose either to meet wit you if you ask her again--or not--but if she doesn't then it is up to you in how you want to proceed. If you don;'t want to break off ties completely--then continue to meet her with your father, and address her as you would in private. If you decide not too, I can understand.

Sometimes fear is what keeps us from doing things that we know are good for us. Sometimes it keeps us from getting hurt and so we avoid certain actions. I think your mother may be fearing or, feeling guilty, about the way she has treated you. She does not know how lucky she is to advice a son that will come forward.

I am personally estranged from one daughter. After a time of hardly any communication, there was a death in the family of her father. I did not attend the funeral, but helped her get to the state it was in. She thanked me for the ticket, but weeks after she wrote a list of grievances that she was unhappy with when she was much younger. We kind of made up and I was so happy to hear from her and see her again, ad she invited me over her apartment for my birthday. But then later I messed things up when I paid for something for her school without her knowing. she wasn't working at the time, and I thought I could help her this way. She said I used her personal information over the phone and was upset about that, and told me that we no longer had a relationship. Every day I pray she will come forward, but so far she hasn't. She was always moody as a teen, and was very sensitive so I had to watch things I said. The strange thing about it is--the list of grievances she had written--some of them were kind of warped, and did not describe me at all. She made me sound very different. It just goes to show that no matter what you are like--some people will take or see things differently than you do.

Good luck!!

[Asker]

I can’t completely cut out my mother given I have to interact with her at family events. My dad is a huge part the problem. When she doesn’t like how I react / talk to her she blames it on him “for not raising a good son” which is 110% false. Then he turns around and guilt trips me. It’s ridiculous.

Anyway she’s been playing super “nice” in recent times. She thinks I will eventually come around. But I made a fundamental decision to put up this boundary years ago and although very painful I have no regrets. She has literally lived her entire life suffering zero/little consequences for her bad behavior. Doesn’t help she was physically beautiful which enabled her even further on all this. Gave her power over men namely my dad that she got used to abusing.

But the biggest thing I am angry about is her unabashed hypocrisy on several issues.

[Amy10223]

I would write to her about how you feel and her hypocrisy on those matters. In a very diplomatic way, without giving too much into emption or anger---give her examples of what she did that you feel was wrong. Let her know this is the reason you decided to put up this boundary.
If you are angry with her after 20 years, she must have said and done some pretty bad things, but---I wonder if any of your therapists has ever spoken to you about forgiveness. Your anger will eat away at you unless you can do that. Think of yourself as forgiving her for being the person she is. You can forgive her, but not forget of course. Once you do, you will feel much better, in my opinion.
Once you point out the things you are/were upset about --that is part of healing yourself because you have finally let her know where she stands with you and take that off your shoulders. Then it's up to her what she decides to do and of course--you as well. It's important to heal yourself from the pain she caused you, but also let her see for herself the things you found wrong, but do not expect anything-- not even an apology. Just let her know.

[Amy10223]

** emotion, not emption

[Asker]

That letter will be intercepted by my dad and later she will use him as “her messenger” about all that. He’s literally her bridge to the real world on a lot of issues.

He has stuck with me with very unfair cheap shot questions in the past with “Joey do you love your mother?”. Her mishaps and misbehavior always get swept under the rug. He always intercedes on her behalf. Always takes a bullet for her.

She was also quickly blame me for my own shortcomings. Not to say I should ignore my own faults but it’s extremely rare when she isn’t automatically defensive.

The letter isn’t a bad idea in concept but it won’t work. Probably make things worse.

Truth is I am remotely suspicious that she has an affair years ago and she’s afraid “I might know”. I am not going to pry on that nor do I care to know the details. But if that’s the case it would be the ultimate hypocrisy. She was always unfairly accusing my dad of that but my dad would “joke” about the local weatherman having a crush on her (she met him in person at grocery store many years ago).

She was also extremely critical do my brother and my relationships with women. Whenever there was a problem she would “protect the poor girl” we were dating and asume the worst about us. Beyond hated her for that. She put “her image” above everything else. Extremely selfish.

Anyway I am venting. I’ve gotten plenty of therapy about this already. But I am at an impasse and it gnaws on me. I don’t like it but it’s how it is. She doesn’t want to change nor take accountability for her mistakes.

thanks for hearing me out.

[Asker]

by the way I have “forgiven her” spiritually. But I got to still go about this superficial relationship with her. It’s uncomfortable but if she wants a real relationship with me we have to have a chat about what I am angry about. She’s just too scared to do it. It’s been 8 years now.

[Amy10223]

It seems to me that you want to express how you feel about the things that have happened in the past, and it’s frustrating because she’s afraid to talk, and your father adds to the barrier. Is there any way you can give her the letter without your father knowing?
Can you call her instead? If that’s not possible, ask her to call you because you have something important to talk to her about. Request that she is alone to talk to you without interferences from other family members. Your father needs to respect that but I guess he is just protecting her feelings. When you speak to them, what are your emotions like? Do you speak in a calm way or are you very emotional? This may be the reason why she is not agreeing to talk.
Would they agree to a consultation with a family therapist? That would bring you all together and have each of you have their say. But my feeling is your mom may not agree. You can try asking them both.
In the meantime, you can’t bury your anger as it may turn into depression of some sort. I would definitely do things that you enjoy, exert energy on things like exercise, walks, sports, and so on. Pick up a hobby you always wanted to do. They say time heals wounds. Instead of letting this gnaw at you, realize she isn’t perfect. No one is. Also understand that you are not at fault for any shortcomings she may have— that’s her and it is not your responsibility to try and make her into a better human. She will realize this one day.

[Asker]

I tried all that earlier. Even offered to pay for a family therapist. She initially said yes and then changed her mind saying “she was too busy”. It was the weakest sauce ever heard from her.

Even if she does get a letter from me she will immediately show my dad and he will be the first to reach out to me.

Anyway she’s got her own deep seated issues with her own mother. In her mind she thinks “it her turn” with me but I called that out. Funny that she’s bitchy to everyone EXCEPT those who were nastiest to her. Has to do with child hood trauma.

Anyway I am mostly angry about her preaching about being “a good role model” to my younger siblings and yet she was a horrible female role model by how she treated my dad. If my dad did to her some of things she did to him he would be in jail for domestic violence. And this lead to me not trusting women and/or being too nice/chivalrous to women who don’t deserve it (which they took full advantage of).

I’m also pissed off at my dad. I get it that he’s afraid of dying alone. He’s very idealistic. But still he shouldn’t tolerated what he did.

[Amy10223]

I would bring up points when your Mom sounds like she is being hypocritical. Be as diplomatic or even sarcastic, but make her aware. For example, is she says, "You shouldn't be this way, you should always..." you can say, "Oh, like the time YOU did this?"... this way if you can't give her a letter or talk to her, she will know how you feel and that you're not blind. I feel bad for your father, he sounds innocent and always on her side---but he doest it because he doesn't want to be left alone.
Good luck with it all and thanks for the MHO.

[Asker]

@amy10223 good timing. The thing is I can go through my daily life just fine but when I start thinking about my mother I find myself spiraling into resentment, hatred, bitterness. It’s a deep anger riddle I can’t solve.

And about my moms hypocrisy I used to call her out on it. That is back when we used to talk. It just goes in one ear and out the other. Just believes she’s “very special” and/or I’m just an ungrateful son. BUT there are some issues where several other family members have come down on her and then and only then does she change. She listens to my little sister.

But you are right about this. And my dad IS a part of the problem. Huge part. In his defense he wasn’t born a “simp”. But he had chivalry pounded into him at early age my late grandfather after he lost his infant sister to SIDS. And my grandfather came from a generation where women actually respected chivalry.

Combine that with decades of being worn down and the fear of dying alone leads to my dad caving. But ironically me stepping up to my mom has HELPED him. She’s seeing for the first time in her adult life that there are consequences to her bad behavior. She especially feels above reproach when it comes to unfairly criticizing men. But now she’s seeing she can go too far.

[Amy10223]

I’m glad to see she’s realizing that she’s not going to get away with everything and that the family sees this too. I’m also glad this is helping your Dad, you standing u to her.
Maybe at some point he’ll come forward and talk more to you about it. Take care.

[Asker]

by the way what you did for your daughter was very sweet. It also sounds like you are open to hearing her grievance regardless if they are fair or not.

[Paris13]

Some will Be Grudgebearers till The day They Die. But you Can Try. xxoo

[Paris13]

Thanks, Gag. xxoo

[noohair]

You are dealing with a dynamics that is not changing. Parents and children have been doing this for eons. You are not changing her. What I did was tell my Mom, you do what you need to do, I will do what I need to do. But if you cross this line, I am not going to listen or let you into my life.

[Asker]

I know I will never change her. But I want a complete fundamental change on how she communicates to me. She does it because it makes her feel relevant and she’s so conceited that she is still worrying about what I do will impact her own image. It’s all about her wanting to put on an “image” to impress other people specifically her own dysfunctional family.

The problem is she got away with this because my dad enabled that bs.

But to his defense my grandfather over the top pounded chivalry into him “to always protect women” given his own psychosis of losing his infant daughter to SIDS. My grandfather also grew up in a time when women respected chivalry more. Now many modern women see that was “weakness”’

[noohair]

It sounds like you are dealing with a narcissist here. And there is no point in getting her to admit to anything. You know she is wrong. A narcissist makes everything about her. And she has a hook in you and is playing you because she knows you want something from her. The adult thing to do is disengage, that destroys her power. Or you can dance like a puppet on her string and waste your time and energy. My ex wife is a narcissist. I learned that getting away from the sh! tstorm was the best way to deal with the insanity.

[Asker]

About four years ago she suddenly with no warning got up from the dinner table (at my place) and started yelling, crying and screaming about “being rejected” and ran out of my house.

This was a family get together before I left for long overseas trip. She did this in front of my sister and brother in law.

My dad chased her out of the house and came back the next day blaming me for everything. She did however text me a short “sorry” the next day. It must of took her a lot of effort because that was extremely rare. But if she wouldn’t have done that I wouldn’t ever had over my place again. It’s MY house that I OWN (ironically her favorite two words to say to me growing up with was “my house!” all the time whenever I did something or acted in a way she didn’t like.

Anyway your right. It’s a fundamental issue I can’t change. I can’t blame her for everything but she really set a horrible example of what to expect from women and how to deal with them growing up. I hated her for that. Also hate how my dad still puts her up on a pedal stool but it’s extremely rare moment when she exalts him.

[noohair]

You have the power to disengage or participate in the sh! tstorm. Your choice. I found peace in disengaging. I started to laugh at my wife when she did the drama thing. I had all the power and she had none.

[Asker]

thanks for your feed back. I disengaged 8 years ago. But has not been easy. My dad tried to guilt trip the living hell out of me.

[noohair]

Good for you. You have the power. Keep it. Good Luck.

[Asker]

It’s very painful. Lots of cognitive dissonance. I want a good relationship with my mom. But her ducking me for the last 8 years from having a real adult conversation has really screwed me up.

Truth is a part of me wants to believe that the problem is me because in that case I can change and improve. But her ducking me has confirmed what I longed suspected about her. And there is nothing I can really do about except distance myself which is very painful.

[noohair]

You can't change another person. Only yourself.

[Asker]

I know. But again this is tough. And it’s a real mind f that she (along with my dad) is trying to gaslight me on all this crap.

[strateguy632]

Cut off that toxi c mom

[Asker]

Easier said than done. I just want her to own up to all her hypocrisy. Own up to all her crap. She just refuses too.