Does anyone know how to care for an elderly person whose stubbornness is affecting their health and life?

[Genie23]

If anyone has been in this situation, I’d really appreciate your advice. The person I’m talking about has been on a self-destructive path for a while now, and I’m trying to understand them and keep fixing things every time they get into trouble or get sick, but they still keep doing whatever they want and don't listen.. Sometimes they even see me as an enemy when all I'm trying to do is protect them.

Things are getting really tough, and I don’t know how to help anymore. I’m just worried about their well-being.

[YourFutureEx]

Despite you knowing so much and reading so much and learning so much and knowing this person so well, everything you've told hasn't helped.

Stop saying, start asking.

When you start helping a person, you create a resistance. Any time you will push a human being, they will resist. It's human psychology. Like for example, when you tell your kid to put on a jacket and put on shoes as it's too cold. The kid will be like "no". But if you give the kid freedom to choose, you don't create the resistance. Instead of ordering, simply ask them, which one does he want to put on first, the jacket or the shoes, and he will gladly pick the order.

Instead of jumping right away and helping, you should simply ask. And no, do not ask "How can I help you?" It presumes that they need help. You haven't even agreed that they need help. Ask them "Do you want to change this?", "Do you want to do something about this?". Or don't even ask and show examples like "That person stopped doing this and it did wonders", "Instead of stopping, that person started doing this instead which was an healthier alternative" etc.

People imposing their own beliefs on what will improve someone's life is just overall a negative thing. Rather than understanding and them understanding for themselves.

Everything you have told them is going to help them, if applied.
Why is it not being applied? Because they don't want to.
How do we change their mind? They have to find that out themselves.
How do we help them finding out for themselves? Asking questions!

[Genie23]

I tried so many different approaches, to be honest. After over a year of him being stubborn, I thought let him do whatever he wants to so he doesn't feel like his freedom is being snatched away and ask him "what do you want? What would you like? What do you expect me to do? What will help you?" as often as I can but honestly, it's like he avoids serious conversations or doesn't know what he wants. Whenever I try to not stop him from doing whatever he wants. He ends up getting very sick or having an accident. Had it again recently. It breaks my heart

[YourFutureEx]

Don't we all know that there are certain things that we (yeah, you and I) do on the usual basis that are no good for us but still, we do it? We all know what's right and what's wrong but we have strong beliefs about our actions, coupled with lack of willpower and reason to change.

My father got mouth cancer (treated) but still he didn't stop smoking after recovery. Sometimes, he was like okay I have stopped, but then he was doing it behind my back. When I caught him, you know what happened? He was like okay, I tried to minimise it but now I will do it openly.

Why did that happen? Because I forced it. Your job is not to force but to make them acknowledge that you are there if they need you and try to show them optimism (as my dad had the faith that by doing it behind my back, he may reduce it to the point where he can stop). When I just let him be, about a year and a half ago, he actually stopped and he's doing great.

Acknowledge them. Be on their side. Don't make them a bad guy. You don't know why they're doing it in the first place as only they know how deep their scars are. As I may have said earlier, you can only do so much. Only worry about things you can control.

Or maybe they just want to live it their way in the final stages of their life and that's how they find the last fragments of contentment in this cruel world.

[Genie23]

True

I'm so relieved and glad to hear about your dad's recovery and him quitting smoking 🙏🏻🥺 It gives me hope.

I've communicated with him that I'm on his side. I'm not his enemy and that whether anyone will be there for him or not but I've stayed with him all my life and will always be there whenever he needs me. He ended up taking me for granted because of that as I have him freedom to do whatever he wants after he recovered from accident 2 years ago but since then he's been constantly doing everything that ends up affecting his health or he ends up having an accident. I wish he'd think twice before doing something that will affect him because not only he suffers but I suffer as well while constantly fixing every mess he gets himself in. But you're right. I'll try to remind him again that I'm not trying to force or control his life and that I'll be there whenever he needs me.

True. That quote is so deep.

Thank you for the helpful suggestion, P. I appreciate it.

[YourFutureEx]

It's not possible for me to pinpoint the solution as I do not have the knowledge about the problem but I can give you a trick.

Look at yourself. There must be something about you that other people have mentioned that is different from normal/average people and even you recognise deep down that it's destructive in some sense but regardless of how many people tell you about it, you are just contented with the way your reality is and you won't change it as your belief is all set about it.

But if you take a deep breath, look in the mirror and ask yourself, can't it really be changed? You know it can. Now ask yourself how can it be changed. Is there anything a person can tell or do to you to change it? Or only you can do it with your free will? Or is it both, like you need some trigger? Or is everyone wrong and it can not be changed or it's better the way it is?

Then apply that on that person in question. You'll be able to see things from their perspective. They have their own core beliefs about their situation. We all do. Even I do.

I will further add that if one thing didn't work, you should try something else, you know? You'll only piss them off if you kept doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results. Find different triggers. That's why I told you to introspect as you will realise the importance of using different triggers, hoping one would hit.

[Genie23]

I keep trying different methods and will continue to do so. I'll try doing what you said and see if that makes any difference. I can't thank you enough.

[ChicoFromThe305]

There is this biblical saying that goes like "don't throw your pearls to the pigs" meaning that the pigs won't see the value of the pearls you throw at them so you are most likely just wasting your value, in this case the value is your intellect and time, I'm not saying give up on the person but I do believe there should be a point in time where you stop trying to get different results when those results don't change, people only change or help themselves if they want too, if anything change up your strategy, you are a smart chick, I'm sure you'll come up with something.

[Genie23]

To be honest, I've tried so many strategies. Gentle approach, firm approach, letting them do what they want so they learn, tried to stop them before they could end up in some problem, tried to express how worried I feel when they act stubborn which results in their health getting affected and I also expressed how they often end up hurting me instead when I tried to help them when all I wanted for them is to live a healthy life. I even tried to convince them to seek therapy but they don't listen.

When I tried to distance as they have ended up hurting me many times with their actions and words when all I ever wanted for them was to live a healthy life but the moment I try to distance from stress and hurt, they often put me in guilt, says kind of things that feels like emotional blackmail and when I reach out again and help them, they become extremely difficult after couple of days. They do exactly opposite of what's good for them and treats me not so good.

I feel lost at this point and wonder is there anything I could do at all that will make him understand he's destroying his health and life

I'm feeling lost at this point

[Genie23]

Ignore that repeatedly sentence

[ChicoFromThe305]

Have you tried the ignoring strategy? Just ignoring everything they say when it comes to any of these things, whenever they talk about these health effecting things you either change the subject or stay quiet, eventually they should realize you keep doing it and then they will ask and then that's when you tell them how you feel, maybe that can change things somehow, although you saying that they blackmail you sounds messed up, definitely not a friendly thing to do, what do you mean by blackmail?

[Genie23]

I meant emotional blackmail. I get all these audio recordings where he talks about dying soon because he's getting old and how he got sick or he hadn't eaten anything yet or how he's leaving the state and going somewhere far.

When I'm fed up and decide to let him do what he wants. If he starts throwing tantrums or hurts me, I go quiet so he tries to get attention and then says "he's leaving forever" .. if I ignore sometimes, he doesn't like it. He tries to trigger my reaction by saying things that really drives me crazy or hurts me. So, if I ignore or let him do anything he wants to do, he eventually gets sick or has an accident. Then expects me to fix it just like I do everytime

[ChicoFromThe305]

Well you surely can't keep living this way, there will have to be a point you'll have to put yourself first if this person doesn't decide to change, because they are making your life more difficult, no matter the decision you make now, nothing that happens to him should hold you accountable in any way nor should you feel like you have anything responsibility for, you've already tried multiple times to help him change and he refused, I think proverbs 18:21 is a perfect set of words for this situation, "death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat it's fruit." Meaning that whatever negative things happen to him are from his own doings because he couldn't keep his mouth shut and everything he says he might be bringing to himself, if that is the case then there's literally nothing you can do.

[Genie23]

That hurts to hear but I guess you're right. There's nothing I can do until he allows me to help and be willing to acknowledge that there's something wrong.

Thank you for your input, Chris. Means a lot

[ChicoFromThe305]

Sure thing, hope things change

[Caroline91]

It kind of depends on whether he has dementia or not. It makes a difference. If he has dementia, he may need placement in an appropriate care facility or full time help at home, If he doesn't have dementia, there's not much you can do. My brother and I went through it with our dad. We even reported him to the DMV to try to have his driver's license removed because his driving had gotten so dangerous. Finally, after an injury from a fall, we were able to get him into a really good VA facility because he was never going to be able to live independently again. But, up to that point, we were not only worried about his own welfare, but about the possibility of him accidentally causing harm to others. One resource you might be able to use is the local Area Agency on Aging. But the bottom line is that It is tough both as far as the amount of your time that it takes and emotionally. Bless you for your devotion to your dad. He is a lucky man to have you.

[Genie23]

My father refuse to seek medical help as he believes there is nothing wrong with him but he's done some things and said some things that he didn't before. I see behaviour/personality changes. I see him confused and clueless at times but on other days- he's quick to think, sharp... acts like a young person. He has accidents 4 times since last year because he went on to do whatever he wants. No ond got hurt but him and because he's type 2 diabetic and he's overweight, he's wound got badly infected and was at risk of getting amputated. He keeps breaking his bones and then panics a lot. I keep helping him in hope that he'll start taking care of his health and won't do anything reckless that will put him in danger or affect his health but nothing good comes out of this as he created this cycle for the past 3 years now. I have siblings but everyone gave up on him. It's just me and I'm the youngest one. So, it's very tough at times but I am doing my best yet I feel am I doing enough? Why isn't he still happy with me?

Thank you so much for sharing your experience. It helped me understand that there's nothing I could do until he let's me help him and the only way he could be helped is if he accepts help from doctors who will diagnose the issue.

Thank you so much for your blessing. It really means a lot. 🫶🏻

[hannamontana]

That sounds like such a difficult situation. It’s really hard when someone you care about doesn’t listen and their choices put their health at risk. Sometimes stubbornness comes from fear or feeling a loss of control, especially with elderly people. Maybe try gently involving them in decisions, so they feel respected rather than controlled. Also, looking for support groups or talking to a professional caregiver might help you find new ways to cope.

[Genie23]

It is really difficult especially when I'm the only one who has been looking after him for 3 years and everytime I let him do what he wants to do so he doesn't feel like his freedom is taken away. I asked him what does he want/need but he seems clueless at times. He ends up getting very sick or having accidents. He recently had an accident again and also got very sick because he refused to listen and went somewhere and did some things he knew could put him at risk. He broke his bones in accidents more than couple of times since last year and got infected wounded because he has type 2 diabetes and other issues, yet he doesn't seem to accept that he is being careless about his health and refuse to let me hire a caretaker. He doesn't even want to speak to a doctor to see whether it's dementia that's been making him behave in such a manner. I'll try to involve him in decisions and hopefully that will help. Thank you so much for understanding and your advice.

[BadApple69]

You won’t like my advice but here it is anyway. Let them live their life their way.
Older people have lived their lives their way and don’t want people telling them what to do. Me personally, I want quality of life over quantity. We all have an expiration dates and eating fresh fruit might be better for us but that piece of cake isn’t really going to shorten our lives that much. That elderly person you are taking care of wants to live and die their way not yours.

[Genie23]

I can understand that but whenever he gets into trouble or gets sick or have accidents, he panics and reach out to me. He had multiple accidents since last year which lead to broken bones and ever since I let him do whatever he wants to he's been getting very sick often. So, I feel like no matter what I do, it's going to backfire

[BadApple69]

You are in a difficult situation and there isn’t an easy answer. Just when possible let him be himself. No one likes others controlling our lives…. That goes for the elderly.

[DishLady]

It's super complicated and depends (1) how well you know them and (2) what's ailing them. With things like dementia you unfortunately DO have to rely on professionals to do the job. It's EXTREMELY tough on kids to see their mom/dad not recognize them, for example.

You can't "FIX" the person and you also need to remember to be kind to yourself and get professional support to help you at home.

[Genie23]

Thank you so much for your input.

That's the problem. I can't find out the reason behind this behaviour as he keeps refusing to seek medical help. He doesn't want to as he thinks he's completely fine. If I try to help, he resist. If I take a step back and let him do what he wants to do so he doesn't feel like I've taken away his freedom or stop seeing me as his enemy, he still makes me feel guilty as he ends up getting sick or ends up having an accident again and then indirectly blames me for it. I don't even know how to help when he keeps rejecting my help many times until he gets into some trouble.

I have definitely noticed there are some personality changes in him. His thoughts process changed. There are some things he said and did that he didn't before. He seems clueless and confused at times.. other times he seems very smart/sharp and acts like a young person. I know something is wrong but is there any way I can convince him to seek help?

[DishLady]

The thing is… esp if it’s someone who feels that THEY should be caring for YOU, they will be upset with THEMSELVES and even with THE UNIVERSE and so they lash out. On some level they’re trying to get rid of you so you’ll WANT to leave and live your life. It’s all coming from a place of self-loathing and revulsion. You DO have to be strong enough to take that in stride.

Tough love… you tell the person… “You know? I love you, but I’ve had enough. You have two choices:” and you present the option of his cooperation with you or the option of his being treated with the home care attendant, who is usually tougher bc he/she has no personal feelings involved.

[Genie23]

I've had that conversation where I told him about the choices and that to either let me help and please be cooperative or I'll hire a caretaker. The last time I hired a caretaker for night shifts was 3 years ago. He was so bothered. He would try to get me to fire that guy so bad. He would often criticise him, complain and even made an offensive comment about him once even though I used to stay in the hospital for 14 hours and it would take me 4 hours to travel from home to hospital and way back to home.

What you said does make things clear though. He does seem like he can't seem to accept that he's now old and can't do the things he once used to and has type 2 diabetes.. knee issue because of accidents in his younger years. I'll just give him time to process and come back to me when/if he's ready to take help

[Tarifa]

Yes, unfortunately. Not that elderly, just older. It involved a divorce, mutual accusations of violence, alcohol and drugs. Some people are beyond help.

The first step to remedy a situation like that is recognizing there is a problem. The second step is the willpower to do something about it. The third step is accepting a helpìng hand. Without this, there's little you can do.

[Genie23]

If they don't feel there is anything wrong with them and don't even consider talking to a professional then?

[Tarifa]

I don't have the correct background, but it could be a serious medical condition that the person concerned is reluctant to accept. Or just thinks that it's not worth alarming other people around them.

Some people prefer to enter into an imaginary world where everything seems fine, because they're afraid to face the truth.

[Genie23]

That's what I think but he isn't willing to seek help so I can't find out whether that's the reason he's acting so difficult.

Anyway.. thank you so much for patiently listening and your input. I really appreciate it

[Massageman]

I checked with my wife, a professional counselor. Here suggestions - Read "Love Must be Tough" by Dr. James Dobson, "When Someone You Love is Depressed", by Rosen and Amador. You can try the Focus on the Family hotline for some real-time help with a counselor at- 1-800-A-FAMILY. We wish you well.

[Genie23]

Thank you so much.

[Massageman]

Hope it helps. We'll pray for a resolution for you.

[genericname85]

it's not your job to fix them. that's what you gotta understand. they are at the end of their life. let them have their fun. it's not like you're trying to protect a kid from ruining their future. their future is death. so just let them enjoy their time even if it's at the cost of a few years. just support them in their decisions. it's not your business to make them do what you think is best for them.

[genericname85]

maybe see their role not as trying your best to extend their life. but to increase their lifes enjoyment to the fullest they can have at any given moment.

[Genie23]

I don't make them do what I think is best, to be honest. I request them to look after their health and take meds as the doctors suggested. The thing is I've given them all the freedom many times. I let them do what they want for a while now but that seems to have backfired. He started getting very sick and he ended up having an accident again. So, when he messed up on his health or becomes badly injured and at risk of amputation, then he reaches out. I help but then after few days the cycle repeats..

[genericname85]

Well seems you're doing a good job then. Really what you can do is change how you feel about this, not how they behave. At their age, they're beyond correction. Just be there for them when they need you. And if you can't, they gotta get professional elderly care

[Genie23]

Okay. Thank you so much.

[llorando]

Currently taking care of my elderly father who's hasn't been quite the same since having sepsis. Is their any chance your father might be suffering depression? I think my father might be, but he refuses to get checked for it. Not much I can off as every situation is different, but it's good to remember being patience is really important to keeping the situation from getting worse.

[Genie23]

To be honest, I have no idea what's going on. I have noticed many behavioural changes and at times I feel like his personality has completely changed. I can't even recognise it's him at times. I tried to ask/convince him to seek help once but he refused to as he thinks there's nothing wrong with his behaviour and so, I don't know what he's suffering from as he won't let doctors diagnose it

[Genie23]

I'm so sorry to hear about your dad. I can imagine how difficult it must have been for you.

[llorando]

It's difficult but your situation with your dad sounds a lot more difficult, my dad is OK seeing his Dr. for a general check up, sounds like you're dad is refusing to see any Dr's which adds to the difficulty. I've noticed slight behavioral changes in my dad which I think is a combination of the sepsis and some form of depression which is common after suffering from sepsis. I'm not sure how health care works in India, but since he refuses to seek medical help, is it possible for medical help to seek him (something similar to a house call here in the US)? Sorry I couldn't be of much help, other the to just be patient and take things as they come.

[Genie23]

To be honest, I don't know whether it's possible. I'll try to check whether I could call them at home.

No, it's okay. The fact that you understand what I'm going through has made me feel kinda supported and better. It's enough. Thank you so much

[llorando]

Good to know I at least made you feel kinda supported and better. I'm here anytime.

[Iron_Man]

Don’t abandon the person whatever you do try to get some nursing some more help. Talk to the person try to work it out. That’s the worst thing that you can do just put them in a nursing home and they have lost their freedom. Those places are horrible and many people are abused It’s really bad in America the nursing homes. I can imagine how bad it would be in India.

[Genie23]

I never abandoned him. He had a horrible accident 3 years ago and I've been looking after him since then. Some nursing homes are good. Some are bad but I never considered admitting him in one. In fact, I fought with my brother over it as he wanted to take an easy route.

[Iron_Man]

I’m sorry to hear that. Thats good that you’re supportive of him and won’t do that. Well what are the chances of him recovering and getting him back on his feet? How old is he? Do you have some kind of insurance can you get some more help so you can rest more and go out and do some things that you need to do for yourself? That’s a lot of work for you it you are the only person that takes care of him. You need some rest and to do some things for you that’s a lot of work 24 hours a day for for example/ but you are to be respected for doing what you’re doing

[Iron_Man]

God Bless you

[Genie23]

He's 72 and he recovered from multiple issues. He is no longer blind, his broken bones healed, his sound that got infected due to type 2 diabetes healed. Doctor told me he was at the risk of having a heart attack... also coma. But he recovered and I took care of him and his diet. Made sure he becomes healthy. But as soon as he healed... He started becoming quite careless. He started eating everything he's not supposed to. He stays out until late even though he tends to fall asleep even when driving. He skips taking meds. He doesn't eat on time even though he needs to take meds. He often leaves hone and goes out. Travels but ends up having an accident again. He can't seem to be content. He wants to live the way he did when he was young. Very extroverted and outgoing.. with no health restrictions. No one to stop him. If you try to ask him to not do things that will affect him, he gets very irritated or angry or does completely opposite. Often argued. Often gets sick when I let him do whatever he wants. It's tough and I don't exactly get rest of even respect for being there. Nor from him or from my brother. But that's okay. I am doing it because I have a conscience. I just wish he'd make things easier. No, I don't have insurance that covers his expenses but that's okay. I can manage financially it's his behaviour that's difficult to handle.

Thank you so much for your blessing. Means a lot

[Iron_Man]

You are very welcome. I’m glad that he’s back on his feet. You did an excellent job. You should be respected and congratulated. As far as him being stubborn and everything else that’s on him. he should know better than that trying to be rebellious. After everything you’ve done for him. He can’t live the life of a 20 year-old he has to slow it down so he can maintain his health. Your brother should be more understanding and workable with you. What does he do to help out?

[Genie23]

He doesn't do anything. He is focused on his career and on his girlfriend. When he gets a day off or weekend off. He either sleeps at his home all day or goes to hangout with his girlfriend or friends. He doesn't want to take the responsibility. Put his hands up openly.

[Iron_Man]

that’s very selfish. I’m sorry that he is like that. You are wonderful for what you are doing. Your relative I assume is very lucky that he has you

[Genie23]

Thank you so much. That really means a lot to me.

[Iron_Man]

i’m glad it does. I appreciate what you’ve done. 😊

[lorenzomichael]

You just have to be patient like if they were 3yr olds. But really you have to have love in your heart to be able to do that. I know of some people that say they have love but can’t stand there own mother. As for me I have much love for old folks and little kids. What ever is bothering me when it comes to the old and the very young I just let it go.

[Genie23]

You sound like a very kind person. I'll try to be more patient. Thank you.

[lorenzomichael]

You’re more than welcome and good luck.

[DJB72]

My mum has dementia. It's not a good situation. We've hired a support carer for her during the day and I deal with overnight stuff. Medical aid here doesn't cover it.

Take it one day at a time. It's never easy.

[Genie23]

I'm sorry to hear that. I can imagine how tough it must have been. I'm handling it all alone but don't even know what he's suffering from as he refuses to seek help.

Thank you so much. I'll do that

[Xawyx-2]

I know a person just like that, but he won't listen, and he doesn't care what his doctor said. He has colon cancer.

[Xawyx-2]

By the way, it's my dad.

[Genie23]

I'm SO sorry to hear that, X 😞 I can only imagine how difficult it must have been for you. I wish he'd listen to you and start looking after his health.

[Xawyx-2]

Thanks, I appreciate your support 😇

[Genie23]

You're welcome ☺️

[Bklynbadboy12]

Well i take care of my father full time and he's pretty stubborn

[Genie23]

How do you handle it when he acts stubborn to a point it starts affecting his health?

[MasterKS]

You should let them do their own stuff, sometime being back is best option.

[Genie23]

Tried that. Ended up getting sick and having an accident :-/

[MasterKS]

@Genie23 sounds too bad, i just messaged you!

[Imsmurter1]

I'm facing similar problem with my grandpa. He refuses to let me look into his health record although he needs help with it cause he doesn't know English. So i dunno how to help well

[Staximus]

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make the bastard drink it

[wkhan_87]

Yes it is so tough, try your best

[Genie23]

I'm trying my best

[RageBabe]

Patience.

[jimmy2]

Yes it was me

[Genie23]

Is there any advice you'd like to share with me?