How often do women make the first move? (Page 2)
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I have been approached like a dozen of times. I barely talk to girls or even have girl-friends but still it has always been so for me.
I have approached like one or twice ever and got rejected once. My friend asked me to approach that girl by the way 😂
I did it only once. I figured if I made a move first, he's not really interested in me.
I am happily married to a man who chased me. If I had to chase him, what are the odds he's going to go down on one knee and ask me to marry him? Probably, never.
For how long did he chased you?
Just curious
@SportsNerd few months. Around 5-6.
Sorry to the 2 blue downvotes, it must be a bitter pill to swallow.
So you are saying you are happily married to a guy whom had you asked out, never would have never wanted to marry you?
@VIVANT yes.
@VIVANT Did this make you roll your eyes too?
@AllThatSweetJazz truth hurts.
Sure, but that doesn’t mean you should ignore it and buy into nonsense that makes you feel good. It might hurt you but you should face it anyway.
My friend confessed her feelings for a guy she’d been hanging out with and asked if he wanted to kiss. He said no and his mom came to pick him up. It happens.
We'll geez asking to kiss is super full on after first saying she likes him. She scared him off by being crazy. Of course he said no.
@MusicMayhem He lead her on for months making comments about how they’d be a cute couple and he really wanted to ask her out, so she really thought he wanted to be with her.
Doesn't matter. If you do creepy shit, you're going to turn people off.
Very rare. And if they do, it's usually not that direct as in your examples. They are usually more subtle about it and like to "hint".
I remember meeting one girl in a bar though, I thought she was hot, but I didn't think I had a chance in hell, but I guess she was into me also. General conversation turned into her asking me some personal questions (almost in an interview style lol), and then simply said, "hmm, maybe" lol
And a while later (don't know if it was the same night or a different one?), she then planted a kiss on me totally out of the blue. I just stood there in shock because I wasn't expecting it at all.
I thought about him so im expecting him to take the hint already
That seems like a joke, and if it is, it’s funny, but part of me is wondering if you’re serious.
Yeahhhh... a.. joke
Too real
The page isn't loaded
the pic loaded😂😂😂
Seriously though, if that wasn’t a joke then it really bakes my noodle.
Almost never. We teach women to do everything like men except date. As soon as you bring up sex and romance women want to be spoiled, pampered, courted, treated, and swept off their feet. It's one of the many, many, many failings of feminism and women's "empowerment". It's 100% hypocritical.
The one time I made a move the SOB had a girlfriend, this was in high school and they are still married after 20 years
Welcome to every man's life. Approaching people not knowing if they are single or not.
The majority of women I've dated over the last 20+ years have been the initiators. Their pick up lines have ranged from "where have you been all my life?" "to would an offer of oral sex get you interested?"
I do it pretty much with every guy
Well you are a unicorn my dear
I guess so. I just figure none of them have the balls to do it themselves; or they're taking too long, and I'm an impatient romantic lol
So I'm not alone.
@askuser
lol you guys are awesome 😎💚💚
Unless he's a hottie virtually never. As they get older though and their looks start failing them, they start putting on some weight, body parts start sagging, offers start drying up. Then they either get bitter or they start going on the offensive and start asking guys out. And now the shoe is on the other foot. Now it's the guys turn to reject them repeatedly. Oh believe me i feel bad doing it. But if you just don't feel that way about them you just don't feel that way. 😊
It doesn’t usually happen unless you made her really feel guilty for flaking on you in the past, or you’re already in a relationship, and she wants to have a guy she can’t have.
I don’t usually but the boy I’m with I’m extremely comfortable and tend to make the first move sometimes which he tends to like
I don't make the first move per se, BUT sometimes i innitiate contact in one way or another or open myself up to him feeling like it is ok for him to approach me in that way.
How so? Because if it's 'subtle' chances are we won't pick up on it lol
They usually do. Eye contact, smiling, a quick remark and then leaving him again to leave the ball in his court
It happen to me once but I was with my "friend with benefits" I guess you could call her although I was totally in love. I wanted to give the girl my number but I felt wrong because I didn't want the other one to feel bad.
True, to be honest that's how I got to know the second wife. It as at a friend's funeral. I was sat down have a coffee and bun when she came over and introduced herself. We started chatting and that was me hooked...
It’s not every man’s dream. Statistically men prefer to be the ones to make the first move.
Unless you want a dominant woman.
What? I'm as dominant as you want but it doesn't help me any. :( :(
"Statistically men prefer to be the ones to make the first move"
Take a poll and I think you'll find that's not the case.
can't speak for every guy
Of course there are exceptions.
The exceptions are those who prefer to make the first move.
You think most men want a dominant woman?
Probably 50/50.
"You think most men want a dominant woman? "
That's a different question.
I'm addressing the original framing of the question: Men *do not* have a problem with women making the first move. The vast majority of guys would appreciate it.
Then those men need a dominant woman.
Asking someone out is not being dominant nor is being asked out submissive
It’s just Being wiling you communicate clearly... most sane people appreciate that quality in a partner
And yes in polls men come Out Being OK with or preferring women to be clear in making interest known as is done by asking a person out.
It’s Just healthy line of communication.. I don’t see why it needs to be made complicated... just be clear. That’s never a bad thing. 🤷♀️😊
Asking someone out is absolutely a dominant persons role.
Communication or not, many people just don’t want to step out of that line of comfort.
Not saying there’s anything wrong with that.
"Asking someone out is absolutely a dominant persons role."
That's only *your* feeling about it.
If everyone else doesn't feel that is the case then -- and they don't -- then it should be understandable that most guys just feel the pressure of making the first move and would appreciate women doing it.
Conflating that as "the dominant role", deciding on their behalf what they want and that it reflects on the entirety of their desires as them wanting a dominant woman is inappropriate.
I definitely don’t feel like my asking a guy Out nor a guy asking me out is a dominant person role.,
I’m just relieved someone did something and we get to see if there is mutual interest
I don’t think much Thought Should be Put Into Getting the ball rolling. Just get started and see where it goes
I’m sure some guys see it as a test to whether they see dominant and that may help to e plain why they will reject a womsn even in the case where they like her... they may see it as a test and if they say yes she will see them as weak. Or That by her asking she is not acknowledging their dominance... I’m sure there is some of that.
Thing is in a mutually joined relationship in a democratic society no one is really dominating anyone it’s all an illusion. No matter how anyone Feels, it’s all mutual.
To me you either like a person or you don’t. I think I you potentially miss out on a lot by worrying who starts it off. Obviously not everyone feels this way.. But some do and there simply is not one way of looking at it.
in my opinion you have one life. This all seems like a waste of time. But then I’m sure I do things other people would find silly.
I do think Feeling free to communicate without worrying if you are in the wrong lane is likely Beneficial across the board
@VIVANT "they will reject a womsn even in the case where they like her"
That's not a thing.
@AllThatSweetJazz
It is it happens. I am not saying it happens majority of time, but it absolutely does happen. I’ve seen it and I have heard guys rationalize Doing just that as well.
Point is , Women are more wrong to Think some guys will react this way. But my point is why accommodate those guys at all and use that as an excuse to not be direct with the rest who would welcome it.
@VIVANT "I have heard guys rationalize Doing just that as well."
But isn't that reliant on your interpretation? I would wonder if these 'rationalizations' are simply good and valid reasons.
The rest is fair enough. I agree with the point.
You guys aren’t getting it that there are statistical data that says men prefer to ask out more than women do. It’s rooted in biology. Testosterone makes men pursue, not women. Not saying that they can’t. Just that it the the exception, not the other way around.
"statistical data that says men prefer to ask out more than women do"
That's not the same question. You're changing the framing.
If 1% of women prefer it and 2% of men prefer it then it's technically true that more men prefer it than women, but that doesn't mean that the *majority* of men prefer it, because 98% would still prefer a woman to do it.
"Testosterone makes men pursue, not women."
It's not some magic word that says men are going to do all these things. You're way oversimplifying it and it still has the same problems as with you statistical statement.
To put it very plainly:
-Men who prefer to make the first move are the exception.
-Most would appreciate a girl to make the first move.
www.psychologytoday.com/.../why-dont-women-ask-men-out-first-dates
More men do not prefer it than women.
I'm familiar with that graphic, I've tried looking for a source for it hoping I would find a properly published study but there's nothing. I can't find it in any of my university databases.
I've also tried looking for similar statistics but can't find any. It's the only thing out there that says that and you can literally poll guys right now and find out what they think -- you'll find they don't agree with you. So I do not accept that article as sufficient evidence.
You’d rather take a sample from the sub par male population of GAG? Seems rather silly. I’m sure you’d be right on that though.
Even if it was true that they are sub-par, what does that have to do with the result?
The question is about what guys prefer and there is a sampling of guys right here.
I think you'll get the same result from actually asking guys as well. If you have some arbitrary problem with guys on gag then go ask around elsewhere, you'll get the same answer.
There are some good guys here too, but there are far too many incels and mgtow here as well, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they’d rather be asked out by a woman, seeing as how they’d love to push more responsibility on to the woman against her preference, as is evident by much of their content here.
But these men aren’t in the market (largely by choice) anyway so what value would their vote hold anyway?
"push more responsibility on to the woman against her preference"
But it goes both ways, you're pushing responsibility on men. The only difference is that you seem to be fine when it's going in the direction you want.
"these men aren’t in the market (largely by choice) anyway so what value would their vote hold anyway"
Firstly, that doesn't mean their preference doesn't persist. It's about having a sample, specifically avoiding samples that you believe won't give you the results you want is not appropriate.
Second, I don't think they aren't in the market anyway. If it's by choice then you can simply ask them that too. It sounds like you're making up justifications to avoid their answer because none of what you've said excludes them from the data, even if were true.
But whatever, ask a proper sampling of guys in the general populace and you'll get the same answer.
I don't know any guys who say they prefer it and most guys I know are from university, just like the sampling in the article you're trying to use. But by all means ask a proper sampling of guys and find out for yourself.
I’ve got a poll up on twitter. @ashpariseau Look me up and cast your vote.
The twitter poll had interesting results. Can you separate the men from the women though?
The poll in the other question was similar to what I expected, though I think your framing skews the results, it's in the realm of what's expected.
The answers in the other question also reflect what I'd expect, which answers a separate question: Does it even matter? And the answer is no. Even if 100% of guys preferred to ask a girl out, that still in no way damages a woman's chances with a guy to be reason for her not to make the first move. So there's that.
I've been trying to find studies in databases that can have more data, but I'm not coming up with anything that speaks to our question. Though I found things like this YouTube video. This is generally what I expect to hear from a guy when asked. It's consistent with what I hear from guys when asked and it's consistent with the other question. The discrepancy is with the twitter poll and the graphic from that old article. The next step for those things would be to ask the guys who answered that what why they answered that way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fVsv_CmIn8
Woops, wrong video. Still, that's also what I expect from women's experiences, so it's relevant.
Here's the guys' one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCojIDHgnjY
If a girl really wants to ask a guy out or make the first moves, sure she can. But I would encourage her to keep a close eye on how he shows his effort and interest in her otherwise thereafter.
A lot of guys who responded to the poll here signal low interest and low self esteem.
Then there are the ones who said they were afraid of being labeled a creep which shows a lot of low trust in women and of himself and that’s a red flag.
There are plenty ways of showing your interest without looking like a creep. So I’m not sure if that’s a piss poor excuse or if they’ve just been coming on to a woman inappropriately in the past and labeled as creepy. I don’t know.
Hell my man is pretty introverted (I am too) but he still pursued me because his interest was that fucking high, he told his friends that HE was on a mission to have me in his life and that was very attractive to me, initially along with other attractive factors about him. Then I reciprocated the effort later on.
In my own past experience, I used to ask guys out in my early 20s, and that set the tone for the relationship. I ended to carrying them through the whole thing and I didn’t like that.
I’ve had several guys admit to me that while it’s flattering to have a girl ask them out, it takes something away. Some guys are aware of what that thing is and some aren’t. It’s that testosterone that makes a man want to pursue.
That’s why I encourage women to not just listen to what a guy says but watch what they do. What men say they want and what they respond to are often two different things.
If her asking him out works for you then more power to you.
I respect the guys answers who mentioned equality and meeting half way.
"signal low interest and low self-esteem."
I don't know what that even means, but assuming that's true -- whatever it means, so?
That's not an argument for anything.
"shows a lot of low trust in women and of himself and that’s a red flag."
Still not an argument for anything, even if that was true.
You also neglect the possibility that there's actually reasons not to be blindly trusting of women.
"There are plenty ways of showing your interest without looking like a creep."
According to you. The issue is that control of a woman's perception of you is extremely difficult. And from your perspective, you're only seeing the end result. Just because you saw something and called it creepy doesn't mean that that's the whole story.
"he told his friends that HE was on a mission to have me in his life and that was very attractive to me"
Yes, that's what *you* like, weird how that's the narrative you're pushing for everyone else. You shouldn't give people advice when you can't see outside your own narrative.
"I ended to carrying them through the whole thing and I didn’t like that."
Again, you're telling us about *you*. Who cares what *you* like? Only you and the people in your life. Other people work differently, and you shouldn't be trying to put them in boxes.
"I’ve had several guys admit to me that while it’s flattering to have a girl ask them out, it takes something away."
1. Cool, a *handful* of guys.
2. Within that statement is also the admission that it adds something too.
3. You're missing the point of the encounter. Even *if* it did "take away" something for *some* guys, the point is to get humans involved with each other; establishing relationships and forming connections. Guys and girls alike should be trying to grab onto something good that's in front of them rather than waiting around for something perfect. No one person's perfect story is going to fit two people.
"Some guys are aware of what that thing is and some aren’t."
Some guys don't even experience what you're talking about.
"It’s that testosterone that makes a man want to pursue."
No. Testosterone mostly relates to confidence and triumph. It doesn't "make them want" to pursue, it provides greater confidence to do so. But that still has nothing to do with why women shouldn't make a first move. Furthermore, testosterone doses come most powerfully *after* good things happen (triumph) -- incidentally this is why people saying 'testosterone causes violence' is a little bit bullshit too, but I digress -- so we find that a woman initiating provides that testosterone boost as well.
In short, your thoughts on testosterone are faulty.
"What men say they want and what they respond to are often two different things."
Okay, the same is true for women, and it's still not valid reasoning as to why a woman shouldn't make a first move.
"If her asking him out works for you then more power to you."
I agree that people should do what works for them. What I take issue with is your framing of it. You've got a narrowed view of what all this means and are giving advice to people that doesn't accurately represent them -- which I think creates its own problems. Basically, I'm saying it's often going to be bad advice.
As I stated before, men and women can do whatever they want. I just give my opinion based on my own observations and experiences, and I can give whatever advice I want, even if based on my own experience, which many people do actually care about. I’m one of the very few people of gag with a marriage lasting longer than 10 years. If you don’t find value in my advice, feel free to ignore it, but I make it my business to provide value and insight to those who want it.
Okay, but just so we're clear, none of that is a defense of your original position. It's just "agree to disagree", in which case, whatever. I think I've made an effective argument for anyone else who reads this.
The last thing I would add is that being married for 10 years seems more like it would speak to your authority on marriage, not on the early stages; navigating the modern social landscape, meeting people, making new connections. I think that stuff is a different kettle of fish.
A guy just recently commented on that thread about age. He says:
“I suspect that if you asked this question again and separated it by age, you would find younger males want the girls to ask and older males want to do the asking. These younger guys haven;t learned to be assertive with women because they text everything instead of dealing with women in person. Cowards way out!”
It does seem to appear that this is generally the case.
Age could be another factor, yes. I would also expect differences depending on nationality/culture. However, that still doesn't mean anything in relation to how people should act.
And then furthermore, I don't respect the "cowards" remark, I always find people who call others cowards to be pathetic themselves, there's no need to be dragging others down like that -- mostly it just seems masturbatory.
So I agree that there are probably many lines you can divide the demographics into, but I don't agree with the sentiment nor that it has significance.
I wouldn’t necessarily say it’s cowardice, but rather insecurity that influences the asker to think that it’s every man’s dream to be approached by a woman when it’s in fact not every man’s dream, but only some men’s dream.
Doesn't need to be their dream. That's irrelevant -- whether its many or some.
I think it's generally their preference to be asked (and that its not a commentary on power dynamics), but even that's irrelevant.
It's simply not an important detail when it comes to what people should be doing to get the ball rolling on romance.
It’s not important to you maybe but that doesn’t mean it’s not important to others.
But when you say "important" there you're referencing subjective value a person holds for something right? That's what I've been pointing out that you've been using. But what I'm talking about when I say "relevance" or "importance" is practicality. I'm making an assertion that -- regardless of what you personally hold to be important -- that it's not important practically; that is to say it's not what you *should be doing* to get positive results -- which is usually the function of advice.
Additionally it’s what one *could be doing* or *might want to consider* based either subjective or objective criteria to get positive results.
You could alter your behaviour based on a ton of subjective criteria, but I think there remains a philosophical argument to say that a particular set of criteria is unrealistic/unreasonable and that there is a practical way to go about this that at least approaches "true" beyond what is subjective.
But insofar as the subjective aspects are relevant, I've been saying the whole time that there's a lot of different ways to see things and even if you can't imagine another way it could be seen, you should just assume there's a perspective out there you haven't heard yet. So to bring it back to the start, framing these things as "dominant" and all that stuff is to assign a highly personal perspective to a population that largely doesn't share that perspective and encourages people to think in ways and make decisions based on subjective criteria that doesn't really apply to them -- if it were even relevant.
I do all the time but does it help me? Nooooooooooooooooooo!! I guess I'm too fucking ugly!
You ain't ugly. You look like 2003 Avril Lavine. In a good way
Thanks even if it is a lie. :)
I love your hair
Avril Lavigne?
Lol you’re not ugly. I always thought you were really pretty — even with your other pic where you look mad 😊👍🏻
@VIVANT Thanks, but I always look mad. ha ha
Maybe so, But some women look hot when they are mad. You are one of those women lol 😎😎
I dont make the first move when it comes to guys but I'll always help him out a little my smiling, making frequent eye contact or try to flirt/compliment him.
According to a survey in my country - 25% times the girl makes the first move and 75% of times the guy does
And I got no stories to share mate
I did and I was so nervous the first time but I wouldn't ever change it