My friend had an argument at a restaurant. She ended up handcuffed & gagged. Did the authorities go too far?

[supercutebutt]

Read about the unfortunate encounter and VOTE!

CALL THE COPS!

So I just found out that a friend of mine had an embarrassing thing happen to her when she was out to eat. She complained that her food wasn't cooked to her liking and that she wasn't going to pay because of that. The waitress insisted that she pay and my friend challenged that idea and told the waitress to focus on her job and that she was leaving. As my friend describes it, things took an unfortunate turn after that. The waitress insulted my friend's appearance which resulted in the waitress being subjected to having a drink poured over her head. Then an off duty cop restrained my friend by cuffing her. Keep in mind that no punches were thrown and all that happened is that a waitress got a little soggy. After some loud complaining, a security person literally taped my friend's mouth shut! After like a half an hour of sitting basically cuffed and gagged, the police showed up to resolve the dispute, which only resulted in a warning.

Did the authorities go too far or was what happened to my friend justified? VOTE BELOW!

I feel that she deserved to be handcuffed until things could be sorted out. Tape over the mouth, though? That went too far.

I feel that handcuffing her went too far. But I can see putting tape over her mouth if she was causing a disturbance.

She deserved ALL that she got! And I would have found this situation VERY amusing!

I am totally against everything that they did to her. None of this was justified!

The only time it is OK to tape a person's mouth shut is if that individual is a child. My parents did this to me when I would misbehave.

The only time I am for this type of restraint is during a romantic encounter.

Updates

1 y

You can read about the detailed encounter here:
I got Hancuffed & Mouth Taped for refusing to pay a bill and an argument with a waitress? Right to be annoyed? ↗

[libsaretards]

Lengthy answer warning. If you want the shortest answer, skip to last paragraph. Before giving my answer, here are some key notes. First, I am a Correction's Officer, which IS law enforcement and we learn the role of police and what powers they do and do not have. Second, a police officer has the authority to detain and arrest whether he is off-duty or not. His authority does not end until he retires, resigns or is fired as a commissioned officer or if he is outside his jurisdiction. So him being off-duty does not make a lick of difference. Finally, I only have what you have told me to go on so my answer may not 100% apply, depending on what has or has not been left out.

That being said, here is my answer. Your friend was in the wrong and technically committed theft and assault at a minimum, depending on local laws. If the food was not cooked to her liking, she should have said so and given the waitress a chance to address the situation. Regardless of if she like the food or not, the food was made for her so she is obligated to pay. To not do so is theft/any other applicable charge, depending on the local jurisdiction the restaurant was in. The waitress was wrong to insult your friend, but that was not illegal. Your friend pouring a drink on the waitress is assault in most jurisdictions. The off-duty cop had an obligation to restrain her to prevent things from escalating further. When a scenario like this happens, cops will ask the restaurant if they want to press charges and whatever the restaurant says usually happens. So the fact your friend got only a warning was the mercy of the restaurant. Had they wanted to press charges, your friend would have gone to jail.

While the police did nothing wrong, the security guard DID do wrong. Once police are involved (off-duty or not), security's involvement ends. The guard should have moved on. Even if the police allowed him to stay, it was not in his authority to gag your friend. That was for the police to decide, and they can only do so if she was spitting at people or trying to bite them.

Here is summing things up. Your friend completely was wrong and could have been held legally liable for her actions and charged with theft and assault. The security guard was wrong and overstepped his boundaries. The off-duty and arriving officers were right to cuff your friend. People get cuffed when they show aggressiveness. There is a difference between being detained and arrested, but both involve cuffs usually. Being detained is just a caution. Being arrested is when someone has something to worry about.

[Crafteroon]

Based on the information, she was offered less than adequate food. Considering she doesn't mention it again, it seems that they however ate all the food. Otherwise you use the plate as evidence, ask for a refund or a new dish.

Saying you're not going to pay and trying to leave is a no-no. You are essentially dine and dashing. Arguing with the waitress is pointless, while it's very Karen-like, asking for the manager is what you should do.

Escalating from words of frustration to throwing a drink on someone is really dumb. That's assault. If the drink is hot it can be even argued that it was made with permanent harm in mind. Words are easy, but once you throw a punch or a drink, you have lost the argument.

Also it's hard to say if the mouth tape was warranted, but generally once they feel the need to handcuff you, that's when you shut up and speak only when spoken to. The mouth tape implies she didn't do that. Her friends should have video taped the incident as soon as they found the handcuffs were needed.

You had a case with the bad food, but lost it by making one bad decision after another.

[supercutebutt]

In the update section I provided a link to the original question. You may be able to get specific answers to your questions from Alex herself. :)

[Crafteroon]

I based my answer on the information mentioned in both writings.

[Subarugirl]

The authorities didn't detain or gag her. According to her the staff and an off duty officer detained her after she became violent and assaulted her waitress... according to your friend she didn't say anything until AFTER she ate half of her food when she complained the lasagna was too creamy and wasn't warm enough...

She is lucky that she didn't do something like that to me because I would have pressed charges and prosecuted her to the full extent of the law... if I remember correctly the other patrons applauded after someone taped her mouth shut... that should tell you all you need to know about weather or not she deserved it.

[AlexM007]

Were you there?

[Sparkie460]

@Subarugirl I can see that we both feel the same way about this

[AlexM007]

@Sparkie460 A drink isn't assault, and they cheered because they thought i was the one instigating it cos they hadn't seen the whole thing, i shouted at her cos I had too cos I was at the entrance.

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 throwing your drink on someone is assault

[Sparkie460]

@alexmoo7 like I said, it all could have been avoided if you said you didn't like the way the food was cooked when you first started eating it. You waited until you ate half of it. I'd expect you to pay for the food too if I was the owner.

[AlexM007]

Not being funny I will give you further context at first we were made to wait in the seating area 32 minutes before being seated, I made a joke to the waitress about the fact her shoes were like fred flinstones and mocked my post sandals "its been raining and your in bright yellow post sandals" thats what triggered it all to begin with.

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 that doesn’t give you the right to go around assaulting people…

[AlexM007]

Right so by your logic your "assualted" every time you go out in the rain? didn't warrant aything, should have been allowed to leave.

[Sparkie460]

According to a police officer, Throwing a drink at someone is considered malicious mischief or assault punishable by 3 months in jail or $5000 fine

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 you seriously comparing weather to throwing something at someone’s head, hahah forget jail time you need an asylum and some medication…. Holy fuck

[AlexM007]

She provoked the reaction first and foremost, it was only in her direction secondly, and I was pushed slightly in return. So its hardly a big crime your being full on "Karen".

[AlexM007]

Oh and no one shuts me up so no "meditation"

[Sparkie460]

@Alexmoo7 if you didn't like the waitresses attitude when you first got there you should have spoken to the manager

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 you’re responsible for your own actions Karen…. Just because you felt insulted doesn’t give you the right to go around assaulting people

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 all I can say is that you’re lucky that you didn’t do that to me….

[Sparkie460]

@Subarugirl I'm sorry for butting in on your opinion

[Subarugirl]

@Sparkie460 oh no, it’s totally fine. You’re more than welcome

[AlexM007]

How am I the "Karen"/ Iknow I am, but I didn't do anything that warranted it

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 you assaulted your waitress…. Are you stupid or just slow?

[AlexM007]

Love how people actually find the fact I got "gagged" amusing even friends seem to think its funny, see how people find it funny they get drama over nothing.

[AlexM007]

Explain that then so I throw a drink at her so I then what do you think should have happened?

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 no I don’t think it’s funny, I think the whole situation could have been totally avoided if you’d acted like an adult instead of a spoiled brat

[Sparkie460]

@AlexM007 you were irrational and obnoxious. If you were more level headed things wouldn't have gotten out of hand

[AlexM007]

@Sparkie460 Not spoilt in the slitghest

[Subarugirl]

@AlexM007 then stop acting like it…

[Sparkie460]

@AlexM007 I mean come on, @Blackcosmo is a 14 year old girl and even she thinks you handled it poorly

[Sparkie460]

@Blackcosmo I'm sorry for mentioning you but I had to make a point. You're more level headed and rational

[Blackcosmo]

@Sparkie460 Oh no problem.

[libsaretards]

Technically she was detained. Being detained means she was not legally free to leave until the cops sorted things out. She was not arrested, but she was detained. You do not even have to be cuffed to be detained.

[Subarugirl]

Thank you for MHO

[Blackcosmo]

The whole thing could have been dealt with more professionally and I do think putting tape on her mouth was a little too far. Honestly your friend was already being rude and she could have just asked to speak to the manager "politely" but she didn't do that.

[supercutebutt]

Anytime you ask to see the manager these days, you get called a "Karen." You know?

[Blackcosmo]

Definitely but it's better than getting into a fight if you ask nicely. The thing about karens is that they demand a manager.

[supercutebutt]

Oh I see. You ask nicely instead of demanding.

[Blackcosmo]

Yup. Who knew people would find humour in people who are rude.

[Blackcosmo]

Thanks for the MHO!

[OlderAndWiser]

"which resulted in the waitress being subjected to having a drink poured over her head." That is a semantic device to try to minimize the fact that your friend poured a drink on the waitress. If the waitress insulted your friend, that was uncalled for, but it did not justify your friend's response. Pouring the drink on the waitress constitutes a simple assault and gives probable cause for an arrest. Based on your friend's post she was being very loud and was warned several times before she had the duct tape placed on her mouth. She had no right to be loud, obnoxious, and to ruin the dining experience for everyone else.

I feel no sympathy for her.

[supercutebutt]

Did you vote for option 'C'?

[AlexM007]

Ruining it for everyone else by telling a jumped up waitress some home truths? Gee, I bet your fun at parties!

[KrakenAttackin]

@OlderAndWiser. "When Karen's attack".

[D_Bone_Steak]

I read her original post... it all sounded pretty avoidable. My advice is don't drink like that if you can't keep your cool. She's lucky if you ask me... I've been in places where something like that will get you killed pretty super fast.

So some people mocked her and called her a Karen, they handcuffed her and taped her mouth. Big deal... I've had people try to murder me for not much more than being white and minding my own business. Throwing drinks and stuff... come on, that's retarded.

[AlexM007]

So what?

[D_Bone_Steak]

@AlexM007 So what? I'm saying it could easily have been worse. If you were in the wrong neighborhood they'd rape you and throw you in a dumpster, light you on fire, and use you as a hand warmer. Just handle the booze, put that place on your shit list for shitty food and move on. Don't start a bunch of shit where you actually get hand-cuffed and mouth taped shut. Like I'm pretty sure that wasn't an enjoyable thing. ... it was avoidable.

[AlexM007]

Right...

[D_Bone_Steak]

@AlexM007 Well you seem reasonable... your friend making it about Donald Trump and Mike Pence though... is she a nutter? I'm pretty sure Donald Trump and Mike Pence didn't put you in that situation.

[AlexM007]

Neither did i

[D_Bone_Steak]

@AlexM007 I wish the best for you, sorry you went through that bullshit... and hop supercutbutt realizes Donald Trump and Mike Pence are not the cause of everything that happens in the world. lolz. She's gotta be trolling 😂

[I_Can_Help]

@D_Bone_Steak you go on message boards claiming people all over the place are looking to murder you because you are white. That's quite a story. And you accuse others of being "trolls"? Why are you so despised? Do you walk around your neighborhood in a clansman's robe?

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help I'm just white in black neighborhoods.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help Don't worry... I understand it's all Donald Trump and Mike Pence's fault.

[I_Can_Help]

Trump's fault for sure. What does Mike Pence have to do with anything? And I'm surprised you were able to respond. I didn't think you'd last the night with all your murderers out there and everything.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help Hillery Clinton jumped out of the bushes and saved my butt tonight. It won't be long though... I'm pretty sure that sneaky Trump has a plan.

[I_Can_Help]

@D_Bone_Steak I read two of @alexm007 questions and in both she was being made fun of for being orange. And she specifically mentioned Donald Trump as a reason for being teased because he is also orange-skinned. So you can bring up Hillary all day long but she had nothing to do with what happened. Facts are facts. Maybe you should turn your skin orange? The change could save your life with everybody looking to kill you over your white flesh.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help... and you're being serious right now huh? Wow dude. Either you see how silly it is or you're eating it up hook, line, and sinker.

[I_Can_Help]

Are you calling @alexm007 a liar?

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help I'm not saying shit about her right now... just looking at you and wondering if you actually blame all the woes in this world on the 'Orange Man Bad' narrative. She actually opted out of blaming everything on Trump and Pence, but that supercutbutt blaming it on Trump and Pence is actually a bit silly. So you're in the same camp?

It's alright to just admit that a drunken happening in a restaurant might not have a lot to do with Trump and Pence... but hey, maybe that's just my opinion as well as alexm007's opinion apparently.

But if you're here to say it was all Trump just say it... It's not going to be something so crazy that I haven't heard it before.

[I_Can_Help]

@alexm007 specifically brought up Trump and you specifically brought up Hillary. Those are the facts.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help And I was obviously joking and context matters. Can you just pretend you've had your big "gotcha" moment and bow out already? You're trying to turn this into a semantic argument and nobody seems to be serious about everything but you now. You're dodging the "is it all Trump's fault" question just to try and jab at me... a guy that thinks it's stupid to blame some ex-president for a spat in a restaurant.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help If you're legitimately confused about anything I said, scroll down to the thread right below me and read. The one started by exitseven. If it's not painfully obvious as to why I was poking fun at blaming everything on Trump and Pence after reading that then I simply don't think there is any way I can help you.

[I_Can_Help]

Where did I ever say "this is all Trump's fault" prior to you bringing up his name? I only mentioned him after you said someone else mentioned him. And Trump was brought up because the girl who poured the drink over the head mentioned that she gets teased for her skin looking like his. That's the entire history of it. Nothing less. Nothing more. Well, until you blamed Hillary. That was uncalled for.

[D_Bone_Steak]

@I_Can_Help OMG just read! It's not my fault you wandered into dialog like a lost kid that doesn't know what the adults in the room were talking about. Read and figure it out wise guy.

[AviatorTom]

She caused her own problem. If the food was inedible, she should gave talked with the manager, and the manager would have taken steps to resolve it. Restaurants almost always go out of their way to satisfy the customer. Pouring a drink on the waitress was uncalled for, never okay to do that. The waitress us just doing her job, which us why you talk with the Manager when you're not satisfied.

It's not clear if your friend ate any if the food or not. If she didn't touch it, she was justified in not paying, and she could have just walked out... after talking to the manager. If she ate done if it though, the restaurant deserved the chance to fix things.

[AlexM007]

Again, I had EVERY right to refuse the service, so that once again is not "creating my own" problem.

[AviatorTom]

@AlexM007 Refuse the service? Yes. But no write to pour a drink on the waitress's head! Nor to yell and scream about it! If she talked to the manager and he was unwilling to do anything about it, she could have calmly walked out of the restaurant.

FYI, my then-wife and I had a similar situation many years ago. We ordered our food, and a server delivered plates to us about 30 minutes later... not what we ordered and cold. We talked with the manager who apologized, said she was short-staffed, and that it would be another hour before we would get what we ordered. We got up and walked out... the manager understood.

[I_Can_Help]

Boooooring.

A drink over the head of the waitress would have made for an unforgettable evening.

[AlexM007]

@I_Can_Help Hahahha

[Massageman]

While I can certainly relate to and appreciate "F", realize that law enforcement personnel of ANY kind just never know what is "around the corner", either physically relating to location, or in future time.
When working at a Jaycee event (decades ago), several of us working the event were help for questioning. The police told us to sit on a bench- one person per bench, so we couldn't talk to each other and make up matching stories- so we sat on the benches. No one was tied up, cuffed, gagged. If we sassed back, balked about it, etc., we would have restricted in some manner too.

[AlexM007]

How in any way does that justify what happened here then? I didn't pay a bill for shitty service and inadiquate food.

[Guy13]

There were other patrons there. And with the shootings, one never knows. Everything is Safety first and she's lucky she was not removed from the premises to the outside or into a car. I do not know but guns now and days. She may want to consider that?

[supercutebutt]

Well I agree that gun stuff has spiraled out of control. But the only "weapon" in this instance was a cold beverage.

[Guy13]

I got you but "safe than sorry" maybe. I don't disagree with you... How about one of choices.."now she's ready for the bedroom"...

[supercutebutt]

well the last choice does hint at romance.

[Guy13]

And :) cops like sex too.-That's SO WRONG... I see a moderator coming to scold "the troll" now...

[I_Can_Help]

I have a question. Was it a lady cop who cuffed her?

[supercutebutt]

Umm, maybe it was a dude cop? I put a link in the updates section with greater detail. My friend posted that herself yesterday.

[supercutebutt]

Yes. It was an off-duty male cop.

[I_Can_Help]

well that sucks. Would have been hotter if it was a sexy lady cop.

[supercutebutt]

I think the security person was female, though. The one who taped her mouth shut.

[AlexM007]

No It was the female secuirty woman who cuffed me, the off duty just provided the handcuffs

[I_Can_Help]

@AlexM007 Cool. That's a hotter story. Thanks for clarifying.

[AlexM007]

Ahaha what you mean? Difference it make?

[I_Can_Help]

@AlexM007 I guess It's a guy thing. I can't really explain why exactly. Just seems hotter.

[AlexM007]

Oh.. lmao

[jeffreylowe]

Okay we don't have the whole story here for sure. I have lived a very colorful life with that being said your friend must of done 1 of 2 things "1 - spit at the officer 2 - attempted to bite the officer" my guess she lugied right in his mug and that's when shit went sour. Your friend needs to quit being a entitled baby an hold herself half accountable at least. And peoples meals did she ruin that's a lot of money and meals out that get pricey these days. She needs better customer service skills and the waitress should of backed down from the gate but sounds like a case of no harm no foul life lesson baby.

[exitseven]

They should have just not charged her for the meal. I have sent stuff back to the kitchen before and the restaurant is always trying to keep a customer. I bet when this was all over your friend ended up not paying for the meal anyway. They had to act like dicks for nothing.

[supercutebutt]

So my friend Alex pours one drink on one head and you call her a "dick." But Donald Trump is trying to destroy democracy and got people killed and wanted Mike Pence murdered and he is your "hero." What a world!

[exitseven]

the restaurant staff acted like dicks. your friend should have just been able to leave without paying. Read what I wrote @supercutebutt

[supercutebutt]

Oh OK. I'm not used to you making sense. :) What happened, did you swallow a smart pill or something?

[exitseven]

now you are being a dick.

[supercutebutt]

Oh I see. I make one tiny mistake and I'm a "dick." But Donald Trump is trying to destroy democracy and got people killed and wanted Mike Pence murdered and he is your "hero." What a world!

[exitseven]

Geez- lighten up willya?

[D_Bone_Steak]

Donald Trump and Mike Pence become a part of some chick throwing drinks around... You really can't be serious with this shit. I mean seriously. You have to be trolling. Nobody is actually that retarded.

[exitseven]

@D_Bone_Steak Meet Miss Nobody then.

[Sixgunsound]

@exitseven The only issue I can see with the restaurant letting her not pay, is everybody in the room to wash that all go down decides they aren’t paying either and the restaurant goes out of business. Food service is a cutthroat razor thin margin industry, and they can’t go giving out precedent for people to rob them. Either way, whoever throws the first punch or the first drink loses.

[Agagagagaga]

@supercutebutt Why are you bringing up Donald fucking Trump in a story about your friend? Wtf?

[Sixgunsound]

@Agagagagaga Trump derangement syndrome

[supercutebutt]

@Agagagagaga I brought him up because Alex gets teased for her skin looking like his. She is self-conscious about her Trumpian glow.

[Agagagagaga]

You’re hopelessly insane.

[supercutebutt]

@Agagagagaga Are you sad that your cult leader is going to be indicted?

[Sixgunsound]

I kind of hope he does get charge for something, so that he can go in there and humiliate the kangaroo court even more than they’re already humiliating themselves. Honestly this guy just keeps win win winning, and I thank you for bringing him up free of charge and demonstrating how much time you spend thinking about him still. Thanks again for the free publicity🤣

[RavVid]

Pouring water over the waitress was an assault even though it was just water. So it was justifiable to hand cuff. I doubt the tape was legal though I am assuming she screaming like banshee.

Did she eat the meal then complain and refuse to pay or did she taste the meal and then complain? If she ordered something she thought she would like but didn't that is her fault again.

[AlexM007]

I ate half of the meal

[Wraven]

None of the above, cuffed yes. Tape on the mouth, only if they were creating a scene around small children and sensitive adults.
Personally i would have used a taser and hand cuffed her and thrown her in the back of a police car until she calmed the hell down.

[AlexM007]

How on earth is it "creating a scene" to respond to someone who was looking over at you in a mocking tone and telling her some home truths about her service and the quality standard of the establishment. I only cursed a few times, if people were so easily offended.. *cover your ears*

[AlexM007]

Why did I need to be tasered? I threw a drink over her for crying out loud after being provoked (isn't like it was a random act)

[Wraven]

@AlexM007 despite what you may think, pouring a drink over someones head is assault. Unless they specifically tell you to do it. If you have an issue with how someone is talking, just walk away, pouring a drink over them now makes you the offending element.
Just like someone provoking a crowd of people, even if they remain sedimentary while the crowd rampages, they created the scene. Next time just walk away

[AlexM007]

I was walking away thats the point! She called me an "angry orange" and that I could not leave which I could! Cos the service was terrible and thats when I threw some soda at her. I then got hancuffed and made to sit at the entrance for atuhroties and got into it again with the waitress and then got a piece of tape on my mouth all for having an opinion and standing my ground

[SaoirseS]

Handcuffing was probably appropriate. Gagging, well that depends on how loud and how foul she was getting, especially if there were kids in the restaurant. It might have been to keep her from spitting for all we know.

[supercutebutt]

No, she isn't a spitter.

[MikeInHawaii]

Pouring a drink over someone’s head is simple battery or perhaps disorderly conduct and she could get arrested.

Refusing to pay for food after eating it is theft of services and she could be arrested for that, too.

She shouldn’t have gotten off with a warning. She sounds like an entitled bitch and a few days in jail might be the attitude adjustment she needs.

[Friendlybro79]

If I understand correctly the waitress used poor judgement with bad words but your friend might have committed offensive touching which is battery.. That is technically illegal. The waitress saying bad words isn't illegal.

Regardless should she have been cuffed and taped up for this no.

[Friendlybro79]

I meant Pouring a drink on someone can be considered offensive touching which is battery

[Drumlin2001]

Sounds like your friend lost control and acted appallingly. But they shouldn't have taped up her mouth, regardsless how loud she was

[humanearth]

That's what happens when stupid people control us

Republicans, Democrats, and others

We are no longer free, we are slaves to the government.

[supercutebutt]

Or slaves to the wait staff at least. lol.

[Xtendable]

I voted D. Deprivation of liberty is not really dealing with the problem of poor food or service and the restaurant could be liable for civil action

[Staximus]

They didn't need to take her mouth, they could have just taken her outside until the cops show up. Dumping a drink on somebody's head is an attempt to incite violence and she was out of control Karen that day.

[Sparkie460]

The whole thing could have been avoided if the waitress was notified that the food wasn't cooked the way you liked it when you took your first bite.

[This_Is_My_Opinion8]

Tape over mouth was to much. She can sue him for that.

[Jackblue]

Well I am going to take the safe option in the year of 2022, if she was white yeah arrest her, if she was a woman of color no they went too far.

[Jackblue]

I should mention that in cases in which customers dine and dash, it is not uncommon for the managers to make the waiter/waitress pay for the meal so I can see why the waitress was upset.

[Jackblue]

Seeing as your friend calls herself an orange lady, than yeah the cops were too easy on her. If you order food and don't like it you should ask for something new and then pay for that. Pouring a drink on a waitress's head is terrible conduct.