What makes a man become an "incel" - is it him or society?

Question

If you read the scientitific & psychological research on incel - and there's a lot, I don't have the GAG rating to post links otherwise I would - the majority who fall into this category have social disorders.

In this research the general concesus is the majority of "incel" males has antisocial personality disorders or in short they don't fit into society in general. If anyone visits incel heavy forums & sites you'll find this is quite obvious in their embittered blame-everyone-but-me-for-problems-I-face posts and even admitting of having few to no real life friends.

Now given that - a mannerism that is unappealing

Who is responsible for a man becoming an "incel".

blueonblack22 · Accepted Answer

This is complicated. Very complicated. Much more complicated than most people have the mental capacity to fully grasp. Most people take mental short cuts and either fully agree with the “incels” or quickly dismiss them as losers, betas, misogynists, etc

So what is the exact definition of “incel”. It’s shorthand for “involuntarily celibate”. So a man is unhappy about his romantic life or lack thereof. He feels society has wronged him

So on one end a man should do his best to be his best. He should focus on doing his best in school, career, exercise, sports, hobbies. Just being a self pitying worthless bum isn’t attractive to anybody. Complaining about your struggles in itself doesn’t accomplish anything. Even if they are legitimate problems (and a lot them are) just complaining in itself isn’t good for anyone. There has to be an action plan to improve.

However on the other end society really has changed for men when it comes to their interactions with females and not for the better.

It used to be very clear cut. A man seeks out a woman to date. If she chooses him then he married her and has kids. I was his job to be “the man” by protecting and providing for your wife and kids. Most men were fine with that arrangement.

However women have radically changed their perspective on what they want out of life in modern society. They are putting off marriage. They are having kids. They have a ton more options given social media and dating apps. They can (whether right or wrong) call a man out for sexual harassment and people will listen to her over him. Promiscuity is no longer as dangerous for them. They have birth control and their no shame in getting an abortion. Their reputations won’t be damaged like they once were.

So anyway a lot of these “incels” would of likely been happily married in a different time era. But they find themselves being disenfranchised if they don’t make the “top cut” of men. It isn’t just guys who dwell in their parents basement who are angry and frustrated. But there are guys who are semi attractive, make decent money (not rich but sufficient), have okay personalities, etc that are finding themselves undateable to their female equivalents.

So what happens when these guys hit these setbacks? Some work harder to improve themselves to be exceptional. But others get further depressed and give up. They often engage in self destructive habits like porn, drugs, gambling, etc. All in all there is a cold hard truth that men are NOT special for just existing. They are expendable unless they offer something of value to society.

Most women do not really comprehend that. They seriously don’t. I am not letting incels off the hook. They should work on getting their shit together. But a lot of them have no idea how to and that’s a serious problem.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/nr_H0QC2G_c

EnglishArtsteacher · Accepted Answer

I didn't vote because I'm inclined to believe it depends on the man, and I'm not sure which choice would fit for most male incels.

Anyway, the term "incel" has some ambiguity. While not being intimate with people is a basic requirement, there are many men who aren't intimiate with anyone who don't display traits of the stereotypical "incel". For the sake of discussion, let's just define a male "incel" as someone who isn't intimate with women, and shows resentment towards women, or his situation due to emotional, and mental issues.

Honestly, just from my anectdotal experience, I think it's a combination of both themselves, and society. Sure, any man in this situation should reflect on themselves, but since most people in society stigmatize self-reflection among males, society does indeed help create these monsters.

I work on a college campus, and it seems like your generation of men are more prone to being incels than any other generation. They're constantly raging about rejection, and are usually derogatory towards women.

mandyfire98 · Accepted Answer

Yes, most incels and we are discussing the actual incel community. The ones that hate women and blame women for their problems. The ones that advocate for dehumanizing of women. The ones who've actually commited mass murders.

Those are incels. Incels no longer just mean virgins. They crossed that line a long time ago.

Incels normally show traits of anti social personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder. They pull the victim card of life is out to get them. Women are out to get them. Women are punishing them. Trait of a narcissist. They make themselves the center of the universe and act like the rest of the world even knows them at all.

The thing about most incels is they're actually voluntary celibates. Not involuntary celibates. Most incels only want a certain type of woman. Not just any woman will do. They want what they consider a "Stacey" they want the head cheerleader and prom queen.

There was a very interesting documentary done where a woman who they referred to as a "foid" interviewed a group of incels and they complained about women being boring and not interesting and not into what the incels were into and thats why they couldn't meet real women. When the interviewer proposed a situation where more women would join STEM classes at college, the incels said if they shared STEM classes with women they would drop the class.

It's not that incels truly want women and can't have them, it's that deep down they just don't like women at all. They don't like who we are or what we are into or how we act. They just flat out don't like us. They never will. So it's not women not dating them that's even the issue, it's their personality disorders. Even if they had a girlfriend they'd still be fucked up. They essentially want a sex slave they can have sex with and then turn us off.

Siri137 · Accepted Answer

It's probably a bit of both, to be honest. You mention the research that demonstrates they're generally males who suffer from "antisocial personality disorders", and that they "don't fit into society in general". The first sounds like disorders like autism, and speaking from experience, I can truthfully say that those who have conditions like Asperger's Syndrome and autism really, really struggle to even comprehend how society works, and why.

In the past I've been really harsh with incels here on GAG, but they're not entirely to blame for who or what they are. They can't figure out interpersonal relationships, they don't understand the importance of compromise, understanding and empathy within those relationships, and they generally suck at everything they do, so I can understand their frustration. Frustration, if untreated and prolonged, leads to anger, and that leads to violence (hence school shootings).

Anonymous · Answer

Most of them hate women or non-white who take their women away from them, which is why they use Nazi rhetoric.

A lot of far-right fascist and hate movements try to recruit sexually insecure men to join their ranks because they're easy to manipulate.

I don't view a guy who is suffering from loneliness the same as an incel. Many people use incel and loner synonymously, which to me it's disrespectful to the loner's intelligence because a lonely guy who isn't an insane homicidal incel gets lumped into that group.

Those incels want to take women's rights away and get a state-mandated girlfriend, and they want to hurt people. You'll see a lot of incels that are very vocal on social money, saying insane shit to get cloudt money and views.

There are legitimate lonely guys who are suffering and need help, but because of the insane incel groups, they get demonized. Incels are openly misogynistic and hateful and should not be lumped into the same category as a guy who is just a loner.

Effably · Answer

I mean... the real answer is obviously a bit of both and then some extra sides to consider.

The either or answer: Him.
Ultimately no matter what part of the genetic, birth, or societal lottery they didn't win or scored poorly on society is never going to go out of its way to fix your problems. You can.

Now is it true that our society creates more 'incel' than previous societies? Sure. It does. A lot more. Both men and women. Is that due to our society? Sure is.

But a lot of things are unfair. To men especially, even if you or I want to pretend otherwise. The individual solution remains to man up and beat the odds.

E. g I know and knew full well I'd have an easier time getting the grades I needed if I were a woman. It has been proven again and again that academia grades women higher for identical work. I can complain about it, and probably should, or I can put in more work than the girls do and earn the same grade for a little more effort. It is not hard to sell the fact that I should not have to do that. But if I want decent grades for me and not my grandson, I damn better just outperform the girls.

Same goes for incels. Many might have social disorders. Unfortunate genetics. So on. These are all things you can rise above, even if they are not fair and a lot of people got much more than you did for no effort. What matters more? Being right and wrong or getting the outcome you desire? One can be achieved by blaming society, the other by blaming yourself.

DextroShade · Answer

It depends, there are losers living in their parents basement with no job who are entirely responsible for their own lack of sexual access but there are also many dudes who are self-sufficient adults with jobs and their own place who still can't get laid; 1 in 3 men are either virgins or haven't had sex in over a year and they can't all be basement dwellers. The truth is too many women have delusional standards for what they have to offer and would rather be passed around by the top guys than settle down with an average man. Hoeflation, the idea that a man has to work much harder than his grandfather to get a woman much worse than his grandmother, is very much a reality. Much like with home ownership many men are simply getting priced-out of the sexual marketplace and the women who are available are increasingly fat, promiscuous, entitled, and have few domestic skills but a lot of attitude. It's hard out there for men these days, I feel like I got the last cookie in the jar with my wife.

Anonymous · Answer

Do you know how many articles I have and have read from women who are femcels and these are published by women from mainstream news outlets, grad students in university and even big companies like Elle. Here’s proof with screen shots…By the way I don’t condone incel behaviour. If a girl says no to a guy he can respect it and move on and value himself. But feminism is teaching women rip his manhood off, hate men, males are scum, marriage is a joke, having children is oppression. I’m tired of the imbalance of women and girls normalizing bad behaviour. I used to think women are soft, nurturing, understanding, loyal, etc. I mean there are men and guys out there over 6ft, handsome, in shape and focus on themselves and their careers that even plenty of women fawn. These guys are telling other guys don’t settle for less, man up and don’t waste time on women with femcel energy so does that make those successful men who also get women as “incels”. In the culture today people are misguided politically and also sexually/gender, that’s what I realize now at my age and I stand by that ✌️ dueces.

PeachyPie93 · Answer

I would guess it has a lot to do with the guys mentality but there are factors. Factors like his parents, his upbringing, how he socializes and how he is treated in the world. If children (especially shy ones) are not socialized early with lots of different types of children they will become secluded and not learn the right way to socialize and handle situations. It is kind of like dogs they become aggressive and antisocial if you don't teach them the right way to behave around other dogs hahaha.

4ngelic · Answer

studies haven't concluded that most of them have aspd (sociopathy & psychopathy). though the studies on them found that autism is the most common disorder. some studies even found as high as 60% have autism. also narcissitic personality disorder & depression here's a science paper from cambridge on them & mental illness/personality disorders :

ManOnFire · Answer

Most males who are called incels don't actually identify with the term. Very few males literally say they are one, and when they do they know they have a problem.

In general, the term incel is used by women - and men - who don’t agree with opinions from other males that are unconventional/unpopular. Half these males are already in relationships, but are still called incel anyway because of their opinions. The term incel is also used by women to stir up anger with men, then when you have men who act on it and do things we see in the news like targetting women/acting violent, the women get upset. But making them angry is what they wanted because the women have unclean hearts, and then hate when these men act out.

msmissydc · Answer

Well, a bit of both. I would argue its the lack of having access to the society as a whole. Meaning most incels become one by being only in their infomation bubble that fits their arguments and with enough circlejerking the result is disconecting from reality and being 'proven' right in their opinions.
So the social media as society driven is at fault together with the person themselfe.

KlinkyCoder · Answer

I think more of it is society than the individual themselves - even though the individual person can choose how they respond to it. Sadly, some have chosen to responded with mass violence and taking their anger out on women.

There isn't one single cause for why people especially men end up being incel (I use the term strictly to refer to the online communities). If being incel was strictly one's own fault, I don't think you would see these communities grow as large as they have. But the fact that so many men are in this one type of community gives me the sense that something societal is going on. The polarization and segregation of the genders isn't helping either.

A lot of them also probably attempted to speak up their grievance but they were called bigoted or "cancelled" by society (even if it is not necessarily true), so now they are congregating alone with their other ilk on their small little corner of the internet.

purplepoppy · Answer

Personalities are created in childhood. So I think society is to blame. Kids are growing up under the influence of social media more than their parents so their heads are getting filled with nonsense. Once they reach adulthood it's hard to pull them away from their learnt negative mindset

wiltingrosepetal · Answer

If society was the only problem, all men would become incels. The reason a majority of men aren't shows that there are problems with the individual just as much as society. Life's tough. The weak crumble, the strong move on. Weak people can't handle their situations and become incels.

pickles77 · Answer

I don’t think anyone is entirely responsible. The people who are in a situation often times can’t see outside of it to know what they need to do to live a better life. So in that respect you could say that it is society. Maby they grew up and had a learning disability and never had the resources, or the schools failed them. Maby their own parents while they were children let them fall through the cracks. However when you grow up it’s up to you to decide if you are going to grow and sharpen areas that you lack in. But where you start is where you start and some have a lot more work to do than others

Anonymous · Answer

Ultimate everyone has agency to dictate their own life decisions. But society makes it really easy to blame it on discrimination and favoritism. Sometimes it’s warranted, sometimes it isn’t. But the reality is worse, it’s not even about equality anymore. It’s about equity… but only for certain classes of people. There is a very large divide between men and women in Western society. And it’s a very self destructive divide that threatens to eliminate everything our society has accomplished over the last century. Even worse, there is no solution that doesn’t make it worse.

HelpfulWoman · Answer

Easy him. Remember they're a minority who decide to blame their whole life of issues on the other gender. That's not normal.

bededazzle · Answer

both. but the worst thing you can do when society gets you down is blame all your problems on society. i’ve spoken with some and challenged their points of view. in these cases, it was totally impenetrable. sex was made out to be the most important thing in the world.

short answer i guess is the person, but they really seem totally incapable of taking responsibility to the point where i feel awful for them.

Pohjolan · Answer

In 2019 roughly a third of young men did not have sex for at least a year and over 60% of young men are currently single.

Either they are not as bad as you make out them to be or you are fucked as a society.

On a individual level the individual is responsible but only society will make a third of young men into incels.

And its a growing trend so in the future incel men might be the norm.

KrakenAttackin · Answer

Most men don't get any real guidance about relationships and dating early in life. Add to this a few harsh rejections and being out on blast for approaching a girl, and a young guy gets hardened pretty fast.

Dating as a young man is brutally difficult.

normalice · Answer

It is largely just other incels inviting him to stew in their collective grievance instead of getting out of their moms' basements and improving themselves.

Anonymous · Answer

It's his attitude and high standards. Any guy can get girls, some just can't get the beautiful women they feel entitled to and instead of dating someone on their level or putting in the work to make themselves more attractive, they start hating women as a whole.

Billlewis · Answer

I think it's a combination of both. It's harder now than ever for guys to get sex, and many of us aren't willing to go through the aggravation and expense of doing so.

Anonymous · Answer

Involuntary would imply its completely out of their control which would narrow the definition to guys with personality or developmental disorders.

Many guys labelled as incels aren't incels they are simply unaware of the extent they can change their situation, which when prolonged can unfortunately lead them to spiraling and losing more control over their situation.

VikingWarLord · Answer

Depends on the region he lives. An American dude (even if he's old and overweight) can pull hot younger females in SE Asia (Thailand, Philippines, Cambodia, etc..). In the West he'd be an incel

LiamJHayden · Answer

The delusion that he is actually involuntarily celibate, when the reality is that he doesn't score because those he fancies are not interested. If he expanded his preferences, he could score.

Anonymous · Answer

In this modern society, both men and women are incels. They don't want to date, marry and start a family together. They are scared of responsibilities, making babies, raising and taking care of them. Look at the YouTube videos of leftover women over 35+ years hitting the wall, weeping for a man, sex, husband, babies, family and relationship.

Anonymous · Answer

While an individual is for themselfs ultimately responsible, when a very large number of them are all suddenly having the same problem the environment/Society must be at fault.

robhazelnut · Answer

Both, so long as he doesn't accept that the present moment is as it is.

Fromdusktilldawn · Answer

a lonely guy + low self esteem + frustration + social media + toxic community that profounds negative feelings towards a scape goat (in this case women) and extremism = incel

DarkLegacy · Answer

Feminism is to blame but judging by the poll results women will nver own up when the have done wrong or are in the wrong.

genericname85 · Answer

Unless he physically can not have sex, it's always him. celibacy is always a decision if you physically can have sex.

billmunch · Answer

Neither. Just short, so it's off to the bottom of the dating barrel for me.

JesseP1nk · Answer

Himself is at fault. Does anyone really think EVERYONE else is the problem? 🤣

JamesRandiDebates · Answer

Well, the "in" part of incel is "involuntary." Therefore, its against their will to be celibate. Therefore, not their fault.

Anonymous · Answer

It's always him. But that's good news because it means he can do something about it. It's bad news because that means he'll have to DO something.

Anonymous · Answer

It's the same things that cause a woman to become a feminist... victim mindsert, lack of self-accountability and a deep seated hatred for the opposite sex.

Apple1996 · Answer

It's his attitude

Anonymous · Answer

It's society and women having insane ideas of "normal" when it comes to men.

Chthou95 · Answer

a lot of incels are men that just got really unlucky in life

Anonymous · Answer

Society , the people who care the most about us are separated from us when we go to school The result is mediocrity in every area of life. And a lowly attitude that turns women off

Anonymous · Answer

Both.  Now what percentages of each will vary from man to man.

robocop666 · Answer

mostly looks and if your insane then your personality

Kingofkings1992 · Answer

Can we just stop using the word “incel” please?

rachel776b · Answer

it's not a real thing

exitseven · Answer

Its him. some people are just not good with girls.

Anonymous · Answer

A combination of factors

elaphe · Answer

It is probably a bit of each.

Anonymous · Answer

Neither.. His choices..

ChicoFromThe305 · Answer

It's both I think

What makes a man become an "incel" - is it him or society?

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