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It’s a lot more comfortable to stick to the status quo than it is to go against the grain. The very nature of feminism is to make people uncomfortable. It aims to make you question your values and beliefs about the world. And most people don’t want to do that. They want to hide behind a false sense of persecution, when really the odds are stacked in their favour.
They are feminists, but they don't wanna get attacked.
How dare you suggest that there are only 2 kinds of women:
those who agree with your ideology... and those who agree, but covertly?
I have not seen anything today that has compared to the dehumanization, and depersoning, of women as a whole, as that. You strip all personal choice, and all accountability. You act as if "female" is a hive mind state, and women can not exist outside of it.
I have bad news for you, sunshine. Women are capable of thinking for themselves, and many women have looked at feminism, and found it lacking, and dismissed it. Any claim that no woman is capable of thinking for herself enough to disagree with your ideology is straight up... well, straight up misogyny.
I agree.
@ksoma I think you calling a woman you disagree with sunshine and thinking that some random person's opinion is the worst thing that has happened to women all day is probably a bit worse...
Well, Asker, I have made it very clear, in several posts, how little I care about what you think.
@ksoma Yep, you made it pretty clear that you think you know don't care about women's opinions. That's why you comment your opinion on every second post, with cute sexist remarks like "sunshine", trying to explain to women why you know better what's happening in our lives than we do. Grow up and learn how to have a proper discussion and how to listen to people.
No. The person who doesn't care about women's opinions are the people who suggest that all women are feminists and some women are just cowards who hide it, or people like you who want to celebrate that as a possible legitimate answer.
The person who says "how dare you treat women as a monolith, unable to think for themselves? How dare you refuse to believe a woman has the intellectual capacity to look at your ideology and simply disagree?" is not the person who doesn't value woman's opinion.
You are not "WOMEN." You are a woman. Singular. Your opinion is not representative of your gender as a whole, and disagreeing with you, even fiercely... even rudely, is not sexism. I am disagreeing with a person, not a gender.
@ksoma Calling a woman "sunshine" in order to infantilise her while disrespecting her opinion is a pretty sexist thing to do. Disagreeing with her doesn't give you the right to use common misogynist practices against her. That is way more harmful than a misguided one-sentence statement. You're actively normalising behaviour that is actively harmful to women.
Calling someone "sunshine" is actively harmful to no one. And it is only "sexist" or "misogynistic" if it is the type of thing I would only do when dealing with a woman.
Your assumption, that I would never treat a man with such "disrespect," and that a simple word used is somehow an assault on women everywhere, is insane.
So, good. Another opportunity to answer "why do people hate feminism."
Because you are DESPERATE to be offended, and will find "aggression" or "misogyny" or the "normalization" of "harmful" behavior, in the most mundane of things.
I mean, fuck, "sunshine" isn't even gendered. It is infantilizing, but that's why you use it when speaking to someone who says something that stems from pure ignorance. To insult their child like level of thought.
And I've used it when speaking to men as well, when they say something so childishly ignorant.
@ksoma I'm sure you do. Lol
Infantilization by older men is a thing that younger women are faced with in the work force on a very regular basis. It is actively harming women in their abilities to advance and being taken seriously in their careers.
Hence, another reason why we need feminism: because men like you really don't understand why the normalisation of this treatment particularly of women has consequences beyond the stupid slip of tongue you're now trying to justify.
You really don't get it, do you?
Respect is earned, not given. You, the opinion I replied to, your entire ideology of feminism? They all claim they have a right to respect.
You don't.
Respect is earned. And your ideology, her opinion, and you yourself? Have done nothing to earn my respect.
So grow up, sunshine.
Another reason so many women hate feminism?
Because they are equal to men, and don't see any need to be protected from violent language like "sunshine."
Your cries of how you are a victim of every little thing just belittles women. Feminism looks bitchy and weak. You want us to hear you roar, because you want to prove you're fierce, but instead we listen to you howl "we're victims!"
And because the women who aren't feminists know they are equal, and aren't victims? They see your whole display as pathetic, degrading, and something that, as you claim to represent all women, risks making their entire gender look disgraceful and childish.
Grow up. You are owed nothing.
@ksoma I can say it again, since you're apparently having some trouble reading, I'm not and have not claimed to represent all women or even speak for other women. Unlike you, a man, who says things like: "Another reason so many women hate feminism?""They see your whole display as pathetic..." Hypocrite much?
Your language is sexist, your behaviour is not that of a grown up who is able to properly articulate his thoughts without trying to be deliberately insulting, and you do not speak for women either.
So you can continue using infantilising language against women, to make yourself feel like a grown-up, but that doesn't change the fact that your behaviour was clearly wrong and that asserting it after being called out on it, just makes it even worse.
Treating people with respect is a common courtesy. I'm sure you won't gain a lot of respect yourself if you walk around attempting to insult people and if you're unable to own up to your mistakes.
There are SO many feminists that are very annoying and don’t understand the movement at all. Many are against men and it has been taken way too far.
Why? Because most feminists here are men haters and they say ridiculous things. They want equality when it's convenient for them. Equal pay? Sure! Equal jobs? No way!
Until one of those feminists gets a plumber or electrician job, I can't take them seriously.
Plus they need to stop with that free nipple nonsense. It just shows their lack of education and common sense.
I'm an independant woman and I don't call myself feminist.
It gets them internet brownie points from embittered men.
Stop reading my mind!
Because today's feminism is a bit of a joke. Women won't be taken seriously if this shit continues.
Sounds ridiculous to me. i just moved here from Haiti. It seems to me all first world countries have no time on their hands in order to come up with this type of B. S Back home I worried about my life everyday lol. stuff like food, water, shelter, and each other
Those are all just fake female profiles, basically, they are mgtow extremists pretending to be women.
Feminism is a fucking joke lol. feminists don't want equality, feminists hate men
Because 3rd wave feminism is about giving privilege to women, while degrading men. It seeks to put women ahead of men, not as equals.
Just like every movement there are people that have different ideas. Some treat it like women are equal to men amd we should all be treated equal, this is what I think. On the other hand there are some who believe that since women have been oppressed by mem that they must be evil and lesser. Sadly its the latter that people see more often because they are louder and more aggressive to argue and make their point.
And the Illuminati was supposed to create equality for atheists. The free masons were supposed to create equality for the working class.
The thing with any sociopolitical movement is once it has recognition it becomes very attractive to people hungry for power and is quickly taken over.
Because the majority of men and women already support equality, yet don't want to identify them selves with a group of people who go out of their way to make every little difficulty about their sex.
Many feminists want the advantages of being a man and being a women. They expect a date to be paid for by the man, doors opened for them etc; but kick off when men treat them equal.
Just my opinion though 😊
It's simple, because more women now see it the same way as any sane-minded person would and that is that modern 3rd feminism does not stand for women's rights, but it's now a platform for bitter, privileged, millennial, white women to screech their abhorrent, misandric, pro-Islam rhetoric.
I think a lot of people just don't like what others will assume about them for being femminist. A lot of women act on their want for equality in ways that doesn't actually help the cause and is irrational. This just discourages more people from the title feminist.
I think they're nit anti feminist. They are anti feminazi.
Okay but I've been called a feminazi just for telling a girl to cut her hair how she wants.
Does that sound particularly "nazi-ish"?
@BellePepper If someone called you a feminazi over that, that person was insane and you didn't deserve it.
But in 2 years? More? That I've been here, and have seen you post, you have said a lot of just nasty, cruel things.
You ARE a feminazi, and most anyone who has interacted with you can see that.
There is a difference between the feminism I disagree with, and the feminism I loathe. I can talk with someone who believes the former. We disagree, but that is life. You represent the latter, and openly treat men as potential abusers, and women who disagree with you as either betrayers of the sisterhood... or at least as idiots.
While hiding behind the veil of one time someone called you a mean thing when you didn't deserve it.
@ksoma bro I get called a feminazi for so much stupid shit i think of it just like being called a slut. It just means whatever boy is upset that a girl disagreed with him and instead of thinking about why someone ELSE cutting THEIR OWN HAIR bothers him so much he wants to stomp his foot and call names.
It's a *meaningless* word that people want to describe a *meaningless* concept.
@BellePepper Well, here's something to chew on.
You think feminazi is just an overused, meaningless insult, thrown around by idiots having temper tantrums, and so you feel you can ignore it, and just see the person who would label you that as a complete and utter fool?
Well, congrats. You just answered why men hate feminism, and why so many women are anti-feminist.
Because we can only have insane harpies screech at us about the patriarchy and rape culture so long. I can only hear about how misogynistic I am so much. Women who are anti-feminist can only be berated about their "internalized misogyny" so much.
And then... it just because noise. It just becomes overused, meaningless insults, thrown around by idiots having temper tantrums.
@ksoma dismissing angry little boys is why girls hate feminism?
We both know you can do better than this
@BellePepper You're either intentionally misrepresenting what I said because it is easier to deflect and divert, or you're actually stupid, if you think that is what I said and meant.
And as much as you disgust me, I know you aren't stupid.
@ksoma Don't be rude
@BellePepper You are not owed respect.
@ksoma yeah i am. I haven't been rude to you so don't be rude to me.
@BellePepper No. For one thing, respect is earned. For another, you have not shown respect. You have shown a snarky, self serving ego, that refuses to debate in good faith, and intentionally misrepresents points being made because attacking strawmen gets you wet.
And I have dealt with you outside of this post and its relative discussion. I know how nasty you can be. You are owed nothing. Least of all my respect.
@ksoma LMFAO you're sounding so emotional. Do you want to take a break?
@BellePepper Funny last comment because your status says "Taking a Break" lmao
Because modern feminism is going in the wrong direction.
ivyvaughn.files.wordpress.com/.../...n-monroe3.jpg
u r so right, but what about the equal wages and employment problems
It's not just on here, even in real life a lot of women hate feminism. And should. As the world progresses females don't feel a need for it, especially younger ones. It's a movement that's had a lot of its own dirt, racism, and contradiction anyway.
I doubt the question here surrounds feminism or femi narcissism. Femi narcissism is another unique feature of sabotaging all men and grouping all together as butchers. I mean feminism talks about equity and equality I guess and then I am a feminist but I don't hate all men. I think criminals are beyond sex , race , caste , creed or nationality !!!
I'm just gonna say this: Forcing women to adhere to the feminist agenda isn't much different than the "patriarchy" you so adamantly denounce.
I'm not forcing anyone to do anything. I'm asking for their reasoning because I'm genuinely curious.
There were still some rather condescending undertones directed at women who don't identify with the feminist movement.
That's you opinion, not what I actually said.
"Could you also state if you actually had experience in the professional workforce"
That's a very polite way of saying "the only way you could possibly disagree with me is if you've been living under a rock".
No, that was an attempt to see where people come from. While I'm interested in opinions of all age groups, I do believe that gender issues affect women of working age more than girls who are still in high school or college, so I'd like to be able to differentiate and see what the reasoning of grown-ups is. If you never faced gender inequality, it's easy to say you don't need the movement. If you have, however, and you still don't see a necessity in it, then it starts becoming more interesting for me to hear those women's opinions on why not.
I'm not anti-feminism but like every other recent movement that was started with good intentions it has gone to 💩.
The reason so many women here and all over are anti-feminist is because feminism is a bad thing. Maybe back when it first was conceived it was a good idea for women's equality, which I think still needs a bit of work, but today it's an excuse to put down men and try and put women above men, and that's just the truth.
It's a malicious movement filled with malicious people with malicious intent. It's truly a bad, bad thing.
the thing you're referring to is misandry. feminism is the belief that men and women are equal, and should be treated as such. I believe that women can be tough, men can cry, women should be drafted, men can be raped, women should not get light prison sentences compared to men, and men aren't heinous creatures that cause all of the problems in the world. That's what feminism is, the problem is that people have distorted in into a nicer way of saying misandry.
That's what it's supposed to be. That's not what it is now.
Because a lot of them don't know what feminism means... They think they have to hate men in order to respect women.
Most feminists in 2017 are idiots. They don’t really know what they’re talking about. I don’t have a problem with the idea behind feminism but the feminists who try to ‘preach’ or ‘fight’ for it play a false victim most of the time.
It depends what kind of feminists you are describing.
If it's the bitchy one and that likes to go against and feel superior to men then I think most women in general don't like to associate with that kind of feminism.
If it's the feminism that is fighting for women to able to be free around the world to get a education and recieve equal pay as men for the same job then I think most women are in favor of that.
I agree and I think most men, as well as women, are in favor of that and I know you meant men too in your comment, HCG. :)
@lizziepooh03: 🖒🖒😉
Truthfully , now days men couldnt care less about women and they're issues. For the most part , it doesn't affect us as you wish it would. Most men today are glad that most women will just do they're own thing and get away from them. We've more or less just turned our backs towards the new woman , and we're not interested in how things were are longer. So with that said , a lot of women are trying tong to come back
Anti-man vs pro-woman , wow thats s big difference. Feminism , most all democrat (liberal) feminist , atheist , non-believers or agnostics and superiority mongols , man-haters , are amongst this group. Pro-woman , are usually great strong conservative , God fearing women who talk kindness towards men and others. Who are champions of both men and other women of the same accord.
The woman here tend to have a tad bit more self-awareness than most.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQZP0sKWsAA-fz4.jpg
women*
Trust me, no woman I know will hate catcalling...
wow, not what I meant, I meant no woman will miss it. Most of us hate it.
Because a lot of people confuse feminism and misandry. People who often call themselves feminists really are misandrists. True feminists just want equality where thoae who just want the balance tipped over in favor of women are misandrists
well I know what I am about to say may not go over well but they aren't anti equality they are anti whatever femmanism means to the folks who think they are better then someone based on gender a lot of people who feel this way hide under the banner of modern femmanism
Honestly the only thing I'm okay with is intersectional feminism.
I feel that now because there's so many women that have changed the meaning of feminism to anti-men it has a bad reputation I’m all for feminists but only for equality not for women to be above men just equal to.
I don't like the way feminists act, at least the ones I know
Because more women can see that feminism is not about equality but about hating men and causing conflict between men and women. Feminism tells lies about the "wage gap" and rape statistics. It brainwashes women to believe that they still have inequality and that men are privileged. The opposite is true. Women in the West have more rights and privileges than what men do. Feminism is simply a cancer to relationships and causes hostility between men and women.
Its obvious why. you're opening statement says feminism is supposed to create equality etc etc. Many many woman and men don't view that'd what modern day feminism is about. Less woman are declaring themselves as feminist nowadays.
Because feminism is focused on one gender only by definition. It’s not just the women, it’s also the men.
+there are a LOT of consevative folk on here.
Because people these days are over doing it. Biologically there is a difference and each play a different role for a reason.
Treating each other with respect is important, but now a lot of "feminists" make everything offensive or sexist when its not. And also some do cause hatred towards men, so now they are also in the wrong...
Because it got used wrong. It's more and more anti men and not about equality. Also it is shaming women who like it tradional and like typical girly things.
Feminism has not helped men. Your "feminist" movement has destroyed male shelters, supports paternity fraud, destroyed the family unit, created a bunch of fictional "72 genders/gender identities", and allowed beta males to run the government, aka Justin Trudeau.
LGBTQ issue, not feminism, though I appreciate your recognition of intersectionality. Genders beyond the male-female binary have been a thing since ancient Greece and are found in almost every culture. Indigenous people call them two-spirited, hijras in South Asia, femminiello in Italy and do on, and all of these have been documented way before the Feminist movement became a thing.
Don't you think that lack of shelter is a governance issue? As for the traditional nuclear family, it has been debunked as a myth that was created by Republicans, not a century old tradition.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but can you scientifically prove there are multiple genders?
Yea, you can. Read up on some modern science.
www.nationalgeographic.com/.../
And you have one kid that identifies as a fucking unicorn.
Besides, the only reason why there's "multiple genders" is either the product of lack of hormones, birth deformity, or a mental illness.
Psychological reasons does not equate to mental illness. Homosexuality, as well as transgenderism are common in nature across all kinds of species. Some species can natural change their sexual organs and mating behavior based on the situation they're in.
And if you have a kid who thinks he's a snowflake, who cares? That person isn't harming anyone, why is it such a big issue for you?
Using your LGBTQ terminology, sexual orientation does not equal multiple genders.
If the kid grows up and tries to push the belief that he is a fucking unicorn on the rest of society and demands the government to create washrooms based on unicorns, then yes he is harming the majority of society who was comfortable distinguishing between male or female even with transsexuals by forcing the population to conform to his views.
Your example of using other animals do not equate to human society who naturally cannot change from one sex to another unless through hormonal imbalances that are artificial.
What do you think the T in LGBTQ stands for? People aren't pushing to create washrooms for unicorns though, they are pushing for washrooms that are gender neutral and can be used by anyone, hence eliminating the problem. Furthermore people want to use the washroom that matches their gender identity, bathrooms which already exist. Where's the problem?
As you said yourself, intersex is a natural thing that occurs in people too. Forcing people to choose an identity isn't anymore natural than people choosing their own.
Gender neutral washrooms allow rapists to take advantage of the situation and would lead to sexual assault, harassment, and in worst cases rape if these washrooms were private. If this happened in a school, this would also infringe on privacy rights and would allow bullies to take advantage of the situation.
I agree that people choose their identities, however that does not mean that you identify as a fucking unicorn and then you get "accommodations" for being in the minority.
You can be a feminine guy or a masculine girl, but that doesn't mean you're a whole other gender.
Intersex is actually not that common as you think.
http://www.isna.org/faq/frequency
Trust me, the gender sign on a door is not going to stop a rapist, especially if it's a private bathroom. Sounds to me like rape culture is the issue, not gender identity.
I want equality, but I don't believe real equality can ever exist. It's kind of like a balance. If you put weight on one aspect, it can affect another aspect negatively. I feel like sometimes, feminists have an attitude of "I'm right so you should follow me or else you'll be a hater". I also feel like other times, some of the things they say is somewhat illogical. And I feel like feminists need to look at inequality from all perspectives rather than just the female perspective.
The number one reason is there are barely any real women on here. I'm a feminist and I know the true meaning of feminism unlike most people.
It's not about the "true meaning" of feminism, it's about what the movement has largely come to represent in this day an age, which is a toxic, lie-perpetuating, and gender-shaming whirlpool of an ideology. By the way, the "true meaning" of feminism is "the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men", but it's an ideology and it's more important to focus on what people do with said ideology than its objective definition.
It's both of what you said. It's not necessary. You're there. You're 120% there. Plus the movement has become not about empowering women but it has been morphed into one of man hating. Wage inequality is a myth and is based on many different factors look it up. Women choose to leave the workforce to raise families and or do other things other than work. Women aren't the only ones victims of the men in the entertainment industry.
I think westerners see feminism in another way than I see, here I am considered a feminist but not in the sense as western women see it. Because It's too extreme in my eyes.
Whoa! You think people think for themselves. Most people are lazy and let others tell them what to think. Like many women in hardcore muslim countries help men beat/kill other women who showed skin.
I expected on joining to find most people fluffy. Not true, although they are largely fairly polite.
I don't agree that feminism can be equated to equality. It would be called something else if that were true.
cause its annoying as hell and ruining it for traditional women
How? Feminism is giving you the right to choose a traditional one, just like it's giving other women the choice not to. No ones forcing you out of anything.
@itsallover You want to see some serious harassment? Watch a 19 year old stand up in her gender studies class and tell them all "I want to be a wife. I want to cook dinner, maintain the home, and keep my husband happy. I hope to have 3 kids by 30. I think that would fulfill me and leave me truly happy."
You seem to think the class would stand up and applaud, and tell her things like "we might want to focus on our careers, but if that makes you happy, we support you, sister!"
I will bet you the contents of my bank account that, instead, the poor woman will be shouted down, harassed, called names, and treated like total garbage, because she WANTS to have kids and make her husband happy.
Feminism doesn't offer to option to choose to live traditionally. It openly vilifies women who make such choices.
Probably because that is a point when equality reaches equal before it reaches a tipping point when things aren't equal anymore. That feminist tipping point has now exceeded in the tipping point in the opposite direction and it's no longer equality, now it's superiority and men are walking away.
Reply to updated question. You mean aside from the rigged justice system?
thoughtcatalog.com/.../
I personally ain't anti feminist. I'm against the feminists that got it all wrong on what feminism is.
Can you elaborate what makes a woman an anti-feminist? Does she have to disagree with one point raised in the question.. or how it's executed? Or disagree with two? Or disagree with everything?
Asker, but men and women aren't the same and never will be. Men have to be men and women have to be women. This is one heck of a topic to answer simply.
Because quite a few females just take it waaaaaaay too far now 🤷🏼♀️🤦🏼♀️
I actually feel kinda bad for my nephews now sometimes with these daft women around!
Feminism involving sexual liberation is total destruction. Destroying the family unit in general and also perverting the minds of the masses to fall deeper into sexual vices. Leaving relationships completely broken and humanity totally void (empty, nothingness). Therefore seeking any and every type of fulfillment.
I think that's the fault of capitalism, not feminism, but maybe that's just me
Capitalism also plays a small part but feminists stand behind sexual liberation 100%
Or maybe the 1960s version of the family unit didn't fit for every one. And millions of people have found something different that gives them fulfillment.
I would say the media and internet lead to the sexual revaluation which you can't really equate with broken relationships. Not everyone is empty. And there is nothing wrong with finding fulfillment in something other than family.
The nuclear family only really became a thing during the Victorian age and was then pushed by Republicans as the only possible family structure, when it really hasn't been for the vast majority of human history. There is a reason for sayings like "it takes a village to raise a child", because historically families were larger and often included people who are not necessarily blood related.
@DocHolliday561 If broken homes equal family unit then I'm in the twilight zone. Fulfillment? If you say so. We'll see how it all works later. But I hear'ya.
i don't believe that is true in taiwan. weak men will interpret pro women as anti men even if not true
Right now feminists have a really bad reputation since when most people here "feminist" they think of feminazis
You lost my support the moment I saw Beyonce posing for Rosie the Riveter. She's such an arrogant bitch. All for feminism and equality among all people, but fuck this.
The measure of any society is how they treat their women and girls. We need to start thinking about a better place of happier men and happier women. A peaceful world! We must all do better! We should all be feminists!
Love to you all..
It's more so that they're against the feminazi thing
Woman should be allowed to be topless at beaches and swimming pools like guys, how is it illegal, like it’s only nipples
Tradition
It was also tradition to keep women down and own black slaves...
I never said it was a good tradition. There's a lot of bad traditions. I was giving an explanation
I don’t think I am anti-feminist but I do not share a lot of these feminists views I have my own. But I don’t think or consider myself a feminist
Feminism isn't a realistic ideology. Men and women are not biologically equal. That isn't to say one is more or less intelligent than the other, its just that to compare is a disservice to both sexes. We have reached a point where men and women are treated at equal (obviously there are idiots who are still sexist).