If society had to be either a patriarchy or a matriarchy, what do you think is better and why?

[HawkPerception]

Patriarch

Matriarch

Updates

11 mo

It's a hypothetical question. Please don't bother posting an opinion if you can't choose peeps

[blueonblack22]

Very few women are capable of being truly effective rulers. Especially for powerful influential countries that are dealing with other hostile countries.

These women do exist (Queen Elizabeth) but they are exceptionally rare.

[bunniesrcute]

why do u think that?

[SixFootSexy]

@bunniesrcute because it's clearly evident. Have you seen Pam Bondi or AOC?

[blueonblack22]

@bunniesrcute because women (in general) have a much harder time compartmentalizing their emotions vs. practicality / logic. To be an effective ruler you CANNOT take things personally. You also need to know how to “push and pull” with political negotiations. You have to have a very thick (nearly bullet proof) skin. You have to make very difficult decisions and you can’t be manipulated with “empathy” when it can lead to more misery and suffering for everybody.

Not to say there aren’t women who can be effective rulers. They exist but they are very rare.

I would vote for a woman IF and only IF her values aligned for what I think is best for this country.

But I sure as hell wouldn’t vote for AOC or Marjorie Taylor Green. They are examples of women acting with little emotional self control.

Last but not least no woman or anybody for that matter will ever convince me to vote for a woman just to “fight patriarchy”. That’s ludicrous. She needs to NOT use “I am a woman and I’m special because of it” angle if she hopes to win my respect. That’s a cop out.

[genericname85]

a patriarchy. cause men are gonna make hard decisions while women are gonna keep crying about how bad this is infinitely and never do anything.

[thegreenyogi]

I chose a matriarch and I think my reasoning is that I see countries where it is governed by a female prime minister for example like in my country and I see there is the desire for peace whereby in countries where there is a male figure as head of state there seems to be more angst, hatred and wars.

[blueonblack22]

And there is also a concept of “peace through strength”.

Just playing nice expecting other countries to do the same is very foolhardy.

[4ngelic]

both options really suck, but if i have to pick one i'd say matriarchy. because it would probably be more peaceful and fair than the alternative, we'd oppress men less badly than they'd oppress us in a patriarchy, also i'm a woman so an actual patriarchy would be terrible for me to live in

[WhiteThought]

all evidence to the contrary

[WhiteThought]

Patriarchy, because it's been proven to work, and a matriarchy has not.

[Caroline91]

This may be seen as not choosing, but I think a blend because one or the other lacks balance.

[HawkPerception]

Yeah that isn't choosing. It's life or death. Let's say someone is forcing you to choose one or the other.

I honestly don't get why so many people don't get what a hypothetical question is 😑

[loveslongnails]

Obviously, the patriarchy has done "so well" throughout history, haven't they?

[HawkPerception]

Couldn't tell if that was sarcasm

[loveslongnails]

Yes, it is.

[HawkPerception]

So you think the matriarchy then?

[Shiprex]

And yet look at evolution of society. Humans can literally now live wherever they want to on and under Earth or in space

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex What? WTF are you talking about?

[loveslongnails]

I think the patriarchy has done a shitty job. Clear enough?

[Shiprex]

The "patriarchy" has turned cabbage eating agrarians into technological masters. Humans can now live anywhere in spite of nature.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex All you are saying is that men are responsible for the majority of inventions and discoveries. And while that's true, ask yourself why? It's not because women are not capable of being great scientists, mathematicians, inventors, doctors, etc., but because the PATRIARCY limited or banned them from entering the fields.

Here are 101 inventions created by women.
www.cadcrowd.com/.../

Here's another list of female inventions that were stolen by or credited to men:
www.marieclaire.com/.../

The patriarchy has been GREAT at fostering war, death, power struggles, oppression and devastation along with the great inventions of societies. There's absolutely NO indication that these same inventions would not have come under a matriarchy. We also don't know what the propensity for death and destruction would have been, though we can say, could it have been worse?

[Shiprex]

You'll also be aware of how ridiculous it sounds when you gender human civilisation as being male and try to demonise it the same way by suggesting it was doing all those bad things. War and death overwhelmingly cost lives of MEN as does oppression, slavery, while protecting and saving women from those same things. Just look at every major natural and terrorist disaster WHO are the ones rushing in to SAVE people? It's MEN and they're also the invisible ones women have been taking for granted who make sure power, water, food flows from where it's grown to where you take it for granted come sun, hail rain or snow. A matriarchy WOULD never manage this because women would not choose those roles and would be worse at them.
No Matriarchy is a mythical political fantasy that would KEEP men doing all the shitty stuff while women would lord it over them even more than today. YES women have all the cards from birth to death in their hands. Longer life expectancy, no expectation to work, treated more gently and with more care in childhood and seldom held to account. THEN we can talk about the access to human need for reproduction. Far more men do not have nearly the access or opportunity to LIFE'S major drive of reproduction. Women have more than double that opportunity and access, they have CHOICE men have CHANCE.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex What you're describing isn't even patriarchy, so I can't begin to address your rather obfuscated points.

[Shiprex]

@loveslongnails
in what way is it NOT patriarchy? It's CIVILISATION as we have it and that has cost MEN'S live far more to get us where we are, relies far more on MEN'S work and lives to keep things providing lifestyles.
The LAW has meant men are given second place to women's reproductive rights. They don't get the child they produced when she doesn't want it and HAVE to pay for the one she does but he doesn't THAT isn't Patriarchy but it IS the current state of society that has feminists naming it PATRIARCHY.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex Your fixation with men fighting wars and patriarchal rule is exactly my point. It's uncertain that there would be fewer wars if women led all governments, but it's BEEN certain that when men run governments, there's nothing but a SHIT TON of wars. Get the point? And the fact that men have "created" or discovered more things than women is, as I said, because the patriarchy frowned on it and often stole credit for what these women DID do.

And no, you only get a certain amount of say when it comes to reproduction. Once you donate your sperm to her body, you shouldn't get to say what happens after that unless you agreed to it beforehand, in writing, with witnesses. You don't do SHIT for 38 weeks that directly affects the growth of that egg. If you want a child and don't particularly care who births it, you better get that girl to agree to carry it to the best of her ability, and you provide everything that is needed. You shouldn't be allowed to force her to carry it, but that's what is going on in a lot of states now.

Ironically, you also contradict your argument about reproductive rights with your "who rushes in to save people during emergencies" argument. You claim just because men are physically stronger and better able to do certain rescue jobs, they should determine how they're done, and that's patriarchy! Well, when you're able to give birth, then you can have a say in what happens to what's in your body. So until you get a functional reproductive system, you don't deserve any rights without prior agreement.

[Shiprex]

If men have no say in what happens to the sperm they give a woman then men should have no responsibility toward the outcome of that gift. Her body her choice.
Your knowledge of history seems to ignore that the QUEENS and EMPRESSES and all the other female leaders have overseen some of the worst of humanity. Victoria for example but nah you femorons seem incapable of reasoning that there has been MORE peace throughout history when men are involved yet when women are leaders they've ZERO pause to send MEN to their deaths for their "queen and country".
How tf does reproduction relate to emergency rescue services? Your pink account needs to be swapped for you irrational arguments here. When women commit to being as engaged in making sure society functions as thoroughly as men then they can expect equality to be real. In the mean time women will be laughed at for their life on easy mode thanks to MEN.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex Fortunately, the world doesn't think like you, except perhaps for the neo-authoritarians in the USA and the worst of other countries. Men are held responsible for child support whether they like it or not, because societies protect the women who raise the child. As I said, if you want to have a say that goes against hers, arrange it before hand. That's how the world's laws are structured. You don't like that, change it.

The number of queens and empresses who ruled over mass warfare and death marches pales compared to the number of kings. So what if there were a bunch of horrible women rulers? Compare that to the horrible kings and there's no contest.

All your words simply indicate what rational people have always known; the only thing you care about is power and control. You FEAR the loss of it, and you'll do or say ANYTHING to protect and prolong it. That's who and what you are.

[Shiprex]

Oh please save the drivel. THE RULING classes have been the ones solely responsible for the mass slaughter OF MEN not women so when you look through history WOMEN have ALWAYS been protected BY MEN. Take "women and children first" as a mentality? WHY? Men can row for longer and get further to save the children as well as do more survival stuff than women yet they're sacrificed? THAT'S the irrational thing you're missing.

Women have not demonstrated a competence for leadership because it takes courage and commitment to be the example to others you'd be sending to death. PS Catherine the great, the Victoria, Elizabeth, Cleopatra etc. are examples where the brutality of their actions surpassed many male leaders. Recorded history, like society also hides the horrors of female leadership and behaviour that you seem incapable of accepting in the misandrist world you adore and promote.

Women are the ones who have children, choose who to screw then choose whether to keep them. MEN should be taken out of the responsibility as they can't have the full range of choice that society forces on them just as men are forced to be the primary victims in war through their lives being forfeit and their general expendability thanks to ruling classes deciding they're less valuable than weaker, slower more mentally unstable women

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex You're actually driveling on me, but anyway. You're really incapable of an intelligent discussion due to your slanted version of history. You also seem too ignorant, or unable to read, or both, to understand that I never disputed men have traditionally protected women. That's a big "SO WHAT?" in terms of this discussion.

Now you're onto to some bullshit about the "ruling class", which has been all male predominantly throughout history despite the number of various queens. Again, all beside the point.

So let me keep it simple for your two competing brain cells: My point is that throughout all of history, male led civilizations have both made great discoveries and inventions, but also committed horrific crimes and caused wars, death, destruction and catastrophe at every juncture. This "patriarchy", especially that of religion, is responsible for more death and mayhem than any other single factor on the planet, including natural disasters.

Did I say "women leaders" would unquestionably do better? No, I said there's no way of knowing, at the same time, it's difficult to imagine they would do worse. None of this has ANYTHING to do with shit you keep throwing against the wall. If you can't focus on this simple point, just go away. Your accusation of misandry is both irrelevant and misguided at the same time, quite a feat when you think of it. LOL

[Shiprex]

Haha, your first comment that drivelled sarcasm about the patriarchy doing so well showed an immense misandrist spin that ignorws the reality SO WHAT? Screams that sacrifice and expendability are somehow irrelevant "expectations" placed only on men BY RULING CLASSES of families (think monarchs AND ALL THEIR KIN benefitting from this MASCULINE expectation? Yes thr princesses, queens and all the little boys and GIRLS being kept away from the very wars that expend men's lives as well as the building and progression of civilisation causing death and destruction of MEN'S lives disproportionately.

Its just the two brsin cells competence that's pointing out the misandrist ignorance being poured here.

Blame men and if it was a woman she did it because a man made her do it mentality is what's wrong with society now, you fear holding women accountable because you pedestalise them.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex Dude, the more you blabber, the more it's apparent that you're just a fucking idiot. I've nothing left to say to you.

[Shiprex]

@loveslongnails
You've not had anything sane to say here throughout. You need therapy.

[loveslongnails]

@Shiprex You need to learn how to read. There's a chance you can learn how to comprehend information, however slight that chance may be, but critical analysis is too much to ask. That train left your station ages ago.

[bunniesrcute]

dont literally countries with women in control have it generally better than those with men in control?

[HawkPerception]

On average, countries with female leaders tend to perform better than those with male leaders, yes. And it's proven that women tend to have more leadership qualities on average. But there are good male leaders and good female leaders.

[bunniesrcute]

lmao. says a lot.

[HawkPerception]

You seem to be a little on the misandrist side

[bunniesrcute]

how? by stating facts?

[HawkPerception]

Stating facts? I've been the one stating facts in our interactions. All you've been doing is asking questions in a defensive manner like you feel attacked or something.

And you saying "lmao. Says a lot" to what I said proves your hate.

[bunniesrcute]

it was more of a rhetorical question lol. stop being so pressed and relax a little

[Dongie]

I must sadly say the women. Men have proven to be warmongers!

[Dongie]

I'm going by the concept that ALL the world is such. Not just one country.

[Shiprex]

Queens have been heads of state and when you look at what happened with those as leaders then a lot of imperialism was done under the lead of them.

[Dongie]

But they were trying to impress men by being in competition. Today, with female leadership as a rule wouldn't need to feel that way.

[Shiprex]

No they were seeking power for power's sake. They wanted to DOMINATE people stronger then them.

[noohair]

Women are too vengeful.

[Dargil]

The one we have.

[queenofcardio]

Matriarch

[HawkPerception]

Why?