I think it's fucked up for a full time employee of 40+ hours per week to not receive any medical or dental benefits. Agree or disagree?

[Kingofkings1992]

Why are companies like this even allowed to exist? It shows that they view their employees as being extremely expendable, and that they see their employment as a commodity rather than an investment. "My business needs you to succeed, but I don't care about your health/ well being" are two repugnant thoughts to have going on in your head

Agree

Disagree

[NaultD]

Agree but why is healthcare benefits tied to employment? That's more fucked up for me. It's bad for people and bad for up and coming small buissness owners.

These multi billion dollar companies are basically holding workers hostage so their kids can get healthcare. when in reality these highly educated workers could branch off and create better competition in these fields.

Even if you do get benefits the only profit motivation these healthcare insurance companies have to grow is to rat fuck you out of the insurance that you pay for.

Single payer health care is a thing. You're a tax payer and rubbing the electoral paddles "clear" shock you back in rhythm. You need to stay alive to grow more tax revenues. 4 or 5 kids too while you're at it. Not a great place to be but better then our current insurance companies looking for every loop hole to kill you without anyone caring enough.

[MrChinaski]

Okay. If an insurer insures a pool of workers then they assess risk on the basis of some average of people healthy enough to work. If an individual seeks insurance then the insurer seeks to assess their individual health risks conditional on the fact that they are applying for insurance... sick people really want insurance, right? So the premia for individuals is waaaaay higher than for a group of employees.

As for single payer, that's pretty much the norm as the main form of hospital care in advanced economies. I think the Netherlands is the only other rich country like the US that relies mainly on private hospital insurance but it is vigorously regulated and is much cheaper than the US system.

Just a couple of humble observations.

[MrChinaski]

*point being that insurance is tied to employment in the US because it is cheaper for employees to insure as a group

[loveslongnails]

@MrChinaski Not really. That statement is only valid if you're comparing groups vs individuals, but it's STILL expensive even in a group. The reason it's stupid expensive in the USA is many fold, but the base reason is ---- it's a scam. It's not health care for people, it's insurance and medical assistance for PROFIT.

To a single payer system designed for citizens, like the one in New Zealand, the US system is an abomination. An associate of mine spent 2 weeks in a New Zealand hospital with a heart issue and needed a pacemaker. His total bill came to $22,000 USD for everything; the hospital room, the doctors, the labs, the technicians, the drugs -- everything, no insurance. The cost for the same stay in a US hospital with no insurance? $320,000.

It's a bullshit scam. $22K doesn't put you into bankruptcy. $320K does. There's is absolutely NO reason for health insurance companies to exist. They serve NO function whatsoever for the customer.

[NaultD]

@MrChinaski "point being that insurance is tied to employment in the US because it is cheaper for employees to insure as a group"

When ww2 started majority of workers went over seas. Their was a very high demand for workers but limited capital to give into salarys. So deals were made to attract workers.

https://youtu.be/CeDOQpfaUc8?si=Rb0EGL8k7dlwpKAw

[MrChinaski]

@loveslongnails I agree.

[MrChinaski]

@loveslongnails As a rough benchmark of entire health systems, you spend about $14,000 per person per year on health care, we spend about $8000. We have higher life expectancy.

[loveslongnails]

@MrChinaski The USA spends the MOST money with the WORST health outcomes. Whatever the numbers are, the outcomes are the worst because they're designed to be. Bad outcomes=big profits.

[Kingofkings1992]

@loveslongnails I actually share the same opinion as you, imagine that. Yes, there is not a single redeeming quality to the American healthcare industry. We spend more on healthcare than any other wealthy nation does, but a smaller portion of our citizens have access to the care. And we also consistently rank as having one of the lowest life expectancies, and one of the highest rates of depression/ mental illness. The US healthcare system is a joke. It's corrupt top to bottom. It's all about the healthcare CEOs salaries, and nothing else. Maybe you and I might have more in common than you think.

[loveslongnails]

Don't let it go to your head. :-D

[Anonymous]

And then there's the OTHER side of it. Some businesses are simply too small to give benefits. And in a way they pay for it by not getting very good employees. Because who would work a fulltime job without benefits, unless they were just too young and healthy to know better, or unless the were desperate and had no other choice.

I understand your frustration. This is why in TODAY's world you have to view yourself as a brand. Always be improving that brand. Have loyalty to PEOPLE, but not to ANY company. Because they would slit your throat in heartbeat if it made their stock jump a qtr. of a point. Make yourself skilled to the point you become hard to be disposable. And still only care about your brand. You are in the business of YOU, not them.

It's much easier to change you and your mindset than to expect that the world ever will.

[Anonymous]

Why does the company have to pay it?

You realise that if companies were paying for your health care they would just deduct it from your wages anyway.

What is actually needed is that health insurance be stripped down to bare essentials and serious medical conditions. For instance we women can just buy contraceptive pills over the counter, men can buy their viagra. Most importantly we need to tackle the obesity problem as it drives up the price of health insurance.

[Kingofkings1992]

Lol. You kids are funny

[Opinion Owner]

The statistics are there. At least 90% of all adult related deaths are obesity related. Similar statistics for the majority of ailments that health insurance pays for, which drives health insurance through the roof. If you look at countries with health insurance and people of a healthy weight, their health insurance costs much less.

[Opinion Owner]

Sorry 20% and 90% of ailments.

[Anonymous]

There has to be a better way. I just don't know what it is

[DryGermanGuy]

When I saw your question, my first reaction was, this can't be legal. Then I realized that you're American and in America getting fucked over at every step is part of the experience.

[Anonymous]

Well we hear so much from employers about " work ethic" in terms of employees. But there's also pay ethic. There's also an ethic to what you pay your workers. If you dangle a job in front of desperate people and pay them only the absolute bare fucking minimum to keep them, then you're unethical. Pay ethics. . . we need to talk about that more. That needs to be a conversation.

[slatyb]

The real problem is that the US needs to join every other developed country and provide health care for all it's citizens.

[Kingofkings1992]

We're the only one who thinks it's a business, and not a human right

[loveslongnails]

I agree with NaultD. Healthcare in every other industrialized nation in the world is paid for with tax money. Some systems are very good, others suck like in the UK. But it shouldn't even be tied to employment.

[exitseven]

I agree. I would quit and find another place that had benefitrs

[msc545]

Of course I agree this is one step above slavery.

[Kelley1]

It is a cost that is deducted from salaries.

[Cidknee]

Oh, I agree.