Feminists: They're not all the same!

[sherbearee]

"Feminazi"
"Man-haters"
'Hairy-legged b!tches"

We've heard them all.

Yet feminism has helped women get the chance to vote, the opportunity to apply for various jobs, and the right to independently own property. Feminism has impacted society in many (and I'd like to think) beneficial ways.

Feminism is a range of movements which promote equal rights, treatment, and opportunity for men and women in political, social, and economic sectors.

Now, the general definition isn't that bad. However, in the 1980's, "feminism" began to branch out into a whole bunch of diverging theories. Some of the more extreme ones have made a name for themselves, causing people to recoil at the notion of a "feminist."

I admit that I opposed feminism for quite a while, associating feminism with extremist "feminazis." But upon realizing that there is more than one type of feminism, my views slightly changed as well.

Liberal Feminism

This is the more subtle feminism that strives to integrate women into a generally patriarchal society. Liberal feminism supports legislations which help remove barriers to women's equality. It believes that women are just as intellectually capable as men, and thus should be given the same opportunities. It promotes the idea of equality of women through her own choices and actions.

Radical Feminism

Radical feminism is, well, the radical one. Some of it's ideals clash with those of liberal feminism, so instead of trying to integrate women into society, it believes that society as a whole must be reordered and patriarchy abolished. It rejects "gender norms," traditional family systems, and the roles usually associated with them. Although this type of feminism generates the most backlash, it's actually the foundation of many ideals for other branches feminism.

Cultural Feminism

Even though cultural feminism is a more modern branch off of radical feminism, the two types have quite different views. Cultural feminism states that women have an innate tendency to be gentle, kind, caring, and interdependent, while society values "male traits" such as agression, domination, competition, and independence. This actually contradicts the abolition of gender norms -an idea of radical feminism- as it commends the difference between man and woman. It believes that if women ruled the world (which I personally find juxtoposes equality), there would be no more conflict and war. However, cultural feminists tend to focus on individual change and its influence on others, rather than take political measures.

Socialist Feminism

This type of feminism calls for major social change, arguing that the economic sources of women's oppression must be removed. It declares that women's undervalued domestic work will prepetually be dominated by the powerful, wealthy, and predominatly male capitalist class, arguing that for every $1.00 a man makes, a woman only makes $0.70. Socialist feminism focuses on the broader social relations, calling for the end of capitalism in favor of socialist reform of the economy.

---

Just because one supports a woman's equality does not mean that one opposes a man's.

There are many, many, types of feminism, and I have only briefly covered a few major ones. Feel free to correct me, and feedback is appreciated :)

[Anonymous]

I understand not all feminists are the same but if you went out and asked people to name the most influential feminist of the 2nd wave back in the 60s and 70s Valerie Solanas' name would probably come up twice as much as whoever was in second place. She and her followers were the vocal majority not the vocal minority. She was so crazy that people thought her SCUM manifesto at first was satire until she tried to murder a couple of guys for being guys and then people went "oh maybe she wasn't joking, she's a psycho..." but she gained an absurdly large following.

I also have a problem with socialist feminism. That isn't about gender it's about being assertive. There is no specific pay anyone is going to get at a job. A man and a woman can go into an interview for the same job that has two openings. They can come out both with the job but with different pay. That's because pay is negotiable and so how much you get paid depends on how bold you are about what you ask to be paid. They won't get the same pay because one asked for more than the other. That's how jobs work. If the girl didn't ask for a higher pay from what was offered to her that's not sexism on the employers part that's timidness on her part. Don't blame others for your own shortcomings.

[Opinion Owner]

Instead of upvoting or downvoting I'd rather if people either added on to what I said or critique what I said. Otherwise I don't know where someones opinion feels the same on something specific or greatly differs.

[sherbearee]

I'm not familiar with Valerie Solanas, to be honest, but I can slightly relate to the socialist theory... that has to do with the $0.70 for a woman 1.00 for a man data, right? I don't particularly agree with the feminist theories, because they seem to compare things that are fundamentally different. Women and men often to pursue different careers, and thus the salary is different. Then some women CHOOSE to stay at home, which the feminist theories do not account for.

[Opinion Owner]

That is a factor as well. I think profession choice and race are the two biggest factors. The pay gap for white men and women while still existing is closer than the 78 cents. And I think both white men and women earn more than men or women of any other race in the country (except maybe Asian men). But I don't have a source right now for that so don't hold me to it.

[sherbearee]

hmm that's possible, though the minority groups ARE minorities afterall... so if you're talking GROSS amount made, definitely. If it was by averages... it may be a bit closer

[sjoes006]

in my opinion a feminist is anyone that doesn't want to be barefoot and pregnant to be seen but not heard. I don't like the term and I think it needs to go away. It's not the 1970's anymore.

Men and women are never going to be the same and there will always be differences but that should t mean difference in pay. My friend's husband got a pay bump just for getting engaged even though she foots the bill on everything. If they have kids he'll get another one. Women don't get these types of bumps even if we are the head of household.

It isn't feminist to want to be treated like a human being instead of 2/3 of a human being. It isn't feminist to want equal rights.

[Riggers]

No offence, But why does it matter which person in the relationship got the ''Pay Bump''.

The money will be going to BOTH of them as a couple right? Not just the man. The woman gets just as much as extra money as the guy in that situation.

[sjoes006]

Actually no not all couples share money.

[sjoes006]

@Riggers I'm revisiting this as it was quoted on my profile. Further it matters because of divorce. Women end up with the kids. It matters because many people are having kids these days in nontraditional households. A single mother doesn't get a bump, gays don't get bumps, married women don't get bumps.

White men are already ahead in terms of base salary, and then they get HUGE bumps for life events at certain companies? Not okay.

Also a problem because he isn't the earner and is probably better of not working if either or had to be made.

Let's assume both partners make the same income And share wages. Does it matter who gets the bump? Not as much for that couple but as a general principal it does. You as an employer cannot give a bump to men and not to women for the same event. It is illegal discrimination yet it happens all the time.

Yet women shoulder the cost and time of child raising while men run free not even paying the proper amount.

[Riggers]

"While men run free not even paying the proper amount"...

Tbh. I'm genuinely do not have the willpower within me to argue with another feminazi who hates white men just for the crime of being born with a certain skin pigment and with a dick... Nothing I can say will ever change how sexist and racist you people are.

[dartmaul15]

And in the end, feminism is a radical movement. In its time it always has been, and always will be. It was radical to demand to work, it was radical to demand to vote... you get it.

But it was genuine imbalances in society. Now it's no longer like that, the woman isn't universally the victim. Men and women are bot the victim, but in different areas. Women may earn less (actuall, the 70cent per dollar is bull. it's closer to 92cent), but men are not heard when victims of rape and donmestic abuse (men make up about 40% of the victims actually).
And we have our social stereotypes. It's still not okay for men to be weak, it's still not okay for men to be poor. Women are still seen as the weaker sex.

But what's feminism pushing for? HER problems. Notice the word "femi" in the name?
I get that they're trying to improve on her problems, but the world doesn't work like that anymore.
Because when push comes to shove, feminism isn't needed in the west. It has raised women to men's levels. Its job is over. It's time to work towards equalism and egalitarianism! Feminism do not do that.

Over to the second topic. It's called "judged by your actions, not your words". Everyone, look at what feminism is achieving. I'm talking all branches now! What do you think about it? look at how they work.
Is that really something you want to support?
And before you scream "hurr durr that's not feminism," know that feminism is a broad definition that does include everyone from the most hardcore radfem, to the old schhool feminists like based mom, and the old legends.

"not every feminist is crazy". God, i love that claim.
Fine, here's a bowl of hariboo bears. 100 of them are regular, and 10 of them are sugarfree ones. About 5 of the sugarfree ones are enough to make you shit your guts out (figurativey speaking). Do you dare to eat the bowl? Not every bear is dangerous. You can eat 90 of them without getting ill!
That logic can be applied to A LOT of things. Women, men, kids... everything. And the problem is that logic applies. It's how life works. A small minority being excessively bad can easily ruin the fun for everyone if the rest doesn't do something about them.

[Azara]

I wonder how may people stop to think how absurd it is that women ahev to be albked as a thing just for standing up for their rights. If aguy doesn't want to be controlled by other people deixdes to get smo. Make his own decision learn about his place in history he doenst get labeled anything or get attacked as unnatural for doing so. . It's just human. People use the word feminism tomake human things abnormal for women. And then women get categorized I to being a feminist or a good proper women... What's a woman withiit women's rights.

You can't be human withiit being human there's no better kind of human this the one who demands human recognition. And yet I hear women themselves Will refer to themselves in some kind of pure untainted with poltical concerns kind of way as posed to troublesome women who see themselves as men... For being human.

This has nothing to do with my being against feminism. That would be crazy bc I woul t even be here writing on this computer withiit the mivemet. I just think it's time that we are all sort of history without being an accept ion for scholars and scientists.

" feminist are concerned with " insert anything having to Do with women's status in the world " . Last time I checked women are people. Not a cause. Social movements are import at to keep progress from back testing but it gets old being referred to as feminist issue unless being referred to a hoise wife or traditional

No problem with Your take just got me thinking:)

[weegin]

You're right, feminism makes it sound like women are an exception to the norm, when everyone can see they are not. I propose a solution: Abolish Feminism. Then women will not be treated differently from men, because neither gender will be portraying itself as needing more help than the other gender.

Sound good? :P

[Azara]

I wonder how may people stop to think how absurd it is that women have to be lqbked as a thing just for standing up for their rights. If a guy doesn't want to be controlled by other people and decides to ask his own decioms , takes steps to learn about his place in history... He doesn't get landed anything or attacked as unnatural for doing these perfectly normal things. It's just being human which we ALL are. Just bc historically women were forced into insane circumstance in no way means departure is " unnatural". Crazy is crazy no matter howlomg it stays around. Things are just being tuned back right see up. Complaining about " normal" is weird. People use " feminism" as a way to make what is normal a me right very human things seem abnormal for women. As a woman as female human being you are categorized Indepedent of your will outlook as feminist or a proper woman. As if acknowledging a woman's right is somehow unwomanly... What exactly is a woman without woman's rights?

[Azara]

Oh that was correcting typos^

Feminism is a movement its abiit evolving. To exist to be a human being in this moment as a woman you don't need a label. Labeling a human being for being human >>> crazy.

[Anonymous]

Oh here we go again.

They all want you to believe they are different and in their minds they believe they aren't like the rest, but any feminist you meet will have believed the same doctrine, they will have at some point spewed the same lies about wage gap, rape stats, and domestic violence. They will have all at some point benefited from the hate crimes of the radicals without making a stand against them.

So when you say feminist are not the same... They actually are the same in all the parts that make the movement bad. They may be different in minor aspects but the core is the rotten part. Just like there is no amount of good actions which will make you a "different KKK" or a "better Nazi". The CORE fundamental beliefs of these groups are what make them what they are and the actions of the majority are what dictate the true nature of the group.

So please stop trying to justify yourself with words and start doing it with actions.
Stop spreading the lies, and misinformation
Stop allowing the bad to "tarnish" your brand
Stop accepting the benefits gained by the radicals

[Azara]

What lies about rape and domestic violence? Where are they?

Just to be cost you're saying equal rights and oppsrin to patriarchal rule is analogous to being a nazi?

So a revolutionary is a nazi?

You realize no society in the world was sstsblsojed withiit a revolution.

Co purges are part of the technological revolution. Are you a nazi bc you use a computer?

[Opinion Owner]

Rape is not 1 in 4... the mary koss stat is bullshit and falsified feminist garbage. The federal crime statistic database shows it over the last 20 years as being 0.5 to 1.7 out of 1000.
HERE YA GO: https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv08.pdf

The DV stats are also not "Mostly women" or "1 in 4" or 5. These stats ignore male victims, and there have been over 286 different studies which show it is EQUAL between the sexes. YES EQUAL!
Here is a list of those non-Biased non-Feminist studies.
https://web.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

I am saying that hate groups are hate groups regardless of a minority of people feeling they are "good ones" in that group. So yes the analogy to Nazi's applies.

What is sstsblsojed, I am sure it was a quick type or an auto correct but I don't know what you meant to state.
But in regards to a revolution... Feminism was a revolution back when it fought for actual causes, women have had equality in western cultures (or more than) for decades now...

[Opinion Owner]

... the only "wins" feminism has had reciently have been stopping men from sitting with their legs apart, shutting down men's issues, getting men fired for saying "dongle" jokes, Publically ridiculing a man who advanced space exploration for wearing a shirt, fighting to close womens prisons and stop women from being punished for crimes, and pushing legislature to end peoples ability to disagree with feminist.

These are NOT wins... these are petty bullying and prove the true core of feminism as it stands today.

[Opinion Owner]

So as expected, this is where the conversation grinds to a complete halt.

I would like to believe that the other person involved, as well as the take owner, would see these facts and use them to see the lies, misinformation, and corruption of the ideology they love so much. But that is simply a pipe dream where logic and reason is considered over fear mongering, bigotry, and lies.

IF feminist are not all the same... Prove it. Show one that doesn't believe the lies, cover up or disregard the truth, stifle or ignore men's issues, fights FOR men's issues, doesn't spread false propaganda, and stands up against the one's it says are just the "radicals".

[Someguy17]

I like you, but let's not stop there. How about horrible inequality in divorce court/custody cases, longer prison terms, higher incarceration rates, lower high school/college/post secondary graduation rates with almost all funding still going to support the promotion of female education, institutional gender quotas that favor women just for being women, and medicating young boys just because they have too damn much energy. Feminism is absolutely a hate group that is getting increasingly successful at subjugating men.

[Opinion Owner]

@Someguy17 Totally... I would have easily continued into that conversation. The 5 downvotes which all happen to be pink, so why it's so hard for males to speak up about these issues. As a female I am more likely to be at least listened to without being instantly shut down with some shaming tactic, but even then, feminist will fight tooth and nail to have the truth silenced.

Lauren Southern a very amazing anti-feminist who speaks out about the lies and atrocities of the social justice propaganda, is in a women's studies class and voices her opinion about the wrongs. They have now issued her with a legal gag order to have her silenced.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDiKFtlre00&feature=share

[9mfeo]

Bro, the conversation is grinding to a halt because you're on anonymous and can't tag people so they actually see what you've said.

[Opinion Owner]

9mfeo: I am anonymous for good reason... "BRO"
So if you have more to add please do.

[LogicBomber]

I feel I should assist here. Since I would like to see where this conversation goes.
@Azara
@9mfeo
@Someguy17

[9mfeo]

No need to be a bag of dicks. Just explaining how the notification system works.

[Someguy17]

Yes, I have seen her video, big fan. I also like Girl WritesWhat and Dr Helen Smith. It is sad that society will absolutely not listen to a man who speaks up for himself. He gets labeled as a sexist immediately. Women like the ones listed and yourself are a huge, and needed breath of fresh air.

[Jager66]

Interestingly enough, none of these have anything to do with equality.

Liberal Feminism: The source of affirmative action laws that discriminate against men because women aren't as capable in Feminist eyes and they need special help to do the same thing a man does. Otherwise known as Misogynist Feminism.

Radical Feminism: (Other wise known as Mainstream Feminism or Feminazy) These are the man haters, nuff said, everyone knows about these crazies.

Cultural Feminism: (Otherwise known as SJW's) This group is the one responsible for "Safe Spaces" on campus where adults can go to feel safe from ideas that are different from their own on a University Campus, so long as your view is a Feminist view other wise you are excluded. They are also responsible for such turds as "Man spreading" or expanding the definition of harassment to mean anytime a man talks to a woman, even just saying hello, or the He For She campaign.

Socialist Feminis: (Otherwise known as Marxist Feminism) Yep the curtailing of individual freedom is a small price to pay so women can be the dominant ruling class. They are the ones who push they 70c per male dollar earned Myth that has been debunked by experts for decades.

What do they all have in common? They are all based on a conspiracy theory called the "Patriarchy" (not to be confused with actual patriarchy, Feminism likes to change/expand the definition of words). They are also all immune to critical review and will resort to logical fallacy and shaming tactics once facts become a part of the conversation.

You also forgot "Factual Feminism" this is the Feminism that actually endeavors to be pro equality but has been crucified by the other Feminist factions because it prefers to rely on critical thought, evidence and build a world where women are equal to men instead of grabbing at power and government dollars.

[sherbearee]

interesting... thank for the input, and I do know a missed tons of "types."
I agree that a lot of the modern data used to base "facts" on are skewed, but the women's suffrage that won women's rights in the 20th century I'm grateful of.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

Here are some quotes on the liberal feminist taken directly from the text because you said none of these forms of feminism have anything to do with equality: "subtle feminism that strives to integrate women into a generally patriarchal society," "believes that women... should be given the same opportunities. Promotes the idea of EQUALITY of women." I think you should learn to read carefully because it clearly states that liberal feminists promote the idea of EQUALITY. Also it's not that women make 70 cents to the dollar a man makes, they actually make 78 cents to the dollar a man makes and potentially less depending on race, and before you begin with your 'it has been debunked by experts for years' without actually having any evidence to back you up here is an article on the white house website (a reliable source if you even know what that means) that will show you the error you've made: https://www.whitehouse.gov/equal-pay/career and before you assume I'm a hardcore feminist I'm not.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

(continuing my thought because I ran out of words) I'm not going to deny it would be fantastic to be treated equally and not instantly thought of as less by much of the male population because I'm a woman but it's not like I think all men are assholes. I've come to accept it in a way which I am disappointed in myself for but in our society it's still sort of a norm. So like I said, I'm not a hardcore feminist before you even bash on me about something like that.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

Also I want to point out that you seem to be warping what the myTake Owner wrote so as to fit your personal and biased opinion, you are involving a lot of emotion and instead of it being a sort of informational type thing like what it should be. You kind of turned this entire thing into this whole rant about how all the forms of feminism the author wrote about are terrible in a different way like for example how they 'resort to logical fallacy and shaming tactics once facts become part of the conversation' (not agreeing just restating.) And you say that they are all based on a 'conspiracy theory called patriarchy' but I'm not understanding what is different from how feminists define patriarchy and what it actually is because if you're claiming that patriarchy does not exist I can tell you for a fact that you're dead wrong because I've witnessed it myself in my life and if you want examples (from the world not my personal experience because you might think I'm lying) I can show you them

[Jager66]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ Well I'm not being emotional about it, sorry if it came off that way to you. I think part of the problem with my post is that I have had this conversation more times then I can count over the years and it just becomes exhausting having the same conversation over and over and over with people who can't be bothered to look into the critique of the Feminist movement. After a while it's like all I can be bothered to say is that Feminism is fucked up because reasons.

I could post source after source and make dozens of arguments but that would take FAAAR!! more room then this site allows and frankly most people are so biased they just outright ignore counter arguments no matter how well sourced or reasoned. The problems with Feminism are very complex it really does take a great deal of research to get to the bottom of the issues they are lying about, which is pretty much everything.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

You make claims that you have sources that will back you up and you may have some on the corruption of feminism but nothing else. I'm not biased, I believe on opinions created with facts or life experiences and clearly we have different ones. I'm not blind to the fact that there are some serious problems with feminism but with your logic I can bash on the government, religion, and basically anything else because there will always be people in a certain group that will tarnish the name of any (no matter how great a cause) specific group of people who want to obtain a goal. Basic human nature is sadly corruption. What I disagree with is you stating that 'The problems with Feminism are very complex it takes a great deal of research to get to the bottom of the issues they are lying about, which is pretty much everything,' because you seem to be generalizing all feminists and it's a lie to say ALL feminists have fault. Some really just want equality and I don't see what's so wrong with that

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

And I'm not most people, you stated that 'frankly most people are so biased they just outright ignore counter arguments no matter how well sourced or reasoned' well I don't because I'm not arguing for the sake of being right, I'm arguing because I sincerely think there's a fault in your way of thinking and if you can prove me to be wrong with factual evidence, I will change the side I am on. However with your logic (like I had already said before but I want to make sure you understand) anyone can bash on any group of people like 'feminists' in this case because there will always be the people who tarnish the name of even a good-willed organization, and people only seem to pay attention to all of the bad things associated which I don't understand. I'm not saying there are not flaws to feminism, I'm saying you're wrong to put all feminists into the terrible categories you did, considering that not everyone in a specific group will think or act the same.

[Jager66]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ When I said "frankly most people are so biased they just outright ignore counter arguments no matter how well sourced or reasoned" This is not an accusation of you, it's an expressions of my experience discussing this issue with people online, thought that was obvious hope this clears it up for you.

Did you miss the part where I listed "Factual Feminism"? That is a good form of Feminism in my opinion, it's just VERY!!! rare. I am not blindly bashing and only focusing on the bad, the problem with Feminism is that it is now rotten to the core and has been for a very long time, at least since the 70's if prominent Feminist Christina Hoff Summers is to be believed.

Have you ever asked your self why the founder of the battered women's shelter movement is an Anti-Feminist? or why so many intelligent people fight against Feminism? or why so many people call it a Religion? The reasons are not simple and easily dismissed as Feminists would have you believe.

[DessieDoo]

Here is my problem with feminists... In my state, the only feminists you come across are the ones who believe that women are far more superior than men. The women who believe that men are the only ones who rape. The ones who hate men as a whole. I have a son and a wonderful boyfriend and quite frankly, given my experience and encounters with these ignorant women have completely set me off. There is no way I will ever become a feminist or stand beside them because of this issue. Yes, not all feminists are the same. Obviously some feminists stand for a very good and powerful cause. But as I said, people in my area are twack jobs. They are all about image rather than the movement. I now have women walking around our area with their tits hanging out and purple arm pit hair because they are women and need to "free the nip" or "be true to themselves". I won't even let my daughter leave the house sometimes because I refuse to have a Miley Cyrus on my hands. Maybe if women actually stuck to the actual movement instead of trying to ruin men's lives or display public nudity (especially in areas with an abundance of children) then feminism wouldn't be seen as something so pathetic.
I have also had women walk down my street with signs saying "Abortion is only necessary for boy children" or "Don't breast feed your boy babies. Your beautiful girls need that nutrition" and my favorite, "Circumsion is not an option! Keep the boys from feeling as much sexual pleasure and there will be less rape!" Fuck women like this. They are lucky I didn't go out and shove that sign straight up their nasty assholes. I have a son. So yes, I take these things very seriously. Especially where my son is going to grow up dealing with these women's ignorance.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

Finally, someone who doesn't think generalize all feminists into a single terrible category. I completely agree with you. I really like how you clarify that you think not all feminists are the same and that some stand for a very powerful cause. It really is unfortunate that feminism has been labeled so terribly because of the people who call themselves feminists and do the things such as "Circumcision is not an option! Keep the boys from feeling as much sexual pleasure and there will be less rape!" when it was supposed that feminism was created to gain equality, but nonetheless it's admirable that even with your terrible experiences you still knowledge that not all people from a single group (in this case feminism) are the same.

[DessieDoo]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ Absolutely! I believe there are some women out there that actually stand for the cause. I am not a feminist but I don't disagree with the actual movement. It is truly just the women within my area that put a bad taste in my mouth. And that is simply because of the reasoning I listed above.

[aliencreature]

thats like saying not all nazis want to murder jews

if you believe in equal opportunity then you're not a feminist. period. abandon the label and get with egalitarianism--but you won't, because if egalitarianism is what you REALLY believed in then you would have. you cling to the label because equality and sufferage is this ridiculous hollow man argument feminists still cling to despite the world knowing how full of shit that is for quite sometime now. even if you did believe in equal opportunity and you somehow thought that banding together with a bunch of hypocritical man hating twatbags, the world does not owe you the effort of willfully differentiating you as the one exception in a movement of radical hypocritical misandrists. just like if you band together with a bunch of nazis the US forces invading the concentration camp dont owe you the courtesy of differentiating you between a movement of radical jew hating religious nutbags--its your prerogative to think yourself different, pretend you believe something different and still wear that swastika, and if you do, good for you, but its still your fault if you get caught in the crossfire because you should have distanced yourself from that group long ago.

and if you dont think thats a valid comparison, yes, yes it fucking is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOCD_T9Qqpchttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iARHCxAMAO0

You're a part of a HATE GROUP, dumbass. get the picture or don't but you're still on my shit list whether you join them or just defend them

[aliencreature]

No one buys NAFALT excuses anymore, no one is stupid enough but you

[aliencreature]

NAFALT NAFALT NAFALT NAFALT NAFALT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQWoNhrY_fM

[skykidx1]

Wtf is this?

[26ukdude]

I don't mind women wanting to be equal to men, that is, until you realise men and women ARE different, it has recently been proven (unsurprisingly) that men are better equipped to deal in combat and war zones than women. Us being stronger than you is not us hating on you, it's just the way it is. Nursing and care roles are largely dominated by women... but wheres the men complaining that they are underrepresented in those jobs?

You have equal rights (in the UK) so stop going on about it, if you live in the western world you are the same as us. Now explain to me how is it fair that some nightclubs allow women in for free, yet men have to pay?
You are depressed and get taken seriously instead of being told to man up or stop being a woman, wheres the fairness in that?
Feminists don't care about true equality, only that which suits their own agenda. So I like most other men have little time for them, stop thinking you have it so hard nowdays, you dont. Notice how I said nowdays, not in the past where it was needed, but please its outdated and not needed so stop.

[sherbearee]

I never did say I was a feminist..
I'm just really appreciative of the women's suffrage movements in the 20th century. I like being able to own things, to pursue an education, and I like being an individual.
As towards the 21st century in a Western country, I no longer find it really necessary for feminism. I just simply wanted to inform people of the various types.

[Anonymous]

Differentiating between the different types of feminist seems like an argument that only pertains to white people. #firstworldwhiteproblems

Minorities worry about gaining respect as a person, institutionalized racism, cultural appropriation, & staying alive. #BlackLivesMatter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26Ys13CEepE

From Mississippi 1963 to South Carolina 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_fkb5BpIf0

Hidden Colors

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_hx30zOi9I

Institutionalized Racism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1KJRRSB_XA

Cultural Appropiation

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

Feminism or differentiating between feminism doesn't only pertain to white people. It is something that affects and influences women as a whole. It's really shows how uneducated you are if you think that racism is the biggest and most important civil right movement. I think all civil rights movements have an important role they play towards a better society. And I can also pull up videos and write a short blurb of information that make feminism seem like the best of causes and make people understand it's a problem if you want me too, it really isn't that difficult. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to say that I think the feminist cause is a greater one than racism, I just hope you understand that both should be valued because you were already dismissing feminism as a "#firstworldwhiteproblem"

[Opinion Owner]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_
Wow, you obviously didn't read for an understanding lol!
Where did I dismiss or say feminism wasn't important? I said, "Differentiating between the different types of feminist", which does not mean the same thing genius! Feminism is a whole, feminists are individuals.

Where did I say racism was most important? I said, "Minorities worry about gaining respect as a person, institutionalized racism, cultural appropriation, & staying alive."

Next time comprehend what is said before trying to refute it lol! Your ignorance & lack of reading skills is showing :)

[Riverock]

I agree with your Take and is was pretty good.

I actually used to identify as feminist but don't anymore (even though the comment where I identified as feminist keeps coming up on my profile which is weird).
in my opinion, the word has become so vague as to be almost meaningless. Most people believe in equality for both genders but disagree with much of feminist theory yet the word applies to both. So identifying as a feminist means that you can either believe that men and women are equal or you also go into 10 minute long rants about how the patriarchy means men have their legs too wide on buses.

For the purposes of communicating your beliefs, the word is too vague to be useful in my opinion. It's like saying you have political beliefs so you're an "politicalist" or something.

[HikerDude]

Feminists once advocated for equality among the genders, now they advocate for female hegemony. Gender equality, after all, is an accomplished fact and has been for many years now. Because of this, I neither identify with Feminism nor have positive associations with the movement as a whole.

In my experience, girls get the best of everything, get treated with greater care than boys, and garner much greater sympathy for their troubles. Guys' lives are much rougher, the edges much sharper. If one girl is assaulted anywhere in America, it's national news. A dozen guys could get murdered in the street and you'd never hear a thing. Happens every weekend on the South Side of Chicago.

[skykidx1]

Any girl that does not argee with this know. It's true... girls get treated better 90% of the time it's a fact.

[Anonymous]

Yes there are many kinds of feminism, however what is true to all feminist are actually not the promotion of equal rights, treatment, and opportunists for men... in political, social, and economic sectors. In fact most feminist don't care about men's rights at all, they focus exclusive on women's rights, so having as part of the definition is really stupid.

The only part all feminists agree on is the existence of a patriarchy. The belief in a patriarchy is what defines feminism.

The promote equal rights, treatment, and opportunity for men and women in political, social, and economic sectors, are not done by all feminists, but it done the non feminists as well.

Therefore the patriarchy is the only common factor of feminism.

[Rainie_]

I agree. And I honestly don't understand how some people don't want equality and rejects it, just blows my mind. And I hate saying Im a feminist cause guys always give me this look like "geez, another feminazi" *rolls eyes*. Feminists in history is what got us women the rights we have today and Im so thankful for that. 😊

[sjoes006]

Don't accept the label. It shouldn't have to be explained.

[mexborough]

depends... you only go through life on your looks... so you don't need laws or moral changes to assist you...

[Someguy17]

Yeah, and what about feminism today? If you believe in actual equality maybe look into something that takes multiple perspectives into account and doesn't simply try to shove it's narrow ideology down everyone's throats. There is a reason men look at you that way when you say you're feminist. I immediately think "brainwashed," and I've yet to be disappointed.

[Rainie_]

@Someguy17 I do believe in actual equality. Feminism IS VERY MUCH needed. Especially in countries like Pakistan, Yemen, India, most of Middle East, Bangladesh, I could name so many countries. Sure, the west have come hell of a looong way, but thats only because of what feminists in our history have done and sacrificed for our freedom, if it weren't for them, heck we still wouldn't be allowed to vote or partake in anything that has to do with politics and much more, just showing my respects. But the west IS the minority of the world. there's still female genital mutilation going on, brothels, no access to education (or getting killed for trying to get an education), being killed for walking outside without a veil or beaten if you walk outside on the street without male relative accompany, getting thrown acid on because you rejected their marriage proposals, forced marriages of 12 year olds. So stop assuming shit, I know damn well what Im supporting. -.-

[Someguy17]

Cool, support away. I'll choose to fight for everyone, regardless of gender.

Oppression is a part of life for almost everyone and you can keep acting like you've got the market cornered if you like, but I call bullshit. The only way forward is together and not through the lens of a narrow ideology that supports by name and action just half the population.

If you care so much about the plight of women in other countries, then please go fight for them. I cannot solve all of the world's problems, but I can impact the ones in front of me. I don't need to pontificate about the problems of people on the other side of the world in order to imbue my causes with a sense of justice. I see plenty right in front of me in my own life. Besides, hoe much have you educated yourself on those cultures, or do you simply buy all everything that you're told if it suits your worldview?

[skykidx1]

Not Manny are like you n... That's a sad fact

[MashedPotato]

"I don't understand how some people don't want equality and rejects it"
Its pretty simple. Instead of supporting a movement based on its self proclaimed goal, we look at what they are doing in practice. Feminists don't do reasonable things that'll bring gender equality anymore. Hence we don't support the movement.

Tl;dr:Smart people buy products based on the ingredients and not by what is claimed by the brand

[Someguy17]

@Rainie_ Whoops, forgive the typos, I suck on my phone. One more thing I couldn't let pass; you mentioned female genital mutilation in overseas countries, but do you realize that thousands of men have their genitals mutilated everyday, including in the US (60% of all men), and almost no one says a word about it or sees it as a problem?

The only real reason to do this anymore is aesthetics. This is just one of many examples of the attention men's issues get vs women's issues. This all happens while feminists scream about the far less frequent act of female genital mutilation. Of circumcision, nary a peep, equality indeed.

[Rainie_]

@Someguy17 Look here's the problem, as soon as I mention few women's problems you quickly fire back at me with "what about men huh? We got lots of inequalities too!", sure but if you compare that with women in the world as a whole, then you know damn well you're better off as a man than a woman. I'm not saying men don't have issues and I'm not denying circumcision, in fact I do believe it is really sick and needs to be stopped. I wasn't putting it down or comparing it with FGM at all, YOU are the one who is comparing and putting down an issue when it's been happening to 130 million people including women in the UK as well, how is that not an issue that needs to be addressed? If you've actually talked to women who has had FGM then you know that they clearly remember the day it happened are still badly affected by it (I know because I know a few women who's had FGM) We're focusing on women's issues in this post, not world issues in general, not men's issues, that's another post.

[Screamsgutter]

US Society focuses on womens' issues practically 24/7. Here you can't turn on the tv or browse news sites without being trampled by some womens' march in full swing over the 'right'' to go topless in public 'cuz men can or something. Morning talk shows filled entirely with female hosts (go diversity!) often donate its entire hour to such issues. Public service announcements about domestic violence portraying women as its exclusive victims. And why don't they just make a cartoon spokesperson for the gender pay gap and stick her on a flag, 'cuz it's an issue that brings no shortage of hot air for it to flap in.

What I'm saying is that it's literally a treat to be able to speak about mens' issues openly and without a helmet, and it's conversations about mens' issues that receive the lion's share of 'what about' derailment, not womens' issues.

Thread about feminism = concerns women AND men, and I have a bridge to sell you.

[AleDeEurope]

To me, there are 2 type of feminists:
a) the ones that support true equality, like those back in the day, but who stay at home and do nothing about it.
b) the one's that hate men, come up with made up statistics, distort facts, and want men's oppression, and this kind of feminists are the only ones that go out on the street and demand change, claiming they want equality, but their actions say otherwise, and when you tell them there's no need for feminism in the West, the say that it is needed on other places around the world (which is true), but when it's time to fight for those women they all chicken out.

Yes, real feminism was VERY positive, it brought change and for good, but today, there's no necessity for that, at least in the West. That's why they're complaining about manspreading... -_-
I support real feminism, the one that dates back to mid 20th century, but I do not support today's feminism.

[sherbearee]

Those are two extremes...
I'm content with where we are now, in terms of equality. Men/women have very similar rights, job opportunities, etc.
I appreciate all the women's suffrage movements in the 20th century as well. The point of this was not to advocate for feminism, as I do not identify myself as a feminist, but rather inform people of the various types so they do not incorrectly label others

[QuestionMan]

This ^

[AleDeEurope]

I know you weren't advocating for feminism, I got the point of the Take, but I have a different view about it.

[sherbearee]

Okay, that's fair

[rickydobby]

I will say I consider myself a feminist, even though I dislike most women, but that's because most women tend to contribute to sexism against themselves. I think making men pay for things and complaining about doing things because they're women is dumb. As a woman I would never not do something for the simple fact that I have a vagina and boobs. I may not be able to do something because I'm not strong enough, for example, but that's not because I'm a woman, it's because I'm lazy. If I wanted to be strong enough I could be.

I also, by the way, don't think it's wrong for a man to hit a woman so long as she hits him first. I don't think a woman should hit a man either though to begin with, nobody should hit anyone. I just think that if she does, a man shouldn't be punished for defending himself.

[DarkHumorRUs]

Whoa, you're telling me that not all members of a large, barely defined group aren't all exactly the same?
Incredible...

[sherbearee]

thank you X)

[Jager66]

Well they are all generally the same, they just focus on different things. Like some Feminist's focus on the denial of due process rights for men accused of rape, while others believe that woman should be paid the same as any high earning ceo or coal mine worker even if all she does is work 15 hours a week at a reception desk in an air conditioned office.

The list could go on and on, the bottom line is that they all seek to make women the dominant ruling class at the cost of men, it's all about lies and hate wearing the mask of equality, kinda like how religion nuts will launch a JiHad and then claim to be peaceful because in their mind taking over the worl with their religion is the only way to achieve peace, thus they are peaceful.

[DarkHumorRUs]

@Jager66 the original definition of feminism is just the belief that women should have equal rights to men. But of course there are like a million different opinions on feminism because people are uninformed.

[godfatherfan]

Problem is that the men haters have so tarnished the word "feminist" that the only reaction your going to get form 99.5% of men is bitter hatred. Sorry, you have your fellow women to thank for that.

[RandomUsername3464]

It's fine. I refuse to ever date a feminist, I will run for the hills if I see one coming in my direction. Many feminists are utter misandrists, and they don't apologize for it. They deny men can experience any hardships, and they see men as pieces of trash who need to be punished simply for existing. That's why I dislike and avoid feminism as much as possible.

[sherbearee]

that's the generalization though. Some feminists are simply looking to bring up the women's status, to reach a man's. They don't necessarily see men as trash..

[RandomUsername3464]

"They don't necessarily see men as trash.."

"NECESSARILY"

Just admit it, you do. Other feminists have admitted to me and in public forms of media plenty of times. It's alright if they see me as trash, since I see them as trash too.

[sherbearee]

some women think men are trash. some men think women are trash.
I think neither.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

I think (like the myTake Owner already told you) that you're generalizing feminists into a group in which not all of them fit. There is the form of feminists who only want equality (to be seen as equals to men, to not be thought of as less just because they are female.) It shouldn't be looked down upon to want what is fair. I acknowledge that there are the feminists that think men are trash and curse their existence and I understand that they are who give feminists a bad name but you still have to understand that feminists aren't all the same 'we should be the dominant race' 'let's just kill men' 'I'm not gonna shave my legs and fuck any man who thinks I should,'

[RandomUsername3464]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ omfg people keep downvoting what I said. Feminists have always been horrible to me. I have never met a nice one in my entire life. They are hurtful to other men too. Why is it so wrong that I want to protect myself by not dating them? I wouldn't go near them with a 100ft pole.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

People down-vote what you said because it's based on your sole experience and because you are making extreme assumptions about a huge group of people who in no way are all the same. It's a shame that you have only encountered feminists that have been horrible to you and who and who you don't date can only be decided by you and in no way am I asking you to change it but I have met so many lovely feminists who live in societies who oppress them because they are female and even in those conditions they always find a way to live happily and not hate on men, they try to peacefully gain equality but I'm not sure it's so doable where they live. Well anyways (I got off topic) I just want to stress that even if you have only had bad experiences with feminists you shouldn't just be completely put off to all of them. Have some open mindedness and don't let your previous experiences dictate the way you treat other people or prevent you from meeting some great people.

[RandomUsername3464]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ Nope. I refuse. So you say you respect my decision when it comes to dating them, then you subtly sneak in at the end that I need to be more open minded? No. I always have and always will run away from feminists who show any interest in me, they see me as sub-human and I will do everything I possibly can to disconnect and distance myself from them. How dare you try to use reverse psychology on me to change my decision.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

I don't think you understood me at all. I do respect your decision and when I said to be open minded I meant friend wise not dating wise and I'm not trying to force you to change your ideas I'm merely suggesting a different opinion for you to think about. When I form a solid opinion I like to see all sides of the argument and I was only giving you mine, but if you really can't get close to any feminists that's okay but you might be the one missing out on some great people.

[RandomUsername3464]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ Right. Well, I've only met two feminists in my lifetime that were nice to me, compared to hundreds that were awful. Take that how you want. When you get older, maybe you'll understand that when people get treated like that, it damages them. But you obviously do not understand yet.

[_Surprised_Gatorade_]

Don't think I'm inexperienced to the world around me because I'm younger than you, I don't think I'm all knowing but I've experienced a similar situation in which everyone who I met from a specific group of people treated me terribly, I know how much it damages someone because it's something I've gone through. Basically since kindergarten and up until the late years of middle school all of the Mexican people I met bullied me, I really hated just Mexicans in general because like you with feminists all could recall was bad memories. When I got into high school my biased opinion began to change and I realized that I was being unfair by generalizing a large group of people like that. It took me a long time to actually forgive 'Mexicans' because even though they weren't the same ones who bullied me it still felt like they were responsible for making years of my life miserable. It was really irrational thinking. But again you have the final say in what you do, I just hope you don't regret it

[RandomUsername3464]

@_Surprised_Gatorade_ Alright, well I just wanted to clarify something I noticed, and basically I meant that out of all the feminists I ever interacted with, the two nice ones I met were in real life. When I said "none" were nice, I meant the remainder, which were hundreds on the Internet and in real life. I was just upset because people were downvoting me and it seemed like you were trying to invalidate my horrible experiences with feminists. But at least you are one of the few females on this site that are civilized to me when you want to make a point to me, and I thank you for that.

[Watermelonoma]

im aware of feminisms different forms, but i have my own disagreements with pretty much all of them when it comes down to specific issues, which is why i don't self identify as one.

[9mfeo]

-braces for inevitable barrage of bitter male/MRA/MGTOW fury-

[Nathand]

HUMANITY IS FUNNY.

SO WE HAVE A GROUP

THAT IS THEN DIVIDED INTO OTHER GROUPS

WITHIN THE OTHER GROUPS ITS THEN DIVIDED INTO OTHER GROUPS.

FK IT.

IF YOUR A FEMINIST THEN YOU HAVE ISSUES. I'M SICK OF THIS "NOT ALL ARE BAD".

[sherbearee]

1) I thought you were an alien
2) No where did I state that I was a feminist

[Nathand]

i'm speaking generally.