Did I save myself from a night of humiliation?

[Anonymous]

Beauty is in eye of the beholder. But most people, probably 85% would classify me as unattractive or average looking while the minority 15% will see me as ridiculously attractive. I don't go out often but when I do, I would usually get either ignored or rejected while other girls get approached. But on a rare occasion, I would get a guy who would be totally captivated by the way I look, in public / streets/ train. Vast majority of the time they just stare and do nothing. In the past, most guys have rejected me.

Due to this my self esteem is quite low, Last week, a guy friend wanted to introduce me to a group of his coworkers. He knew that I liked hot men in his line of work. But I declined since I felt like I would just go in there to be humiliated anyway because they would reject me. To me, I felt like I had saved myself from a night of humiliation. Meanwhile, my other friends are telling me that I should have went to meet them even if they reject me. I've had men reject me very harshly in the past. Especially as a sensitive shy girl, it's difficult to endure.

Imagine if you and your gang were told to expect a girl to be coming then she shows up and she is a complete disappointment. wouldn't that be humiliating?

[SteveSmith1985]

Are you quite sure that this guy was trying to introduce you to his coworkers on a romantic footing?

This sounds like "hey come meet a few of by buddies from work; work buddies meet (your name here).

Just... no guy brings a girl to meet his friends... so his friends can either hit on her or reject her. He's not your pimp right?

Nobody would ever ever do that. If he were introducing you to ONE guy, then he's setting you up.

If he is introducing you to a group of guys... and has told these guys to "expect you"... and you go to be judged by this group of guys? and what? They fist fight if more than one of them wants you?

I think you might have totally misunderstood the footing on which he was introducing you to this GROUP of co-workers.

He would have said something like: "Guys my friend (whatever your name is) might come by, she's pretty cool, I think you guys will get along"

That would be a normal thing to do. What your describing is a... thing nobody would ever do.

He was trying to do you a solid insofar as... you meet a group of guys, and in a no-pressure friends-only environment... maybe you would become interested in one of his co-workers.

He did not tell these men you were coming by to be claimed or rejected.

There would have been no possibility of rejection. You were brought as his friend, to meet his co-worker friends. He thought maybe you might hit-it-off with one of them, maybe. It was just a chance to socialize with the kind of guys your friend is aware you're into. In a no-expectations environment.

No, you did not save yourself a night of humiliation. You misread this badly.

That's ok, you can just say yes next time.

🙂

[Asker]

he wanted to introduce me to them because he knows I have a "thing" for firemen. No, it wouldn't be platonic and I really would expect that he would've told them already that I had a thing for firemen. I don't want to walk in just to be judged by a group of men

[SteveSmith1985]

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. Either that, or your friend is a huuuuuuge asshole. No guy would ever do this to a girl he gave a shit about.

The scenario you think it was, would indeed be humiliating. He would be brining you as a piece of meat. It would be against all social convention. If this guy is actually a friend (I'm not suggesting he isn't), then you are wrong. Do you imagine a successful meeting would end with you and a particular firefighter arm-and-arm? Think this through. Would you do this to a guy friend? Of course not.

THis is not how people behave. It just isn't. Not in the Western world anyway. If you're somewhere with wildly different social custons, then ok.

I'm not an asshole... I wouldn't be this insistent if I wasn't very very confident... that you are mistaken.

"I don't want to walk in just to be judged by a group of men"

Yes. That makes perfect sense. Every woman would have a problem with this. This would be a crazy thing for your friend to set you up for... wouldn't it.

You do have this wrong. I guess I'll leave it here if you remain unconvinced. It's just painful to watch someone misread their own situation so badly.

I hope you think about what I'm saying here, if it doesn't make intuitive sense still. I hope you come around. I did my best. Good luck.

🙂

[Asker]

listen, in our world of hookups right now, all women are just pieces of meat until she isn't. All men are sex addicts. There is no way that a man would meet up with a woman without sex on his mind. Men also get bored with women unless she has sex with him by a certain date.

But I think that if the vibes are right and if a guy does fall for you, he will go for you.

It is just the sad world we live in

[Asker]

He has also invited me to visit his firehouse and to meet the guys. I don't think he means any harm or humiliation. The firefighters are usually super nice and friendly.

[SteveSmith1985]

You can't have it both ways. Either my interpretation is correct. Or your friend is an asshole, because he DID mean you harm and humiliation.

Can't be both. If he brought you there as a piece of meat in this crazy world we live in... he's an asshole.

Can't be both.

Live your life however makes you happiest. If you want to think your friend set you up like this go ahead. I haven't read situations like this for hundreds of people on here. Take it or leave it. It;s up to you. But nobody behaves this way. Good luck (ok, Im actually gonna end here)

[Asker]

you can't just assume that just because a guy introduces a girl to his coworkers, then it must mean he is trying to get them to fuck her. we live in a social world where people are curious about each other. I think its your assumption that is incorrect.

Him inviting me to his firehouse really can just be a nice friendly gesture, it doesn't necessarily mean he wants to pimp me out to his entire firehouse

[SteveSmith1985]

You're unbelieveable. I can't believe you keep drawing me in. You are so obstinate in being so clearly wrong. You aren't even internally consistent:

"Him inviting me to his firehouse really can just be a nice friendly gesture, it doesn't necessarily mean he wants to pimp me out to his entire firehouse"

Logically.

A nice friendly gesture cannot include parading you in front of a group of men to humiliate. Can we agree? THat is not a friendly thing to do. Agree? If not, please do walk me through why you disagree.

I have read hundreds of people (women mostly) situation with guys. From crushes, to abusive relationships, to breakups. I know people's behavior in social situations. If I have enough details, I can usually give an excellent read of situations.

If I don't think I'm right. I'll be very clear about not being confident in an answer.

I have never been more confident that somebody was reading a social situation wrong.

I have never ever been this insistent with anyone, because nobody has ever been so unwavering in digging their heels in to their incorrect interpretation.

I have never once NOT ONCE had someone come back and tell me I was wrong. I do, get thanked all the time for figuring girl's guy situations out.

It would be really really unlikely, that this is the one time I somehow lose the skill of reading people's motives and behavior in social situations. That would be one hell of a coincidence. I'm so sure, and this, is the one time I'm wrong. I dont know what else to say.

Even your own mind is muddled.

**A friend does not pimp you out. Therefore if someone is pimping you out, that person cannot be a friend.**

[SteveSmith1985]

"you can't just assume that just because a guy introduces a girl to his coworkers, then it must mean he is trying to get them to fuck her"

YOU are making this assumption. Not me. You think you were taken as a piece of meat. YOU are assuming this.

(I'm hoping that's a matter of a missing negative or something gramatical. Otherwise... this is you)

[Asker]

Listen, you have a very pessimistically skewed or fucked up perception of the world. We live in a social world where people are interested in meeting and getting to know each other.

Not everything is either just all about sex or entirely not about sex.

I really think YOUR perception of the scenario is truly fucked up and it screams that you have been around bad people for a very long time.

W

[Asker]

I am a very insecure person which is why I feel judged everywhere I go, especially if it is around men.
It does not mean I feel like I am just a piece of meat. It does not mean they only see me as a piece of meat.
I'm just insecure. That is all.

But its truly sad that how some people think that a simple invite to a firehouse, means he is trying to pimp me out.

[Asker]

I'm sure some of the guys would just want to fuck me. But there may be other guys who aren't just interested in a quick fuck. It's just people meeting people. We are social animals who are curious about each other.

[SteveSmith1985]

Wait, what are you talking about?

I am not saying this? You are.

I am saying this guy is a friend, therefore he didn't set you up for humiliation.

You're the one assuming he's bringing you to parade in front of his buddies! = (good world not about sex)

YOUR position: My friend (who would have to be an asshole) invited me be to meet a group of coworkers so the coworkers have the opportunity to reject me (bad world all about sex)

Yo literally switched what you're arguing against. This is getting nutty. Seriously. Read your last message back.

[SteveSmith1985]

(good world not about sex) should be one line up**

[Asker]

There is nothing that I've said that was about sex.

The only thing I have said was: I didn't want to meet them because I felt insecure. Yes, strangers do judge you on the way you look, especially when it comes to the opposite gender. But this does not necessarily mean it has anything to do with sex or hooking up.

[SteveSmith1985]

I am writing this without seeing your last couple of replies, (in a word doc) because I figured out where you went wrong in understanding what I was saying.

I tried to explain in a way that clears this up. If you still don't get it (or disagree) then I really will just have to leave you to think whatever you want.

You originally thought your friend invited you to see his friends, you didn't want to be paraded in front of them. (Friend=Good) (Guys have been told ur into firefighters; risk humiliation= Bad)

I was not trying to convince you that your friend was a bad guy (that's where I think you mistook me).

So by the time I stopped replying it looked to you, like I was saying (but I actually wasn't):

“your friend is a bad guy (Friend=Bad) so he brought you to parade you in front of them (Bad)”

I used it as an example. I used it to illustrate that it had to be the same (Good with Good; Bad with Bad)

[SteveSmith1985]

I used the Bad with Bad example (quoted above) to show that IF your friend was as bad guy, then it WOULD make sense that he invited you to parade in front of the group.

I was never actually arguing that. Just showing it had to be like pairs (Good with Good & Bad with Bad)

What I am actually arguing (and have been since the start. Read the first line of my first reply):

BECAUSE (I assume) your friend is a good guy (Good), he would never tell his friends you were into firefighters, so no risk of humiliation (Good)

My argument doesn't see a bad world. My argument doesn't rely on people being bad. It's the opposite.

I have been saying:Social norms mean it is impossible to have a Good with Bad (or vice-versa)

They have to be “like pairs” (GG or BB)

(NOT GB or BG)

My point was to show it could never be a case where Good (friend) could result in Bad. (humiliation)

(because a friend who is good, would never parade you for group and risk you being humiliated)

[SteveSmith1985]

***So I'm saying your friend is a good guy, (Good) therefore you did not risk humiliation (Good)***

You were originally saying : Your friend (Good) invited you to parade for them, risking humiliation (Bad)

-I was saying that wouldn't be how anyone behaves.

-A good friend would invite you and NOT tell his co-workers you liked firefighters, because no (good) friend would want you to feel paraded or risk humiliation.

So, I hope that all makes sense. I think it was the example that got things mixed up. So let's leave it here. I hope this makes sense. (it does make sense).

Good luck. 🙂

[Asker]

[BECAUSE (I assume) your friend is a good guy (Good), he would never tell his friends you were into firefighters, so no risk of humiliation (Good)]

Many people just have big mouths. They just can't keep their mouths shut. He is not aware of my low self esteem.

He is not my best friend. He is just an acquaintance.

[SteveSmith1985]

Ok. I'm just glad we can agree on the validity of the argument I was making, even if you don't think it appllies. That was crazy-making.

So, you're right, people do have big mouths. And if he's not someone you're trusting to be good (a friend) then its possible I suppose. I still don't think most people would do that. He would have to be an asshole to do that.

Still though, I don't think you avoided possible humiliation. Even if he had told them you like firefighters, there is no humiliation in not hitting it off with any of them. That doesn't lead to humiliation if you leave without being chosen.

You also would have to like those particular firefighters. It's just as possible that you weren't interested in any of them; as it is that none of them were interested in you.

So leaving alone could just as easily be the result of YOU rejecting (each of) THEM. No humiliation for you.

I think maybe the lower self-esteem made you see it as a one-sided choosing process. In this case none of them showed they were interested that would be humiliating.

It's not humiliating if nobody shows you interest. It could just as easily be the result of you not being into any of them. (no humiliation risk).

[Asker]

He never told me that he had told the rest of his coworkers that i liked firefighters. I just assumed because I have enough life experience to know these things. I'm a nurse. If I had a guy who was coming to visit me and my nurse buddies, then of course I would make it a point to mention to them that he liked nurses. It has nothing to do with being a bad person. People are just way. Its like mentioning a fun fact. And its pretty ego boosting which is why I would tell them.

I've just been rejected a lot in the past leaving me with 0 confidence. Its ok. Even when a guy is interested in me, I don't have the confidence to talk to him. I honestly feel safer and better in my shell.

[SteveSmith1985]

I can tell you feel safer in your shell. That was the only reason I answered your question in the first place. I thought, "she doesn't need to miss out on stuff like that. She wasn't going to risk humiliation."

I think if you think through your nurse example... you'll see that him leaving with no nurses seeming interested, can just as easily be him not being interested.

So even if he said something, you still were good. These are normal situations. There isn't a risk of humiliation. If there was, they wouldn't be so normal (bringing a friend of the opposite sex around).

So I hope that you get out there next time. You won't necessarily find someone you like. But you also just might. But if you don't go, you'll never meet him.

I hope you start venturing out of your shell more. Guys will be able to see you better if you do.

Sorry for getting frustrated with you.

🙂

[Asker]

There was another time where I was walking down the street. The street was on a hill. I was going down the hill. Toward the bottom of the hill, were a group of firemen about to go into the market to shop for groceries. All of them went in the market, the last fireman stood outside the doorway with his head turned back, looking at me.

I thought "uh oh. this is uncomfortable. maybe if i don't look at him, he would go away" I did just this and he still didn't go away. So I turned my head to the right , as to look at the cars going by on the street. Then finally he stopped looking and went into the market.

I went home then realized that he prohbably saw that I was attracted to him and he wanted to talk to me.

But at that time, I gained weight, dressed very poorly and didn't wash my hair the night before so I had really dirty hair. I just didn't have the guts to be talking to young handsome men, looking so terribly.

Not only this, every single time I went out to bars or parties, I always get rejected in some way shape or form. Guys never approach me. They never show interest. While all the other girls get approached.

[Asker]

Now looking back, I think he probably just wanted to use me for sex or something like that. I have heard that men will have sex with any woman that is easy, including unattractive women. For dating, an attractive young guy like him would likely be looking for someone else equally as attractive.

[Asker]

Its really hard to boost my self esteem after the number of times I have been rejected by guys. So don't just tell me the generic, "just be confident!" It won't work.

[SteveSmith1985]

Oh my god? Girl. You have a self-estemm so low you're creating that assumption (past things you've been through as well)

I mean, if they wanted to use you for sex, then he's a shitty guy to even have as an aquaintance. Why would you think that?

If there isn't a reason, then this sorta thinking is really going to be detrimental to you. Are you basing that simply on the fact that these are men, and men in the past have mistreated you?

This is heatbreaking.

Guys are looking for a girl they like for dating. If someone is attractive, it makes a guy more interested right away (just like girls with an attractive guy). But its the girl that matters.

She looks different depending on her personality. I've known beautiful girls who didn't look good anymore once knowing them, and I've had the experience of not finding a girl attractive... and that changing drastically once I got to know her

(I'm thinking of two girls in particular. It's happened more times than that though)

I'm not going to tell you generic things. I know the kind of impact past traumas can affect people. I have no idea what your experiences might have been.

I can do my best to give you a read of what I think might be going on (in these cases, the type of guy a girl goes for might be the problem. Not always by any means)

Can you identify the kind of guys you like as any sort of "type"? (Firefighters... does that mean you like strong guys, or guys who are dependable, or is it clean-cut and fit etc.)

If you'd like to talk about any of it, I'm always happy to lend an ear. If not, that's totally understandable. I just hate to see someone... in their shell (that was a good way to put it)

[Asker]

It's not the first, or second time this has happened, where a guy has shown some sort of interest yet I just didn't have the confidence to talk to them. I just pretend I'm not interested as a way to avoid rejection. Whenever I see someone, I'm attracted to. My mind just goes to "I wouldn't have a chance any ways".

I do like men in uniform but also highly educated professional guys. But it just seems like its so hard to meet guys in NYC. There is literally no other way to meet guys to go to bars. Bars do not work for me.

I do regret it not talking to guys who were interested in me, usually on the streets. But it doesn't happen a lot.

Its hard trying to talk to guys, especially meet young handsome men when you're a bit overweight and not exactly the most attractive girl. Beauty is in eye of the beholder. Some people do find me attractive but most do not

[SteveSmith1985]

I can imagine the bar scene being terrible. You're actually the first woman I've talked to who was using that as a way to meet guys. Everyone is using the dating apps. I don't think anybody would have much luck trying bars, or relying on being hit on on the street.

Have you ever tried any dating apps?

I do love how desite having a low self esteem, you're aware that there are a small percentage of guys who find you quite attractive. That's cool. It's not usually the case that someone who thinks "I wouldn't have a chance anyway" would still be able to recognize this.

[SteveSmith1985]

"I just pretend I'm not interested as a way to avoid rejection."

Is that because of the number of rejections?

or were the particularly painful ones that stuck with you?

[Asker]

I've been on the dating apps since 2016. Only perverts, married cheaters, single parents, scum of the earth or socially inept people tend to use those apps. I stopped in 2021. The quality was just so incredibly low. I just couldn't continue any further. Thats why despite my crippling shyness, I still tried to venture out to bars to meet people.

There is really no other way for me to meet guys. Not the dating apps, not the bars. Where else would I go?

I can't possibly just go over to "visit" the firehouse, as a shy girl.

All I can do is to wait for the next guy to show interest in me on the street. It has happened in the past. I never made a move.

[Asker]

Not only have I been rejected every time I went out to bars, speed dating events etc. I have also been criticized for my looks as a child. When I was a kid, I looked like a boy. Being forced by my parents to have short hair , didn't make it any better. Well this explains why I have such cripplingly low self esteem.

[Asker]

the number of rejections. "painful" isn't exactly the right word for it. Just very discouraging and self esteem damaging. It teaches me that I'm not good enough and that I simply do not qualify for 95% of all men.

Its worse when I see other girls getting approached effortlessly.

[SteveSmith1985]

I've heard a lot of women complain about the quality. You're the first one to get sick enough of them to leave them all together to go meet people in person.

You're right about there not being any other way to meet guys. But have you tried all the dating apps that you might like?

I honestly really admire you for going out to try to meet people in person. That takes guts, even if you weren't shy.

I'm just skeptical that this is better than the apps (in terms of success). I don't think it's you personally that's responsable for at least some of that rejection at bars.

The other thing is... a guy at a bar (specifically) is definitely thinking "sex" if somebody shows him interest. He's thinking "can I get her to come home with me" not..."I'd like to take her out for a coffee and get to know her better"

That's not to say it's impossible. It's to say... a guy who you're interested in at the bar, is assuming you're looking for sex as well (because it's a bar. Only at bars). So you may need to be pretty clear that you're looking to meet with the hopes of meeting again, not going home with him.

Even aside from that... I just think that's a good way for any woman to experience a whole lot of rejection.

You made me laugh with the visit to the firehall. Yea, don't do that. hahaha, I don't know a single woman confident enough to do that. I don't blame you.

Are you dead-set against trying some sort of online app/site for dating? I can see you getting frustrated, but... there is a reason everyone still uses them despite complaining about them all the time. I really do think that's going to be a better chance of actual success, and (you would know better than me)... isn't rejection in person worse than sending a guy a message that he never replies to?

[SteveSmith1985]

"All I can do is to wait for the next guy to show interest in me on the street. It has happened in the past. I never made a move."

You should make a move next time. But how often does this happen to you? (maybe you're more attractive than you think)

[Asker]

I've been on the dating apps for many years. I can tell you with 100% positivity that MOST people are not on the dating apps. The only people who are on dating apps are socially inept people, people without social lives, short guys, single parents, guys looking for sex, cheaters, perverts.

Please don't act like I don't know online dating. I have been doing this for a very long time. Women get sexually assaulted , raped meeting guys from dating apps all the time.

When you mention equality, men and women are not designed to be equal. Men typically are bolder, braver and crave the opposite gender more than vice versa. Women typically are more shy, timid than men. Traits associated with masculinity differ significantly from traits associated with femininity.

Honestly if I had just made a move or responded to the guys who stared at me or showed any kind of interest, I wouldn't be stuck in a rut right now. My first instinct to a any guy showing interest is just to dodge eye contact and pretend I don't see him.

It happens once in a blue moon. Maybe once or twice or three times a year. But the normal sane guys never approach. Its always the crazy, slightly mentally ill, or perverted guys that approach me.

[Asker]

I'm not saying that every single person on dating apps is low quality. But most people are on there because they cannot get anyone in real life. When I take one look at them, I can usually tell why they are on there. You are much more likely to meet someone who is attractive with a better personality from real life.

[SteveSmith1985]

Yes, I was wondering if the guys who approached you were guys you were interested in.

" Men typically are bolder, braver and crave the opposite gender more than vice versa. Women typically are more shy, timid than men. Traits associated with masculinity differ significantly from traits associated with femininity."

I disagree strongly with the idea that it's somehow a man's job to do this. I'm well aware that lots of people disagree with me. But... it does mean you're waiting around for a guy to ask. So I'm not trying to argue with you if that's how you feel. But it does make it much harder.

I wasn't acting like you don't know dating apps. I was basing on women all being on there. Not men. I don't know what men are on there.

But then I don't know how you're not stuck, just doing what you're doing with going out and trying to meet someone. I... don't know how anyone could do that without being rejected 90% of the time. Maybe take a break? (I really don't even know what to suggest. You've eliminated other options, so you're kinda stuck)

[Asker]

[I disagree strongly with the idea that it's somehow a man's job to do this. I'm well aware that lots of people disagree with me. But... it does mean you're waiting around for a guy to ask. So I'm not trying to argue with you if that's how you feel. But it does make it much harder.]

Being brave, assertive aren't feminine traits and it takes a certain amount of self esteem in order to accomplish this.

But what I am seeing nowadays is not that men aren't approaching women due to lack of self esteem but more so, due to lack of social skills and having high standards. Nowadays, young men are only interested in talking to women they are physically attracted to. A lot of them consider it offensive when an unattractive woman says hi to them.

[Asker]

I would just be more responsive the next time a guy shows interest. But approaching a man is something I can never do. I don't have the looks or the charisma

[SteveSmith1985]

I think you are absolutely right about the self esteem (or confidence) being at the root of approaching. But I don't at all agree with your thinking that its lack of social skills or having high standards that are responsible for men not approaching. I don't think either is a factor at all.

Its confidence or self esteem. (or specifically a fear of rejection) It's hard for a guy, the exact same way it is for a girl. Exact same. Guys are not inherently braver when doing something that makes them vulnerable. This is not something that plays to the male strengths. This is emotional risk. They feel the same things as you.

The difference is, this used to be a man's job. Back when as "good woman" didn't work and was expected to make good pie and have some babies.

It's something men did because it was their job in a world built on thoroughly sexist assumptions, you and I can almost certainly agree are bullshit. (not saying everything is fine, but you are "allowed" to divorce and have your own bank account for example).

So men asked women out because there was no choice. If anyone was going to ask someone out... it WAS their job. It's not a job any guy would want to be his. It's just socially expected.

To me, its based on a fundamental fairness.

Women have made huge gains towards evening out some of the most egregious inequalities of that old sexist society. It seems only fair that the undesirable bits be shared too.

It doesn't sit right with me for a woman who is broadly in favor of being treated as equal fall back on this outdated sexist social norm... because it IS hard to do. It sucks. It's something that anybody

[SteveSmith1985]

would much rather be on the receiving end of. There is no emotional risk in being asked out.

That is all well and good. But In the practical world. I can fully understand how you're hesitant to go approach random strange men at a bar and ask them out

. (that kind of asking out, for a guy, in a bar specifically... is indeed easier for a guy compared to other environments. But that's because of all the casual sex implications of picking up a girl at the bar. Plus the alcohol doesn't hurt. It's less emotionally risky, than say, asking out your co-worker.

That's why I'm a bit stumped as to what to suggest to you.

I do understand why you don't approach, in the places you're looking. I don't blame you. I just hope you realize its equally hard for a guy to approach you too (any guy, in general anywhere except a bar).

I know that's not a solution or anything. It is something to be aware of. It's true, and it might be a useful thing to know. Maybe not. You are quite mistaken about it being any less nerve wracking, scary, stressful and emotionally risky for a guy vs. a girl when it comes to asking/approaching.
I agree that you should definitely be more responsive if a guy shows interest. That might be all you can really do.

I'm sorry I didn't see this until now. I think we might be in different time-zones.

[Asker]

Im not saying it isn't a scary thing for men to approach women. But men are biologically designed to be hunters while women are the nesters. The same way the sperm chases the egg.

Men and women are not created equal. You can repeat this all you want. But men crave women SIGNIFICANTLY more than women crave men. Men have way higher sex drives than women.

[Asker]

It is very wrong to assume that just because men and women have equal rights then it meana there should also be no inherent differences between the two genders. Men and women are not designed mentally or physically to be identical.

[Asker]

You can also take a look at history. Who have historically started and fought wars? Its definitely not women. Dont tell me that men are brave enough to fight wars for thousands of years, hunted animals for millions of years but be too afraid to ask out a woman.

The truth is... masculinity has been on the decline over the past few decades. Men are literally turning into women and they aren't even aware of it.

[SteveSmith1985]

Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. That's alright.

[Asker]

@stevesmith1985

it has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing. We are talking about the FACT that men are different from women in many different ways.

Men tend to be more desperate for women compared to vice versa. They need sex much more than women. Men also tend to be braver , more dominant, more assertive than women. All these things factor into why men tend to approach the opposite more than vice versa.

Sure, cultural influences may also be in effect. But men are not designed to be the same as women.

Don't tell me that men can go to war, die in war for thousands of years but do not have the guts to ask out a woman.

[Asker]

@stevesmith1985

Men are much more likely to be risk takers than women. Take a look at investing, firefighting, law enforcement, these are all male dominated fields.

[SteveSmith1985]

None of those are emotional risk. It's not at all comparable risk. They are fundamentally different. You are talking about physical risk. Not emotional risk. One thing guys are famously bad at is showing vulnerability (emotional).

But I'm not looking to change your mind. We can just agree to disagree about this. I don't think either of us is likely to change their views on this.

[Asker]

@stevesmith1985

and what makes you think it doesn't require emotional risk to go to war?

what makes you think it doesn't take emotional risk to invest your own money?

there is no such thing as "Agree to disagree"

you just aren't agreeing because you DON'T LIKE THIS FACT.

[Asker]

You don't think it takes a risk taker , to start and fight wars?

you don't think it takes a risk taker to invest your own money?

you don't think it takes risk taker to do dangerous jobs like law enforcement or fire fighting?

[SteveSmith1985]

I am aware of the emotional components of going to war, dangerous work, or investing. Agree to disagree was just a polite way for me to say I am not interested in debating this. It doesn't bother me if you feel differently. So I mean, think what you want. You're also forgetting about the fact that until recently women weren't considered people. The reason some of those are male-dominated has way more to do with female exclusion than female aversion. Your argument presupposes that female soldiers are inherently less equipped biologically to compete with their male counterparts when its fighting time. Your views are rooted in historical sexism. Not in some natural distribution which has men dominate law enforement, finance, firefighting and even fighting wars. History has a lot more to do with that then biology.

This is not a matter of straight facts. The arguments you're trying to make are more complicated than the way you're framing it.

But, listen, I am not interested in debating this with you. I'm gonna end it here. I won't be drawn back in. I'm not interested in changing your mind, I think we both just have trouble hearing something we find just wrong. I'm going to resist that urge regardless of what you reply.

We are going to disagree. I'm ok with that, I can't control how you feel about it though.

No hard feelings or anything, but you can think whatever seems right to you. I'm going to think you're wrong because I see it differently. There is no point in our trying to change the others mind. Its not happening. So, it was nice chatting with you, but I think we should (I'm going to) leave it here. Take care.

🙂

[Asker]

@stevesmith1985

I smell that you have a lot of bias.

I wouldn't trust that you would have fair objective judgement, if you are going to say that going to war or investing requires only physical risk but not emotional risk.

Recognize the fact that you are disagreeing simply because you are biased.

[ChicoFromThe305]

I think the fact that you went with your own decisions is a good thing, I'm not saying you would've went and gotten humiliated but sometimes it's best not to get caught in the what ifs and if you had a feeling not to go and you didn't, there's nothing to feel regretful for, your future may hold better situations, besides, you don't know what was truly waiting for you behind those doors

[Shiprex]

Judging by your comments and responses it seems that this could have been a set up to hurt you but I think maybe that's not the case. That is he may be trying to get someone interested in you but maybe not for a relationship kind of thing.

[Asker]

I just have no idea why people just think he is setting me up just for sex.

[Shiprex]

Some people are like that unfortunately. They see others as being here to provide for their wants and needs and have no concept of reciprocation or care about the impact of their behaviour on others.

[MannMitAntworten]

Regardless, one of them would have likely wanted to take you home. There is always at least one friend chopping at the bit.

[ColHathi]

Sure, if you think that all they'd care about is looks.

[Anonymous]

So you're ugly but like hot guys, eh.

Life is going to be hard for you sweetie.😆

[Asker]

beauty is in eye of the beholder

[Gayuglycowardv3]

Im ugly and everyone makes fun of me but they target my sexuality more than my looks because its more damaging to