Guys do not care about girls' fame or social status

[Anon-ymous1]

This shouldn't take too long.

As always, it needs to be said, sadly, that I'm talking about the overwhelming majority of guys here, not literally each and every one on the face of the Earth. Thanks.

What do I mean, guys don't care about fame or social status?

When guys are checking a girl out or looking for girls that they're attracted to, we do. not. care. whether she's a famous movie star or a musician or if she's wealthy. Is that stuff nice? Sure, I guess. But to guys, we just want someone who is classy when she needs to be; who is intelligent; who enjoys the fine arts and music; who has some of the same interests as we do; who, above many other considerations, is pretty/physically slim and attractive.

^ That's Marilyn Monroe. Actress, sex symbol, and all-around hottie from the mid-10th century in American culture. Very very famous. Undeniably very wealthy/high status while she was alive. Almost all guys wanted her when she was alive, and even though she's gone now, her fame persists. She was hot.

^ This is a barista from some coffee shop. She probably makes 9 to 10 dollars an hour. You don't even know her name. She is hot.

You could ask a thousand guys-- which one of them is more attractive to guys? And the answer would be "both/either." Marilyn Monroe was not made more hot by her fame-- she was hot because she was hot.

We don't give a shit about money-- we care about pretty/physical attraction. Money/fame does not matter... she isn't going to be wearing her money or fame when we're getting physical with her/having sex. That's not how guys' interest is kept.

This is just a quick and easy example; there are many more appropriate ones out there.

In my opinion, NOT caring about money or status is actually far less "shallow" (if that's what you want to call it) than doing so, since it doesn't actually make a person who or what they are. Not mentally, not emotionally, and not physically. Sexuality is inherently animalistic, since humans are animals, and money sure doesn't make sex better.

~This was a short one, but thaaaanks. Hugs and kisses.

[englisc]

Very true. This is what women get wrong when they think guys find these things intimidating also. These are things that women find attractive in men so they assume that we think the same way. In reality a really good looking girl who works at McDonalds will be more attractive than a rich, successful but average looking woman.

[Anon-ymous1]

We literally find one, and one thing only, intimidating in a female: Being really, really fucking hot/pretty.

[Anon-ymous1]

*find one thing

[CT_CD]

I agree. Men aren't attracted to wealth or social status. Men don't care about that stuff like women do. They prioritise physical attractiveness.

[KezHarris]

Wow! I didn't know this was true

[Nik1hil]

Totally true

[Billlewis]

Yes, ma'am, all we care about is if you drive us crazy... lol

[Nik1hil]

@Billlewis Yeah, Dude I know Kez, she drives a lot of men around her crazy.. She is a seductress. 😂😂

[Billlewis]

@Nik1hil I believe it.

[Anonymous]

The only men who find succesful women undateable are men who are not confident about themselves and are not as successful. They crave to be as successful as these women but they can't. So what do they do? They do what they usually do to girl- challenge her femininity and call her ugly or undateable.

I have been surrounded by successful people like investment bankers, ivy league grads, doctors. These in most cases have married someone of same social status, education and success as them. Even a 8/10 man who is a surgeon is married to another 5/10 doctor. Investment bankers are the ones who are likely to date below their social status but I've seen that happen rarely.

Only someone who is successful themselves knows the value of it. Someone who is successful has perseverance, hardworking and smart. It tells a lot about your character (provided that you earned success through proper ways and not short cuts)

When initial honeymoon period is over and reality sets in where you have to file tax returns and all that unromantic shit, these are the traits that take you long way.

Not to mention how helpful it is to have a better lifestyle and provide a much better lifestyle to future offspring when both partners earn equal amount of money.

My parents are both successful equally and thus I have a better lifestyle than what I could get if my dad married someone say.. a waitress. Not to mention how I get exposure to important people from both sides. How my Mom can understand the kind of tensions and stresses dad has. How my Mom is well aware of things around her and we all as family can discuss these things.

[Anon-ymous1]

I didn't, and am not, arguing against anything you said here-- you're correct. I didn't say here that most guys find wealth or high social status to be a *negative* when regarding a female; I said we don't *care.* That means one way or the other.

[Opinion Owner]

"We don't give a shit about money-- we care about pretty/physical attraction. Money/fame does not matter... she isn't going to be wearing her money or fame when we're getting physical with her/having sex"
My point being, genuine guys do 'give a shit' about these things when they're looking for a long term partners.

If it's casual stuff then yes, what you're saying is true.

[Anon-ymous1]

I don't know what the word "genuine" is supposed to mean-- I assume you mean, a guy who wants to marry the girl. I'd just as soon ask why everything in life is automatically assumed to have to be about, or leading to, marriage, or else it's automatically labeled as "casual," again whatever that's supposed to mean.

[Opinion Owner]

Oh well that's just old school me. But you do have point too.

[morningstar01]

Opinions like this scare me.
It's basically saying all men care about is how a woman looks. You know the woman you deem attractive and want to be with will age and whither... what then?
You leave her for a younger model?

It's like a woman saying she only cares about a man's status. Men complain about hypergamy, but I think they're blinded by assumption. My mother in law makes a significant amount more than her partner. She started her business as a teenager and as a result has had romantic partnerships who she supported financially, or who worked with or under her.

Hypergamy my ass! My mother in law is passionate about her craft and loves her man for his personality, not what he can provide or be used for.

A woman with status may have something more to offer a man of status than a woman whose only desire is to bear his children and nothing more.

A woman of status may provide a certain level of challenge-- she maybe driven, intelligent, can provide interesting conversation and push her partner in a healthy way. It makes two partners feel equal and give them both a sense of unbreakable and unique connection.

A man who is turned off by a woman's desire to achieve things for herself probably has confidence and control issues.

[Anon-ymous1]

"A man who is turned off by a woman's desire to achieve things for herself probably has confidence and control issues." Agreed.

At no point did I suggest that guys are, or should be (though some of us are, doubtless), PUT OFF by a girl having wealth or high status-- I said we don't care. It's not the same thing.

[Anon-ymous1]

Also, "what then?
You leave her for a younger model?" It has happened, many times. Not for me personally I mean, just in general.

[octopusrebellion]

He's being very broad here - what's probably more accurate would be this statement : in general men won't, at first, rank a woman social status above physical attractiveness. At FIRST.

In practice, it all comes down to the individual chemistry / compatibility / complementary personalities (obviously). Your father-in-law I'd image likes the attributes in your mother-in-law that allowed her to achieve that success. Other guys might not. That's fine.

By the way, I don't think most guys are turned off by a woman's desire to achieve or intelligence... it's the lack of clear ways for the male to balance out the power dynamic. Stay at home dads aren't well respected and I don't just mean by other men. In fact, females who are the primary breadwinners are more likely to say they are unhappy with their partner and have higher rates of divorce.

The guy in the dynamic has to have a way to establish equal role / value and, above all else, respect.

[ChurchOfIron]

I was with you until this part, "But to guys, we just want someone who is classy when she needs to be; who is intelligent; who enjoys the fine arts and music; who has some of the same interests as we do; who, above many other considerations, is pretty/physically slim and attractive."

I don't like classy chicks. I also don't like intelligent chicks. They're high maintenance in my experience. I prefer dumb and fun any day of the week. Some cleverness is nice, but intelligence is a turn off, to me. Also don't care about fine arts, and women typically have bad tastes in music, anyways, lol.

Although, some studies have suggested that money does, indeed, make sex better for women. Not for men. But, yes, money is a sexual characteristic for women and not for men.

End of the day, humans are indeed animals. We're all shallow as fuck. Anyone who pretends like they aren't is just a liar or delusional. All we care about is survival and passing our genes on. For women, the best way to do that is to obtain high status males capable of protection and provision. For males, that means fucking as many bishes as possible or finding some way to spread their genes. Most rely on monogamy, because that is the easiest way to get women to give up sex.

Men and women are both shallow. But that's okay. Because we do also have a rational brain. We are also capable of observing our actions and our predispositions. And by doing so, we can attempt to reduce the harm we cause others, or measure whether an impulse is proper or improper.

[Anon-ymous1]

"I also don't like intelligent chicks." Weird, dude. You're going to get bored of her if she's not smart enough to talk to.

[ChurchOfIron]

Abnormal, for sure. But, naaaa. To me, intelligent chicks are more boring than dumb chicks. Like, I love Oscar Wilde; but, I don't wanna have a conversation about him with a love interest. I'd rather have more basic conversations involving more playful wit and charm, rather than cold calculation, passive observation, or random trivia or facts. It's more exciting.

Yeah, talking about astrophysics might be engaging for the frontal lobe, but it doesn't really do shit for the limbic system. For me, anyway. Playfulness kinda mandates that you short circuit your brain, anyway. I can stimulate my frontal lobe anywhere. I can't get exciting play time anywhere.

Like, average is fine. Some insight is fine. But, relatively "intelligent", naaa.

Also as I stated, I think intelligent women tend to be more critical and more difficult to please. I want things to be easy and fun. I don't want a debate partner.

[Anon-ymous1]

I suppose. Yeah I want that too but eventually the playful wit can stop, and then what? There's always the option of trying to get a new girl but that doesn't work forever, maybe.

[ChurchOfIron]

Maybe, but there's no guarantees in life, anyway, yes? There's also a risk associated with tying your life to another person. Especially with a 60% divorce rate 80% of the time initiated by the woman.

If you ask me, that's a greater risk. Marriage doesn't work forever, either. Nothing does. To me, I derive more benefit from jumping from one to the next and perpetuating the honeymoon stage. It's always exciting. It's always thrilling. There are issues, of course, but I like the fast ups and downs rather than the stable boring way.

I think intimacy is built a lot more easily through play than studious debate. So, even if the playfulness subsides, you still feel a bond with the other person. And if it does fade, then it's a lot easier to jump to another one than try and wade through thousands of idiot women to find that special someone who will likely end up leaving you, anyway.

My view is, she's not yours, it's just your turn.

[Anon-ymous1]

Fair enough.

[smg99]

Marilyn was hyper sensual and also very in tune with her emotions sadly she died tragically and with heartbreak despite her alluring everything. God I love her after reading about her !

Coffee girl looks aged n it shows ! The slog and toil can accelerate the aging, that said I don’t think she’s a sex Symbol even forcing myself to look at her sensuality!

What do you say about a guy who once coveted a girl with longing stares and then turned it upside down to picture that same girl in a bad light?

No talking much, being sweet otherwise, ok doing things that you deem are artistic. In my opinion I think I needed to read this today.
I did rely on the very hallmarks of your checklist, got the looks stares etc smiles and then got told that his colleagues are Eve teasing him and he himself assuming the same.
Then all that is lost because words like embarrassing him or flattering him are used towards me?

That makes me feel maybe we can’t tell what we win by.
Trust me I’m in great shape my pic is what I am in daily life. That too only wearing bb cream, mascara and lip stick. Albeit yes designer ones.

Well I’m confused why I was issued such slander that provoked me to tell him why he thinks so highly of himself!

[BeMuse]

Yep, the more she is involved in social media the less desirable she becomes. The same applies for general fame and popularity unless she’s become famous due to something I think is impressive. When it comes to number of friends generally the fewer the better. If she has a few good quality friends she likes to spend time with here and there to have her own life, perfect. If she has no friends but is able to spend time alone with her own hobbies, also perfect. If she has tons of acquaintances and wants to be an entertainer with big parties filling my house with a bunch of strangers or constantly wants to go to office parties to schmooze and be scene then that’s really unattractive. As far as financial status, the main thing I find important is that her work ethic at least meets her appetite; she should be solvent. That said the more materialistic she is, even if she can pay her bills, generally the less desirable she is. If she make a piles and piles of money but is frugal and humble with it, then that’s cool but the money doesn't increase her attractiveness the low key humbleness does increase her attractiveness though.

[Anonymous]

Um I beg to differ with your MyTake. Let me explain why
1. A prince for example or a billionaire isn't going to marry the hot barista from your local coffee shop, no matter how hot she is. They will go for someone that combines both looks and personality and already has a high status. Prince Harry married Meghan Markle who is very attractive (but not a supermodel) but is also a famous actress and well-educated.. Also Grace Kelly when she became a princess of Monaco was beautiful but was also very famous and had won an Oscar. Kennedy also married Jackie who was attractive but also socially equal.
2. You don't explain the phenomenon of hot/good-looking men with below average/average guys. I know some attractive guys in real life that have dated less attractive girls (of course beauty is kinda subjective and to them their SO might be hot..). Google Hugh Jackman or Pierce Brosnan wife and you might be surprised. Schwarzenegger's wife is kinda weird looking too. What about Lennon, MJ or Marilyn Manson (my fave rock star)? In fact, to a politician an average looking wife might be an asset because this way, he appears more relatable and trustworthy to the public (E. g. Michelle Obama vs. Melanie Trump)

3. Social status matters a lot to certain guys.. Here's a personal example.. Many people tell me I'm very good-looking (that's subjective of course). I dated a guy for 2 years. He was rich, preppy, came from old money, had an Ivy League degree and went to top-tier schools. I didn't know many details about his life so I didn't date him for his money but his personality.
I broke up with him after I found out he was cheating on me. Turns he was using me all this time because he never introduced me to his family or friends and was very cryptic about his life.. Lol I forgot to mention, I went to a public school and I'm just a poor college student

[Opinion Owner]

2. You didn't explain the phenomenon of hot or good-looking guys dating average or below average girls. I know some guys in real life that were very attractive but chose to date not so attractive girls.. (of course beauty is subjective so they might find the girl hot) Also there are many celebs with not so attractive SOs. Google Hugh Jackman's and Pierce Brosnan's wife and you will be surprised. Schwarzenegger's wife is also kinda odd-looking. What about Lennon, MJ and my fave rock-star Marilyn Manson? In fact an average looking wife might be an asset to a politician because this way he might appear more relatable and trustworthy to the public (Michelle Obama vs Melanie Trump).

3. Social status is important to some people and here's my personal example. Most people tell me I'm very good-looking (of course that's subjective). I used to date a guy for 2 years. He was rich, preppy, came from old money (if you are familiar with that concept) and had an Ivy League degree and a very good

[Opinion Owner]

job. I'm just a poor college student.
I didn't date him for his money though because I didn't know much about him back then.. Anyway, we broke up when I caught him cheating.. Turns out he was using me all that time and was never serious about the whole thing because he never told me anything about his life or introduced me to his family or friends...
PS: are you telling me the fact I went to a public school and I'm from a poor family is irrelevant in this case?

[Anon-ymous1]

"going to marry" Not everything in this life is, or should be, about nothing more than marriage. So you have a point about marriage, I suppose, for guys that *are themselves* very wealthy or high-status. But then, there are thousands and thousands of wealthy persons in this world... you only named a few for which your examples apply.

"PS: are you telling me the fact I went to a public school and I'm from a poor family is irrelevant in this case?" ... Um, I have no idea what you mean. I haven't even said anything to you.

[brocklee]

Well, there are different degrees of "fame". I guess at one point it didn't even register on my radar, but it does cross my mind now.

When I met my current girlfriend, she was a local celebrity. She was the spokesperson for a big local company. She was on local TV commercials regularly. On billboards all over the city and along the highway. Wherever we went around most of that part of the state, people would recognize her. We rarely had a quiet moment. Then there were the weird dudes. Guys hitting on her right in front of me were funny at first, but it became annoying. Then there were the two stalkers. They figured out who I was, that I was with the object of their desire, and they did some shitty things to me. She gave that all up and focused back on the business world. I am glad she did. Going out is so much more enjoyable now.

[Anon-ymous1]

Damn man.

[Anon-ymous1]

But my point is, her celebrity isn't what drew you to her overall, was it? It was simply that you thought she was pretty and you liked her.

[Anonymous]

Doesn't really flesh things out but yeah, it's a hard and fast take but accurate enough.

I say these kinds of things all the time.
A local waitress is competing on the same level as a big time CEO or celebrity.
I don't care about your education, it's not the same as being intelligent anyway -- and when girls make a big deal about their education like I'm *supposed* to care, that's a turn off.

I would say money/status/etc is more "shallow" but not because it doesn't make you good at sex or whatever. I relate the body to being "closer" to who "you" are. All that other stuff is outside and removed from you far more than your body -- the physical location of your mind.

[Anon-ymous1]

Yes I didn't really have time for a long, involved explanation of the nuance of the situation, but the matter stands.

[partydelights]

I think "first impression" that result in "love at first sight", this argument is true.

But for both genders, if they want to marry, then after the initial physical attraction is career, habits, family circle, ... so called "compatibility" comes into play.

Hence my opinion is, looking for ONS or friends with benefits or a spouse? This argument is not applicable for spouse hunting.

[Anon-ymous1]

I disagree, but I hear what you're saying.

[partydelights]

Thanks and I appreciate that.

Society has changed much. I just recalled the days of my "courtship" with my now wife.

When sex was out of our courtship life, what was left was non sexual intimacy along with a lot of "get to know you better" activities.

This is where job, education, further ed, religion, in laws, friends, post marital lifestyle, etc came into discussion.

Not that this will ruin the engagement, but we get to know what to expect after (first few years) marriage.

[Anon-ymous1]

Sure but all that stuff can be attained too along with sex. It's not like they're mutually exclusive.

[Ellie-V]

In my opinion I don’t think girls want or expect you to be *attracted* by their wealth or status. But they do want you to respect it and not turn them down simply because they make more money than you. And yes a lot of guys do that for reasons I don’t 100% understand. Not every successful person male or female is uptight or snobby. But that is how successful people are perceived. Men for whatever reason do not catch flack for their wealthy & self-absorbed stereotype but women do. That is the imbalance that women try to combat. I know this is just anecdotal, but I have met a lot of down to earth career driven women. I have yet to meet this stereotypical “I don’t need no man” type. Also I think when women vocalize that they don’t need men, guys will take it as “I don’t want you” and will associate that with ladies who are financially well off by themselves.

[dalibara]

Nah. Depend on the man also. Some men want an alpha woman, while others desire a woman that they would be able to dominate, so they don’t want her to be successful, and a lot of these women aren’t truly happy in this relationship , unless they are truly submissive. Even if a successful man date an unsuccessful woman , know that the guy will be less carring and respectful toward her, than if she was wealthy and indépendant. One of the biggest differences, is that a guy will be sure that a rich woman won’t date him for his money, so it marks a point for her since men hate gold diggers. I believe in true love but life is not a Disney movie

[Lightning8]

Why do women in general tend to find wealthier guys more attractive? Would a rich woman date an unsuccessful man? How can a successful man ever know she loves him for him and not his success? Can women ever love man as he is and for who he is, not what he can do for her?

[dalibara]

Yeah. As long as he love her for who she is and not what she look like and doesn’t expect her to be a caring housewife since he’s not a provider

[Lightning8]

yeah I agree she couldn't be a housewife, but by caring do you mean like performing tasks like making lunches, cleaning etc., or being emotionally caring or available/responsible?

[dalibara]

Both

[Lightning8]

Oh... I mean I get the first part with the cooking, cleaning and all but without emotional availability and care etc. I don't see how that's a relationship. It sounds more like being hired.

[Anonymous]

I have to agree. I wouldn’t care if she was wearing a trash bag, as long as she’s hot that’s what I like. Not to say that we’re intimidated by a lady who’s successful, it just means regardless of her status it doesn’t bother me much. For example, there’s this lady who works at the plasma center I donate at, she’s fucking hot. She’s a janitor, I know she doesn’t make a lot but does that matter to me? Fuck no her hotness negates all that lol

[Anon-ymous1]

Exactly.

[MannMitAntworten]

I met a legitimate actress last weekend. We hit it off. Probably talked for close to three hours. Yes she was quite attractive, but it was how engaging she was to talk with that kept my attention. We exchanged numbers.

I could care less her net worth. I likely have a greater net worth - she wouldn't know that considering we were both casually dressed in a small mountain town. However, yeah, her looks did make the initial impression but it was in talking with her that embossed her likely forever in my mind. A rate thing...

Take this however you wish.

[Ellie-V]

OH MY STARBUCKS!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS? LIKE ARE YOU ACTUALLY SERIOUS? LIKE... OH... MY... STARBUCKS😱

For real, no regular everyday woman walking down the street really cares about her own fame and status unless it’s work related...
The only girls that actually think all that stuff is “attractive” enough to bag a dude are instagram models. You can expect that kind of behavior from them.

[Anon-ymous1]

..."Oh my Starbucks?"

[Ellie-V]

Yes 😂 I literally heard a woman say that yesterday.

[Anon-ymous1]

The hell is it supposed to mean?

[Ellie-V]

Oh my god

[Anon-ymous1]

Lol then she should have just said that. She sounds like Regina George or whoever trying to make "fetch" happen.

[Ellie-V]

I know. I thought it was funny (and corny), so I repeated it

[Anon-ymous1]

It is pretty amusing.

[Browneye57]

Exactly. Nothing is more important than her level of attraction and desire for HIM. Not her job, her education, her cat, her hobbies, whether she's a body builder or whatever the fuck.
Whatever a girl has going for her is all great, but it will NEVER be more important to anyone than it is to HER. I think this is all part of their solipsistic nature. They're just so sure that if they do this or that, or have some kind of notoriety, that makes her more desirable. But that's just not what makes a woman desirable - it's her willingness to want HIM. For without THAT nothing is going anywhere fast.

[Anonymous]

Dude--SOOOO true! Perfect example using a barista too. There was this one who used to work at a coffee shop near me who was just STUPIDLY hot. She literally should've been a figure model somewhere. But yeah--probably pulling in about 15 bucks an hour or so. No guy would care though with a body as nice as hers.

[Anon-ymous1]

Agreed.

[SarahsSummer]

Phew! Such a relief to know I don’t need to be famous to be acceptable to men. Thank you exalted one for sharing this valuable information.

[Anon-ymous1]

Now you know...

[itsJay]

I agree with this post, but I'll also point out that there are some things that stand as an attractive point from women. Like having their life in order, a stable vision on where they want to go career-wise and being capable of handling work or aspirations that can positively impact their selves. It's not associated with fame, but I'd consider it a success that has a lot of value to someone's character. It's not only about physical attraction, I wouldn't want someone to get that wrong.

[Anon-ymous1]

Sure, absolutely. You're correct in that-- I simply left it out because it wasn't part of the point I wanted to make. I sort of put it in there in the first paragraph though.

Except our (logical) feelings are in contrast with a lot of girls' feelings, where they find money or social status/fame to literally be sexually attractive. It's weird and makes no sense.

[CottenBrick]

I think this is based on the fact guys are often chasing girls asking for sex, whilst the ladies get to choose. So men will often show off theyre skills or social status and the girls then get to pick.

[Anon-ymous1]

Yeah maybe. It's still dumb that girls are actually sexually attracted to stuff that isn't just physical attractiveness.

[whyisitso]

Why should women be attracted to only physical attractiveness?

[Anon-ymous1]

@whyisitso Didn't say they should; this isn't about intellect or personality... it's about wealth and social status. Personality and intellect and being an interesting person make sense to be attracted to. Ain't talking about those.

[MzAsh]

What men don’t understand is that we don’t care if you don’t care about status, fame, or money.

Many women are going to want that regardless of how you feel or think about it.

Not everything revolves around what men find attractive.

[sasukeuchiha7]

And not everything revolves around women either. The take was about what men find attractive, not what women find attractive.
Ok sure women find money and social status attractive (though I understand money but I don't see how social status even matters) but he says guys don't care whether women have those.

[MzAsh]

The take implies that women aim to achieve high status, fame, and wealth for the purpose of impressing men. Then he goes on to say that men don’t care about these things like it’s some kind of public service announcement.

It’s possible that I could have misunderstood his intended message here but that’s what it reads like to me.