MGTOW stands for men going their own way because the system is rigged against us. 1. More than half of marriages fail (bad financial risk). 2. Women instigate 72% of all divorces (finds a new man). 3. The judicial system is heavily against men (you will lose your finances and children most likely). 4. It is easier nowadays to have casual relationships with women 5. It is very nice to live stress free.
No, you're right. It's men going their (YOUR) OWN WAY. I understand MGTOW, but I'm not exactly MGTOW. As in, I haven't given up all hope on women. I just know it's extremely unlikely, so I don't put any stock into it. Maybe you can say I'm MGTOW Lite or whatever. I mainly just do my own thing.
I'm not going to say it's literally impossible for me to ever have someone, but doing my own math on the matter, I put the odds of me finding a compatible woman who would love me completely for me (flaws like shortness and all) at about 13.5 billion to 1. So that would mean if we had access to a good three extra Earths full of women from the Multiverse, at least ONE of those women would be a compatible partner for me, who'd love me as I am and treat me as well as I'd treat her. But considering THIS Earth maxes out at about 3 billion females (not even counting minors, married women, old women, lesbians, etc), the odds are *pretty much* impossible, although not literally so.
But yeah, do what you want in life. As long as it's what YOU want, and no one else. Dating in this day and age SUCKS! Women try to complain about it too merely because no man is literally perfect enough for their standards, but really, they're irrelevant. There'll always be Chad and that's many of them want, anyway. The modern dating age mostly hurts MEN. So if MGTOW is what's keeping you from being depressed at this f*cking dystopian nightmare future of 2022 we're all stuck living in, then more power to you! Cheers! 🍷
At least your logical and not emotional like many of the people who join groups. Rarely anything is 100% homogenized ; women included.
Dating a shorter man is something I've done... Being willing to marry a man who is shorter "and" lacking in a few other preferences, he'd have to have the same beliefs as me...
I don't understand MGTOW. I get it, a lot of women suck. I've dated plenty of women that have made me feel that way, especially hot ones. But I also have dated some really great women, that I wasn't interested in, and they probably felt the same way about me as I did those other women that hurt me.
I realize that I overlooked most of the ones that don't suck because they weren't HOT enough, or did what I want in bed, etc... Those reasons were justified to me, but their stupid reasons weren't.
1. Ok, have her sign a prenup and do what you can before you are married to cover your ass. Buy your house before you get married, and keep it in your name. Keep accounts separate if it makes you feel better. Getting married is actually one of the key factors to having financial success if you can stay married.
2. This is true. That's why you need to find a woman that really loves you. I dated a lot of women just cause I wanted to fuck them, and there were terrible people. I see a ton of men doing the same things, even marrying them. Then get surprised when the girl that was out of their league leaves them. If she wouldn't be with you if you were broke, then don't marry her. Also, refer to #1. Vet these women better, ask the important questions, and see her actions for what they are.
3. Again, stop marrying hoes that think divorce is ok. It's one of the topics I bring up while dating, and I pay attention to her attitude towards it. No big deal, you out the door.
4. For some men it is. Until you get about 40, then you become the creepy single dude that no one wants to invite anywhere. Most people are coupled up by then.
5. My life is way less stressful with my current girlfriend. She lets me play my video games, scratches my back, cooks for me, cleans and does laundry when I don't want to. If I was alone I'd have to do all of this shit on my own, or pay someone to do it. She does it just to make my life easier, and I do the same for her. It's a nice exchange really.
If MGTOW is the way you want to be that's fine, but to me, it just sounds like someone who keeps losing a game, so they decide to just give up, instead of getting better and figuring out how to win.
I think it's fine if men or women want to go their way and do their own thing, I notice though that some of these types of groups or movements seem to be motivated by their anger or bitterness towards the opposite gender. For that reason, even as a single woman going her way for many years I tried hard not to let anger and bitterness towards some of the exes consume me. I may not have been bitter for the same reasons as men of MGTOW but I felt that holding on to the bitterness was too toxic and it was holding me back and I've learned to let a lot of that go. I did not want to turn into a raging man-hating feminist lol. I view myself as more of an equalist because I try to listen to and understand the arguments that both men and women have in these gender battles. For me making peace with the fact that what motivates men and women in different aspects of life is different, trying to find the balance and appreciating those differences between men and women is the only way I think I can move forward.
I wish you well though, life these days seems like a battle, sometimes it almost seems like a losing battle but maybe things would be boring if everything worked out perfectly.
A respectable, well thought out and balanced response. I find it depressing that a lot of womenâs first response is to lash out with insults and belittle those that identify with it instead of at the very least trying to understand why.
Everyoneâs had bad experiences, some worse than others, but nobody really cares. So itâs easy to withdrawal into like-minded groups. As long as you stay focused on positivity and bettering yourself and your friendships thatâs fine. Society seems to be rapidly degrading though, and its not looking good for the future. People like you are a rarity.
Except that the mistake your making is thinking MGTOW men are angry and bitter. Some maybe but most aren't. It's funny how this get twisted by some women. These guys don't hate women they've simply moved on.
@ChiTown33 If they are not angry or bitter towards women and they've just moved on, that's great, more power to them. I'm glad that's it just a few of them that feel angry or bitter because I know personally how those emotions can hold a person back as I've been there myself but I do think that they are justified to feel the way that they do in many of these instances.
Let's play Fleetwood Mac "Go Your Own Way" . . Is that how u kids think today really? I will repeat my story, I was a stripper/prostitute in my early 20s. I had dropped out of college bc I failed a course 3x and was looking for some easy money. One regular guy I saw on the weekend turned into more than just a trick. We've been married almost 9 years and have an auto shop together. He has taught me a lot of things besides fixing cars. My point here is, no matter if u like girls, guys, both.. everyone needs a lifetime companion. My mom was divorced twice and lives sadly alone in an elderly apartment complex. I don't think u want to be like that. Even if u get old w/a nice retirement. I used to c this 1 old rich guy in Chicago. He was alone and would pay me to just hang out w/him for 4 hrs. U don't want to be like that either. Hiring hookers to keep u company? No way.. just figure out ur career choice and have some fun right now. Ur still young. But don't give up on a long term relationship.
I envy you , Yes I am jelous of you. You want to know why because you have a beautiful gift Your husband love. Something that not all woman have. I always had bad luck in love I guess love isn't meant for me. Please appreciate your husband he loves you he teach you all of these good useful things. I am going to be just like your mom I will die alone. I was married once but he didn't love me he left me for some other girl now I am 29 year old divorce.
@Alwayreckles93 U r still young! My mom grew up during the hippie movement, so independence has always been her state of mind. The whole submissive housewife thing wasn't her cup of tea, so she had 2 failed relationships. U have so much more time to find your lifelong partner. Don't listen to social media/news. That is what is discouraging this generation also. Society has pushed open relationships as the norm and making stable families look like a joke.
You are very kind thank you for saying that. Honestly I feel old guys don't want me they all want the young clueless 20 year olds. I've always wanted to be the submissive wife raising kids taking care of a husband. My ex would yell endlessly while he drove in the high way like crazy. All he care about was vidoe games beer. His 30 years old left me for someone younger. I feel old my selfsteem is low.
@Alwayreckles93 That's his loss. He'll see soon enough. That young girl he's with is probably only interested in partying and money. U will find someone else. U have so much more time.
My husband and I have been married for 21 years. Marriage isn't always easy, but I wouldn't trade my life for a single life for any amount of money.
1. I'm not sure how accurate that number is because I recall reading about how that statistic was measured and it was off, but non the less, divorces are pleanty especially if your own parents are divorced. My parent remarried and has been married over 30 years, so I feel safe there and my husband's parents have been married over 60 years.
2. Women do file the majority of divorces. But please take into account the reasons for that also include domestic violence, husband's affair, husband walked out, more men end up in prison, etc.
3. You're absolutely right. I can't argue that the courts rule in favor of the wives/mothers even when it's unjustifiable.
4. Yes, lots of women will settle for a casual relationship. That's the type you'll always end up with and I can't help but think that a lot of those women are also the ones that don't stick around.
5. There's no such thing.
Anyhow, I think you are the only person who knows what's best for you and I wish you happiness.
Well, the Bible said something about staying single and serving God, but if you are going to "burn in your desires", get married... but you are going to suffer. It's mating season now you are >13, and these are the decisions you must make over next 40 years.
To be clear... you want a woman, may consider random encounters to gratify your "needs", but won't commit to one... is that right? If so, I'd say you need to resolve your childhood trauma that is controlling your view of yourself and limiting you from developing into the man you can be in life... all disguised as a logical conclusion of fear. Thus, early childood trauma/trust issues are suspected. There's truth in many perspectives and we can all justify how we feel with logic. However, no such great adventure in life is undertaken in that way... e. g. a list of reasons not to.
You are better off looking at what you want in life, validate why you want it... and go for that.. rather than living in fear. Random encounters can leave you empty and in a bad place, as well as leave offspring dead or hopeless. In other words, not being a man for your family.
I was MRAFW (Men running away from women) for 5 decades. My wifes been very good for me, do I need to list all the ways so you see positives? I know other men the same. I also know people whove gone through hell... pain and suffering... both male and female.
There are no guarantees in life, life is not fair... get that concept out of your mind, nothing is perfect, you may get thrown some "curve balls". This is life.
I'd suggest getting a new perspective... but it's your life.
I donât think youâre misguided. Everything you stated is factual and any guy not concerned about these things is a fool.
That said, Iâm not saying youâre on the right or wrong path. Iâll say youâre on your path, and if you feel most comfortable going MGTOW, I donât think thereâs any harm or sin in it at all. It is prudent so long as youâre happy with it.
The last thing I will say is women are not men. They donât love us as deeply as we love them. Their love towards us is much more superficial. They love children the way they should love us, but they cannot. Itâs not within their ability. Generally speaking, and there are exceptions to every rule, Feminism and liberalism have further helped to make them much more self centered in relationships, and all aspects of life, to the extent they are not of much value to us. They are told they are victims when they are not. They are empowered to serve themselves and legally armed to do so to the fullest extent to our detriment. Again this is speaking generally. They are the product of a sick culture. Men are failing in their own ways as well but thatâs not the subject at hand. It is possible to find a good woman and have a happy marriage, however the chances of ruin in this game far outweigh the chance of success in it. In love extreme prudence and wisdom is required as is self control. So, the bottom line is, you can marry and be happy, and not get your kids and cash and property legally stollen from you in divorce court, itâs not impossible itâs just very difficult in a superficial, self serving, morally bankrupt culture.
Why do you hate the female version of mgtow (feminism) but think itâs ok for men? Nobody is challenging that there are a lot of problems with modern gender relations and the injustice system, but that just means you have to be very careful about whom you voluntarily enter into situations which you could potentially end up in family court with. There are good women out there worth your time who are sick of the dating games too and want to have a healthy family and great relationships. Most of them are married by 24 years old though so you only have a couple years left to find a unicorn. You might try looking at women who care more about being an awesome girlfriend and wife material than they do about being a supermodel. Itâs been my experience that you canât have both.
Money and toys and cars are NEVER going to look as good as a handwritten Fatherâs Day card and a little smiling face looking up at you. I think most men have been where you are looking at the evils of society, but with a woman who is good to you and good to your kids, the benefits far outweigh the costs. I talk a lot about men only rising to the standards set by women, but to a lesser degree it works the other way too. If youâve read Rollo enough to consider yourself a mgtow, you know that women are born rich and die poor, while men are born poor and die rich. It sucks being a single young man, but it sucks even harder being a single middle aged woman. The first two things you need to do are get off tinder and stop looking for supermodels. I guarantee youâve passed over a girl-next-door type who would be a great wife and mother. Now Iâm just some stranger on the internet, but Iâve been where you are when I was younger, and Iâm infinitely happier that I chose my wife instead of a sports car.
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0 Reply
Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
What they call Marriage today by terms is not Marriage but rather simply a legal relationship. Marriage does not simply end because its inconvenient or one party isn't enjoying it anymore or would prefer to be with someone else.
Such a union would be a wast of time. So what your really conserend with is the high rate at which modern women are dishonest in their Vows and leaving men.
This is a legitimate complaint reflecting a very real cultural and legal problem, that effectively undermines if not outright abolishes the institution.
It is not however honest to blame all women for the actions of even a majority, nor fair to assume you can't find one woman who would be interested in a genuine marriage.
The problem must be confronted and they must be made to understand that the union is not out of conveniences, nor for good feelings, it will be hard work and the propose is not our happiness but the security of our children and financial future.
Any woman who cannot honor those terms should not be trusted in any kind of relationship, not as a friend, not as a coworker, nor a wife. For commitment thou unpleasantness is the foundation of honor and trustworthiness.
You are cultivating extremist thinking. That's definitely not the right way. 1. More than half of marriages fail (bad financial risk). The risk applies to both sides, then. Marriage is not mandatory. You can still live together with your SO.
2. Women instigate 72% of all divorces (finds a new man). If that is true, then that would say a lot about the (former) husbands, wouldn't it? Did you think divorce is roses & rainbows for the woman?
3. The judicial system is heavily against men (you will lose your finances and children most likely). Either parent can claim custody provided they are deemed competent for it. The one not claiming custody likely pays child support. That's completely reasonable.
Divorce is definitely not pleasant for either side. You may have some fantasies about women purposefully divorcing so they can claim "his shit". That's not how it works. There is no legislation that reads as "the ex-husband has to give so and so to the ex-wife". Both sides have claims to whatever they acquired during the marriage.
4. It is easier nowadays to have casual relationships with women 5. It is very nice to live stress free.
MGTOW is just misogynists, incels, and male supremacists. So if you truly believe women are lesser, that men are better, and all that bullshit, then I'm glad you joined the MGTOW movement, as then it stops women from having to interact with you as much, and no woman deserves to put up with you.
For everyone action there is an equal and opposite reaction. MRA was a response to Feminism, but MRA had absolutely no institutional power or legal sway, so they were absolutely destroyed and slandered. Mgtow was an inevitable result and will continue to grow exponentially as marriage rates collapse and people give up on relationships. Itâs not a political movement or a social group, itâs simply a mindset. You can slander and mock those that identify with it, but unless you provide an alternative youâre only validating their ideology.
Women have very high standards for men, in terms of responsibility, morality, and overall goodness.
The only men who need to consider throwing in the towel on women, are those who have already thrown in the towel of bettering themselves. If meeting a womanâs standard to essentially mirror Jesus in word and deed is too hard, you can always jump between women whenever one starts to know you well enough to criticize you, but that sounds a lot more like being a boy than being a man to me.
What you termed âbettering themselvesâ could be likened unto a cow bettering itself by fattening itself for the slaughter. Younger women usually want the most worthless sociopathic scumbags they can find. Such bad boys excite them. No amount of self âimprovementâ will make a man of more interest. It may take a reaming in the Family Court, discovering that âyourâ children were sired by your wifeâs lovers, then being ordered to pay child support for those children, being reduced to destitution and gaoled because you could not pay the child support, for you to open your eyes.
Your beliefs are not based in evidence. You exist in a self-fulfilling delusion, perpetually fueled by your own misery.
There is no statistical evidence validating your belief of what young women are usually like. You are a prisoner to your own negative and unfalsifiable beliefs about women.
Plenty has been written about how women want bad boys until they are around 30, then they begin to look for beta bucks to provide them with a white picket fence. You could begin with The Rational Male, by Rollo Tomassi. What has been written aligns with female behaviour that I have observed since I was a teenager.
At least one girl exists out there who can and would marry the best version of you if you worked tirelessly at becoming him and finding her.
If youâd rather extend your boyhood indefinitely and keep your geneâs out of the next generations because some author articulated your gripes in writing, then I canât stop you. Youâre missing out on some great stages of life though. Maybe youâll change your mind when youâre older.
Look man if you wanna gtow then go for it, I'm not gonna stop you. But as a man who has experience with females in most capacities, it doesn't add up that all of them are so cunning and analytical and don't really care about you when you see how many women really get hurt the exact same way by cunning analytical men who don't care about them.
It goes both ways all the time. And it sucks both ways. The good shit is when two real ones are able to pursue the relationship they both actually want instead of one half only playing, pretending to want it, and then leaving when they get what they really want. Women are human just like you, and a lot of them are struggling and questioning if relationships are even worth pursuing as well.
It's not easy, and it's a lot harder for some men and women than others, for a lot of reasons most of which aren't fair. If you think mgtow is the best choice for you given the circumstances then good luck and I hope it goes well.
I wouldn't call casual relationships "stress-free." That's very misleading. Real men find the Psalms and Proverbs Virtue Woman, and won't settle for marrying anyone lesser. But will marry her, rather than be a scallywag. And will be faithful, as she is faithful, and reap his reward over the long haul.
Weak men flee from all responsibility. Fools invest in women who are already operating with screws loose.
But you do have one thing right: the courts need reform. Kate Millet Disease and crapunism have corrupted the mentality of the court system away from Common Law, and into bees are fish levels of insanity. Under such anarcho-tyranny, Amber Heards the world over can have a field day, and courts will rob men of everything they have of value.
Marriage as God intended it isn't the issue. Human selfishness, and wayward courts that reward rather than punish selfishness, are the issue. Let's not blame the sun for darkness.
I know what mgtow is, and sorry but I'm not about to listen to a dork in a silly mgtow hat talk, to be migtow is one thing but to wear a silly hat like that there's no way I could take him serious.
Also I don't think real migtows would even have casual flings with women, they are men completely tired of women and that don't trust women, they'd also rather go without sec than risk getting stuck with child support or worse false accused by the #metoo movement.
Hate to break it to you but if you still want to do anything, nomatter how casual with a woman you aren't a mgtow.
I believe finding the answers to these questions will help you find your answers
1. What caused marriages to fail? 2. Were you raised right as a man? What would you think was the "bullshit" you did in your teens? 3. How have your interactions been with women who are not your dating interest? 4. Why do you want to be in a relationship? 5. If the US laws regarding marriage and stuff is really harmful, what's stopping from you going to another country and marry in a country which is "better" in marital laws? 6. If you go towards your way, and find someone who is compatible with you, what will you do?
The system is actually built by men 😆 Itâs funny how you think the system is rigged against you when thatâs what women and minorities have faced their ENTIRE lives. If youâre so focused on making the system equal, how about addressing equal pay for all genders? Racial equality in the justice system? Etc. Thereâs so many problems to be focused on but the only one you seem to be asking about is the VERY SMALL portion of men who feel that the system is against them? Which benefit only you.
This is a selfish post if you ask me. As a white male, Iâm telling you to get a life further than benefiting yourself.
Well it doesn't really solve the problem does it. But it beats the hostility in the feminism camp. Since no one seems to want to fix the situation it will just continue to derail. You can watch it on the side but you can't prevent or fix it from there. So eventually someone will create a law that makes it bad for people just going their own way. Because corruption doesn't just disappear it keeps growing so if you got a corrupt lawbook expect it to expand to include you. If you aren't fighting it. They will keep stealing more and more of your money to fund more and more stuff you have no use or want for. Since you aren't engaged in the system.
If you are MGTOW aka MEOW (men exit own way but also noise a pussy makes), then why not just go, why do you lot keep telling everyone you are going, but never just fuck off.
itâs simple, you donât like society, then fair enough, just stop bleating about it.
it does seem to be an American thing where grown arse men cry about how bad life is, yeah it sucks, live with it and stop the constant bleating.
Ha, who are we kidding? You don't need confirmation on whether MGTOW is the right path. You're going to do whatever the hell you want...like everyone else on the planet. Why do you care what I think and feel on this topic? Correction: you've gone your own way, so my thoughts on it are clearly irrelevant, but you know, do you! You hate women, you can't stand us, or shrugs for whatever the hell reasons you've come up with based on statistical data that "explain all women," cool man. It's all good. Don't look at us, don't call us, don't date us, don't sleep with us, don't marry us, don't have kids with us, keep all your money in an offshore account where no woman can ever reach it and go off and be friggin' happy being you by yourself. It's your life!!!
I'm MGTOW, but not because of these. I'm MGTOW because,
1. I have my own personal goals to achieve before dating 2. Dating arena is highly skewed. Equality is so rare. 3. Finding a worthy woman is so hard and they are really rare. 4. No offence but many women are shallow and aren't smart. 5. Tagging along someone else is mostly making it hard to achieve goals and do things that go with my taste.
I'm looking for someone who is not any of those mentioned above. So I haven't thrown the idea of dating completely off the table.
Men who aren't intersted in dating or marriage, need only to not date or marry.
Men who make videos bitching about women, are men who want women, but can't find a match, and deal with that by stereotyping all women and just giving up.
it should be called wlmwguapatt (whiny loser men who gave up and pout all the time), not mgtow.
I guess I'm an MGTOW too. I lost all trust in women long ago. I don't have kids and since I'm nearly 40 and still not married, I probably never will, so IDC about that. In the highly unlikely event that I ever get to marry a woman (unlikely bc I already know she's marrying my money, not me), I'll ask her to sign an agreement that in the event of a divorce, she won't have any financial or property claims. If she refuses - no marriage.
by the way, that "MGTOW" sounds more like a military vehicle name than like something related to men. 😁 Mostly because of the German "Wiesel TOW" (below) and to me "MGTOW" sounds like its cousin.
âTo love at all is to be vulnerable. Love anything and your heart will be wrung and possibly broken. If you want to make sure of keeping it intact you must give it to no one, not even an animal. Wrap it carefully round with hobbies and little luxuries; avoid all entanglements. Lock it up safe in the casket or coffin of your selfishness. But in that casket, safe, dark, motionless, airless, it will change. It will not be broken; it will become unbreakable, impenetrable, irredeemable. To love is to be vulnerable.â
Well, your facts aren't off, but have you paused to ask yourself WHY things ore the way they are? That picture shows a lot more antagonism than the situation warrants. Do you really think it's *women's* fault that family law cases are so lopsided?
Are you really walking away from a rigged game, or are you spewing vitriol on those who still play it?
Being chased by women may look like a blessing at first, but ironically enough, in reality it's a curse! I keep seeing these young couples on malls, supermarkets, out in the street.. doing really tedious stuff, like walking at tortoise pace while window-shopping for mall items, or taking her tiny dog out for a crap at night.. those guys do NOT look happy or thrilled doing those things. What's ironic though is, my biological impulse and the constant, visual conditioning of society out there keeps telling me every now and then to try and aspire to that stuff!
So do your thing my guy take care of yourself , enjoy life
Remember YOU CAN ALWAYS BUY A WOMAN FOR ANY PRICE YOU LIKE.
I have been a MGTOW monk for 21 years, but began to withdraw from women about 30 years ago. A man can be rejected, hurt ang fucked over only so many times before he realises that interaction with females fails a cost/risk/benefit analysis. Women have chosen to become so unpleasant and legally dangerous that even non-sexual social interaction is too dangerous.
I wouldn't judge them. Perhaps they were a loving husband at some point and his wife never appreciate the things he did for her. It always happens the shitty wife always end up with the good husband. And the good wife always ends up with a jerk. Perhaps it's a trauma. I am not going to judge a guy we never know what caused him to changed and had this mindset let be more understanding more patient.
but of course feminists, beta males, simps and manginas are gonna try to convince you that you're going crazy. by I suggest you refrain from listening to them. if you need any help accomplishing this let me know cause I got your back on this one
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
1. If you are white and your wife is white your chances for divorce become 35%. 2. Yes they start 72% of all divorces. A divorced is implied so you have to be in the previous 35% and then apply the %. Meaning after you say "I do" the odds your wife will divorce you are 35x0.72=25.2%. Doesn't look so scary now does it? Just basic math. 3. No it isn't. I'm divorces involving children 51% of the times BOTH parents agree that the children should stay with the mother. Meaning most of the times men don't even fight for them. Since men win custody around 23% of the times, it's 23% out of the 49% we actually fight. Nearly half! 4. Yes, but if you just want sex out of a relationship your marriage is doomed from the start. And before anyone says that you have friends and family, the companionship, live, care, support etc that your wife gives no one else gives. Hard to explain, but it's very different. 5. Yes and a good wife will help your life to be stress free.
Itâs been a while since I took a statistics class.
35x0.72âŚâŚhow do you have it at point 72? Its 72% out of 100%. Shouldnât it be a whole number? Wouldnât 0.72 be a number lower than 1% thus invalidating the formula?
Not trying to argue, just having difficulty understanding the figures youâre using and why.
@Exterminatore it's a percentage over a percentage. We have 35% of all marriages end in divorce. Out of those 35%, 72% are started by women. If we want the probability of your wife divorcing you, 35x0.72=25.2% If we wanted the probability of you divorcing your wife would be 35x0.28=9.8% Add the two and you have the total amount of divorces. 25.2%+9.8%=35%, as it should.
Of course the 35% is a stat that involves only white couples and the 72% isn't. We have an error there.
Actually I have to say you did some pretty eye opening math. When you see divorce you typically see 40-50% ending in divorce. Never saw the stats by demographic. Thatâs just all men. You are correct in breaking it down numerically by race which does give different percentages. Now Iâm curious about other factors like age or income.
@Exterminatore I did my research and math just to show other men here that marriage is not as hopeless as they think. That just saying "women initiate 70% of divorces" sounds way more scary than it actually is.
I have no data regarding age or income. I know that age difference past 10 year increases the risk of divorce. And couples that make a similar amount are Les likely to divorce. But I don't have the numbers.
I absolutely love most women and it's clear the feelings are mostly mutual... but I will never date, marry or have children. They have priced themselves completely out of the market. You don't seem sure of your choice. Some men learn from other men's mistakes, but some need to learn from their own.
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Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
Sure, go your own way. It sounds like you are doing us a favour.
@sp33d I guess I was asking the wrong person. I should of asked @abc3643 about his theory on evolution. cause if he thinks that if more men give up on dating means he will have access to more women then he obviously does not know how the gene pool works and like any other fool he's in for a rude awakening
See here's the thing. MTGOW wants to be Clint Eastwood riding off by himself into the sunset.
Instead MTGOW are guys who failed at getting dates/relationships/sex whatever, and instead of focusing on other things or trying to improve themselves, they keep shouting to people about how they won't date and relationships are awful.
If you do not mind sharing, what happened in your life that pushed you towards having this kind of mindset towards women? I do not speak of your desire to be single and find your way alone.
Iâm curious to this too. I think most men want a partner but are afraid of losing what little power they have in their life.
His facts are on point except divorce is 53% of all marriages and women file 80% of them.
I myself was very MGTOW and black pulled. I canât consider marriage an option anymore⌠itâs one sided and comes with no benefits. I wouldnât even consider living with a woman for some time because women have all the power and the government WILL take her side in divorce/family courts.
That being said many men arnt popular with the ladies and even though they want a relationship they canât get one so they become bitter and grow to hate women or else they just worry the women are such quality it wonât be worth the effort. I sit in the ladder of the two.
I'm kinda learning that now being married that it can be very one sided. I don't care for all that other crap about the government and taking sides even if things do not work out with my husband I want him to be present in our kids lives and I want him to survive and thrive. We will still be parents that won't change but together, I wonder if it can ever work.
I feel like crying just watching that video because my guy was not top game perfect or anything. He was just my guy he had issues he needed to grow from but sadly he won't act on bettering himself and I am left picking up the slack. Our kids get to see him yell and be constantly upset with himself, he is constantly losing jobs because of his porn addiction.
We are falling behind because of this, I would love to go to work but he wants me to stay home because he can not stand the kids being he is struggling constantly with porn addiction. It makes him irrational and irritable. I'm left feeling really alone and isolated. I leave the house once every 2 months or not at all for months while he goes out almost everyday. I have talked to him about this but when it's my time to get a hour or two he gets frustrated and starts stressing and tells me not to be long he does not want to be with the kids for to long.
He is out most of the day when he leaves... I feel like this marriage has become hyper focused on his needs and life I don't know what to do anymore. I am trying to be understanding but his issues seem to rule this marriage almost like another woman except its porn and watching women when he is out.
He is seeing a therapist but is not putting in the effort to try the things the therapist asked of him. He has medication but refuses to take any. He says he tries something and it does not help him but he actually just tries it once and never stays on top of it. I am afraid of how this will effect our kids and thier influence as into adulthood.
He has every excuse in the book. He tells me he thinks he is better off alone so he does not have to deal with the stress of kids and doing much. If this is what he wants I understand. I just want him to make a decision about all this so I know what I need to do for myself and our kids. :(
The last part of your post, I understand it's hard to get a girl especially when a lot of guys have social anxiety. I just wonder what girls they are talking to that treat them like options.
I have always taken people in general seriously, I am not gonna beat around the bush. If I am into a guy and he is into me I will date him and find out if we are a good match and not waste his time or be easy.
That situation sucks. Under the circumstances where efforts truly been pushed for every possible fix and no effort is given anymore⌠thatâs where I start thinking divorce is an option. But I donât like divorce. It shouldnât be an option as long as divorce is a business. I know I wouldnât want my wife to give up on me if I fell but falling and failing are two different things and we rarely want consequences for our choices. You never fail until you give up and try trying to improve. Under them circumstances I believe a man has failed to keep his side of the agreement. Something big needs to happen⌠leave for a month or two with the kids⌠donât tell him itâs temporary and let him live his best left without you. After having family if you take it away most men break. It might be the stress you need to make him give a fuck.
I donât talk to women lol. I just quit my job of 4 years because I was working too many hours to enjoy my time with what family I have. I spent years on dating apps and was completely ignored. I think you find the qualities men possess that are rare and women really want like devotion, sacrifice, strength⌠their not something you see without investigating these men further. But Iâm poor at marketing myself so women donât know what I offer. I worked 6-7 days a week for so long I didnât have time to invest in the effort of dating. Then I reacquired my brother and became part of his family. Even if Iâm never a father or husband I got my niece and sister-in-law. Itâs not the same of course but some men no matter what they offer will never have their own family.
â¤ď¸ I have been on dating sites before I understand to an extent, at the time I was working day and night shift and when I was not working had some time to spare.
Guys would message me but a lot seemed more interested in sex then actually finding a partner, so was not a good place for me. The other guys I talked to but we came to find we were not compatible.
It sucks women did not give you a chance. It would be cool if they created a dating site were bio and compatibility matched you and one picture of yourself fully was shared only once a person was interested in chatting with the match.
I think dating sites do not work as well either because a lot of people are not actually interested in dating. I feel like it is something you just leave up in the air until someone is interested. It just does not seem that reliable.
Thier are some women that don't mind slow effort in relationships when they themselves are busy and on the go.
Your pretty young still I'm crossing my fingers for you to bump into that someone special may it be here or anywhere!
It's nice though you want it and see it's value. A girl would be lucky to have you.
I think my husband has become codependent on me, he is more self destructive when I simply hint the idea that maybe he should be with himself for some time and come back once he knows what he wants.
He panics and tells me no that if he has to leaves he see's no point in being together.
His therapist has recommended marriage therapy and we start next week, after 13 years of trial and error I don't know what they will tell us. I don't agree much with divorce either but what do you do when your the only one keeping the foundation together. If this was the other way around he told me he'd leave me in an instant, I don't know if he is just being cold and cruel to himself or if he is serious...đ
I refuse marriage. I donât believe people are capable of the sacrifice of marriage. Honestly the only 2 reasons I consider a relationship over what I have is sex and children. The women themselves are just other people and I donât value people as they are today. Most are too worried about what they get and arnt worth my sacrifice. But if I start worrying about what I get then Iâm a hypocrite.
Too many good men are out there alone and feeling hopeless because their lost. Women are supposed to guide men and support them and now they donât. Womens quality is falling and mens is flat lining. Why should I work overtime to save for family if I can get by on a McDonaldâs salary and thereâs no future i see a family in my life?
I don't know why Iâm wasting my time complaining here this is a womanâs thing venting their bullshit. Nobodyâs going to change society for men. You understanding means nearly nothing.
As for your husband he needs a shock. Dumb motherfucker donât understand what heâs giving up being such a weak man. If you donât shock him I don't know what future your marriage has hopefully a therapist can help but if you shock him he might just give up completely. People have to struggle and suffer to succeed. The harder time we have with life the worse life is but the stronger we are.
Lookup the universe 25 experiment also known as rat utopia. Rates virgin paradise, unlimited food and water, unlimited space, no predictors, no work or effort required caused such a breakdown of society they genocide themselves. Stopped mating, got aggressive, excessively cleaned themselves, even starved. They lost the will to live. Life has to struggle so make him struggle and give me a reason to appreciate you would be my idea.
Divorce shouldnât exist except in the most extreme cases especially with kids involved.
Btw⌠we tend to spin the story in our favor. Gets his perspective on the marriage and understand a little that way. Itâs possibly you thatâs the problem.
I don't need to spin it in my favor I would gladly take the blame, because then I could help the situation.
Are you religious? I ask because this is the idea in being catholic, only divorce in extreme measures. I am but I am not married by church my husband is agnostic.
My parents never divorced and my father cheated a lot and abused my mom at times blamed her for not being pretty enough and treated her badly.
My husband at a time treated me this way when we first married and recently told me that he does not find me attractive but he does sometimes. He says that if I looked more like what he liked and lost weight maybe that would fix things.
When I try my best to lose weight he gets upset that I do not eat at times but I am just following the habits of weight loss routine. He gets angry if I do not eat when I am still hungry and tells me I shouldn't have to be hungry. I get why he thinks this but it at the same time I am still eating enough and just going with my health plan.
My husband had a Abusive Acholic Dad and no mom. He loved his dad even though he beat him and has expressed to me that losing us would turn him into his dad.
Other times he thinks that maybe he wants other women and that's why he is like this.
What do men consider extreme and what would you be willing to put up with if you were married?
It's sad to hear that you feel that way though. The world is pretty big out there. People online are not the majority. If that is what you are looking for I am sure someone out there would not mind the perspective, like I said it's a big world.
Also conversation is just that not really just for women. I have talk to a lot of women they tend to not talk in these subjects as much as before some do most don't.
Your a person in this world and I am too. It's just two people talking. And your wrong me understanding you helps me understand men. One of the biggest reasons why I try to understand different perspectives.
Thanks for that. I voice my opinions and personal experience both to learn from myself by bouncing ideas off others that argue back but also to teach mens thought process to women hoping it can make a difference to help us all. The problem is I canât decide if Iâm too intelligent for people to understand or too stupid to understand Iâm making no sense. It donât help Iâm not very social and canât articulate feelings and thoughts well. Like Iâve called my brother up and answered a question he asked me days after he asked it because I suddenly remember I didnât answer his question LMAO!
But in truth⌠I donât feel Iâve made much leeway and considering the effort required itâs ineffective. Iâve definitely grown callous to the thoughts and feelings of others that are rude because of it. When you stop caring about something like how others view you you take away itâs power over you and free yourself. But when you stop caring you lose something⌠important. I don't know what that something is I canât put it into words⌠ima stronger person now that Idc about people but if society was like me weâd go extinct.
Didnât see your first comment. Letâs see⌠we sometimes canât see our bias and this leads us to unknowingly spin a situation in our favor. Or maybe thatâs just me though I donât like lying I catch myself doing it from time to time and have to really think about it and correct myself.
I donât believe in god. But I believe in and value his words. I believe religions a way to teach people morality. When you die there is no heaven and hell. Heaven and hell exist in the form of the life you choose for yourself⌠Ide be in literal heaven with a good job, my own wife and kids, and a comfortable life whereas Ide be in hell if I went back to being alone, without my extended family, and homeless.
Divorce⌠I donât like it because women have all the power. They take your whole life and you have to bounce back. Sometimes you canât as if the loss of your familyâs not harsh enough. The courts have no business in divorce. But. I only think this way because of what women have become or at least my perception of women. I support divorce if it canât be used as a weapon to destroy the family.
My old way of thinking is a manâs scum if he hits a woman⌠now women consider this when they abuse their men and itâs time to lay women on the ground for their actions. Iâve hit an ex once⌠she woke me up and I sucker punched her. My god how I felt for a week while we went out in public with her sporting a shiner⌠complete accident but still. Abuse is unacceptable from either side. Amber Heard is a perfect example of your average abusive relationshipâŚ
Your husband sounds like a shithead sorry to say.
As for what Ide put up with⌠I refuse to stay with a woman who stops showing she cares about me above all else if I donât feel valued Iâm not trying and thatâs just a downward spiral. And a woman that donât respect herself canât get my respect and respects important from both sides. My last relationship we got too comfortable calling each other names and it definitely affected the relationship.
Hahaha I can't say I have never done that myself. đ I tend to be late in response even in person. lol
Maybe words just get away from you when you get really deep in thought about what your trying to say. I tend to stay in my head sometimes to long thinking of so many different perspectives and understandings of subjects pertaining to the mind. lol
I agree with your view of freedom, I tend to simply not allow myself to see others reactions towards me as malicious and understand that they themselves are projecting feelings regarding thier own experiences, which have nothing to do with me. It allows me room to care about others opinions but also have my own.
I understand honestly whatever improves your ability to self reflect and be more open to communicate your opinion is good in my book. âĽď¸
She needs to stay in shape. Staying in shape makes me want her and shows me her desire to please me and respect her own body. Set limits and follow them. Donât allow men to walk on her. Submission means to follow not be walked on. I like being asked for help and thanked when I do thing for her. If not then what am I here for? Sex and money? I stared down a gun for family as a teenager Iâm worth more then that today as a man. I refuse anything less.
Extreme is very simple. It canât be explained but if your strong you know extreme. Physical violence is the end immediately. Mental abuse is something I donât recognize easy. Iâm harsh with my jokes and can take a hit pretty good if I consider it a joke but for the sake of respect this shouldnât be normal. Cheating is the end. Iâm fucking 3 for 3 on cheaters and Iâm done with cheating hoes. I probably wouldnât leave a cheater but I would respect them and Ide use the hell out of them until the relationship broke cause ima spiteful asshole lmao. When I care I go all the way but I only care if your worth my time. I hate as deep as I love and people naturally come grouped as âIde rather avoidâ these days. Big turn around from the guy that would help anyone he could. Iâve become a terrible person lol. Iâm okay with that because I got my family to give me purpose.
Itâs not surprising women want basically the same as men. The qualities we look for are to compliment us and who we are and want to be. This explains a difference in priorities between the sexes in choosing partners.
Growing happens most when, like I said, we suffer. Hard times makes strong men, strong men make easy times, easy times make weak men, weak men make hard times⌠and so the cycle begins anew. Balancing within that sweet spot of lifeâs difficult but manageable and happy is the real struggle of life. If we take on too much our life can crash or if we donât take on enough we grow arrogant and fail to properly value what we have. I feel if your relationships to grow your husband needs to see your value more and this⌠isnât likely. Itâs hard to change perspective after the fact. It takes time. Time lost. If he was already trying then it would be different but heâs not putting forth the effort in your eyes and itâs not possible to save a relationship like that.
Thanks. I enjoyed our conversation as well. Hope to see ya around.
Iâm just here for the women who shame men for wanting to live a stress free life deep down women realize they need us more than we need them so they do these mental gymnastics to make themselves feel good about treating men like sht and any woman who disagrees when was the last time you apologized to a man?
One must actually be sorry for shameful conduct before they are even capable of apologizing.
American women could accidentally push a button that launches warheads, nuking 2 countries, killing millions and starting WW3âŚ.. and somehow, somehow still be the victim in all this.
@Exterminatore exactly a woman could beat you till your swole in the face and when the cops arrive you still get arrested whether you touched her or not
Vreampiekarl420 Can I give you a good advice? I speak from experience I dated so many woman in my younger days. 1. Don't get marry now wait. 2. Wife should always be much younger than you. Because woman same age will do everything to control you. 3. A much younger wife their more likely to listen to you and to model them the way you want them to think.
@Exterminatore I am from Australia American woman are quite interesting to say the least lol I've date so much in my younger years. I learn from experience woman our age are control freaks and will do everything in their power to damage us. Run their shitty mouths nonstop. Woman our age have a mindset of their own. We will never win a woman. Everyone support their side of the story. My wife and I have a 15 year age gap. I always said wife must be way much younger then the Man of the house. Younger woman are much more possible to control. My wife I know what place she's at 24/7 if pick what close I want her to wear. How I want her hair style and I am able to changed her mindset. Guys that end up marrying much older woman huge mistake. I control my wife how ever I want to. I don't live in the U. S.
You shouldn't call yourself mgtow. Because mgtow means men going their own way. This contradicts that. Instead you should just call yourself red pilled. And you're right about a lot of things you mentioned. Of course women and blue pilled men aren't going to like it but you do raise good points
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
You do you man. I have no problem with guys that choose MGTOW if they're doing it because it's just easier than putting up with the shenanigans of today's toxic female. But don't do it out of anger. This is the one thing we have over women we're the rational, grounded gender. Never let a woman drive you there.
Most people don't have a clue about what MGTOW even is. They conflate it with other movement's like MRA and Inceldom, both of which are not the same at all, simply down to root reasons and actions of those following the philosophies. MGTOW is closer to MRA because its ENTIRELY voluntary, but MRA have an openness of "if things change legally, maybe we'll play along". MGTOW simply do not want to play, seems perfectly victimless to me. Let them walk away, no one knows their circumstances.
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
I learned 2 things from my dating life.
#1 No white women. Never get into a relationship with a white girl. #2 When it comes to women, the less Western the better.
I still get into relationships, but exclusively with Asian women and Latinas.
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Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
Those facts are honestly pretty useless as the basis of how to live your life. Better to start by answering the question: "What do YOU want?" Like if you could have ANYTHING, what would it be? What are the most important things to you to pursue in life and why?
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
Women don't like your reasons because you learned the truth. I don't hate women, some are very nice, but I would never play the high body count game or let them take my stuff, sorry. You're on the right path, the women that don't like your reasons are usually gold diggers or sluts.
I got a good tip man , If you're still single I suggest you find a much younger woman. From experience I had learn woman my age are control freaks they will aurgue with you nonstop as if you were their puppet. There is a 15 year age gap my wife and I Here is the secret I am still able to control her and she does everything I told her and she agrees on everything I say. I told her I don't want you with short hair I you look better with longer hair and she listens to everything I say. Just a tip get a younger wife their less stressful. Woman our age have a mindset of their own which it makes it hard to have a happy successful marriage.
@Ilovepancakes18 You're right and I totally agree, older women have a long past and are jaded and pissed off. Thanks for the tip, but I already know that, lol
There is nothing wrong with upholding Self preservation. By your will. However to be part of MGTOW will taint you as a misogynist Even if you try not to. MGTOW is known for its misogyny. It is ill advised to be one of them. especially if you are still hopeful about romantic relationships. Treat carefully. MGTOW was banned from reddit and several other places for organizing violence and hatred against all of the female gender.
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Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
You donât have to jump on the MGTOW bandwagon just because youâve decided women arenât worth the trouble. Lots of people have decided to just remain single for various reasons. You donât need to make a big deal about it.
Older woman love to control everything. There is a 15 year age gap between my wife. When wife is way more younger than the husband can still be able to control them and even to my own mindset into her. A woman my age already comes with of mind of her own not good.
I think you´re misguided coming from your "facts". I didn´t watch the video because I disagree with the title of it. But I come from a similar position concerning dating.
@cth96190 1. If you are white and your wife is white your chances for divorce become 35%. 2. Yes they start 72% of all divorces. A divorced is implied so you have to be in the previous 35% and then apply the %. Meaning after you say "I do" the odds your wife will divorce you are 35x0.72=25.2%. Doesn't look so scary now does it? Just basic math. 3. No it isn't. I'm divorces involving children 51% of the times BOTH parents agree that the children should stay with the mother. Meaning most of the times men don't even fight for them. Since men win custody around 23% of the times, it's 23% out of the 49% we actually fight. Nearly half! 4. Yes, but if you just want sex out of a relationship your marriage is doomed from the start. And before anyone says that you have friends and family, the companionship, live, care, support etc that your wife gives no one else gives. Hard to explain, but it's very different. 5. Yes and a good wife will help your life to be stress free.
@cth96190 I never said that I disagree with the content presented in the video and I haven´t argued against that. I just said that the title of video turned me off from watching it because of its premise that women solely persue guys to destroy them. If anything I argued against the list of so called 5 "facts" he presented because they are way too shallow in my opinion.
@DarkWinterNights i am not telling him to get married just as long as he doesn't put a ring on someone who is insane he might get out of it with a 50-50 custody. I don't trust anybody. I have been betrayed too many times so I might not get married either.
1) More than half marriages fail is a poor statistic. They calculate that by saying "100 people got married in 2022, and 50 got divorced, so there's a 50% divorce rate". The people who got married aren't the same people who got divorced.
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Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
It is not much to base life decisions on, especially with a lack of personal desires, experience and emotions, but to each their own. I sincerely hope you'll be happy with your descision also in the future
I used to watch videos about MGTOW when I was in my teens, I stopped looking into it when I realized that it shouldn't take a whole goddamn movement to wanna get your life straightend out.
I always said it isn't women it is dating. Thats what the scam is. And that ties into the belief that men have to invest into women. But yes 90% in fact of college educated women initiate the divorce/breakup.
Those are all valid facts that shouldnât be ignored. But regardless it is foolish to think there isnât one woman in the world who could possibly be suitable for you.
Home > Guy's Behavior > Questions > The reason why I am a MGTOW man is because of these 5 facts and one YouTube video. Have I been misguided or am I in the right path and mindset?
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