Do you think it’s okay for men to cry?

[Dat-Alpha-Lion]

[Chazmatazz269]

I think men shouldn’t experience the negative consequences that we do for crying, but we do. And there’s no signs whatsoever that that is changing meaningfully. Men lose a great deal of social value for crying, among other men AND women. Crying is weakness and weak men are useless to society. Any man on the verge of tears publicly should be prepared to lose something, or possibly everything. Privately, even if it’s just you and your woman, you better know your audience. If you cry about something of which she doesn’t approve or to an extent that she doesn’t approve, she WILL lose respect for you and women don’t stay with men they don’t respect. Ever notice how a man with nothing left to lose is quicker to lose it? We want to think we’re a progressive society, but when it comes to men we’re not. Not even a little.

[ElementoP]

And it makes sense because crying means you've lost control over your emotions and they're pouring out. There are certain situations where it's perfectly ok to not be ok, like when someone you love dies. But if he's crying over spilled milk, he's not a man that can keep a cool head under pressure and get shit done, like men are supposed to do. Men are solid emotionally for a reason. We can't just have everyone going around getting all emotional and losing their good sense or society would collapse

[Chazmatazz269]

I disagree. Bottling emotions is unhealthy. We can’t even properly detect and treat PTSD because, as you say, a man who loses his shit even if it’s from active duty in the military or police, or a traumatic experience as a firefighter or EMT, is a useless piece of shit. Society is better off if they’re dead. Which is why men suicide at four times the rate women do. Educate yourself, fool. And stay off my comments until you do.

[WeirdoFriendly]

Absolutely. It's definitely okay for men or women to cry. You're less easily broken by something if you let out your pain, anger or happiness every once in a while. No wrong in doing so either.

People may say you're weak for crying, but I think crying makes you strong. Letting out pain or grief is the hardest thing to do. You just want to keep it bundled up inside so no one sees that you're hurting. But, let it out. There's no harm in it. No bad decision to it. The more you keep things inside, the more you're going to explode one day.

[DermalPunch]

No, it isn't! It is right out of order. In fact, I propose mandatory tear duct removal surgery at birth for all newborn boys. I also propose a hefty financial incentive for jaw and cranial surgery for boys 8 and under to prevent any sort of grimace leaving the capability for only complete stoicism at all times.

[jennifer_bloom]

I like emotional men, because it’s easier to love somebody if they are capable of being vulnerable but I don’t like men that are abusive or hateful in their thoughts.

[Sixgunsound]

I think a lot of women will write publicly that it’s OK for men to cry, but those same women will call him names and shun him if they witnesses it in real life. When ideology collides with practical necessity, most women will pick a man who will fight off a mugger over a man who will try to talk it out. More women will likely pick police or firefighters or military than psychologists if their paychecks are the same. In high school more girls want the star quarterback than the star of the school play. That’s just evolutionary biology proving progressives wrong. Progressive attitudes are easy to have on a screen but they get more difficult to live in reality.

[AmandaYVR]

Uh... no. I know you feel strongly about this and you think you're right. But dividing this as a character trait [flaw] between political party lines is really not a good idea. You are invalidating what 1. women and 2. progressives say, and there is absolutely no way forward, to bridge the widening gap between republicans and progressives, men and women, with an attitude like this. I don't even care what, exactly, you are denying, but I, and others, could throw the same exact method right back at y'all. "We don't believe it. You say it, but it's not true." And that shuts down any reasonable potential conversation and is very insulting. Sometimes we (women, girls, progressives, whatever...) actually do say what we mean.

I asked a q about this once and ~ 80% of pinks voted in the way which you would only say is a lie, a front, hiding their deeper feelings on the matter. But the accompanying written comments also support the fact that females have more to them than 'rescue me and protect me' syndrome. Most/many of us want to love our men, and support them (and the platonic ones too), and it's not just lip service.

Don't tell us what we "really" think. It's a slippery slope, and that door swings both ways.

You won't believe this, it won't change your mind, but you can read it if you choose.
Ladies, True or False: "I've lost attraction to a/my man I really cared about because he expressed vulnerability? ↗

[Sixgunsound]

@AmandaYVR I pointedly use ‘some’ or ‘tend to’ or ‘many’ or ‘likely’ language to avoid categorizing groups, so I’ll stop you right there. As I only have my perspective and empirical observations to go on, of course your mileage WILL vary. You approached researching the topic better by creating a research question, so I will give you credit for that. To make sure I understand your position correctly, you would rather have a ‘man’ who wanted to talk to a mugger who is actively trying to do violence to you about their feelings during an attack rather than one who can and will solve the problem in the moment so you can then talk all you want afterwards if the attacker lives long enough to get into handcuffs? The kind of behavior that fights immediate and personal violence with words tends to self select out of the gene pool. Having been military and worked in public safety in a large urban hospital, I’ve observed more women demonstrating attraction to buffed guys walking around in body armor with guns than the guys pushing mops or hauling linens or patient transport. I have an uncle who was a navy chief and an uncle who was a fire chief. Neither lacked options for desirable female companionship in their youth. Worthy of note, I never stated that it isn’t ok for men to cry or that they shouldn’t.

[AmandaYVR]

I don't think there's much point in talking about a mugging situation and "solving the problem."
There are choices and risks. Fight back, try to keep one's money, get injured or maybe killed. It's a combination of all of those.

I don't like hotheaded or hyper men. I like thinkers who are calm. Sure, it would be nice to have a highly intelligent, even-keeled, physically imposing partner who was capable in all situations. But we can't just a la carte humans, make 'em into whatever we want. And I'm ok with that reality. It does bother me sometimes, being with a guy who can't control his temper or a situation (and is often the cause of them), or a guy who avoids conflict to such extremes that I have to often end up being the negotiator, the 'bad cop', etc.

I'm not attracted to men in uniform, or authority figures. They actually repel me, because I don't like the stripping away of individuality, the conformity, following rules, or those who get into these types of professions because they like imposing their will, and authority, over others. I know the type. Had one in my family, and he abused his power.
However, firemen are awesome. They fight fire, not tempers. But wouldn't want to be with one either.

I really think this is only loosely related to men crying. Everyone cries sometimes. It's best if we all do it behind closed doors, but we also know some have less or more control over this.

Two online friends of mine each cried messaging with me yesterday. One male, one female. Life is hard. Everyone's trying to hold it together. I'm somewhat honoured at their choice to share their pain with me.

[Sixgunsound]

@AmandaYVR consistent with two separate individuals, and in agreement with my earlier post about how your mileage may vary, we have significantly different experiences with men crying. I don’t pretend to know your life story, but I have volunteered for a lot of high stress situations where the men who cry don’t make it or don’t get very far if they do. None of the guys who cried in boot camp won any individual merit based awards, and one even used a couple bed sheets to give himself a permanent quick drop and sudden stop in the division restroom one night. The teasing and verbal attacks once you get to the fleet are merciless and are designed to weed out the weak points in the chain who will break under stress.

[Sixgunsound]

After that, there is nothing left to surprise me with that has not been said to me by an angry patient or even staff member at the large urban hospital where I used to be public safety before rotating into the head office. By the end of my first week I had logged in a rape evidence kit from a middle school girl, taken knives from a several crackheads, brought several bodies down to the freezer including a stillbirth in a three foot long casket which was still there when I transferred hospitals because the parents were fighting over what to do. Three restraints in 8 hours was a light day, some of which were knock down drag out fights if mental health or drugs were involved. I remember a fight with a patients mother who got upset that we wouldn’t let her see her nine year old daughter that she beat up for not doing a good enough job in the family street walking business. If you want to see the best and the worst that humanity has to offer, see if you can shadow someone who works in a hospital emergency department.

The guys in those situations who cried didn’t make it very far, typically a year or less if it was a really bad kid case like that one. And that wasn’t even that unusual as kid cases went around there. When I was an ambulance explorer in high school the first call I went to was a kid case, where the mother’s boyfriend of the week kicked her three year old son down a flight of stairs because he was too needy and got too much of mommy’s attention. Did the police who dropped him every couple of steps on the way back up cry about it? No. Did those of us trying to save the kid’s life cry about it? No. We all had jobs to do, and we did them. My point here is not to invalidate your experience but to show you that there are other equally valid experiences in the world.

[AmandaYVR]

People have different strengths and weaknesses. I really don't need a run down of the various tragedies and pains humans experience. It sounds like One Flew Over a Cuckoo's Nest, and others, and I already have the gist.
There are emergency workers, law enforcement, caregivers, service providers, teachers/educators... but so what? They all have different skill sets.

And neither of us would say that crying should never be a part of any human's existence... would we?
So I really don't see the point in continuing this topic. I"m not ending communication with you on some grand scale; I'm just saying that further pursuing this topic is pointless.

The issue I had was you calling out women for supposedly lying about how they feel about men become emotional sometimes. If we use "some", "tend", "likely" it softens the absolutism somewhat, but only somewhat.

Anyway, whatever. We're both entitled to our differing opinions. Yes, we are not invalidating each other's experiences. It's more the conclusions about the world that may need to be opened up a bit, to be more inclusive of others' roles in society. I don't take it as a personal offence, and you shouldn't either.

[Sixgunsound]

@AmandaYVR one question then I’ll shut up: in the absence of statistics what would be more acceptable than than direct observation?

[AmandaYVR]

Well actually it's one of my pet peeves - I can't believe how many people are forming very firm and definitive conclusions about the world based primarily on just their own (often limited) experience (and observations.) Even my husband sometimes asks me, "Well are you basing that on your experience, though?" Come on. I have always had an interest in this, and am constantly reading, researching, talking to different people from different walks of life online, and yeah, I have a particular interest in statistics. I'm curious that way, I guess (about certain things; not all things, of course, but in terms of sociology especially). Not everybody has to put in the time, but I think they should also allow room for a wider net, and not be so absolute.
See, guys don't know how other guys behave with their girls/women. You don't see that side of them. You can, of course, hear the stories about the female reactions (that's valid), but you don't witness it, in all its intimacy; nor do you know what all women want, in all contexts, or in the aggregate. You should not make these broad conclusions based on a slice within these emergency and high-stress situations.

[Sixgunsound]

@AmandaYVR I’ve been in academia long enough to hear a lot of people say a lot of things without answering the question, but it still gets me when someone is so highly proficient in the skill. Well done👍 Thank you for answering instead of blowing me off; I know I can be difficult to talk to but I’m not deliberately trying to be a troll. I respect you as a worthy adversary even if we are unlikely to agree on everything.

[AmandaYVR]

I actually laughed out loud reading that one. Now I have a Cheshire-like grin. I think becoming a "worthy adversary" is becoming my speci-i-al-ity! lol
I've been thinking a lot these past 3+ years about conflict resolution skills. Wrote a mytake about that too. Anyway, thanks! I am beginning to understand your kind (your personality, I mean, mainly.) I know it's not easy to find pinks who will not quickly disengage. Blues don't see it as so contentious, but rather more some sort of intellectual sparring that is, what... invigorating? It's not that for me, but I cannot say that I do not enjoy wordplay, language, analysis, and may have somewhat of a compulsion to address direct questions. Drives me crazy when I see people just ignore another person's points entirely. That's not good sportsmanship.
Anyway, cheerio. Until we meet again...

[ChrisMaster69]

Yes it is.

a couple weeks back a friend of mine (we dated at school) went to the hospital for a check up, just routine.

They found something serious and pretty much gave her 3 - 4 weeks to live.

She’s now deteriorating and will likely be next week or maybe week after.

There is palliative care in place.

So yeah I cried when I found out, I will when she dies and I will at her funeral.

Also I have in the past burying friends, not literally the grave diggers did that lol.

[WelcomeToTheSuck]

Depends why. Most problems guys have are smaller than my own and I'm jealous of the fact that they worry about spilled milk. Most guys with serious issues don't cry because crying in my experience comes from things that are overwhelming. But if you're used to sad things, you don't get overwhelmed.

In my opinion it's not manly to cry. People say it takes strength to put yourself out there, but they wrongly assume that crying is the only way to do that. It's displaying vulnerability which having lots of testosterone makes less likely. So it's okay to do, but not manly according to genetic science. Just be happy that you're not from a poor suicidal family of crackheads and alcoholics who never had a chance at actual living.

[Plinko]

Did your father die? Fine.

Did McDonald's give you the wrong order? Not fine.

If you want to cry in your room, no one will stop you, but it's not okay to cry in public and you should avoid crying infront of your partner. Obvious exceptions aside.

[MAC1983]

I never read that you couldn't cry in public in any etiquette book. Do you get a fine where you're from? Does it take a license?
Avoid crying in front of your partner? Who the hell do you think a grown man should cry with in those "obvious exceptions", his mama? 😄

Also, I don't go to McDonald's often but I never saw anyone adult there crying, let alone because of a wrong order.

[Plinko]

I'm not going to stop you. Cry more often. Cry whenever you want infront of whomever you want.

Just know that if you do it, people will view you differently.

[ElementoP]

That depends on what he's crying about. If a loved one died, it's not just ok, it's expected. If he spilled his coffee on his lap and was late to work because someone took his usual parking spot, that doesn't warrant tears from a man and he needs to get that shit under control

[FinneasWilson]

I was always told that boys don't cry as it's a sign of weakness so I never really did I'd want to but wouldn't, now as I'm older I do have a good cry. I live alone so I do cry quite a lot as I'm lonely and depressed, I refuse to cry in front of people though.

[Pegases]

You are human, yes. However, it's important to know what setting it is appropriate for you to cry. As a man, your image of strength can be shattered by crying, it's just life. So be aware that in private will always be your best option.

[AmandaYVR]

Of course. Since when were they not human. I believe we've always been.

[Sarahplus2]

Yes. Everyone grieves and maybe not in the same way.

[Lionman95]

Yes but I think it should be under circumstances where he feels secure and comfortable.

[Sour-rose]

Yes. they don't then they just be... like the other.

[MTC29]

It's fine, in the right circumstances. I cried when my dog died. She was a great dog.

[Anonymous]

My mother used to tell me boys don't cry. It reflected widespread social views of the time. But these views pervade through time and although more acceptable now, I don't see it as widely and generally accepted behaviour.

[jshm2]

Why? Are they being shot for it?

You're aware onions exist, right?

[GoodGuyBreakingBad]

Heck it's fine for men to cry, I do it often certain things make me sad

[andreasderjuengere]

Okay: yes.

But it's also pointless. No problem ever was solved by shedding tears.

[sheikalana]

Of course. Men are humans. Humans have emotions.

[FunkyMonkee]

Of course it is! What does having a dick and balls have to do with it?

[AsaKyo]

Of course it's okay for men to cry
They ARE humans after all

[YourNightOwl]

Yes. Crying releases a reservoir of negative energy. It actually makes a per feel intense joy or sorrow but should be momentary; not all the time.

[In_Trance]

Over the loss of a loved one, absolutely

Over unrest in Ukraine... fuck no

[Dinosaursandanime65]

Of course it is. Why isn’t THIS being encouraged while Faggotry and Gender Bending is? ☠️🦖

[dolemite89]

only at funerals or when they’re cutting up onions 😂

[Anonymous]

Personally I don't care. But socially? No it's not.

[Ms_Facesitter]

As long as you are human, it is okay.

[Smashingdoozy]

Uh yeah of course

[Blackcosmo]

Anyone can cry.

[Subarugirl]

Crying is human… so yeah

[BeachMe]

Yes of course

[SamA_nold]

Yes, crying is healthy

[TacosRAwesome]

Sure why not.

[XXblack88]

Yeah why wouldn't it be?

[exitseven]

Yes I do, you got a problem with that?

[TexasRed95]

I think it is. Society doesn't.

[TwoToTooTutu2]

At an appropriate time.

[BarryLiverstone]

Of course, I cried a few days ago

[Fuentes]

No I do not think it's OK

[Anonymous]

Only in the rain.

[Blackcupcake]

duhh

[JDBSLAOQ]

of course

[Marshymallow]

Anyone can cry

[NathanDavis]

yes, I am a grown up

[JustinTheGreat]

Of course

[Waldoe]

Yes.