Why is Chivalry dead in your opinion?

[Simslover92]

Do you consider yourself to be a chivalrous guy? Do you feel like it's harder to be chivalrous with the way women are today?

Like for instance you either have women who expect you to always open the door without saying thank you (the princess treatment) or the women who say they can get their own door (the do it themselves masculine types). And if you were to try to get the door for them they would take offense. So I feel men have stopped trying to be chivalrous because of this. Which I honestly don't blame a guy if he feels that he might encounter one or the other girl.

[loveslongnails]

The definition of chivalry in the minds of men vs women seems to be very much up in the air. The dictionary definition applicable today is "courteous behavior, especially towards women", with synonyms such as gentlemanly, gallant, well-mannered, urbane. I've heard men objecting to this idea calling it "favoritism" because they wouldn't treat a man that way. I've heard women call that "simping".

Personally, I think of chivalry as "excessive fawning over women in order to gain favor". That is not the same to me as simply being courteous. If I hold a door open for a woman who's entering a store behind me, it's nothing more than a common courtesy. I'd do the same for anyone who was right behind me.

[bowenw]

I believe I am. I’ve rarely had a negative comment for being polite.

[Simslover92]

That's nice! Glad there is still some chivalry in the world.

[bowenw]

Thank you.

[Simslover92]

You're welcome!

[bowenw]

Thank you for the MHO. 😊

[Simslover92]

You are welcome! 😊

[CalmUntilAbused]

Well... Chivalry has been brutally butchered by modern Western communities. Since a man can apparently get sued for holding the door for a woman, as it's apparently considered to be condescending towards an apparently "weak and helpless" woman, it's become dangerous to show chivalry towards women. I mean... One can never know who they meet in their life. She might be a perfectly sane woman, a kind one, even, but she might also be a man-hating fanatic who will sue them for seemingly looking down on her. It's not worth the risk anymore, unless I know the woman well enough to trust her, and that's an increasingly tricky matter. I'm not really discouraged by being socially rejected for showing chivalry (I got used to being socially rejected, and if a woman does not appreciate chivalry, it means she simply wasn't worth it), but legal action is a very realistic threat that I'm totally undefended against, given that the court sentences tend to be heavily lopsided against men. I've been wishing to reenact a long-forgotten tradition of kissing the woman's hand (as a greeting, mostly on formal occasions) one day with a woman I would deem worthy of such a treatment for some time now, but if holding the door for a woman can be considered offensive and a borderline crime, I guess doing something along these lines would amount for sexual harassment or maybe even a rape attempt. Totally not worth it.

[HawkPerception]

I do not think it's dead. Whenever a girl is cold, I offer my jacket. Happened so many times with my partners. I remember going to a club with my friends and partner and we got kicked out immediately because a friend got piss drunk and started puking everywhere. My ex was freezing her ass off because she didn't expect to be immediately waiting for a taxi and I gave my jacket to her and covered my friend who was on the floor drunk as hell with my sweater because he was shivering a ton and nearly froze to death that night. I read an article the next morning that that new years, a couple people died outside because it was cold. Pretty sure I could've been one of them. It felt like -30 degrees celsius. There was another time (when I was not in a relationship) and went to a college Halloween party and the same thing happened. It was freezing outside and I had no money to Uber back (plus Uber wasn't big back then and I didn't even know about it). There were 2 girls that were freezing their ass off outside and I offered my jacket, gloves and scarf while they waited for it. Then when they left, I put the jacket gloves, scarf and tuque back on and ended up trying to sleep outside on the campus that day. I woke up in so much pain and could not stand up straight.

And I started doing the sidewalk thing and being conscious of it when I learned about it (pretty late in life). As for opening a girl's car door or pulling her chair, I refuse to do that. Those require no effort and I'm not your butler. And it doesn't make sense for me to pay the date for so many reasons but that's a different topic.

[HawkPerception]

Women just like to complain that chivalry is dead when really men are just as chivalrous just in different ways after feminism.

[Finchie40]

It’s not dead, but a lot harder to find these days , society has sadly taken a turn for the worst , people aren’t as trusting and honest with each other anymore , I blame a lot of it on social media and all the nonsense that is drilled into our heads. Selfishness is pretty much the new norm , Most people want their cake and want to eat it to , and sadly that’s pretty much the reason most relationships fail these days , Selfish mindsets by thinking grass is greener on the other side , instead of just watering the grass you are already standing on. People are cheating on each other left and right , because they have selfish mindsets and only want things to go their way. Social media plays a big part into making people think that’s the way to live your life , people’s preferences of what they will accept and not accept is through the roof , most people think they are the center of attention and that everyone else should praise them , never admitting to themselves , that they were wrong but always right. I am not saying I am perfect whatsoever , but with the shit i experienced and witnessed in my lifetime , with relationships , sadly makes it harder for me to even consider having another committed relationship with anyone anymore , every girl I have gave my complete heart to , has turned around and shit on it , when she decided to be selfish all of a sudden , and I was no longer her priority , pretty much , why I no longer rush into a commitment with a girl anymore , because sadly most people in general including myself , have selfish mindsets , change their minds when they feel something better comes along , they trade you in , like they were borrowing a book from the library , when they had enough of it they give it back or they forget what they did with it , you pretty Much no longer matter to them because something new and exciting came along.

[DizzyDesii]

My ex definitely made it seem like chivalry was dead. However the men before him and the ones after have proven otherwise. I don’t need someone holding the door for me though but it is a sweet gesture. My new dude still likes to buy flowers and teddies and stuff and my crush before i met him still wrote poetry for me. Plus i like that these guys are fighters. Feels good to get back to some guys who have your back and stand up for themselves

[Simslover92]

Aww that's so sweet and nice! And yes I don't need to have a guy open the door for me all the time but it is a sweet gesture.

[DarkLegacy]

Women killed it, chivalry is not for man hating feminists obsessed with 'equality'. They don't deserve it, they are full of hate and hypocrisies a bit like on here where women say my body my choice and then slate men for their preferences and try and demonize and slander them. it is just one of the many double standards.

With men losing out on everything thanks to feminism and having no say over their kids, losing out in divorce, being falsely accused you can hardly blame them. men coming of worst in crime and punishment, healthcare, education, employment, etc we should not be chivalrous to women.

What about women giving up their gender roles also. Women can hardly expect men to be chivalrous to them when they do not maintain their gender roles. And what about the way women behave these days trying to copy men and being much worse. Chivalry is for ladies and most women are not that.

[LazerBean]

It's not. People who think that must live in the North or something, because absolutely nothing has changed in the south for the past 10 years. Everyone is still opening doors for everyone else. Nobody thinks twice about it. Maybe it's different for people who live in the major cities, but I have lived in almost dozen different places throughout my life and have not noticed any such changes.

[CrabCakes11]

Chivalry is men doing stuff like that’s for women, not generally human politeness

[LazerBean]

So men who open doors for women are only chivalrous if they snub men?

[CrabCakes11]

Yes. Chivalry is specifically that behavior towards exclusivity women. If you do it to everyone, it’s just being normal

[LazerBean]

The Oxford dictionary says otherwise. What you described is just ass-kissing in hopes of getting laid.

[CrabCakes11]

The Oxford dictionary does not say otherwise lol, but it’s paywalled so let’s check Merriam-Webster.

“ Today, chivalry typically refers to an honorable and polite way of behaving, especially by men toward women.”

Looks like my definition checks out

[LazerBean]

Was that an unintentional falsehood or an intentional lie?
This is what the Merriam webster actually says:

"chivalry
noun
chiv·al·ry ˈshi-vəl-rē
plural chivalries
Synonyms of chivalry
1
: mounted men-at-arms
2
archaic
a
: martial (see MARTIAL sense 1) valor
b
: knightly skill
3
: gallant or distinguished gentlemen
4
: the system, spirit, or customs of medieval knighthood
but Lancelot on him urged all the devisings of their chivalry
—Alfred Tennyson
5
: the qualities of the ideal knight : chivalrous conduct"

[CrabCakes11]

If you scroll down a little and actually read the whole page (getting the entire context) you’d know that’s what the page says

[LazerBean]

Oh you mean the non-definitional text talking about how people complaining about chivalry being dead are typically referring to people's lack of manners? Did you read that part? Maybe you did and just didn't know that manners and politeness are synonyms, further proving your first statement incorrect.

[LazerBean]

Also "especially" doesn't mean only, so everything else is irrelevant anyway

[CrabCakes11]

Im sorry you can’t use your context clues. Especially when we are talking in a post about men’s treatment towards women.

[LazerBean]

Sorry you don't know how words work 🤷‍♀️ further proof that incels and feminists are closely related mental illnesses

[CrabCakes11]

Lmao ok

[Siri137]

If "chivalry" simply means behaving with decency towards others, being polite, and not trying to always be the centre of attention, then no, it isn't dead. Holding the door open for someone is often though of as an example of "chivalry", and I do this all the time, for both men and women, especially if their hands are full and they can't safely open the door. I've never had anyone complain about it, so I do not know why so many disgruntled males make up these ridiculous stories of "some feminist" getting angry at them for holding the door open, because I've never, ever seen it happen.

[dolemite58]

Cuz women killed it. I believe people should always be polite and hold the door open for others regardless of gender that’s just common courtesy. I think the concept of being a gentleman made sense when women didn’t have rights like men and they deserved to have meals paid for and doors opened for them. Now that women have equality and can make their own money, I think anything above being courteous to them is just coddling them. If I ask a girl out on a first date I’m the one that pays but after that she has to go dutch or take turns paying.

[TommyMountainFigure]

I don't believe it is. I was brought up to be chivalrous. I stand up on public transport for for women, I open doors too, and where as chivalry may be dead by others? That won't change me.

Women HAVE said to me before, 'I can get the door myself thank you,' to which I replied 'yes you can, but I wasn't brought up to slam doors into people's faces WHATEVER their views are.' Said with a smile of course!

[DishLady]

Aww. It’s not, really, just hiding.
A lot of guys are raised to be chivalrous then it gets messed up by social media, bad GFs and other toxic experiences. AND STILL I see pockets of it everywhere.


Don’t give up hope...

[Chazmatazz269]

Chivalry is dead. Feminism killed it.
That said, i was taught to open doors as a courtesy, not chivalry. If there’s someone near when i get to a door, i hold it open and let them pass. It doesn’t matter their age or sex. In all my years, i’ve only had two people get attitudey about it. Of course both women. But even if every woman was a jerk about it, i’m not going to stop. When you let people drag you down to their level, THEY win. Be better anyway. It doesn’t cost a thing to be nice.

[CriticalCatDad]

Because women killed it. Chivalrous acts have created condescending and entitled women. Acting chivalrously towards a woman puts her on a pedestal and makes her feel as though she is better than everyone else. Chivalry should have died with the knights in mideval times

[Anonymous]

I was raised to be chivalrous but too many modern women take this as a sign of weakness.

I rarely had women get “offended” if I acted chivalrous. But they do something far worse: they labeled me a “nice guy”, consider that boring and exploit my kindness with friend zone bullsh*t. That far far worse than a woman just getting offended. That leaves a much longer lasting negative impression of women on young men.

Not to say all women are like that. I’ve met ones who very much respect chivalry. But they are truly in the minority nowadays.

[handsomelad70]

As a randy older man, it isn't dead for me (I enjoy pulling out chairs, putting on coats, holding open doors, shielding a lady for oncoming traffic, lifting objects, etc.), but since the Women's Movement, too many women think chivalry infantilizes them and prevents them from enjoying true equality with men, so many men have dispensed with chivalry.

[genericname85]

chivalry was a "service" to women that the overwhelming majority women nowadays are rejecting. so men aren't offering that service to women anymore. simple as that.

another aspect is: that the service of chivalry is only offered to women who behave like ladies. that type of woman is incredibly rare in todays society.

[dustybiker2]

Not where I live. People are polite to each other, aside the new crowds that move into the area. They are maybe 3% miseries.

[Billlewis]

Number one, I don't think it's dead, although it is more challenging to be chivalrous nowadays, and two, I will never, ever abandon my effort or my belief in trying to treat every woman who crosses my path as someone to be respected and admired. If she's taken aback by my holding the door open for her, so be it.

[Kaneki05]

Because it's Illogical. Why would I waste time opening the door when they can do it themselves. And I've got to open the other door for myself.
It's simply quicker for both to just get in the car themselves no?
Doing tedious slow things is not something I actively look to do that's dumb.

[CaptainOverthink]

It's not dead.
It's just not promoted, nor nurtured in culture anymore. It's become something that you have to choose to do on your own rather than something that runs through the norms of society by upbringing, examples, fatherfigures, rewarding outcomes and social-enforcment (whether that be through norm-shaming or religion).
It's become something you'd decide to nurture within yourself, because you believe it to be a part of who you want to be.

[DrPepper12]

Chivalry is FAR From dead. Being chivalrous is actually classy and fun. Women still appreciate the gesture and tbh that's your in. Smile! Make eye contact! Say "Anytime" in a voice that conveys admiration and interest. As she passes barely audibly mutter "wow". Pause. Pause. Pause. Say SOMETHING else that will make her stop and turn around. Be witty, be direct, be humorous but BE SOMETHING!! MEN: THIS WORKS!!