Why I feel the term feminism has been ruined

[Anonymous]

I've grown up as what I thought was a feminist, I have been involved in volunteering with young women, working on their skills development, building self-esteem and promoting equality. One of the places I work as a therapist is I a women's centre doing a similar thing.... I am a massive believer in doing what makes you happy, positive mental health and most of all working hard to get what you want (as nothing is handed to you)

HOWEVER, the word feminism has been distroyed as far as I am concerned....
I've heard it all...
Feminists hate men... they blame men... the are controlling.... they expect without putting anything in....
In other words, the thing I hate about people. I understand some have it better off than others, but I have always disliked those that expect they should gain something without the willingness to out the effort in. I guess it makes me a little sad that people are like this.

Second, what exactly have "men" as a collective done wrong? I have met some horrible guys, but that should not be a reflection on the gender as a whole. After all there are many lovely guys too... many of my friends are... I am also a massive advocate for mental health as I said, and men have higher risk rates, therefore I want to help (even on a smaller level where I can listen to my mates and let them have space to talk about how they feel too)

After having arguments with guys that all feminits are bastards and also women "feminists" saying the fact that I would even consider supporting guys makes me part of the oppression.....
I wouldn't say women are oppressed these days generally, at least in the western world... soooooo arguing being friends with guys is causing oppression is too much...

-------
So should people stop using terms like "feminist" and just call people what they are which is human beings? After all, I believe everyone has problems and while one person can't solve them all, I can at least try my best and if everyone stopped insulting eachother then maybe the world would suck a little less

What is wrong with wanting equality?

[Rocco7070]

Its made out to be a extreemist and radically opposite model for women to live by. Of course its radical, but originally it had to be. Radical isn't bad in itself. So, Im too young to know much abi0out it but my Mom sat all her boys down from time to time, explaining about the world. She has 8 boys. One lesson I learned was about the feminest movement. Gloria Steinem Betty Fredian many others. Why the movement had to happen just so women could just be able, try, to be equal in every manner. So, it hasn't been men who ruined it, if ruined, its been ultra conservative women. They couldnt imagine equality, with it comes decision and thought, their conditioning was those actions belonged to men. So, yes tgis 36 yr old Mother schools her children monthly about every sort of thing mattering in life. My Dad died. So, in so many ways she's the ultra feminist, takeing her 8 boys minds and helping to shape those minds by herself. in a fair and honest manner. So, thats her being a feminist , teaching us lessons these past years, teaching us responsibility, compassionate views avaliable in so many actions and reactions. We even were taught ww2 battle stratgies, she teaches history, and battles, all the time allowing us to apply strategic manners in life, win a battle through strategy.

[myTake Owner]

Your mother sounds like a strong and brilliant women to do all that :)

[Rocco7070]

Oh she is, at 9 i studied a chapter of ettiquet a week, so I wouldn't feel so dumb when with nice people. Right now my 16 yr old bros reading King Lear

[VanillaSalt]

I hate the word equality. People aren’t equal. Men and women sure as hell arnt equal... Men can’t have babies... Women will never be a majority of hard/dangerous/long hour jobs. Feminism has been bastardized and now has ruined the idea of dating for me. My blood boils when I see that word anymore. It’s like a festering wound poisoning the body and mind. One bad apple rotting the whole batch.


I like the idea of gender rolls. I’m ok with my rolls and being the protector/earner. If I’m ok being the one to check on the crash at night to kill the spider (fuck that 8legged bastard) to work 80 hours a week... I do expect you to support and honor me and make me feel like a man. That’s the only way relationships will benefit men.


Women get everything out of relationships these days. They control the initiation the money the sex the freedom... unless a woman is support then what’s the point if we can do it on our own...


#redpill #mgtow

[myTake Owner]

As the person who is sent to to check on noises and get rid of spiders, we have slightly different experiences on roles in a relationship...

But as long as what you do works for you

[VanillaSalt]

Well yes you have odd balls everywhere. Something outside the normal... but there’s laws and such conforming to the way stuff is right now that effect even these couples. Example... are men really better off in a relationship? What do men get from said relationship? The basic thought has been men provide money and protection. Women provide support. When a marriage don’t work out women get alimony for years of faithful service to the home and husband. Women will almost always take half and the kids... Here’s where you mention prenups... my reply to this is great another thing we have to use to filter women not like we don’t already expend enough time, effort, and money dating to find a good women to settle with.

The systems fine as it is but when you start changing the dynamic it throws the whole system off balance. I used to respect women unequivocally but since this feminism thing took over and between my 80 hr/week job and covid being limited to inline dating all I’ve seen of women is the worst kind and it’s definitely poisoning me against women. And it’s effecting other men in similar ways... introverts and men working the longest hours tend to be the men that’s least likely to cheat and most likely to treasure the time they get to spend with you and yet here we are in a shallow world where everyone wants what’s better for them without a thought to anyone else.

I’m not good at putting all my thought on paper but I’ve look at many videos by many different groups on both sides and this is my opinion from what I’ve seen.

Women need to be happy with their roles and men need to grow up. This don’t mean women need to just accept being homemaker and men need to marry up. The quality of men and the number of men would sky rocket when women realize one thing... their roles in the relationship is to support the men. Honor and respect... men see this and realize she’s a catch and stay loyal... they marry and treat their “prize” “unicorn” whatever like the queen she is.

[VanillaSalt]

More men dating of a higher quality just from women doing that... women can work and support men. What do I someone working most of the time need a career women for?

The problem with this is feminism puts all these support wives down for what they think instead of fighting for women to have the right to work they fight to make women think they should and have to to be equal to men... disgusting.

[myTake Owner]

1) I have never said I have an issue with women wanting to stay home and support the house in that way... my entire issue is the word feminism being used as a slur when it was a historical movement of value.
2) we dot have alamoni here as a thing for divorce, so once you are done and settled, then that is it
3) just because this is what you want and need in a relationship, doesn't mean it is what all men want/need
4) you assume that what women get from relationships is money and protection, so if they dont get that then are you one of the people that argues that a women won't stay then?
I do enjoy playing devils advocate, but if your way works for you then that's good. Everyone deserves to be satisfied

[VanillaSalt]

I think your misunderstanding me. All of this is to further my original comment. You mentioned reversed rolls so I commented on oddballs. But society isn’t really effected by oddballs it’s determined by majority and societal views. With feminism getting so much media attention it’s spreading like fire and while it works for oddities like your relationship it makes everyone else that wants a normal relationship suffer. Also feminism when it became a thing and feminism of today arnt the same today’s feminism is a slur... an insult to the original meaning...

In the states we do so social relationships between the sexes have been strained for a while... with the new movements of #believeallwomen and #metoo men feel its dangerous to just have meetings alone w it h women. They won’t mentor them anymore. They won’t meet alone. Dinner dates for work don’t happen... companies are either afraid to hire women or will hire ONLY women... like our Vice President for Biden being chosen just cause she’s a woman... here in the states men are charged with rape if their accused many times without proof. They are suspended from college for a year... they lose their careers and all ability to be hired. Even if proven innocent.

And what do you think women offer in a relationship? What about men? And I was speaking as the old fashioned normal expectations. That’s what I meant by basic thoughts. It’s been generally what expected. But I’m very curious what you think each side has to offer. Give me a simple list and we’ll compare what you think to what I think... I bet their similar but with different importance put on each point.

[myTake Owner]

Honestly, I'm not one to say either gender provides a role.
Both should be responsible in supporting their partner... this can be in a more traditional role setting or not, but it works in any form. If there is not a level of support provided on both sides then a relationship won't work in my opinion. Financial support, mental support... all of this is a form of support and should be respected as such.
Personally, I am less intrested in a man providing financial support for me as of the way i have been brought up, but I am happy for a partner to add to the collective financial as well in whatever matter... but job wise it is more important that my partner does something that makes him happy, that brings in the most bacon as it were... this is a view I take after all, I would rather be happy and make enough to live comfortably than make masses and feel miserable.
I have no issue if people choose to spit the work differently, but I would never want to be in a relationship when I am financially provided for

[VanillaSalt]

So you’d date a man that didn’t have a job?

[myTake Owner]

My partner is a university student doing teacher training (and previously his masters later year)... due to his limited funding most of his finance is going on his living accommodation therefore I buy in more food to make sure i know he is eating properly

[VanillaSalt]

I’m sorry I should have clarified would you date a man who has no intention to work.

[myTake Owner]

Then not really, it isn't about the money that one but I am a very goal driven person so what I wouldn't like is to date someone who hasn't got passion to do "something"... however if the person was really driven to do art, or building work, or was passionate about taking the most housemaker parent position then I would happily support them...

[VanillaSalt]

Agreed goals are important. We seem to agree on a lot of things here except the role of the woman in the relationship.

I honestly don’t know how to defend my opinion. I feel feminism is being used against me and men like me in a personal way. Calling me out because I have expectations. As if dating for men wasn’t hard enough now we have to date based off personal expectations. The world was simpler when all I had to do was love, honor, and care for her. Now I don’t even want to try anymore.

[myTake Owner]

I can understand why it is difficult, a lot of my views is because my dad had similar views about being the breadwinner, but he had 3 daughters and no sons... because of this, we are the ones who watched and played sports, learnt about cars and were taught the importance of being able to provide... as he's grown older, he has started arguing we need men to look after us, but as we were given the tools and views to do things for ourselves, we all pushed ourselves to be the provider to prove we didn't need anyone... very much our version of rebellion...
It is hard dating, but there are still women that share your views and everyone deserves to find someone that supports them. My relationship would not work if my partner and I did not support eachother towards our goals after all. And you do seem like a nice person

[VanillaSalt]

Your lucky I hope what you have lasts. So many women and men are confused by what’s expected of them these days... I’m tired. I don’t have it in me to bother anymore. Ide rather drop $300 on an escort and live free than deal with the drama with today’s women with their body counts, short pink hair, and expectations.

[myTake Owner]

While expectations is something I have words to say about, high body counts is something I'm very against 😅 but hopefully you will find happiness as you seem like a genuinely nice person

[WolfyGirl2077]

All "Feminists" hateing men and blameing men im talking big red and the like isn't Feminists but extremists and should be seen as such they aren't whats good for women they are whats bad for us they want "equality" but the way they act hurts the reputation of the rest of us and creates a bigger divide in the human race no extremists there act on their belief should be taken serious or respected rather the old homeless man/woman giving away what they earn so another can have a good life should be respected and seen upon as a great human cause they knows their survival is on the line but they still help others in need and so should we cause its not by some god were gonna succeed is by our own hand as we lift people out of a bad life so they might have a chance and if we end there aswell that we also can be lifted out and continue a good life with friends and family by our side

[Anonymous]

I guess you're mistaking feminazism for feminism.
- Feminazis are not feminists, they are misandrists and female supremacists.
- Unlike them, feminists support equality of both sexes.
You can put a horse mask on a cow, but it's still a cow, not a horse.
- Egalitarianism is not exclusively gender based, egalitarians believe in equality, but related to social, political, and economic affairs.

[myTake Owner]

That's all well and good (and I wish it was me being confused) but when people use the term feminism wrongly it sets a negitive precedent that sticks... that is basically my issue... otherwise I'd completely agree with you

[Opinion Owner]

Thank you, I agree, people often misuse the term, and it can cause negative reaction, just like swastika was corrupted by the nazis, while it originally represented the symbol of good luck, health and prosperity. Nazis reversed the symbol, and made it into representation of their evil politics.
Feminazis did the same to the term feminism.

[destrosio]

Feminism has not been ruined; it has only been exposed. I put a bit of history before to made you understand what I mean.

The first wave of feminists demanded equal rights to men. Often, however, they were not offset by duties, as it was for men. Such women wanted to maintain the privileges of a dual society while also acquiring the right to vote. A large part of first wave feminism created the feminist fictional story, where women were exploited by men and this is a note of nonsense that we carry with us so far. Historians have revealed over time that each of these was bullshit.

The Marxist vision of work is that those who do not work do not eat. The women are not excluded from this except during motherhood. Women's work is like men's work, i. e. women do the same heavy work as men. Soviets placed equal rights and duties on women, however women were not happy with this. Feminists in America who speak of patriarchy and oppression in a Soviet system would end up in a gulag / laogai.

The second wave of feminism was in two parts, the first was the sexual liberation, the second was the discourse on language. Sexual liberation was a branch against family, women were oppressed because they were wife and mother, so by destroy family and from give to woman power of not be mothers it gave an enormous power to them. Before there was nature where all gender is equal. The huge woman advantage was that women were no longer judged on their sexual conduct by man (but woman continued to did it heavily). On the other hand, in this way the woman has become a purely selfish being. Or rather, the fact that being purely selfish was a good thing has been cleared, whereas before it was considered bad. Women's feminism is the feminism of language. For them the language is phallus-logo-centric therefore the language must be changed to become feminine. This was the radical movement, summarized in a way I am not wrong, it is reality that is wrong.

Feminist movement is in crisis and is colonized by lesbians, who tend to be androphobic and phallophobic. In this period everything that was feminism until then is radicalized and misandrized. Men from exploiters become Satan incarnate, and therefore the source of all evil. But the basis for this is given by the previous report especially by the feminism of language. Feminism shows its nihilistic nature. Heterosexuality is viewed with suspicion as it is pointed out as the origin of any exploitation. In this the feminist delusions began, becoming the only feminism in fact. In fact, modern feminism originates in the 1970 lesbian feminist manifesto, "Women identify women", which only means we are women and we decide who is a woman and who is not. The view of sexual liberation become extremised from freedom from motherhood and marriage become freedom from heterosexuality (thing that in public they don’t want explicitly admit).

The new owner of feminism from 50 years to now made it an apology for narcissism and selfishness. If you think about it this is nothing more than a narcissistic / borderline movement. The woman is always better than everyone especially if she is not straight (if she is straight, she is a looser). The woman is always a victim of everything, she never has any responsibility for what she does, as if she were a child. It, like a child, can behave selfishly and no one must or can judge it and it must not be transparent in any way.

If one thinks a little, one finds that many of these theories are at the level of a conspiracy theory. Which places man as the source of all evil in a completely childish way.

The feminist movement today:
is a lesbian-based misandry movement that aims to make all women misandry and generate social conflict between men and women. It is because now this is the feminist movement. If you notice it is a movement with a circular thought always against everything and everyone. Today's battle is tomorrow's oppression.

[Cherokeehp]

I’m every group there are extremists and those who just fuck it all up for the rest of the group. For example, there are radical Christians that use the Bible as an excuse to discriminate against lgbtq people and people of other religions. And yet, millions of people still support Christianity. ISIS is a radical Islamic group that has committed some horrible atrocities, and yet there are still millions of people who support Islam. There are millions of gun owners in America, but every now and then someone decides to do a mass shooting, and yet millions of people still support gun ownership. The point is, you have to be able to discern the difference between true ideology of the group, and the extremists. And in my opinion, the only two groups that people constantly fail to look past the extremists and focus on the real message is Feminism and Black Lives Matter. Honestly I think it’s willful ignorance to control the perception of these movements so that those in power feel justified in ignoring their pleas for change.

[SomeGuyCalledTom]

Well put.

I would go further though, in that it's not just the WORD "feminism" that's been ruined, it's that feminism as a MOVEMENT has been ruined. For many of the reasons you state, and many more besides.

And in the end it'll be women who suffer the most for it (even though Internet commenters are quick to point out the "anti-male agendas" of 4th wave feminism).

The fundamental error modern feminists make is in forgetting that they NEED MEN ON THEIR SIDE if they want systemic changes that benefit both genders. Men and women working together for social change and positive progress is the high tide that raises all ships. But modern feminism doesn't wanna hear this, in their eyes men are the "enemy", the "oppressor", and the feminist's entire lexicon is that of "the oppressed". They victimise themselves then blame it on men when their self-victimisation creates a self fulfilling prophecy. At a certain point, men just throw their hands up in frustration, sick of being painted as these oppressive monsters, and say "fuck it, fuck all these feminists, I'll just avoid women altogether so they can't accuse me of oppressing them". We're seeing this already in the corporate world, male managers won't take private meetings with female employees out of fear of being accused of harassment. We're seeing it in dating too, as more and more men turn to counter-movements like MGTOW and Red Pill, fearing that a romantic advance will be misinterpreted as a violation or act of oppression. And then women wonder where all the good men have gone. The feminists just drove those men underground, into the anti-feminist subculture, and more generally speaking, into a self-imposed asceticism borne out of existential fear of "being accused of wrongdoing"

[Nalix]

Like any label, our perception of it is shaped by the people we know who wear it. It's also shaped by the name itself. If I tell you that I'm a Loorathian that's probably gibberish to you because I just made it up. If I say I'm a Humanitarian then it logically means I'm pro-humans, since that's how language works.

Then if I tell you that humanitarian means I'm pro-American, then you would naturally ask why I don't use that word instead. I then explain, as if I am speaking to a slow child, that it's because American's are the best hope for humanity and therefore anyone supporting America is naturally supporting humanity. You should be more than a little skeptical if you hear something like this.

The same thing happens with feminism. The word clearly means pro-female, but then we are told that it means pro-equality. Why? Because women have been historically disadvantaged and in order to support equality between the sexes. Now you might actually believe this, but for many people who have seen how men and women interact and have heard how they have interacted throughout history, they are understandably skeptical.

Then there are the feminists we know. I can't speak for anyone else in this regard, but nearly all of my friends who identify as feminists come off as strongly self-righteous and arrogantly preach a religion that they assume that anyone who doesn't practice must necessarily be a bigot and degenerate who is in need of enlightenment and re-education. Perhaps friend is not the right word.

For me, that's why the term feminism has been ruined. It never was particularly good to begin with, and the reputation of its bearers has cemented that reputation.

[Anonymous]

Amen. Thank you for writing this. I agree with everything you said. Today's feminism is not what it claims to be. Despite what it claims, it's not about the ideals of equal rights and fairness and hasn't been for a long time. The fact is, if you truly believe in equal rights and fairness, supporting feminism is the last thing you should do. Almost everyone would support feminism if it was what it claims to be, but the vast majority of people clearly see it's not.

Feminism is toxic, sexist and divisive. We already have too many divisive influences in society today. We need influences that bring us together instead, ones that encourage us to care about others, regardless of gender, and treat them with respect rather than pointing fingers at them and blaming them for every problem in the world.

I appreciated your last sentence about the world being a better place if everyone stopped insulting each other. So true. The world will be a better place without the divisive influence of feminism.

[connythebaker]

If men just want sex they are disrespecting women. If they are paying prostitutes that would be the same as rape.
If women only want sex, that is perfectly fine, emancipated.
If women who like sex without commitment also accept money for it, however, they are just the poor brain-washed victims of their male abusers and have not yet coped with some presumed childhood trauma.
If that same women tell the self-styled "feminists" that they can easily earn 12,000 EUR+ per month that way in part-time, most of those dimwits will finally shut up...
It is annoying though, that the same ancient male-hating ritual that has been going on for decades is still continuing in mainstream media.
I don't know where and when you have been brought up as a feminist: Here in Germany we have the same men-haters (Alice Schwarzer) continuing to talk their undifferentiated crap on the airwaves since the 1970s. Nothing new at all.

[Sapioit]

Equalitarian would be a better word. Feminism is the modern version of feminazi/misandrism.

I personally subscribe to hyper-efficientism, which focuses on reducing the unnecessary pain as much as possible, while improving the living standards as much as possible.

By the way, I highly suggest watching the video below, because it highlights a very real effect of the extremist feminism we have today, namely the effemination of men in general, and near-extinction of the manly men, with very few exceptions near the top of the beauty and hotness rating:

https://www.youtube.com/embed/OeL-Fn0V8iU

[Sapioit]

Note: some spell equalitarianism as egalitarianism.

[blank_expression]

I pound the word feminism continuously on here not because of the equal status of women but rather its tie into the Cultural Marxist movement that deleteriously affects all even if they are off minding their own business. Women and men going bananas over feminism doesn’t affect me in the least but the long term effects of fueled gender hatred is destabilizing civilization such that it could come crumbling down and that is where I start to get involved. While successes are claimed, as with anything that yields power such as “feminism” corruption infiltrates it. The word “feminism” has been hijacked by Marxists and their ulterior goal is to destabilize the world, but I will stop there.

Great take/write by the way!

[bluetoblack99]

I’ve seen more and more women who actually want the best for people but struggle with the “feminist” label and for good reason. So many liberal ideas start out with good intentions the get radicalized (e. g. #metoo, BLM, #defundthepolice). People then want to make excuses and rationalize the term. They have to say “oh I’m a classic feminist” or “she’s just a radical feminist” blah blah. They just can’t give it up.

We just need to change the phrase “feminism” to denote being radical altogether. It’s gotten so politically charged that if causes gag reflexes in many people when you identify as that.

Try “egalitarian” instead.

[Unit1]

"and also women "feminists" saying the fact that I would even consider supporting guys makes me part of the oppression"

Woah!!! I experienced the exact same from those MGTOWs. Dare I agreed or stood with (or sided in favor of) or approved A WOMAN or said "she's right you know" I was called a beta, a blue pilled white knight, who gallops to aid the damsel in distress and waiting to be divorce raped 😂😂😂
In other cases I've been called an idiot, so I blocked them.
HAHAHAHA! Ridiculous! Simply ridiculous!
I would call them clowns but clowns are actually cool. They however are not cool but ridiculous and imbecilic.

[SuccessfulHornDog]

Some people have stated that the choice of the name Black Lives Matter is unnecessarily divisive. Why choose a name that promotes divisiveness?

Feminists are guilty of this as well. The idea that there is a group that is accepted and promoted by media and colleges for the sole purpose of women is divisive. But, if their messages weren't divisive this could be overlooked. If there wasn't any hate from them then it could be overlooked.

I agree with you that not all women that call themselves feminists are the same and that it really does mean different things to different people. But, the reality is that groups are often defined by their extremists and if the group doesn't police itself and challenge the extremists then they rightfully earn the same reputation as the extremists. Guilty by association. Its used all across society to invalidate groups and movements.

[Dargil]

The Woman's Liberation movement of the 1960's, just like the related Civil Rights moment, was needed and essential. Both succeeded in their goals. Both were co-opted by hustlers not interested in equal status, equal access and equal opportunity (guaranteed by the Constitution, if not always enforced) but interested in money, power, entitlement and now, in come cases, anarchy. The word Feminism itself reflects derangement.

[zamasux]

Firstly I really appreciate you thoughts for this topic. The country I belong there are parts where women are still not getting their basic share/respect in the society whereas there are some parts where feminism is obsessed that you may feel injustice with men.
Still I see our generation is mature then these oldies. We treat both gender equally and don't have that dispute. I have a gut feeling soon gender equality will be seen everywhere.

[myTake Owner]

I do hope so, and if we all just do a little at a time towards it I think we will live to see that day :)

[zamasux]

Yes we definitely will see that day☺️✌️

[KilledByBees]

I understand your point, it really is a shame that terms and movements like these get co-opted and ruined. I think it is important to take back the term for yourself and use it in the proper way, show people what true feminism is - the advocacy of women's rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes - which sounds like it is what you are already doing with your good work.

[Browneye57]

Feminism was fine when it all started - women should vote, they should get equal pay, they should have equality. All fine and good.
We now at third and fourth wave of feminism, and it is not longer about things being equal, it is about hating men and gaining power over them. The vast majority of people, both genders, do not accept or condone where they're going with it. These are the rage-queens that hate on everybody. Hope they like cats.

[godfatherfan]

Yea, I hear the word Feminist and I hear Feminazi. That doesn't mean they are all men hating vile people, that is just the picture I get in my head when I hear the word.

[StephenCF]

Judge Judy here shows the ideal attitude on the topic of feminism (we shouldn’t use movements to define ourselves)... 👏🏻

https://youtu.be/DHi5R0-dcVU

[jack187625]

Investigate egalitarianism, it's what some feminists insist they are.

[007kingifrit]

i for one am happy they use the term feminist, it lets me know to stay faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar away from them

[myTake Owner]

I hate it but love it XD

[Juxtapose]

Same!

[Kdude010]

Feminists refuse to call out the misandrists and femcels in their movement. Don't blame us for equating modern day feminists with incels. We see men shame and call out incels, yet women are awfully quiet doing the same for their own femcels.