The Looming Population Collapse: Feminism, MGTOW, Tang Ping, and Economic Pressures Driving a Global Crisis

[DexWest]

Hey everyone, I’m back to build on my previous threads critiquing feminism’s impact on modern dating, where I argued it’s turned relationships into a battlefield. Women, empowered by feminist ideals, chase hyper-independence, career focus, and “high-value” men, often dismissing traditional roles like marriage and motherhood as outdated. Men, frustrated by being labeled toxic for wanting stable families, are opting out, fueling movements like MGTOW and “passport bros.” But for a balanced take, let’s widen the lens: feminism isn’t alone in tanking birth rates. Men’s movements like MGTOW and China’s Tang Ping (Lying Flat) are equally complicit, creating a mutual opt-out that’s accelerating a global fertility crisis. Combine this with economic fallout from the 2008 financial crisis, crippling inflation, and the soaring cost of raising kids, and we’re barreling toward population collapse. Gen Z is effectively half of a half, with each generation shrinking as fertility rates plummet below replacement levels (2.1 kids per woman). UN projections estimate global fertility could hit 1.83 by 2050 and 1.59 by 2100. If boomers had 3+ kids, millennials dipped under 2, and Gen Z is trending toward 1.5 or less, we’re facing exponential decline. Let’s unpack why and what it means for the future.

Why Are Birth Rates Crashing? A Perfect Storm?

1. Feminism’s Role in Disrupting Family Formation: My earlier posts hammered how modern feminism promotes delaying marriage for careers, framing motherhood as a setback. Women are encouraged to prioritize independence, often waiting until their 30s or 40s when fertility drops sharply. Dating dynamics exacerbate this: women, with greater economic power, pursue top-tier men, leaving most guys sidelined [Source: The Atlantic, “The Sexual Recession,” 2018]. Movements like South Korea’s 4B (no dating, no sex, no marriage, no kids) take this to extremes, but the broader trend is clear: fewer stable partnerships, fewer babies. Easy access to birth control and abortion further enables this shift, with countries like Japan seeing plummeting birth rates after adopting Western feminist ideals [Source: Japan Times, “Japan’s Demographic Crisis,” 2023].

2. MGTOW and Men’s Opt-Out: On the flip side, men aren’t just sitting there. MGTOW (Men Going Their Own Way) sees guys rejecting marriage, cohabitation, or long-term relationships, citing biased divorce laws, false accusations, and a culture that devalues traditional masculinity. They argue modern dating offers high risk with little reward, opting instead for independence, hobbies, or seeking partners abroad [Source: Psychology Today, “The Rise of MGTOW,” 2020]. This movement’s growth has slashed marriage rates—down 50% in the US since 1970—and directly cuts birth rates as men avoid family-building [Source: Pew Research, “Marriage Decline in America,” 2022]. From the US to India, “marriage strikes” are noted as demographic killers [Source: The Times of India, “India’s Falling Birth Rates,” 2024].

3. Tang Ping and Global Disengagement: In China, the Tang Ping (Lying Flat) movement reflects a broader rebellion. Young people, especially Gen Z and millennials, reject the grueling 996 work culture, consumerism, and pressures to marry or have kids. Facing unaffordable housing and education costs, they choose minimalism and personal freedom over societal expectations [Source: BBC, “China’s Lying Flat Movement,” 2022]. This has tanked China’s fertility rate to 1.09 in 2022, with officials scrambling to address a shrinking workforce and aging population [Source: The Economist, “China’s Demographic Decline,” 2023]. Unlike gendered movements, Tang Ping impacts both sexes, amplifying the global trend of opting out.

4. Economic Pressures as the Catalyst: The 2008 financial crisis obliterated economic stability—millions lost homes, jobs stagnated, and student debt soared [Source: IMF, “Global Financial Crisis Impact,” 2018]. Inflation since 2020 has spiked living costs by 20-30% globally, while wages lag [Source: World Bank, “Global Inflation Trends,” 2024]. Raising a child in the US now costs over $300,000 to age 18, with childcare alone eating 20% of income [Source: USDA, “Cost of Raising a Child,” 2023]. In China and Europe, similar pressures make kids a luxury, pushing people toward movements like Tang Ping or MGTOW. Wealthier nations see sharper fertility drops as trade-offs (career vs. family) hit harder [Source: OECD, “Fertility Trends in High-Income Countries,” 2022].

These forces—feminism, MGTOW, Tang Ping, and economic strain—create a feedback loop. Women see men as unreliable, men view women as entitled, and both sides disengage, with economic realities making family life feel impossible. The result? Fertility rates halved in decades, with Gen Z’s cohort size potentially halving again by Gen Alpha.

Projecting the Ramifications: A World Reshaped by Decline

If trends continue, the consequences are seismic:

• Global Economic Fallout: Fewer births mean fewer workers, shrinking economies. By 2050, China could lose 200 million working-age people, gutting GDP growth [Source: The Economist, “China’s Demographic Decline,” 2023]. Labor shortages, already severe in Japan, will spread, with automation unable to fully compensate [Source: Nikkei Asia, “Japan’s Labor Shortage,” 2024]. Aging populations strain pensions and healthcare; dependency ratios could hit one worker per three retirees in Europe and Asia [Source: UN, “World Population Prospects,” 2022]. Immigration battles intensify as rich nations poach talent, sparking global tensions [Source: Foreign Affairs, “Migration and Demographics,” 2023]. The IMF warns of 1-2% annual GDP losses in affected nations [Source: IMF, “Economic Impacts of Low Fertility,” 2021].

• Transformed Way of Living: Smaller families mean lonelier societies—more childless adults, weaker support networks, and rising mental health issues, already evident in MGTOW and 4B communities [Source: The Guardian, “Loneliness in Childless Adults,” 2023]. Housing shifts—suburban oversupply, booming elder care facilities. Culture tilts toward anti-natalism, with Tang Ping normalizing minimalism over ambition. Dating worsens: sexlessness among youth is up 30%, and apps deepen isolation [Source: The Atlantic, “The Sexual Recession,” 2018]. In China, “resignation parties” celebrate quitting the grind, but sap societal vitality [Source: South China Morning Post, “Tang Ping Culture,” 2022].

• Work and Jobs Overhauled: Industries pivot to AI, elder care, and gig work, but fewer consumers shrink markets. MGTOW and Tang Ping mindsets reduce career ambition, worsening skill shortages. Governments push later retirement (age 70+) and pro-natalist policies like tax breaks, but these clash with cultural shifts [Source: World Bank, “Global Inflation Trends,” 2024]. Both men and women face irony: their “freedom” leads to state pressure to reproduce, eroding choice.

Speculating on Solutions: Reversing the Fertility Freefall Before It’s Too Late—and Which Economic System Does Best

We’re at a crossroads. Feminism, MGTOW, and Tang Ping, fueled by economic despair, are a mutual opt-out driving us toward collapse. But is there a way out? Speculating here, based on global experiments and expert insights, reversal won’t come from one magic bullet. It demands a holistic reboot: aggressive policies, cultural resets, and targeted fixes for those disengagement movements. No guarantees—some countries have tried and flopped—but a combo could nudge fertility back toward replacement levels (2.1 kids). Crucially, which economic system best enables these solutions? Pure capitalism often exacerbates the problem through inequality and work pressures that deter families, leading to lower fertility as wealth increases but security doesn’t. Socialism, in theory, could prioritize collective welfare, but historical examples like post-communist states saw sharp fertility drops during transitions, and modern attempts (e.g., China’s state-driven reversals) have failed due to lingering economic strains. Data suggests mixed economies—blending capitalist innovation with socialist safety nets, like social democracies in the Nordics or France—perform best. They sustain higher fertility (around 1.7-1.8) than pure capitalist systems (e.g., US at 1.64) by funding robust pro-natalist measures without stifling growth. These systems enable generous policies that modestly boost rates (0.1-0.2 kids per woman) while addressing root causes like cost and work-life balance. Let’s break down the solutions within this framework.

1. Amp Up Pro-Natalist Policies with Real Teeth: Governments in mixed economies excel here. Baby bonuses and tax preferences in Hungary (a mixed system with capitalist base) lifted fertility from 1.23 to 1.48, though dips followed. Extend parental leave like Sweden’s 480 paid days, maintaining rates around 1.7 in a social democratic model. Subsidize near-free childcare; universal access can add 0.1-0.2 kids per woman. France’s family allowances and free education have added millions to population over decades, keeping rates at 1.68 in a mixed welfare state. Tackle housing with low-interest family loans. The catch: Even in these systems, policies fail without cultural buy-in; Finland’s perks haven’t reversed decline to 1.3 despite strong socialism. Immigration fills gaps while boosting innovation.

2. Cultural Shifts to Revalue Family and Marriage: Mixed economies support this via education reforms—integrate parenthood-positive classes to counter child-free narratives. Campaigns like Singapore’s glamorized families, temporarily boosting births in a capitalist-mixed system. Overhaul work culture: End overtime grinds, as in China where it tanks intentions. Shift to communal values—religious communities in mixed setups maintain higher rates.

3. Target the Movements: Bridge the Gender Divide: Recalibrate feminism to include family as choice with subsidized treatments. For MGTOW, reform divorce laws for fairness in mixed systems. Ease Tang Ping with debt forgiveness or UBI pilots. Regulate apps.

Pie in the sky? Combos in France or Sweden stabilize higher rates; without, decline locks in. Social democracies lead because they balance growth with support, unlike pure capitalism’s fertility-crushing pressures or socialism’s implementation failures. What policy or system tweak would you prioritize?

What do you think: empowerment or self-sabotage? Let’s talk solutions.

[BonzoInBitburg]

The problem with feminism is it picks and chooses where it wants "equality". They want to be CEOs but not bricklayers. They want the man to more cooking and cleaning but they don't want to take out the garbage and kill spiders. Every guy can see right through this and a growing number are opting out. The irony is this, when I went back into the dating pool a few years ago I was looking for a someone who would rather look after a house over working fulltime and could help out a little with my businesses. When a woman told me they were educated, strong and independent, I said that we probably weren't a good match because I wanted someone to stay home and cook and clean which was an exaggeration but a surprising number of women preferred that life. I was told over and over how manly I was and they loved that they could be submissive. The more I leaned into the so-called "toxic masculinity" the easier it was to date and I could fill every night of the week if I wanted to.

My point is that I believe all these movements are a mile wide and an inch deep. Men should be men and women should be women. We're different and work better together when we appreciate our differences. Everything is cyclical and a generation will eventually come along and reset family life.

[MzAsh]

The majority of women interested in trad wife life are interested in a particular lifestyle for themselves. They want to be spoiled and pampered by a man who can afford to do so without giving her any lip about how much of his income she’s spending on luxury. Only dumbass women are going to submit to average Joe with less than 100k. The really dumb ones think small business owners are rich. Be mindful of this.

[BonzoInBitburg]

@MzAsh You are correct but I would say $100k is low to afford a traditional wife. Western culture is getting further removed from traditional households so most people really don't understand what it takes to make it work. And it's not even an option for most households because they need 2 incomes to afford food and shelter.
Small business owners go broke all the time. Happened to me and my first wife left.

[Anonymous]

I don't know Tang Ping, but I feel like feminism and MGTOW are the same thing these days. They both are hate machines and each feeds off the hate of the other.

[Anonymous]

If we fight economic issues with affordability , no new tariffs on imports , sensible strides to make products in America and their components too at an affordable rate , bring down housing costs , free childcare , cheap hospital bills , raise taxes on billionaires , make sure no insurance companies scamming you , cap the price of credit card charges , get rid of hidden transaction fees , make concert tickets affordable by cracking down on Ticketmaster , break up The Big Techs , make Pharma Goods cheap and not overpriced , and push competition in the market scene then we’d see a positive shift out of the economic crisis.

I haven’t see any of this take place recently, though it should for the betterment of American society. Not to mention we are at eachother’s throats due to rising tensions, which puts people on edge. Who wants to raise a child in this Capitalist Hellscape? Exactly, push positive healthy change. When a system no longer works for The Nuclear Family, then you push reform. We as Americans never stopped pushing reform, so we should have it on the table.

[exitseven]

I keep hearing about the decline of population. I see out of control traffic, developers building on every square inch of land and an impending shortage of drinking water. Everyone complains about global warming. Well, more people use more resources. More cars , more electricity and more traffic. Maybe having fewer people without needing a plague or a world War would not be so bad

,

[Ariesman81]

@exitseven

Keep in mind, China is still building high rise towers that they won't be able to fill either. And almost all of the construction I see is apartment complexes and HIGH end homes in the metro areas.

[exitseven]

@Ariesman81 I live in a town that has a 30,000 minimum lot size. It prevents too much development. That was one if the reasons I wanted to live here

[Ariesman81]

I don't blame ya. I work in the city and commute an hour to avoid it. Buddy works construction and all they've been building the past couple years is apartment complexes. Fortunately our city board has denied permits for more than the one that exists. As well as shutting down open enrollment in the school system.

[Anonymous]

Feminism's express goal has been to abolish the nuclear family, and it has been largely successful. MGTOW is simply a reaction to feminism.

Feminism has been a wolf in sheep's clothing that women have gullibly fallen for. It is literally destroying modern society.

[goaded]

TL;DR: Wasn't it much better in the 17th century when women were property or sold their bodies.